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Why I Don’t Buy the Seymour Hersh Story

by Noah Carl
2 March 2023 11:00 AM

Since the publication of Seymour Hersh’s bombshell article alleging that the U.S. was behind the Nord Stream sabotage, many sceptics have concluded the case is now closed. It was America.

This attitude is understandable. After all, Hersch is a legendary investigative reporter who in his long career has broken several stories that were initially dismissed as fabrications and later proven correct. All of these stories were, shall we say, ‘inconvenient’ for the U.S. government.

What’s more, his sabotage story seems to fit together so well. U.S. officials have been threatening for years – and I’m directly quoting here – to “end”, “halt”, “stop”, “kill”, “cancel”, “shut down”, “take out”, “terminate” and “put an end to” Nord Stream 2. (Seriously, watch this video by Matt Orfalea.) And no-one besides the Norwegians – whom Hersh claims were also involved – will benefit more from Nord Stream’s demise than Uncle Sam.

Yet I’m not convinced. Sure, my prior has shifted somewhat toward the U.S. as the party responsible. But if I had to bet, I still think Ukraine’s the most likely culprit.

To begin with, several commentators have picked holes in Hersh’s story, which is far from watertight. Indeed, it’s much more porous than his ultra-confident tone implies. Some of his quotes even sound like they were lifted from a Hollywood movie. Referring to Biden – the alleged mastermind of the operation – Hersh’s source apparently said, “I gotta admit the guy has a pair of balls.”

Then there’s all the circumstantial evidence pointing to Ukraine. Let’s review it.

Motive. Sabotaging the pipelines eliminated Germany’s incentive to defect from the pro-Ukraine coalition. It also ensured that any Russian gas flowing to Northern Europe in the near future will have to go through Ukraine.

Risk. Of all the possible culprits, Ukraine is the only one that could sabotage the pipelines without the risk of sparking World War III. And even though they would have technically attacked Germany, justifying it as retaliation against Russia would have been fairly straightforward (their infrastructure was getting bombed at the time).

Precedent. Since the conflict began, Ukraine has carried out a number of successful sabotage operations. They were behind the attack on Kerch bridge, the assassination of Darya Dugin, and the explosion at Saky airfield. They’re also alleged to be responsible for a spate of “mystery explosions” inside Russia itself. According to the FSB, they even attempted to sabotage the South Stream pipeline.

Warning. Last September, Der Spiegel reported that Germany had been warned by the CIA about a possible Ukrainian attack on the Nord Stream pipelines.

Disclosure. In a recent interview with Freddie Sayers, U.S. national security advisor Fiona Hill stated, “Some of my colleagues who have been looking at this think Ukraine could have done it. And this isn’t implausible”. As to whether they had the means, “Ukraine could have found a way of doing this: we’ve seen them be extremely inventive” ­­– she added.

If the Ukrainians were in fact responsible, how do we explain the threats from U.S. officials, such as Biden’s pronouncement that “there will be no longer Nord Stream 2. We will bring an end to it”?

Easy. When Biden said that, he didn’t mean “we will blow up the pipeline”; he meant “we will tell Germany to cancel its approval”. And of course, that’s exactly what Germany did on February 22nd last year. The U.S. has been pressuring Germany to cancel the pipelines since as far back as 2008. And when Russia recognised the two breakaway regions, they finally had the leverage they needed.

Tags: Fiona HillNord Stream 2Seymour Hersh

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28 Comments
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stewart
stewart
2 years ago

Does ianyine think the Ukraine takes any steps in this war that aren’t pre-approved, tacitly or otherwise, by the US? The Ukrainians would be completely insane to piss off their major ally that supplies them with literally everything, from weapons to money to political cover. Everything.

So whether the Ukraine did it or the US did it, same thing.

218
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Lancer
Lancer
2 years ago
Reply to  stewart

Right, they look to be one and the same at this point – why the whole thing kicked off after Kiev started looking more west rather than east after the revolution (coup depending on perspective).

36
-1
Pembroke
Pembroke
2 years ago
Reply to  stewart

It all comes back to what the deal was with Hunter Biden.

5
0
huxleypiggles
huxleypiggles
2 years ago

If the Ukrainians are guilty of sabotaging Nordstream ll then they acted if not with US support then certainly with their acknowledgement and “best wishes.” It utterly inconceivable that the Ukrainians acted unilaterally.

