UK scientists are continuing to highlight Chile as a warning of what can happen even with widespread vaccination. The new angle is to draw attention to the poor efficacy of the Chinese vaccines. The Mail has the story.
Professor Ian Jones, a virologist at the University of Reading, told MailOnline the figures from Chile suggest the Chinese vaccines “will not be enough to stop the virus circulating”.
Despite fully vaccinating a quarter of its population and getting a single dose to 40%, Chile has seen its infection rate double since mid-February, rising from 177 daily cases per million to 372. More than 80% of the country has been forced to retreat back into lockdown, which was used by No 10’s scientists as proof the UK is not out of the woods.
However, the South American nation is primarily using the CoronaVac vaccine, made by Chinese pharma giant Sinovac, which a University of Chile study found was only 3% effective after the first dose, rising to 56.5% two weeks after the second. Another study in Brazil found efficacy could be as low as 50%, which just meets the World Health Organization’s threshold for an acceptable vaccine.
For comparison, the Pfizer and Moderna vaccines have efficacy rates of 95% and 94%, respectively, while AstraZeneca’s is about 79%. Trials of tens of thousands of patients given the US and British jabs found they stopped up to 100% of hospitalisations and deaths, compared to CoronaVac’s 84%.
Even China appeared to acknowledge the shortcomings of its vaccines at the weekend, when Gao Fu, the director of the Chinese Center for Disease Control and Prevention, admitted “protection rates of existing vaccines are not high. It’s now under formal consideration whether we should use different vaccines from different technical lines for the immunisation process.”
However, since then the Chinese Government has put out an interview with Fu where he claims his comments were “a complete misunderstanding”. He said: “The protection rates of all vaccines in the world are sometimes high, and sometimes low. How to improve their efficacy is a question that needs to be considered by scientists around the world.”
Chilean Science Minister Andres Couve also came to the defence of the Sinovac vaccine. On Sunday he revealed that the health ministry will shortly publish a real world study on the efficacy of the CoronaVac vaccine, saying it was important to focus on the data and the effectiveness in reducing serious illness. Likewise, Heriberto Garcia, head of Chile’s Public Health Institute, said people should ignore headlines. “The University of Chile study and the study the Health Ministry will release say the same thing: the number of people who fall ill and are hospitalised has decreased,” he told local newspaper La Tercera. “We are going down the right path.”
A number of UK scientists criticised the Chinese vaccines, according to the Mail.
Professor Gabriel Scally, a public health expert at the University of Bristol, told MailOnline the crisis in Chile “was not a great tribute to the Chinese vaccines”.
He added: “They haven’t been approved by any of the major medical regulators and there is very limited research evidence, they certainly don’t appear to have a high level of effectiveness in the real world. And in the absence of data it’s very difficult to know [how effective they really are]. The only benefit of them is the fact they’re cheap.”
On whether countries rolling out Chinese vaccines should fear a resurgence of the virus, he said: “I think they would have a right to be worried.”
But he admitted that a vaccine that’s partially effective is better than none at all.
He told MailOnline: “That 50% mark is the line in the sand that’s drawn by the WHO, which is great. But I think it’s beginning to dawn on people these [Chinese] vaccines aren’t going to solve the problem completely.”
Professor Scally said the UK was “in a different place” because it has highly effective vaccines in its arsenal, adding: “As long as we take it easy [coming out of lockdown] we should be fine.”
However, other scientists see Chile as a warning about the limited effectiveness of vaccines more generally. Chris Whitty told a Downing Street press conference last week: “We want to do things in a steady way because the assumption that just because you vaccinate lots of people, then the problem goes away, I think Chile is quite a good corrective to that.”
Sir David King, a former UK Chief Scientific Adviser, told Sky News yesterday:
From the point of view of the population itself, we’re all dying to get out of lockdown. From the point of view of the epidemic, I think it’s all a little bit more worrying. Chile is a country where the rate of vaccination amongst the population was third highest in the world – they were ahead of us in terms of the number of people who have had the vaccine – and they’re suddenly now into a third wave. They now have 7,600 cases a day and the total number of people in Chile now who have Covid is over a million. So what has happened in Chile is very, very surprising – a high percentage of people have been vaccinated, but here’s a variant of the disease coming through the country.
