Peace talks between Ukraine and Russia have been frozen since July, and there’s no indication they’re about to restart. However, evidence has emerged that talks in early April bore fruit – only to be scuttled by the Prime Minister Boris Johnson.
On 8th April (shortly after Russian forces withdrew from Kiev) Johnson made a “surprise visit” to Ukraine’s capital, where he met with President Zelensky. At the meeting, Johnson pledged his “unwavering support” to Ukraine and promised another $130 million worth of “sophisticated weaponry”.
Yet according to Ukrainska Pravda (a pro-Western newspaper in Ukraine) pledging support wasn’t the only reason for Johnson’s visit. “Sources close to Zelenskyy” told the newspaper that Johnson was an “obstacle” to peace talks because he’d brought “two simple messages”.
The first is that Putin is a war criminal, he should be pressured, not negotiated with. And the second is that even if Ukraine is ready to sign some agreements on guarantees with Putin, they are not. Johnson’s position was that the collective West … now felt that Putin was not really as powerful as they had previously imagined, and that here was a chance to “press him.”
This was reported back in May, and was hardly mentioned (if it all) in Western media – perhaps because of scepticism about its veracity.
Fast forward to August, and an article in Foreign Affairs by the self-described Russia hawk Fiona Hill claims that April’s talks did yield a “tentative” agreement:
According to multiple former senior U.S. officials we spoke with, in April 2022, Russian and Ukrainian negotiators appeared to have tentatively agreed on the outlines of a negotiated interim settlement: Russia would withdraw to its position on February 23, when it controlled part of the Donbas region and all of Crimea, and in exchange, Ukraine would promise not to seek NATO membership and instead receive security guarantees from a number of countries.
In the end, of course, no such agreement was reached. But the timing suggests it was Johnson’s visit that scuppered the talks.
As the writer Branko Marcetic notes, this interpretation is bolstered by a Washington Post article from the end of March, which described a “mixed” US reaction: “Secretary of State Antony Blinken expressed skepticism about the talks in Turkey, saying Moscow’s continued military offensive leaves little room for optimism.”
Did Johnson scuttle the talks because he and his American counterparts had concluded, after Ukraine’s initial success on the battlefield, that Putin could be beaten? It’s a real possibility.
However, we should remain sceptical for the time being. Both pro-Russian and pro-Ukrainian commentators have expressed doubt that the “tentative” agreement would have led anywhere. According to writer Anatoly Karlin, a Russian nationalist: “all negotiations fake until proven otherwise”.
In addition, Ukrainska Pravda mentions another “obstacle” to talks aside from Johnson’s visit: “the revelation of the atrocities” committed by Russian forces. So even if there was an agreement, Johnson’s visit may not have been the crucial factor that nullified it.
Nonetheless, the possibility that war could have been over by April if not for the actions of Britain’s Prime Minister is certainly alarming – particularly given the ongoing energy crisis. New revelations may yet emerge, so watch this space.
Stop Press: According to a longer article in Ukrainska Pravda, Johnson said, “if you are ready to sign any agreements on guarantees with him, then we are not. We can with you, but not with him, he will still abandon everyone”. This suggests Johnson was also concerned that Russia would not respect the agreement.
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Did Boris do it? Quite possibly, indeed quite probably – remember those rumours about Boris becoming head of Nato? The real question is, on whose orders? Whether or not he was the messenger, it has been clear for months now that not only do none of the Western countries want to see a peace agreement between Russia and Ukraine, they have been actively inflaming the situation and apparently deliberately escalating the conflict, with the extraordinary amount of weapons being poured into the country.
The Dutch defence minister recently announced, quite generously, that there was no ceiling for the weapons that NL was willing to procure for Ukraine, even as she continued depleting the Dutch military’s own arsenal, to the detriment of our defence capabilities.