Last edited 2 years ago by huxleypiggles
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transmissionofflame
transmissionofflame
2 years ago

The US probably know who did it, even if it wasn’t them, and they probably knew beforehand.

56
0
DevonBlueBoy
DevonBlueBoy
2 years ago
Reply to  transmissionofflame

Like they know the exact origin of the Rona bug

18
0
transmissionofflame
transmissionofflame
2 years ago
Reply to  DevonBlueBoy

Of course they do.

11
0
Covid-1984
Covid-1984
2 years ago
Reply to  transmissionofflame

And if not “Blame Trump ” is their go to

9
0
FerdIII
FerdIII
2 years ago

So the US 51rst state blew up the pipeline….and they want to join NATO….not sure I follow the logic old chap. The Ukes would need US, NATO tooling and people to do it. So if they were the figleaf the op was done by the US. Let’s live in reality shall we.

Last edited 2 years ago by FerdIII
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godknowsimgood
godknowsimgood
2 years ago

Here is Noah Carl’s first argument as to why he doesn’t buy the Seymour Hersh story:

‘Some of his quotes even sound like they were lifted from a Hollywood movie. Referring to Biden – the alleged mastermind of the operation – Hersh’s source apparently said, “I gotta admit the guy has a pair of balls.”’

If anyone is swayed by that argument, explain to me why you think it’s implausible that the source would have said “I gotta admit the guy has a pair of balls”, as I am baffled by that argument.

54
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VWTS
VWTS
2 years ago
Reply to  godknowsimgood

I didn’t find that implausible at all. Americans do in fact talk like that.

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godknowsimgood
godknowsimgood
2 years ago
Reply to  VWTS

Well Seymour Hersh used the phrase and he’s American, and Noah Carl has suggested that it’s a phrase you’d hear in Hollywood movies, so I don’t see how it’s implausible that Hersh’s source might have used the phrase, or a variation of it, Hersh could be paraphrasing.

13
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VWTS
VWTS
2 years ago
Reply to  godknowsimgood

Exactly.

5
0
lds001
lds001
2 years ago

Noah – This is just an opinion – right? With all due respect – I don’t know who you are, but Hersh certainly has credentials and is probably better ‘connected’ than most of us in this case.

I find it a little disappointing that the Daily Sceptic allows you to have a full headline article to express your opinion as if we were just having a cup of coffee on a quite important subject – . Its mere placement gives it gravity – but it’s just an opinion from someone many of us don’t know (sorry!)

The DS has been good at providing information that helps balance the MSM – but opinion – I can get that anywhere.

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TheBasicMind
TheBasicMind
2 years ago
Reply to  lds001

Agreed. Noah has given no non “feelings” based reason to doubt Seymour Hersh. And Hersh has said he has insider source confirmation. In his interviews he’s disarmingly matter of fact and very much comes across as having no particular axe to grind, in a way that makes him very credible and, for me, rings no alarm bells. Given his record I have no reason to doubt the guy.

And then for each item on the circumstantial evidence list, there is an easily reasoned counterpoint for saying the US did it. And each point IMO more powerful. So easily reasoned, I wonder how long Noah took thinking about this article before churning it out. It certainly points to a tendency to rushed subjective analysis.

So for the US

Motive: Money. Lots and lots of revenues from US energy supply. Strategic alignment. Prevention of Germany aligning with Russia (which they were VERY much doing without making it explicit).

Risk: Virtually none. The US and U.K. and many western powers can carry out a thousand clandestine operations like this without ever getting caught “red handed.” Who has the power to catch them and confirm the catch? Who would publicly do so even if they did catch them? Indeed the Seymour Hersh article is the perfect illustration of just how aware the authorities are of how little prospect of comeback there is. A full unnamed source confirming it is the US, yet still everyone is in line and there isn’t a peep from any government source indicating there is a problem. The CIA, the Presidents office, the military are all aware how easy it is to herd public opinion. All it takes is one “look, squirrel with Stars and Stripes” statement and all governments and the media drop their pants and fall in line. Look also at how brazen the smear operation against, for example, Julian Assange was. These are organisations happy to operate on an “we know you know, and that’s fine by us because this is a message we are sending. We can ruin lives at the click of our fingers. Don’t mess with us” basis. They literally have zero fear about such operations.

Precedent: Can i really be bothered to continue and cite the examples. The US and CIA. The CIA!

‘Warning: Multiple warnings. Clear loud warnings with hardly even any pretence at a “hint”

Disclosure: Seymour Hersh provided the disclosure!