As Lockdown Sceptics noted last week, Chile is not a good a comparison for the UK, firstly because it appears to be using a less effective vaccine, and partly because it is in the southern hemisphere and so is currently in the middle of autumn. It is the equivalent of mid-October there, so some increase in respiratory disease should be expected as the winter flu season gets underway. The country is also some way behind the UK in terms of Covid deaths per million, which puts the comparison into some perspective.
We also need to keep in mind that the UK currently has one of the lowest Covid infection rates in the world. Are vaccines contributing to this? You’d have to bet on it. The results from the trials and population studies for the Pfizer and AstraZeneca jabs are impressive and they are surely effective at reducing serious and symptomatic Covid (and hence also transmission, as widespread asymptomatic transmission is a myth).
However, that doesn’t mean we can necessarily expect no new Covid surge at some level this autumn and winter. Even with the vaccines there will still be a winter flu season. It may be a mild one, helped by the vaccines, or it may be less mild. In this respect, it’s worth bearing in mind that studies in care homes have found the vaccines have significantly less efficacy among the frail elderly, with a PHE study finding Pfizer down to 62% effective and AstraZeneca only 36% effective after seven weeks. Similarly, a large Danish study found Pfizer only 64% effective among this demographic. With 40% of Covid deaths in England and Wales last spring being care home residents, a lower efficacy in this vulnerable group may have a significant impact on winter Covid mortality. There is also evidence that some of the new variants partially evade the antibodies created by the vaccines.
This is not, of course, an argument to maintain restrictions until we have better vaccines or endless boosters. Far from it. It is an appeal for realism about how low we can reasonably expect the level of risk from COVID-19 to go. We now have vaccines, and they seem to be helping (and let’s hope the rare blood clots are as bad as the side-effects get). Now is the time to return to normal, just as a number of states in America have done without experiencing catastrophic consequences.
It is not the time to think we can create a 100% effective barrier against a seasonal respiratory disease, as the Government appears to be aiming for, with Boris justifying restrictions because “vaccines are not giving 100% protection”, and the BBC promoting the need for continued restrictions because vaccines are not “100% effective”. It is the height of folly to think we can create an impenetrable wall of vaccination and coerce everyone to play their part in building this imaginary edifice. The vaccines, for those who wish to have them, are surely good enough. We must stop living under the shadow of Covid.
To join in with the discussion please make a donation to The Daily Sceptic.
Profanity and abuse will be removed and may lead to a permanent ban.
Astrazenica is 76% or so against *symptomatic* infection. Its only about 65% against any infection (and this figure is also used by IC and Warwick models in SAGE) so its not that much better than Sinovac.
Its perfectly likely we cant get to herd immunity via vaccination at all if we rely on AZ in the UK as the major vaccine.
The Pfizer and Modernas are significantly better with 90% or so protection against any infection (and therefore, transmission).
Yes it stops serious illness which would normally be fine EXCEPT the government is paranoid on case counts. With AZ its unlikely we can ever drive the case count low and keep it there.
This is likely their worry. They know our main vaccine is by far the worst but really dont want to admit that or change course.
>Its perfectly likely we cant get to herd immunity via vaccination at all if we rely on AZ in the UK as the major vaccine.
I thought we were already at herd immunity? 50% tested positive for anti-bodies and then add in natural immunity which could be anything between 20% and 40% puts us very close to the 70% or so touted for herd immunity.
It certainly feels like we’ve hit some level of immunity locally with no Covid cases in over a month (semi-rural Cheshire). If one removes cases caught in hospitals and care homes, we’ve probably been near zero cases for two months.
This is my calculation too and the model from UCL seems to find the same but we have a government who is discarding natural infections and wants everyone vaccinated as they seem to believe vaccination is better. So it seems they will carryon denying this and coercing vaccination of 80% of the population.
Although Boris has just been on the news saying the reduction in cases is due to lockdown, not vaccines!! What planet is this guy on… lockdown certainly hasn’t worked whereas immunity via vaccine or natural clearly has.
You can also discount the “cases” picked up by the massive testing program of school kids before Easter.
