U.K. Orchestra Provokes Outrage by Dropping Nearly Half Its Performers To “Prioritise Increased Diversity”

The English Touring Opera faces a backlash after sacking nearly half its members in the interests of 'prioritising diversity'.

8 min read

The English Touring Opera has unceremoniously sacked 14 of its white members, some of whom had worked there for decades, after its recently-appointed Musical Director held auditions “prioritising diversity”. The move has proved sufficiently extreme to anger even the Musician’s Union, which has hitherto been an advocate for such policies. The Daily Mail reports:

The musicians, aged 40 to 66, have been told they will not be offered contracts with the company in Spring 2022 citing diversity guidance from the Arts Council England, the Sunday Times reported. 

The musicians, who officially work as freelancers, can be dropped from the opera season-on-season but many have played with the company for up to 20 years and consider it a permanent job. 

The Arts Council England has hit back at the ETO, which it funds to the tune of £1.78 million a year, saying it never encouraged the company to sack musicians.

“We did not instruct the English Touring Opera to send this letter,” the Council said. “We are now in conversation with ETO to ensure no funding criteria have been breached.”  

The unfortunate artists received the following from the orchestra’s director:

Dear …,

I am writing to advise you that English Touring Opera is going through some significant changes over the next few seasons.

Some of these changes will directly affect the composition of the freelance orchestra engaged to tour.

It does seem likely that ETO will not be in a position to offer you a freelance engagement in the Spring 2022 season, even if we would like to leave the door open for freelance engagements in the future.

The orchestra has always changed, season to season – just as the company on stage and in the wings has changed regularly – but for a few reasons there will be quite a bit of change now.

As you know, the company has appointed a new Music Director, Gerry Cornelius. Gerry will be involved in advising on freelance orchestral engagements, as you would expect; he has been tasked with working with Phil Turbett on shaping the modern orchestra, and there have been recent auditions to inform that work. 

English Touring Opera is committed to increasing all kinds of diversity in its team, and while there have been appreciable, steady advances on stage in this area, we have prioritised increased diversity in the orchestra. This is in line with the firm guidance of the Arts Council, principal funder of ETO’s touring work, and of most of the trust funds that support ETO.

I appreciate very much the commitment and achievement of all the freelance players who have achieved such high standards for ETO during my tenure with the company.

I know that all those players have achieved distinction in their work with other groups, in their teaching, and in many other fields. I recognise, too, that this last 18 months have been extremely difficult for freelance artists and technicians.

I know that you are not likely to read gratitude into this message – but I assure you that I do feel grateful for what you have brought to ETO in the seasons during which you have played so far.

James Conway

Director

The orchestra has compounded the backlash to its actions by issuing a follow-up statement on its website awkwardly attempting to defend its position, following a slew of negative press attention:

English Touring Opera engages freelance orchestral musicians for seasonal work, on the basis of excellence, in the same ways as singers and technical staff are engaged for seasonal work. For decades, English Touring Opera has worked with different players for different repertoire and with specialist period, contemporary and chamber groups. When players are engaged for a season, they are advised that a seasonal booking bears no obligation for player or company for future seasons.

This summer English Touring Opera held open auditions for orchestral musicians in order to continue to hear the very best artists in this country, and strengthen the broad pool of players on whom the company calls. Panellists for those auditions were Gerry Cornelius (Music Director), Holly Mathieson (Associate Artist), Philip Turbett (Orchestral Manager) and guest Chi-Chi Nwanoku (distinguished orchestral musician, and founder of the Chineke! Orchestra). The auditions were immensely rewarding and exciting; several musicians were offered opportunities to work with English Touring Opera for the first time, based on their ability.

English Touring Opera Director James Conway wrote to a number of players who had performed on tour with the company in seasons 2018 and 2019, but who were not going to be asked for Spring 2022, to advise them of this, to thank them for their work in other seasons, and to indicate that English Touring Opera could ask them to perform in future seasons. …

English Touring Opera is proud of its commitment to the community of high-quality freelance musicians on which the company depends and welcomes talent from the wide range of backgrounds represented amongst them. We will continue to consider every opportunity to work with staff and artists from increasingly diverse backgrounds, wherever we find professional excellence and know that this ambition will only improve the quality of our performances.

We recognise the Musicians’ Union mission to champion all their members and are confident that the Union will continue to find English Touring Opera a supportive and fair producer.

The orchestra’s management appears to be attempting to claim after the fact that since no-one is technically employed full-time, it reserves the right to drop them whenever it likes. This might be technically true although the letter sent to the musicians in question makes it quite clear what the reasoning is.

The Musician’s Union, the organisation ostensibly tasked with defending the interests of those in the already precarious world of the performing arts, spent much of 2020 meekly asking for more bailouts and grants from the Government while wholly endorsing the lockdowns and related policies which decimated their own members’ livelihoods. Incidentally, it also had precisely nothing to say about what effect vaccine passports might have on the touring prospects of its members who, for whatever reason, have chosen to decline the offer of a Covid vaccine.

It did however find time to host various virtual seminars on trendy identity politics issues for its baffled and newly insolvent members, sat at home and often not qualifying for the Self-Employed Income Support Scheme (SEISS), due to having set themselves up as limited companies or by having just over 50% of their income from a PAYE source such as a teaching position. Sensing objection among the ranks, and perhaps after a raft of hasty departures, the Union appears to have deleted all its tweets before June 2021 and largely steered clear of such obscure topics since.

