What the Mail’s Take-Down of Natural Immunity Gets Wrong

Dr Michael Mosley has written a piece in the Mail criticising those like Novak Djokovic who say they are protected by antibodies from previous infection, claiming the vaccines are better. Here's what he gets wrong.

6 min read

Dr. Michael Mosley in the Daily Mail has written a piece criticising those like Novak Djokovic who say they regard themselves as in no need of vaccination as they have protection from a previous Covid infection. In the article Dr. Mosley – who is medically qualified but no longer a registered doctor and has worked as a BBC journalist for the past 37 years – makes a series of claims about the vaccines and natural immunity that don’t withstand scrutiny.

The first is that previous infection provides much less protection against Omicron infection than does vaccination.

Just because you have antibodies against a previous strain of Covid, that does not mean you are protected against catching, or spreading it to more vulnerable people such as patients with cancer or pregnant women. A study published in December, by researchers from Imperial College London, concluded that the protection against Omicron, if you have had a prior Covid infection “may be as low as 19%”. A course of vaccines – the double dose plus the booster – on the other hand, offers something like 75% protection.

What Dr. Mosley doesn’t mention is that the December study from Imperial was a preliminary study that also found no evidence of Omicron “having lower severity than Delta”. Omicron is now known to be considerably less severe than Delta, suggesting the study should not be taken as the final word on Omicron and natural immunity. A more recent study puts the protection provided by natural immunity against Omicron infection at 56%. This is higher than the level of protection reported for the boosters by the UKHSA, which finds just 40-50% protection at 10 weeks. The protection provided by previous infection is also more resilient.

Dr. Mosley’s explanation of why the protection from vaccines is supposedly superior to that from previous infection also makes no sense. He writes:

Why the difference? It appears that our immune systems are very good at learning from experience. The more often your immune system is challenged by a virus (or a vaccine, which is mimicking that virus), the better it gets at defending itself against it.

The first time your immune system encounters a virus it isn’t quite sure how to react and it takes time to start building an effective response. While that is happening, the virus is busy replicating, spreading and doing damage.

If you’re lucky, your immune system will spring into action and you will recover after a trivial illness. If you are unlucky, you end up in hospital, perhaps in intensive care. The idea of a vaccine is that your immune system gets the nudge to start working long before you are exposed to the real thing.

The reason for a second, and even third jab, is this amplifies and refines your immune response to protect you, and others, in the future.

This of course fails to explain why encountering the virus should provide less effective immune protection than a vaccine. Just because while your body is working out how to counter the virus the virus can make you unwell tells you nothing about how strong your subsequent immunity to re-infection will be. It is true that a vaccine mimics a virus to prime your immune system, and the idea of multiple shots is to improve that response. However, there is plenty of evidence that the vaccines are weaker and less resilient against infection than natural immunity. For example, see the chart below from a large Danish study, where the orange line for the previously infected (but not vaccinated) is higher and stays much higher than the green line for the vaccinated (but not previously infected).

Protection against infection (vaccine effectiveness). The orange line is previously infected but not vaccinated; the yellow line is previously infected and vaccinated; the green line is vaccinated but not previously infected. (Statens Serum Institut, Denmark)

It’s been suggested that the reason vaccine protection against infection (contra Dr. Mosley) is relatively weak and declines fast is because the vaccines, being based only on part of the virus and injected into muscle, do not produce the full immune response that encountering the full virus does. For example, encountering the virus produces mucosal (IgA) antibodies in the respiratory tract that are important in mounting an early response to infection; however, these are absent following vaccination.

Dr. Mosley then implies that vaccination is superior for protecting against new variants like Omicron and therefore better for preventing transmission and protecting the vulnerable.

Multiple exposures seems to be particularly effective at educating your T-cells, immune cells responsible for seeking out and killing dangerous viruses, and which are vital for conferring long-term immunity. T-cells also seem to be much better than antibodies at detecting and destroying new variants of Covid.

And this matters because one of the main reasons for getting vaccinated, as far as I’m concerned, is that by doing so you’re protecting others — particularly the vulnerable who cannot have a jab.

We know that people who are vaccinated carry a lower load of virus, and clear it faster from their bodies, so there is a much lower chance they will pass it on. Vaccines, of course, can have side-effects and are not 100% effective. One of the criticisms of Covid vaccines is that, despite being triple jabbed, you can still get infected and become ill.

As noted above, though, the evidence is that natural immunity is superior to vaccine immunity for protecting against infection, particularly over time and against new variants, so this argument fails. It’s also noteworthy that UKHSA data shows the vaccinated having significantly higher infection rates than the unvaccinated since the autumn, as does Public Health Scotland data, implying it is not true that the vaccinated spread the virus less than the unvaccinated.