That nice mr hancock says no herd immunity by yesterday, unlike everyone else.
“Yes it stops serious illness”
Well – that’s as low a bar as you can get, given that much cheaper and safer prophylactic treatment does the same.
Rick, I am getting worried about the lack of knowledge about the actual emergency trial numbers exhibited by commentators on this site. They are getting brainwashed by the continual repitition of misleading numbers.
Is this what this site is for?
That’s where we are. Contrary to what the politicians say, that is pretty much what the NHS says on the leaflets re the so-called ‘vaccine’. It just says that it can reduce the symptoms if you catch the virus. It also says there is no guarantee that you would not transmit it, either.
As you probably aware the only reason a drug or ‘vaccine’ can be legally given emergemcy use clearance is if there is no viable alternative. As the NHS guidance is that the ‘vaccine’ is only good for reducing symptoms it clearly fails that test, as there are proven alternatives such as Ivermectin. I say proven which is true in practice but not as part of a trial signed off by a regulatory body because none of the pharmas will spend the money ruining their own ‘vaccine’ opportunity.
This behaviour is so transparent, yet no-one besides a few bloggers talks about it. Certainly this site does not.
Yes, this has been a big concern of mine. I stocked up on ivermectin a year ago, don’t need that shitty vaccine
Wondering where you got it. It’s been hard to find in Ireland and in the USA I had to provide evidence of its efficacy and that the FDA had modified their stand on it before my doctor would write me a prescription. And then it was for only five days.
We knew they were openly saying that before they rolled the vaccines out.
It’s similar to the disclaimer on blue/white ear loop masks which say on the packaging ‘will not protect against Coronovirus19 or others viruses’.
You are quoting ‘relative’ numbers, not absolute ones. No test for any so-called vaccine has produced better than 1% absolute protection from at least one major symptom. None have produced ANY result which confers immunity of stopping of transmission.
Read this by Iain Davis back in December, nothing has changed, the trials will not be completed until late 2023.
https://in-this-together.com/vaccine-trials/
Just wait until the vaxxinated cross paths into Hcov-OC43
This opportunistic Coronavirus is just waiting to jump in
Seriously, do you think the CCP would quite like vaccines to be of “poor efficacy”? Presumably they don’t particularly want Western countries to rush back to being free liberal democracies. I’ve said for a long time that those who complain about the USA will really have something to complain about when China [under the CCP] starts to call the shots.
Fortunately the CCP don’t have the power to sabotage vaccines developed outside China, unless SARS-CoV-2 really is an engineered bioweapon…
SARS-CoV-2 is for sure, a gain-of-function Wuhan lab created virus, financed directly by the ECOHealth Alliance.
Perhaps what you should ask yourself is, (a. would it have been better to let this modified flu bug run rampant till we ‘all’ naturally adapted to it, as we have done with respiratory viruses for centuries past…
Or (b. rush in experimental gene therapy vaccines at warp-speed into the elderly and vulnerable first – which guarantees this Franken-virus’s future mutations?
Let that sink in…
I also believe it was a gain-of-function Wuhan lab created virus, but I currently regard the Covid-19 pandemic as an experiment gone horribly wrong rather than as a deliberate Chinese act of war.
For a moment there I thought Lockdown Sceptics had gone full retard with a headline claiming the government had bought into a 100% dangerous vaccine.
Do you think that survey is in the ballpark, saying 20 per cent of those not so far vaccinated are not intending to get vaccinated? (reported in the Express, I think). That’s quite a lot of people to discriminate against/coerce. Whatever happened to “vaccines and drugs are the way out of this”? Oh, but the rest of the world isn’t vaccinated. And then they won’t be vaccinated against the variants. And then they’ll find out there are too many people who just won’t take them (being blighted by war or starvation perhaps). Do they actually have an exit strategy? Or is keeping this nonsense going now actually the strategy?
“Is keeping this nonsense going now actually the strategy?”
Yep. And I’m still not taking it.
Keeping this nonsense (lockdown to enforce digital ID) going has actually been the strategy for just under 12 months now.