Why? Is it really to get rid of Putin? Is it because these f-wits really believe that cutting off Russian gas will persuade Europeans to happily embrace a more simple, colder, hungrier existence to achieve their unachievable fairy-tale of being able to control the climate? To make weapons manufacturers and their financiers even wealthier? To kick off WWIII to cover up the unmitigated disaster these morons have made of the West?
My thoughts too, the war is being used as a smokescreen for too many objectives.
Bunter and the Gumby brothers, Whitty and Vallance, have scuttled the entire British economy and, quite possibly, the Conservative party as well.
So, no question, Bunter is sufficiently incompetent to pretty much scuttle anything.
But the idea that Ukraine was prepared to make a settlement, have any confidence in any kind of treaty signed by Putin, flys in the face of reality.
Ukraine will never trust any peace treaty with Putin and Putin will never withdraw.
This war is set to run and run
Putting aside the various reasons why wars start…
Wars become self-sustaining.
They end only when everyone is either dead or too tired and immiserated to carry on.
Yawn.
There are some medical diseases that cause yawning including bleeding around the heart, brain tumours, multiple sclerosis, strokes, and even heart attacks.
In a spirit of concern for a fellow sceptic, you want to get that looked at.
Agreed…but really it’s more like fricken Groundhog Day…do you think it’s just on a continuous loop?
Groundhog day for many, but not in a good way:
Mobile phone intercept translation:
(R1)=Russian man (R2)=Other Russian man
(R1): Hello, comrade Major, greetings.
(R2): Hello.
(R1): Comrade Major, I have this question, if I write a refusal, does that mean I will be discharged?
(R2): Well, no one has been discharged yet.
(R1): It’s just that, we had an incident yesterday, we should have been going out, well, as support, but our command, they changed their mind on the go, and then the 17th regiment simply refused, and they told us that at 4:30 we will be leaving, they said this to us at 4 that we are going to advance. But we had nothing ready, nothing at all: no plan, “Who goes where and what, who will be at what position”, nothing at all, we would go with no one. And all of our command, the company commander, our battalion commander, they all wrote a refusal. And I wrote it with them yesterday. The f*ck do I need this for, comrade Major? Nothing’s ready, I don’t want to be meat. Will they just return me to the regiment?
(R2): Yeah. A letter will come, then discharged, but I don’t know, I don’t think anyone’s been discharged yet.
(R1): If they don’t discharge me, then on the 15th I’ll write another report, I mean on 15 October, I’ll stay here for another two months and then get the f*ck out of here. […] also, some guy who was with us at this position, they sat on a tank… they had an arrival into the turret, he was 200 [dead] instantly.
(R2): For real?
(R1): Yes, and he’s barely been here for two months, he has a wife and a child, I’ve f*cking lost it.
But yes, it is certainly not in the West’s interests for Putin to profit by his adventurism:
‘….a Russian defeat of Ukraine would turn the proactive Western strategy of economic and political engagement into one of retrenchment, where boundaries could be placed on Western ambition and internal divisions stoked to create paralysis. The question in Eastern European capitals would be that if guarantees to Ukraine were negotiable, where does this leave Article 5?
Divisions would emerge between the proponents of stability, such as France and Germany – eager for pragmatic diplomacy – and those in the Baltic, Balkans and the UK who fear Russian aggression. With NATO fixed by the imperative to assure its internal cohesion it would have little capacity to ‘compete’. This would therefore open the door to a more coercive approach in Georgia and Moldova, where the objective would be to ensure that these countries remain dependent on Russia and within a Russian sphere of influence.
Explicit or implicit assurances to consult Russia on European security frameworks, meanwhile, would demonstrate to Beijing that Moscow is an invaluable ally in preventing AUKUS and other alliances and/or regional security arrangements from being focused solely on the Indo-Pacific.’
RUSI Feb 22 (Pre-invasion)
This is unthinkable for Britain, the U.S,, NATO and, most particularly, Poland, Finland, Sweden and the Baltic States.