The claim that people who are vaccinated carry a “lower load of virus” is also not supported by evidence. For instance, a study in the Lancet found no difference in household secondary attack rate depending on whether the index case was vaccinated, and correspondingly no difference in viral load. A study by the U.S. CDC also found no difference in infectiousness and concluded: “Clinicians and public health practitioners should consider vaccinated persons who become infected with SARS-CoV-2 to be no less infectious than unvaccinated persons.” UKHSA and others have also found viral load no lower in the vaccinated. These studies are all pre-Omicron, which is likely to be even more able to evade vaccines.

Dr. Mosley points out that protection from vaccination plus previous infection is superior to that from previous infection alone. This appears correct; however, as can be seen in the chart above, the difference is relatively small and almost all the protection comes from the previous infection rather than the vaccine. The difference will also likely diminish over time without frequent boosters.

Dr. Mosley disputes that antibodies from previous infection should be used as an indicator of protection.

Some people who are against mandatory vaccinations for NHS staff suggest we could test people for antibodies to COVID-19, and if they have them that would mean they are safe to work. But just because you have antibodies doesn’t mean you can’t infect others or get infected. That’s why regulators, such as the U.S. Food and Drug Administration, have recommended that antibody tests should not currently be used to evaluate a person’s level of immunity or protection from a Covid infection. 

However, this argument applies with at least as much force to vaccination, as it’s evident that the vaccinated can and do frequently contract and transmit the virus, seemingly more than the previously infected. So on that argument, why should vaccination status not equally be deemed inadmissible as evidence of being ‘safe’?

Dr. Mosley’s article is a classic example of only presenting the findings and data that back up one’s point of view, rather than looking at all the evidence in the round. Perhaps the Mail will now allow a better informed (and even registered and practising) medic to write a more accurate piece so as to avoid its readers remaining misinformed?

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120 Comments
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liz.thornborrow@blueyonder.co.uk
4 years ago

I copied this from a previous post, can’t remember who originally posted it but it’s a valuable source of information:

History is littered with examples of the atrocities that ensue when the medical profession abandon their traditional principles and judgement in favour of unquestioning subservience to governmental diktats – medical involvement in torture, forced sterilisation and human experimentation being examples.
The genetic engineering based therapies now being deployed by the medical profession as ‘covid vaccines’ have not undergone the full review process required for full regulatory approval. In fact, all the Covid 19 injections are approved for emergency use only and are still, supposedly, in Stage 3 trials. However, it was reported in the BMJ (20/8/21) that these Stage 3 trials will never in fact be concluded because “There is no control group after Pfizer offered the product to placebo participants before the trials were completed”.
It was also reported by NPR (19/2/21) that Moderna had allowed part of its control group to be destroyed when 650 volunteers who took the experimental Moderna injections at a company called Johnson County Clinical Trials were unblinded, with the placebo group being offered, and given, the injections.
Moderna later announced that “as of April 13,… Read more »

Burlington
Burlington
4 years ago

Hopefully we can all maintain a healthy immunity to people like Mr Mosley. He has been incubated far too long at the Bullshit Broadcasting Corporation.

allanplaskett
allanplaskett
4 years ago

No mention by Mosley of of Walensky’s ‘the vaccines don’t stop transmission’ – 10-Jan-22, widely canvassed now as an official termination of vaccine-mandate validity. Also no mention of the gathering evidence that, according to Robert Malone (see his Joe-Rogan podcast), prior infection heightens the propensity to vaccine injury, such as myocarditis, perhaps by a factor of 4 or 5.

MikeRobe
MikeRobe
4 years ago

The other explanation to consider as to why natural immunity in response to infection is better than vaccination is that unlike live attenuated vaccines, the mRNA-based Covid vaccines include only a limited number of specific antigens and epitopes…all in the surface Spike protein, while natural infection exposes the immune system to antigens from the whole virus (internal and external) and so is likely to provide a broader protection against variants. During an infection, the body is also continually exposed to virus particles and antigens at much higher levels and for a longer duration compared to a single shot of vaccine, most of which is likely cleared from the body quite rapidly.

marebobowl
marebobowl
4 years ago

Isn’t he a weight loss “expert”. Yes, just the person I would take my medical advice from.

MrkMtchll
MrkMtchll
4 years ago

“worked as a BBC journalist for the past 37 years “

why read more?

SimCS
SimCS
4 years ago

In his whole piece, Mosley seems to have forgotten that a vaccine is supposed to stimulate the immune system, not replace it. By definition therefore, the vaccine is not as effective as antibodies. The only reason for vaccines is to kick the immune system into a state of preparedness. Our immune system *IS* the thing. As such, the mRNA treatments are not vaccines, as they don’t provide an inert sample of the virus to allow our immune systems to prepare.