Kill Bill has been pimping pandemics and vaxx solutions for at last half-a-decade…
The EU had vaxx passports on the statue books back in 2018, thanks to clairvoyance obviously…
The machinery to deal with the pandemic was already in place and only needed the WHO to change the terminology of what defined a pandemic to kick in, much like they subtly changed the definition of herd immunity to no longer be natural, though needing vaccine intervention..
“Men, it has been well said, think in herds; it will be seen that they go mad in herds, while they only recover their senses slowly, one by one.”
[Charles MacKay]
It’s never been about cases, deaths, or the logic of testing… and this whole Covidian Cult farrago sure as f u c k isn’t some inconvenient, random act of god that’s trashed the majority of folks way of lives.
¿Comprende?
Anyone figured out here why Saint Greta is now back on the Beeb prime time three nights in a row?
https://brandnewtube.com/watch/the-new-normal-documentary_ecuUiUhHpP9INeh.html
I do my very best at all times to make sure I do NOT watch the BBC, but occasionally my finger goes awry on the remote control and there are moments when I stumble upon its output. Either I am just very unlucky but I fear it is more likely the case that their output is becoming more and more biased towards climate change, ghastly Greta, climate emergency, melting icebergs, habitat destruction….I could go on. I am as keen as anyone to protect our natural environment. I just don’t want this “agenda” rammed down my throat at every opportunity and what really grates is the hideous hypocrisy where they preach endlessly about environmental pollution when they have a weekly programme on their news channel dedicated to all things hi- tech which are belching out elecro magnetic radiation at a rate of knots which is about the most damaging pollutant you can have as it is expecting both man and animals to live in a soup of electromagnetic smog that neither of us was designed to be able to function within.
From an interview of Dr Mike Yeadon by James Delingpole in Conservative Woman:
Council of Europe, of which we are still a member after leaving the EU, we’re still a member, they issued in January a really long document, that two sections of it said, ‘Member states are reminded that they may not mandate or coerce their citizens to receive medical products.’ And then the next paragraph said, ‘And member states are reminded that they may not discriminate in any way between people who decide whether or not to have a vaccine.’ So the law is quite clear. Obviously, it would need to be used. But make no mistake that the law is there to protect us. But if we are too careless, too easily persuaded and almost everyone gets vaccinated, it’s like, well the law’s irrelevant then, isn’t it? You’ve taken your decision.
So hopefully we have some legality to fight back with.
What we have witnessed over the last 12 months is the comeback of socialism, by another name: ‘The Precautionary Principle’
Nothing is allowed unless the ‘Grosser Reich’ first invokes its prerogative power to say whether something is ‘safe’, a euphemism for ‘papiere in ordnung’.
This political state of affairs, opposition neutered by the Conservative party’s move leftwards, forcing a (relatively) moderate Labour leader ever further from the centre, cannot be remedied except by a series of election results so disastrous for the Conservative party that they are forced to replace their leader.
This starts next month……..or Private Fraser was a prophet……..
But the Conservatives are riding high! Look at how nice they are being to us now. We can go out to play, as long as we’re not naughty again. They even give us jab badges if we’re really good.
‘Socialism’. What a gormless comment in a scam brought on by corporate free-market forces and predominantly parties of the right! Plain stupid.
Intemperate language invariably accompanies a threadbare argument.
But not always. Rick might have been intemperate, but it doesn’t make him wrong. This has absolutely nothing to do with ‘socialism’ well not unless you include ‘national socialism’. Its a biosecurity fascist totalitarian move, corporations and government working together to create a control over society. Its using biosecurity as a means to further an agends which includes changing just about everything you used to take for granted. Its general umbrella for PR purposes is ‘new green deal’ , but in reality its just using that to create a new capitalism based on resource constraint. Every billionaire is currently investing heavily on this new economy, they are years ahead of where the rest of us are going to end up. A geographically controlled, colder,poorer place for the plebs.
I was mulling this over the other day and we need a new word to describe the next stage after fascism – when the mega corporations/big pharma take over in place of governments
“Corporatism” just doesn’t cut it
Faucism sounds good tho
You are entitled to your view. It is not one that I share.
At the moment, this country continues to be run at the whim of health apparatchiks. The government is supine; poll watching; like that ‘nice Mr Major’, in government but not in power.