It’s really quite simple. Russia wants the West to keep ploughing money and weapons in, ruining its military and its finances. Kiev wants to skim off some of the money. America wants Europe unplugged from Russia. Davos wants a situation where the Great Reset looks like the best option. Europe has gone mad.
Did anybody read about how Europe is now buying Russian gas from China? You can’t make this stuff up.
Truly staggering nonsense. With GDP the size of Spain with triple the population, and unlike the West having to field hundreds of thousands of troops, that is the very last thing Russia want. They actually want(ed) an easy and cheap recolonisation of Ukraine.
Can someone explain to me what kind of foreign policy it is when you say…”the Ukraine has lost some fingers, we are going to cut off our whole hand to help them?”
I’ve been puzzling over it for ages……..
Boris also visited a few days before the much reported ‘offensive’…..coincidence?
You may recall a similar crisis from 1939.
This story is based largely on an incomplete quote. In the original Ukrainian article, Boris is reported to have said:
In other words, Boris wasn’t willing to make the UK party to another Budapest Memorandum. At some point, when states like Russia repeatedly flout all manner of international obligations, there’s no point signing any agreement with them. But that wouldn’t have stopped some bilateral Kyiv-Moscow agreement.
Thanks – I have updated the article.
LOL…..The USA is currently occupying a third of the Sovereign Country of Syria..illegally..meanwhile stealing their oils and food, while the Syrian people starve.
The USA is withholding millions of dollars, stolen, arguably illegally, from Afghanistan, while 90% of that country faces starvation….
The USA has the largest and most persistent debt with the UN….payment is an ‘International Obligation’ ( to everyone who isn’t America of course)….
The USA did not meet the ‘International Obligation’ of the 1993 Chemical Weapons Convention…..and still haven’t.
There are so many examples of the Americans routinely violating article 36 of the 1963 Vienna convention on Consular Relations..that it would be impossible to list them individually…..but 20 years after the immoral and illegal (they KNEW it was based on a fabricated lie) war in Iraq …..39 men remain indefinitely detained in Guantanamo Bay ….and 27 of them have never even been charged with any crime. Many of the remaining men are torture survivors; All of the prisoners have been exposed to the physical and psychological trauma associated with prolonged indefinite detention.
Why would anyone in Afghanistan, Pakistan, Libya, Iran, Iraq, Syria, and many other countries around the world ‘sign’ anything with the lying, stealing perfidious USA?
While I make no presumption of holding Russia up as a paragon, this perverse way of looking at Russia as the only ‘wrong-un’ is ridiculous….It’s wilfully blind to the reckless
provocation of the USA and NATO, which it controls absolutely….and makes no mention of Russia’s genuine reservations and requests for assistance in relation to the upholding of the Minsk agreements….
After Pelosi’s provocative visit to Taiwan…and the furious back-pedalling regarding the One-China Policy…we are now hearing that a $1.1 billion arms deal is being put before the Senate for Taiwan? Oh yes that’s the actions of a benign moral country who wishes to live in harmony with its fellows….PULL THE OTHER ONE!
Top class ebygum.
That will upset the Russia bad fan boys.
Thanks hux…even the propagandised lobotomised nut jacks at the Telegraph are starting to question some of it now…even they are finding hard to believe that the Russians are shelling themselves at Zaporizhzhia nuclear plant!!!
The Russians have been shelling themselves since 2014
Mobile phone intercept transcript translation 16 Aug 22:
‘(R)=Russian man (M)=Other man
(R): That last offensive before home, f*ck knows… not enough tanks, my tanks are dying. It’s such an a*s, it’s so f*cked up!
(M): I know, I know.
(R): You don’t, f*ck, on TV they don’t show this.
(M): I know it’s all bullsh*t.
(R): Out of 30 people we have 11 left now.
(M): F*ck.