SimCS
SimCS
4 years ago

We’ve previously seen Dr Michael Mosley as one of the good guys and trustworthy. No longer! I hope this article gets back to him and he has an opportunity to respond, and reflect.

Derek Toyne
Derek Toyne
4 years ago
Reply to  SimCS

Like most people I was quite fond of Dr Mosley with his TV prorams. But since Christmas and his announcement that he wouldn’t be inviting unvaccinated people my fondness for him went down like a lead balloon. I am no vaccine expert but know enough that these vaccines only stimulate antibodies while most respiratory illnesses use T cell memory cells to defeat infections. In fact most people who do get covid won’t produce antibodies because they only created when the disease is severe. The antibodies you get from vaccination or covid will only last a few months and is why you shouldn’t vaccinate soon after infection and why the vaccines only last a few months. Natural immunity from T cell memory cells provides you with long term immunity so making it far better than immunity from vaccination. Maybe this doctor doesn’t understand the difference between vaccines and natural immunity but if he doesn’t he shouldn’t claim he does.

Bella Donna
Bella Donna
4 years ago
Reply to  Derek Toyne

I put my trust in my immune system, my common sense and the fact I’ve done the research and above all I know myself better than anyone else, particularly those who are deemed experts by the government and their puppet masters.

Peter W
Peter W
4 years ago

We have all these so-called fact checkers and censorship and yet a guy like this can have his nonsense published simply because it follows The Narrative(tm). Whether deliberately or not he is lying or is very Ill-informed.

Derek Toyne
Derek Toyne
4 years ago

The big mistake this doctor is making is assuming that a vaccine that boosts your antibodies for a specific disease provides immunity. Respiratory diseases like covid mostly stimulates the memory T cell immunity which provides immunity for several years. I believe it was this discovery or should I say confirmation what immunologists already knew that imperial college London was studying. The study looked into why in some households everyone gets covid while in other households only one person got covid. In my household my wife got covid and even though I never wore PPE I sat and hugged my wife for ten days and I got nothing. Since then I’ve attended several super spreader events and again nothing. I never ware a mask as I am asthmatic and still nothing compared to my vaccinated colleagues who are getting infected all the time. The author of the imperial study claimed that because one in five colds is a corona virus this provides cross immunity to covid.
The researchers of this study hope to use this research to develop a universal vaccine against covid and it’s variants that will last several years unlike the present vaccines which only last a few months.

janvanruth
janvanruth
4 years ago
Reply to  Derek Toyne

asthmatic?
taking budesonide perhaps?

Derek Toyne
Derek Toyne
4 years ago
Reply to  janvanruth

I’ve not used my inhaler in 16 months,the last time I used it was when we began using PPE in the nhs. I’ve quite mild asthma so rarely use my inhaler but when we started wearing masks I had several attacks. Since then I’ve taken vitamin D every day and no more attacks. I’ve looked up vitamin D and asthma since and it seems to help the illness. Last summer while everyone was saying this was the worst year for hayfever I had no problem at all when normally I suffer badly with hayfever. But I believe when it comes to covid I believe most of us have natural immunity due to cross immunity from corona viruses.

Bella Donna
Bella Donna
4 years ago
Reply to  Derek Toyne

A lack of Vitamin D causes many illnesses which can be easily treated by taking it every day. I take 2000 iu daily and haven’t had so much as a sniffle in 2 years.

Derek Toyne
Derek Toyne
4 years ago
Reply to  Bella Donna

Likewise I am taking 25ug which I believe is around 1000iu every day. I don’t want to take more because I believe if you take too much you absorb more calcium into your arteries. I know this can be remedied by taking vitamin K but are reluctant to take any more vitamins if it’s not necessary. At the moment my whole family is into they third bout of colds and me not even a sniffle. To me vitamin D is the only thing I am doing different and maybe why when it comes to covid nothing. In contrast to my vaccinated colleagues who are all catching covid I seem to have avoided it which could be due to cross immunity from previous colds or vitamin D.

jd
jd
4 years ago

I am so glad you called this out. I’m not a doctor virologist or any other sort of ‘scientist’ but I can tell BS when I read it.
Totally illogical rubbish.