The health system in this country is a socialist system in thrall to the precautionary principle, itself derived from eco-socialism.
Certain socialist governments of the recent past undoubtedly contained elements of fascism in their enforcement of adherence to their collectivist agendas.
That is precisely what we have witnessed in this country over the last 12 months: socialist fascism.
Tell you what, Tim, lets review this when the government finally announce the findings of the soon to be announced ‘Improving the energy performance of privately rented homes’. which is a foretaste of what is to come for all the housing sector.
aaaaaagh
It is not the government that is running the ‘pandemic’ response.
It is the NHS.
‘Aneurin Bevan, the minister responsible for its creation, suffered from no such timidity. He described the National Health Service as “a piece of real socialism,” and spoke of how it stood “opposed to the hedonism of capitalist society.”
https://tribunemag.co.uk/2020/07/aneurin-bevan-on-the-socialist-ambitions-of-the-nhs
Forget this or that political category; they box you into camps of thinking that don’t help you. Your world ‘old normal’ has been deliberately fractured into ‘zones’…
For the 99% per capita energy use in the UK is collapsing. The suicide rate of teens has doubled, and mental health issues have exploded…
It’s best to simply humour those that are importing these ugly social controls upon you. Then make it your life’s work to circumvent them as best you can, and put as many spanners in the works as possible, though not in ways that will overtly harm you.
The AI powered panopticon, all seeing SKYNET is up and running.
It’s time to rethink your peasant’s rights, start being ruthlessly fatalistic… and assessing how personally resilient you, your loved ones and family’s lifeboat heimat is?
And we need a campaign of civil disobedience; how about an accompanying slogan: “TAKE BACK CONTROL”?
And then there’s Laurence Fox’s “Reclaim” party, which wants the same thing. Could the media give them some coverage, you think?
Neo Liberal Corporatism
When you have giant corporations calling the shots instead of the state that ain’t socialism
fascism
Socialist fascism.
When you have a state run socialist health system calling the shots, supported by draconian and illiberal legislation imposed without a parliamentary vote, that ain’t neo liberal corporatism.
I heard some one say that if communism and fascism are hands on are clock, they are both on no 12 but just one got there clockwise, the other anticlockwise
Errrrr…….if 50% is the line drawn by WHO……and Chinese sources say the Chinese vaccine is only 50% effective………Chile is unlikely to offer any lessons to anyone, except to its political opposition……..
In this country, SARS CoV 2 ceased to be a medical problem in May 2020 but the political opposition, incapable of drawing any lessons from our predicament, clear to all but the most obtuse, would have made matters even worse
Consequently, we now have a major political crisis in this country; operational, yes, but also structural, constitutional; from which the government believes that it can escape through swift economic recovery and by indirect censorship, ‘strategic news management’, of adverse political messaging.
But the lesson of history, for the governments of Churchill, Eden, Callaghan, Major, Brown, May, and their courtiers, is that national crises invariably have serious consequences.
Vaccines – what we need to know
Ok, I’ve run the figures, and, from 5/12/20 to 23/1/21, there were, according to official figures, 36,315 cv deaths in the UK. In several other major European and South American countries I monitored over this period, the worst was Sweden, who, adjusted for UK population, had equivalent to 26,472 cv deaths, or 9,843 fewer. Other countries ranged from equivalent to 14,854 fewer deaths up to 29,374 fewer (equivalent). I looked at 6 countries in total, but plainly the UK will have done worse than many more over this period.
We need to know how many of these extra deaths were caused by our vaccination programme which started on 8/12/20 – and how much of the decrease in deaths after 23/1/21 can be attributed to the vaccination programme. How accurate is Boris Johnson’s claim about the vaccines saving thousands of lives? And even if it is accurate, does that justify coercion of younger, healthy people with “vaxports”? Maybe someone clever like Swedenborg can find some answers…
My estimate, because the correlation of jab numbers with deaths in the elderly age groups is remarkably good, is around 20,000. This peaked just after the normal seasonal peak. It could appear to be part of the peak without unpacking the data. Indeed, because these poor, uninformed folk were wiped out early, the death rate reduced shortly after and the government, fraudulent scientists and mainstream media hail the jab as being successful.