Last edited 2 years ago by TheBasicMind
57
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jburns75
jburns75
2 years ago
Reply to  lds001

I respectfully disagree. Even if some arguments might be flawed, it doesn’t do any harm to have a debate and read a range of views and opinions, so long as the less mainstream ones aren’t censored.

8
-8
Nearhorburian
Nearhorburian
2 years ago

Ukraine doesn’t have any naval forces in the Baltic.

65
-3
Jon Garvey
Jon Garvey
2 years ago
Reply to  Nearhorburian

“Ah – this is where my theory begins to break down…”

12
0
Pembroke
Pembroke
2 years ago
Reply to  Nearhorburian

Why would you use such a blatantly obvious thing as a ‘naval asset’ if you were performing a clandestine operation?

No you’d use a commercial ship appropriated for the event, probably from a flag of convenience country just for that extra bit of deniability.

2
-1
MTF
MTF
2 years ago

Does Ukraine have the means to do it alone? They don’t have any submarines. They have no access to the Baltic.

70
-3
VWTS
VWTS
2 years ago

One or more of USA/Ukraine/Poland, with the knowledge and blessing of any of those three not directly involved. Would a more specific answer make any practical difference?

20
-3
For a fist full of roubles
For a fist full of roubles
2 years ago

Does anyone really believe that Ukraine could keep quiet if they pulled this off on their own? They are first and foremost driven by propaganda opportunities, and given that no-one on the West would do other than wag a finger at them is they owned up, and would no doubt applaud at the same time, I find Carl’s contention misguided in the extreme.

43
0
Pembroke
Pembroke
2 years ago
Reply to  For a fist full of roubles

The only problem with that would be the NATO aspect, attack one attack all. that would give all the governments something to think about.

On the other hand I doubt Germany will be declaring war on the USA anytime soon do you?

0
0
ebygum
ebygum
2 years ago

The one thing that Germany have confirmed is that in all likelihood Russia DID NOT do it…so that only leaves either their allies, or the country that Germany is sending weapons and money to!! LOL!

The lovely Irish MEP Mick Wallace tells it like it is…..
https://www.bitchute.com/video/7A3aAPxMRker/

“This was a pre-meditated terrorist attack on European critical infrastructure…it was also environmental terrorism…does the EU care?
Has the EU become so subservient to US Empire that you can’t even ask them if they did it? Yous are a fucking joke…..”

Amen to that!

51
-2
jburns75
jburns75
2 years ago

Hersh is a veteran investigative journalist with a reputation to uphold and a lot to risk in crossing an administration demonstrably willing to descend into vindictiveness and gangsterism.

His source might be shaky on the details of exactly how it was conducted (perhaps being party to no more than plans in formation at the time), but they seem to offer an insight that only a senior military figure might have, and it’s doubtful Hersh would have published were that source unreliable or unqualified.

With regards the Kerch Bridge and some other actions, Ukraine might take credit for sabotage operations outside its capability in order to protect those with the capability (perhaps inside Russia, perhaps in another part of the world) from being drawn further and more visibly into the conflict than they might wish, while making continuation of the campaign as costly as possible. Might need to adjust my tinfoil hat, but covert retaliatory sabotage to send a message might explain why a lot of things in the US seem to be going kaboom at the moment.

Last edited 2 years ago by jburns75
10
0
Sontol
Sontol
2 years ago

Handwaving, distracting, irrelevant speculation, versus a simple question:

Would the Nord Stream 2 pipeline ever have been sabotaged if the Russian Federation under President Putin had not decided to cumulate a decades long attempt to prevent Ukraine from moving in an independent and liberal democratic direction by launching an all-out invasion and attempted conquest on 24 February 2022?

Last edited 2 years ago by Sontol
1
-31
Covid-1984
Covid-1984
2 years ago

KJP, Resident Bidens inept Press Secretary, can’t even pronounce Nord-stream and Ole Joe can’t remember yesterday very clearly so it must have been Trump is the go to.

6
0
porgycorgy
porgycorgy
2 years ago

There’s nothing really substantive in this article, unfortunately, and it is patently clear that the USA and Ukraine are deeply intertwined in terms of political, economic and military ‘capture’, and strands of corruption in terms of the Biden family, bio labs etc. Highly unlikely that Ukraine would have needed to orchestrate these explosions – the US and Ukraine act as one.

12
0

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