DevonBlueBoy
DevonBlueBoy
4 years ago

He’s obviously forgotten his Hippocratic Oath

Susan Lundie
Susan Lundie
4 years ago

Sad. There goes the respect I once had for Mosley. Feet of clay, more concerned about his finances and career, it seems, than balanced common sense. All that bluff on his programs about investigating medical facts.

tom171uk
tom171uk
4 years ago

Dr Mosley is a successful showman rather than a medic. He has, for example, profited from the excellent and extensive work of Prof Roy Taylor, with very little input of his own. Very good at presenting TV programmes but hardly an authority on anything.

LonePatriot
LonePatriot
4 years ago

Dr. Vladimir Zelenko said anyone that willfully vilified and obstructed access to hydroxychloroquine and ivermectin in the prevention and treatment of Covid-19 is guilty of first degree capital murder, genocide, and crimes against humanity. They are trying to jab as many people as possible so that their great reset aka depopulation plan work. I believe in God & Jesus. If I get sick I will take my Ivermectin that I stashed just in case and leave rest to God. If you want to get Ivermectin you can visit https://ivmpharmacy.com

sophie123
sophie123
4 years ago

Wait what? he thinks the antibody levels don’t indicate a degree of immunity? How come then that they approved the vaccines for children on the basis of them eliciting antibodies? Because they sure as heck don’t get sick .

DaveNI
DaveNI
4 years ago

“…better informed (and even registered and practising) medic”
Better informed, yes.
Why do they have to be a registered and practising medic?
In my (albeit limited) experience, a lot of medics base their opinions on personal experience, not data.

Anti_socialist
Anti_socialist
4 years ago

I’m going to print that picture & use it as an archery target.

David Beaton
David Beaton
4 years ago

Twitter: Call to 111 between a concerned individual citing adverse vaccine reactions brings advice from Doctor – ‘stop taking the vaccines – they are going to be withdrawn owing to newly revealed (!) safety concerns. ‘Do not take any more’!

Just more “Fake News”awaiting Twitter take-down?

David Beaton
David Beaton
4 years ago

The Mail is “only obeying orders” – it is a propaganda sheet – no longer a newspaper.

dearieme
dearieme
4 years ago

Why is he referred to as “Dr” Mosley? He’s not registered as a medical doctor. He presumably doesn’t hold a doctoral degree.

Moist Von Lipwig
Moist Von Lipwig
4 years ago
Reply to  dearieme

He is Doctator Mosley.

BS665
BS665
4 years ago
Reply to  dearieme

It’s a Reich thing.

Silke David
Silke David
4 years ago

Moseley claims that several injections improve your immune response. I am not *up to date with vaccines we give to children, I believe some require 2 doses, but not 3 doses within 6 months! And they have been tested for years and proven to be relatively “safe”.

Anonymous
Anonymous
4 years ago

In Europe and the United States very serious moves are being made by very dedicated and well qualified people to bring the perpetrators behind the COVID-19 fake and death dealing vaccines to justice. Dr Reiner Fuellmich is just one of these people.

These people are not just going after Big Pharma and Fauci, Gates, at el. They are also going after politicians, media companies and journalists – they are gunning for everyone that aided, abetted, promoted or profited from the death vaccines.

At the Nuremberg trials, a legal method was introduced along the lines of joint criminal enterprise liability, where all people who assisted in any way the crimes to be carried out, could be charged with those crimes – technically, this meant that train drivers and level crossing gate operators could be charged for taking victims to the concentration camps. In the US they used similar type laws to round up and bring to justice various high-ranking and low-ranking members and random associates of mafia organisations.

This is the legal method Dr Reiner Fuellmich and his associates are using. Many people in the German and US intelligence and police communities are cooperating with and eagerly assisting in the investigating… Read more »

huxleypiggles
huxleypiggles
4 years ago
Reply to  Anonymous

I have a lot of respect for your postings FW and I hope you are correct.

For me the stumbling blocks are the courts and the judiciary. In this country for sure they appear bought:

the judge refusing to force the ONS to release deaths of juveniles figures, the truly bizarre and corrupt Colston four judgement.

I hope I am wrong.

Anonymous
Anonymous
4 years ago
Reply to  huxleypiggles

To paraphrase Reiner Fuellmich: Justice will not initially be set in motion through the judiciary – as you’ve said, they’ve taken the Cabal’s shilling. It will have to be the people, with guidance from people like Fuellmich and Robert Kennedy, that set the wheels in motion.
 
That’s why sites like this one are so very important. Every single person that sees the truth of the plandemic and the murderous lies that have been told to promote it, is one more person against the perpetrators.   
 
It will be a scared and cleaned-up judiciary that will then sentence the perpetrators and apply compensation to the victims.
 
If you want to see an example of the sheer arrogance, puerility and shameless stupidity of what Reiner Fuellmich and Robert F. Kennedy (and the rest of us) are up against, take a quick look at this “fact check” that a person called Robert Turner did on Reiner Fuellmich.
 