As soon as you mention ‘cv deaths’, you are dealing in pure fiction.
The only figures you can reasonably trust are those for all-cause mortality.
Sorry – but any other such analysis is meaningless, especially if you add in another fiction : ‘excess deaths’ without precise and less misleading definition..
It all seems to be about steering folk towards the mRNA shots, Pfizer and Moderna.
Been thinking the same, particularly as it rolls out to younger people. We’re getting good at this!
Really really poor article.
Where is the mention of immunity from natural infection in the article? That is the basis for long lasting herd immunity. Natural immunity is close on 100% effective and we know from SARS that this immunity for coronaviruses is long lasting.
How experimental vaccination changes that natural immunity who knows. But why are we attributing the fall in SARS-C0V-2 to vaccination when in January in the UK the first vaccination associated with higher PCR+ deaths (from memory 44% higher positivity in the vaccinated in the first few weeks after vaccination).
LS, when covering experimental vaccination, please do it in a balanced sensible way, not with this ‘vaccines good’ propaganda nonsense.
And correction Professor Gabriel Scally is a dangerous, anti-scientific, zero covid, society destroying, advocate.
Can someone PLEASE take Whitty out, put him in the stocks, and provide spectators with large amounts of rotten fruit & veg?
Ducking stool too!
I have something a bit more permanent in mind.
A full stop after out would have sufficed. There’s a very long list of players in this covid game who will be forever looking over their shoulders. Deservedly so too, I say as a pacifist.
Cases, cases, cases – means nothing. Deaths per £1m of population (according to Euromomo) Chile – 1271; UK 1865.
Tell me again who’s got the shit “vaccine”?
Cases, cases, cases…. Deaths, deaths, deaths…. Blah, blah…bloody blah.
There’s been a campaign recently of FOIs pushing NHS trusts to officially declare the number of folk who DIED OF COVID.
Not people who DIED WITH COVID.
A subtle but important difference when most of the unfortunate fatalities are in the over 80s age group.
There’s a big danger that “cases” will start to increase in September, as is to be expected with a seasonal virus, because even herd immunity doesn’t mean the virus disapears completely. Using the “we’re not 100% protected” line the government will then ask parliament to renew their emergency powers (currently due to expire around the 23rd Sept.) just in case things get worse. They’ll use the excuse that they hope not to use them, but need to have them available just in case. Our totally useless and cowardly MPs, with the usual brave exceptions, will say yes and we’ll be living under the threat of some level of restrictions, and quite possibly a few actual restrictions, until at least March 2022.
I think now is the time to start lobbying MPs to accept that Covid is never going to completely vanish, and that learning to live with it means accepting a small increase in deaths each winter (as we do with flu) not learning to live with permanent restrictions on our freedom/everyday lives.
totally agree. what do we do? can we also get a petition going against government renewing their emergency powers? Can anyone with better skill than me write a template letter that we can all print off and sign and send to our local mp?
Fuel for ” we must keep masks. social distancing , hand gunk, T&T forever”.
I really don’t know what to make of this. The headline suggests that the ‘dangerous myth of 100% protection’ is all vaccines, but then goes on to be specific to Chinese vaccines. It’s then a bit of a love-fest about Britain’s vaccine success, “the UK currently has one of the lowest Covid infection rates in the world. Are vaccines contributing to it? you’d have to bet on it”.
well err..no. I think it’s more likely that Covid has disappeared as seasonal viruses tend to do! It’s like saying the Flu vaccine is a success in June because no ones got flu!?
A few things strike me here, Chile is possibly in the middle of a Covid outbreak, so as many scientists have stated, (Vaxx 101) this should never be the time you start a vaccination programme.
The vaccine itself could be the cause of the high fatalities, or at least adding to them.
The only people I can find saying that the UK’s Jabz programme is effective is The Government, MSM, and the Companies themselves.
All people we totally trust to tell us the truth…….I don’t think so!
yes, I didn’t like this article. Let’s have some proper news on the site
Yes you really have to struggle to fing the ‘news’ bits. It’s very much opinion pieces now. I’ve come to accept that while the site might be lockdown sceptics, they aren’t in the least bit sceptical about the Jabz, and that’s frustrating because there’s a lot to be sceptical about.