(R): So I’m telling you, what’s on the TV is all complete bullsh*t. I’m not being paid money either, f*cks sake, Tan’ka said that the salary should have come with a “combat” payment for a month. Anyway, for two months I’ve got 80 thousand rubles. And it should have already been 400 thousand. I have so many “combat” payments [i.e. payments for attacks]. Do you know where I am, according to the lists? I’m in Moscow! I’m a rifleman-grenade launcher in Yampol regiment. But here I’m driving in a “box” [tank]. So it is. Complete bullsh*t. Guys are without money, I’m telling you, some refuse and don’t want to go, imagine? It’s the third month, but simply no money. And according to the lists they are in Russia. […] Those of ours who f*cked off, who left, they’ve been at home for a month now, and they get paid 80 thousand salary. This doesn’t go outside of the unit [as in the information]
(M): Right, I see.
(R): There’s no one left to fight. The command is completely finished, even our own [troops] are f*cking us, the artillery sometimes fires at us. I didn’t think that after Chechnya I will [get into this], this ain’t war, this is total bullsh*t. Like I said, it’s the last time when I signed up for this army.’
New revelations have emerged as to why any peace agreement ceding the Donbass region to Russia is a very bad idea indeed:
‘As I told you from the very beginning (and even before the operation) – Russian managers are simply not able to establish a normal life in the new territories. Not because they are fools (although most often they are), but because the entire management system is designed not for facing challenges and implementation of new projects, but for stability and control. That is, to support life in the Russian region – yes, bread is baked there, but to arrange the delivery of bread to Mariupol – no, because this is beyond the limits of competence and usual powers. Plus, the law enforcement system is set up so that anything going beyond the limits of authority is stopped and the initiator is punished.’
‘…the new territories will become a zone of humanitarian catastrophe in winter. Restoration of heating and water supply in many affected settlements does not occur. Restoration of housing stock for the most part takes place in the form of window dressing – beautiful houses will be erected on the main streets. There is a hidden struggle for budget contracts – patronage regions, LDNR, Chechens. In addition, people simply have nothing to get by for. Payments to state employees from Ukraine have ended, and those from Russia are difficult to kickstart, even Putin’s 10,000 [rubles], for the most part, have evaporated somewhere. Small business could rectify the situation, but in the Russian system of coordinates it is seen more as a problem. So, for example, in Melitopol, the first thing they banned was street trading, and in Kherson they took away goods for “illegal trading activities.”
Therefore, when you fantasise that Ukraine will die of cold and hunger in winter, you must understand that it will not be the first victim of winter. In the fall, a new wave of refugees may pour in (to Russia) from the occupied territories, and no one even understands where to take them.’
Ex-Ukrainian politician Dimitriyev Telegram channel 31 Aug 22
“New revelations have emerged as to why any peace agreement ceding the Donbass region to Russia is a very bad idea indeed..”
….As some of our Ukrainian Nazi brothers didn’t get to kill or torture enough of them, prior to Russia intervening…
Ex-believer in Ukrainian propaganda…WILKO!
Impassioned and yet entirely evidence free….as usual.
It was Washington which supported the war, aided & abetted by our treasonous PM, by encouraging France & Germany to renege on Minsk II
This is all planned & it’s working brilliantly.
https://www.lewrockwell.com/2022/09/no_author/germany-to-hit-the-wall/
With you 100% BB.
Have we a troll amongst us?
Yes Russian trolls everywhere it seems.
How right you are:
‘Key findings include
‘FCDO Communication Team’
‘“There were people who really flew at [the work] with enthusiasm, and then some who came to work just realizing that all they were doing was nonsense,”
‘“Under any news, whether it’s about missiles, or the United States, or Putin, they’re everywhere, like cockroaches,”
‘Sometimes “trolls” would be expected to respond to another “troll’s” comments or post, to give the appearance of a discussion involving two unconnected users.’
Sergei K, former employee, Russian troll factory ‘Internet Research Agency’
Tell me exactly what the difference is between Russian Propaganda, and the US/UK Ukrainian propaganda being spouted by all of the MSM?
Isn’t it all just propaganda? Or do you genuinely see a difference?
And if you do, what proof do you have that what you think is true and you are not just as propagandised as the next person?