Here’s a verbatim quote that sets the scene for Turner’s fact checking ability:

“I’ve linked to the video below as we are going to address his fairy tale piece by piece, so you’ll need to refer to the video from time to… Read more »

186NO
186NO
4 years ago
Reply to  huxleypiggles

HP: Stop Press; shock horror, Judges shown to make political judgments and relegate the Law to last place in 2022…..precedent set in 11-0, never before seen, judgment relating to Prorogation case……Lead Judge a well known Remainer…..just like the other 10.

I hope you are wrong, but fear you are dead right.

janvanruth
janvanruth
4 years ago
Reply to  Anonymous

keep on dreaming

Encierro
Encierro
4 years ago

Novak Djokovic’s French Open in doubt after sports minister U-turns on vaccine passesFrom the Telegraph. This is not going to end well, the Fing passports are here whether we like it or not.

TheyLiveAndWeLockdown
TheyLiveAndWeLockdown
4 years ago
Reply to  Encierro

French open closed because of medical apartheid.

GlassHalfFull
GlassHalfFull
4 years ago

“one of the main reasons for getting vaccinated, as far as I’m concerned, is that by doing so you’re protecting others.”

Why should I as a fit and healthy 66 year old risk “vaccine” injuries or death to protect someone with an unhealthy lifestyle, obese and self-inflicted health problems?

They are the ones who should self-isolate and are a burden on the NHS.

JohnK
JohnK
4 years ago
Reply to  GlassHalfFull

And the quoted sentence is, essentially, a lie, isn’t it? The product on offer does not actually prevent infection, nor reduce the risk of potentially infecting others. It’s just a prophylactic, mitigation drug, being marketed as a “vaccine”, by the look of it.

Margaret
Margaret
4 years ago

“…as it’s evident that the vaccinated can and do frequently contract and transmit the virus, seemingly more than the previously infected. So on that argument, why should vaccination status not equally be deemed inadmissible as evidence of being safe?”

Exactly!

Lucan Grey
Lucan Grey
4 years ago

Just because somebody is a Doctor of Medicine doesn’t mean they have a clue about how to interpret scientific reports, design scientific studies or interpret statistics.

Particularly not when they are really journalists who work for the BBC.

huxleypiggles
huxleypiggles
4 years ago
Reply to  Lucan Grey

Let me be cheeky and edit:

Just because somebody is a Doctor of Medicine doesn’t mean they have a clue.

Bobby Lobster
Bobby Lobster
4 years ago

So Mr Not-a-doctor is promoting repeated not-a-vaccine(s) as being better than millions of year’s developing immune system. Keep making your “informative” BBC programs which I can no longer stomach!

brachiopod
brachiopod
4 years ago
Reply to  Bobby Lobster

Billions maybe, certainly hundreds of millions based on the understanding of when ‘not just a vitamin’ D was first synthesised in Eucaryotes .

Free Lemming
Free Lemming
4 years ago

Absolutely sick to my back teeth over this ridiculous debate. Which is better, a natural immune response to the entire virus, honed over a couple of hundred thousand years, or one that’s triggered by Pharma artificially attempting to generate one (using new tech) by forcing peoples own body cells to create a single part of the virus – the spike protein? The discussion is absolutely ridiculous. Ignoring ‘science’, which is no longer actual science, you only have to open your bloody eyes to see that the vaccinated are getting infected, and being ill, at bizarrely high rates… hmmm, almost like the shot has screwed their immune system. When this is all over, these idiots need to be rounded up and shipped off to some remote island where they can happily inject themselves with as much pharma crap as they want.

brachiopod
brachiopod
4 years ago
Reply to  Free Lemming

By all accounts the cationic lipid nano particle delivery system for the mRNA does serious damage to mitochondrial DNA and to cellular DNA and on its own may account for damage unique to the vaccine and not seen from the viral infection.

david gray
david gray
4 years ago

Wasting valuable breath on lies. The whole covid narrative has been the emperors new clothes from the start, in fact several moral tales, the boy who cried wolf, emperors new clothes, king Canute approach to stopping the fictional virus, supported by dihydrogen monoxide science, then the pied piper if you don’t have the jab. There are no clothes, there is no virus so there is nothing that flows from that, no variants, no vaccine, no immunity, no suppressed treatments, ivermectin etc, it is all just one big but frightening fairy story. Stick to there is no covid.

ComeTheRevolution
ComeTheRevolution
4 years ago
Reply to  david gray

But what about Long Covid – kids can get it so they need to be jabbed too. And Covid Toe. You have no heart. 😉

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