I’m starting to see this
I suspect Toby has been comprehensively leant on.
“We’ll let you keep your website as long as you delete the plebs every night and big up the vaccines”
Well that’s what I’d do if I was a psychopathic politician
Oh totally!
Typical of this government (or more precisely SAGE, although it is diffiucult to tell which is which) to focus on and compare the UK to Chile and the problems there. However, the strategy used in Sweden can’t possibly apply to the UK, due to the differences in ….. <fill the gaps with the latest reasons>. Pick and mix to suit the most negative narrative.
Has no one been following the reports in UK Column News about the numbers of deaths associated with the Pfizer “vaccine” 283 and AstraZeneca 421 together with 377487 adverse reactions from AstraZeneca and 116627 adverse reactions from Pfizer? Not my figures Government figures buried deep in the MHRA website. MSM are focussing on blood clots to take our eyes away from the real vaccine tragedy that’s going. Please fellow Sceptics follow the story as I said on UK COLUMN NEWS every Monday Wednesday and Friday 1pm.
I have. My husband and I do not see eye to eye on this ***** that is going on. I showed him theses gov figures and he still managed to justify them by taking the vaccinated figures and calculating the death nos from that site and claiming they were still much lower than covid deaths! It is so infuriating
Yes indeed – one wonders how divorce rates are running!
He should consider these vaccine deaths are solely caused by the vaccine, whereas deaths solely caused by covid are probably lower. death with covid and comorbidities then gives a higher number.
I told him that but it just doesn’t go in
I know people who have been vaccinated and I am convinced their mental functioning has decreased since having the vaccine
Expecting this site to become ‘Vaccine Central’ any week now. Nevertheless, although it is not perfect, I can think of nothing better. I think most readers would agree that the sceptic edge needs plenty of nurture – the next member of the team should have more radical leanings, because, as most of us tend to say “The virus is just a side-show”. Without real political understanding, none of it makes any sense at all, and never has done.
From Tavistock Social Engineering the masses..In a 1981 interview, Hal Becker from a think tank called “Futures Group” in Connecticut said: “I know the secret of making the average American believe anything I want him to. Just let me control television…. You put something on the television and it becomes reality. If the world outside the TV set contradicts the images, people start trying to change the world to make it like the TV set images….” You see, television is not the truth, for as much as people keep tuning in to its lies. Television is an amusement park, a group of jugglers, belly dancers, storytellers, singers and stripers. But you people, have been completely hypnotised by the Tube. You sit there, day after day, night after night.… TV is all most of you know! Five percent of Americans read more than five books per year, yet one billion people tune in to the Oscar awards. You dream like a tube, speak like a tube, smell, dress, act like your television.
Good post! This perhaps explains some of the real dissonance between us and them! I know we all wonder, ‘why can’t they see the reality of what’s happening”?
I never watch the news because I could see which way it was going last year, bu family, friends, and neighbours have been watching it for over a year, pretty much 24/7.
They know no other ‘reality’, and it’s got to have influenced their thinking.
thank you. Michael O’ Bernicia who is bringing a lawsuit against the government https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8-0iPusIy7c
Hehas said that the Tavistock Institute is at the heart of this pandemic because they have been employed to manufacture all the mind games for this ‘pandemic’
I read a fantastic article yesterday from John Rappoport (look up his site ‘nomorefakenews’) where he uses the movie Network to make his point, explaining this exact dilemma. In fact, I don’t think he’s got a single thing wrong on this whole shitshow.
thank you I will have a look
“…we’re all dying to get out of lockdown…”
In a very real, literal sense if you’re a cancer patient
My brother had some gallstone trouble. A very painful condition. His specialist told him the bladder had to come out. Waiting list on the NHS: One year.
Fortunately he had private health insurance. Most people do not.
Ironically, the determination of the NHS and the Public Health people to only treat COVID at the expense of everything else, is going to drive more and more people towards private health solutions – supposedly the precise opposite of what they want.