And wouldn’t you think in a supposedly democratic country that we would be able to see it all…and make up our own minds?
Because UK, democracy, free speech, goodies in white hats and all that? But we can’t, can we…because we can only be subject to our own county’s propaganda!! (Because that’s the real propaganda they want you to believe!) LOL!
It’s an absolute replay of the Convid Scam…and as the entire media is owned by around six global consortiums I assume it’s the way that the bought and paid for media will perform for the foreseeable future….
Much better, have a bit of a sit down and a nice cup of tea.
Also try a damp towel on the forehead.
Once you have identified troll factories in this country, let me know so that I can detail the differences between them and the Internet Research Agency while you enjoy your tea…..
The original problem was Russia’s earlier reneging of the Budapest Memorandum, ie the respecting or borders in return for Ukraine handing over its nuclear arsenal. ie setting the scene for the Russian imperialist invasion.
Maybe, but did the PM really need to stick his nose in to a conflict which is between two non-NATO nations?
Is it really in the best interests of one’s citizens to refuse to negotiate peace?
What is the purpose behind Zelensky condemning any citizen who receives humanitarian aid from the Russians as a collaborator who will be punished as such? Humanitarian aid to the citizenry is part of the Geneva Convention. Zelensky’s action has demonstrated that he doesn’t care about the law or the welfare of his citizens.
The US have publicly stated that they will wage war until the very last Ukrainian. Doesn’t seem to be about the Ukrainians at all to me.
The first casualty of war is Truth.
If our MSM & political class cared about truth, then there would be no censorship of the news. Technically, we’re not at war. Yet NATO has been training & pouring in weaponry since 2014, since the Maidan Coup.
Don’t accept blindly what either side publishes. Read both if you can find it & follow some independent journalists. The ones who just film, observe, question & leave the analysis to their audience. The ones who are taking in food, medicine, water to the citizens who have been starved, bombed & injured. Note I’m saying that we need to look neutrally at the information before us; listen to what the citizens on the ground have to say about it to a neutral in response to open statements such as “Tell me what has been happening.” “What has life been like for you these last x amount of time?” “Where did you get food/water/medicine from?” The responses from the citizens are illuminating & bear no relation to what the MSM are reporting.
As always “Cui bono?”
War zones are perfect situations for child sex trafficking. See Gabbi Chong’s website for hard evidence of the sheer extent of this malevolent trade & the echelon’s of power who are involved. Our governments are not our friends.
My conclusion is that this is a conflict engineered by the CIA as a proxy war against Russia on European soil to bring about the economic collapse of Europe as a vehicle for bringing in food rationing linked to digital ID, biometrics & hasten the implementation of One World Government. They are already pushing for a One World Army via the UN & a One World Health Service via the WHO. Both of which are led by former terrorists.
Any differences between us is wanted to deflect our attention from the real agenda.
Your last para sums the situation up completely.
Correct, it’s also who will be in charge of all that…essentially about American hegemony..Therefore they have to ‘big up’ Russia and China as the enemy…if they didn’t what would we need a US led NATO for?
…they were never Ukraines, they never had the codes, they always belonged to Russia…
the international community would not have allowed them to keep them anyway……red herring…….how many more times?
Nope.
‘Undoubtedly, the expenditure of billions of dollars to obtain a nuclear deterrent would have been extremely straining for Ukraine given the dire state of its economy. In addition, Ukraine’s president, its scientists, and especially Ukrainian diplomats understood that Ukraine’s decision to develop a nuclear weapons program would incur international isolation, sanctions, and possibly collapse of its civilian nuclear energy industry, which was dependent on Russia for fuel and which provided some 30 percent of Ukraine’s energy. And yet it seems that Ukraine had a far greater indigenous technological capacity and a nuclear starter package than other nuclear aspirants like India, Pakistan, or North Korea that doggedly pursued a nuclear option and, despite economic hardship and international opprobrium, succeeded.’
WWICS Dec 2017