I am finding this all very bizarre because for my mother and I the reverse is true. My mum had a cancer scare last year and she had instant testing and scans, phone calls, MRI the lot. As her ‘bubble’ (can’t say that without feeling sick) I went with her and the hospital was EMPTY – we were seen early every time.
I am in London and I broke my hand in January 2021. I went to A+E and again there was no-one there. I was seen immediately and offered MRI to check for hairline scans.
This contrasts entirely with when I broke my hand in 2012 (yes I am that clumsy) and I went to A+E and was there all day and then refused even and x-ray as they claimed my hand was not broken because I did not scream loudly enough when they bent it back (their words) It was broken badly but I had to go back twice to finally get a proper diagnosis and an X-ray
I suspect there is a difference between acute services and more “routine” operations and screening services – the latter being postponed and cancelled in favour of COVID.
maybe – but a gallstone is pretty urgent
I think the “dangerous myth” that the government has bought into, judging by its behaviour, is the myth that we can achieve “zero COVID”.
As soon as the vaccinations were extended beyond the “at risk” groups, it was clear that this was no longer about public health and all about something else – politics, money, corruption.
We should be arguing about whether vaccine X gives Y% or Z% protection. We should be arguing over whether they are needed AT ALL.
^We shouldn’t be arguing about whether vaccine X gives Y% or Z% protection
I don’t think the government has bought into that myth at all. I think the government has created that myth to push forward their agenda of digital passports
This article is perhaps not that focused on the real issue. Before the vaccination started, LD published articles discussing that the vaccination campaign will be used by the politicians to claim victory over C-19 when in practice, the last peak would just have the normal pattern unaffected by any intervention. There is no more discussion about this issue and the extreme very sharp curve in January.
Also the important issue with C-19 deaths in Scotland with 23 % of all C-19 deaths in Scotland occurred 28 days after vaccination. This type of information would require an urgent investigation if something similar happened in England, Wales and NI.
I’m afraid this site is becoming a bastion of crap analysis, not enlightenment.
Cases, or “cases”?
I ask because our “cases” are going to spike when the schools go back and mass invasive testing on children resumes, without a single extra actual case.
sigh
Sky News reported that they spiked yesterday, massively!
Govt. website showed testing did too; up from 482K to 1.2M!
Answer? Never get tested folks!
If we stopped testing tomorrow this would all disappear like melting snow. the testing keeps the whole show and the fear porn on the road.
all those false positives and PCR cycles set too high
Even this article still accepts the basic promo stuff – that it, like lockdown, does make a difference.
Perhaps discussing India’s vaccination campaign would be interesting.
apologies someone sent me a link to ‘a stand in the park’ on telegram.
I have got the app now but I have no idea how to access a group that I am not invited to or already part of. Am I being stupid?
I don’t really want to be in a Facebook group – trying to avoid Facebook
I think you just join. At least I did for my local group – I wasn’t invited.
but is that online on a computer?? because on my phone I can’t even see the group, never mind join
Here’s a link to one of the sources on Telegram.
https://t.me/dryburgh
thank you, is that a link I put in my computer, or on my phone? I’m seemingly useless at this
If UK’s vaccination campaign was a success story, I wonder what a failure story would be considering the absolute horrendous UK death spike in January. In Israel there is no proof that the vaccine ended the outbreak i.e. the C-19 cases decreased at the same rate in the non vaccinated young as in the elderly. We still have no explanation for the excess mortality in the second Israeli peak.South Africa and Portugal had exactly the same peaks as UK without mass vaccinations. There are lot of interesting investigations to be had instead of accepting point blank MSM propaganda.
UAE another country like Israel with early and massive immunisation.Very similar curves.
OMG, that David King? The global warming clown? Nuff said.
Has no one been following the reports in UK Column News about the numbers of deaths associated with the Pfizer “vaccine” 283 and AstraZeneca 421 together with 377487 adverse reactions from AstraZeneca and
yes I have.
Uk column news doing a great (well horrific) piece today on how counties are being transformed by the new city Mayors, which have been given more power and are starting to be linked globally to achieve ‘future cities’ aka ‘green cities’ basically where we own nothing and are un-happy and are segregated. Terrifying