Nevertheless, the Union was “appalled” at the heavy-handed tactics of the ETO, and released the following statement:

The Union is appalled to hear that a number of members have been sent a letter by English Touring Opera (ETO) stating that they will not be booked for the 2022 tour. This equates to almost half the orchestra losing their roles.

Many of the members who have been told they will not be booked for the 2022 have been performing with ETO for 20 years or more, and even those who have been with ETO for fewer years have been loyal to the company season after season. …

While the MU lauds efforts to increase diversity in the workplace, this should be achieved fairly and legitimately, not by “sacking” half an orchestra.

We have spoken with Arts Council England at length about diversity and inclusion and ways in which this can be appropriately promoted within the orchestral sector. The unexpected and brutal decision taken by ETO risks undermining any positive efforts Arts Council England (ACE) might make in this regard. The MU will be writing to ACE to officially raise a concern about ETO in this regard.

There has been an understandable outcry from MU members in response to this news today. It comes at an especially devastating time for our freelance community and musicians in general, with so many struggling with little work and income during the COVID-19 crisis.

One can’t help but note the irony of an organisation like the MU balking in this way at the real-life consequences of the kinds of policies it has been pushing for. It’s not made clear exactly what speed of change they would be happy with, or how representative (or indeed over-representative) they would like any given music company to be, but the cognitive dissonance is striking.

One musician friend of mine shared with me his letter on the matter to the MU (shortly after leaving it), which sums it all up pretty well:

Dear X, …

You’ll remember that my resignation letter contained a warning about the obsession with Equity and Diversity being necessarily zero-sum and divisive, as well as useless in addressing any real prejudice and disparity or redistributing opportunities.

Not a day goes by without seeing positions advertised to musicians of diversity X or Y only, or getting calls from fixers asking me to recommend a ‘non-white, non-straight, non-male musician’ for Z.

These practices used to be called “discriminatory”. They are now called “non-discriminatory”. Just like “inclusion” really is “exclusion”. A beautiful paraphrase of the 1984 dystopian slogan: “War is peace, freedom is slavery, ignorance is strength.”

The MU has been working tirelessly to create precisely this perverse system of incentives for producers. Acting “appalled” now that it all comes to fruition reveals the extent to which the organisation is out of touch. This is the world you created.

I certainly feel vindicated in my decision to withdraw my support, but I hope that this regrettable incident might act as a wake-up call.

Regards,

Stop Press: Zoe Strimpel writes in the Telegraph today that “the sacking of white members of the English Touring Opera shows how woke will destroy the arts”.

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121 Comments
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RickH
RickH
5 years ago

Of course – I’ve just clocked one saying of the bleedin’ obvious that hasn’t been said in the trip down the backwater of immigration:

This issue has nothing to do with immigration. It’s about British society and British citizens.

Mark
Mark
5 years ago
Reply to  RickH

Amazing ability you have to just repeatedly deny the undeniable, presumably because you are desperate to refuse to admit it because it’s just too important an issue for you to face up to.

These harmful antiracist policies are instituted directly to address supposed “problems” that were created by mass immigration, and clearly could not ever have existed in the UK without prior mass immigration. Yet you barefacedly declare they have “nothing to do with immigration”. Quite a remarkable degree of shameless denial.

TheBigman
TheBigman
5 years ago

Things like this is what will contribute to our demise in the planned conflicts with China et al that are in the pipeline.

marebobowl
marebobowl
5 years ago

Please do not join MSM in attempting to divide people. Thanks. So many other issues to address like kids being given a experimental dangerous biological by the state, without their parents consent.

BungleIsABogan
BungleIsABogan
5 years ago

I sincerely hope Arts Council England remove all funding given to English Touring Opera.
I very much doubt they will somehow though.

fionab
fionab
5 years ago

As an ex-pro musician who used to be a member of the MU, I’m encouraged to see such an accurate summary/expose of the selfish incompetence of this union, who have largely stayed invisible to the public eye, hiding behind catchy slogans like ‘Keep Music Live’ whilst doing little in practice to protect the livelihoods of musicians. Their silence has been deafening throughout lockdown … but don’t worry, folks – as soon as there’s a national strike, they’ll be mobilising unpaid jazz bands to keep up morale on the picket lines. They’re really good at that.

chris c
chris c
5 years ago

Meanwhile In Other News, white people told to stop playing the blues.

RickH
RickH
5 years ago
Reply to  chris c

… or you don’t book white bands.

You’re right – it’s a total nonsense. But we do have the Catch-22 of ‘cultural appropriation’ which covers blues and jazz being banned to whiteys 🙂

Of course – diversity in music is crucially important, but not when identified with colour- or gender-sensitive head-counts.

There would be no western popular music without that cultural inclusivity.

Rogerborg
Rogerborg
5 years ago

Ah, but are they Judenfrei yet?

Because that’s exactly where these policies end up.

It’s not “inclusion”, it’s dehumanising.

richteabiscuit
richteabiscuit
5 years ago

I was a classical musician (now a therapist) and played with ETO for a season. The players are my friends and I can say with absolutely certainty that they are some of the most decent, thoughtful and all-inclusive people I know. They celebrate musicians from ALL cultures and corners of the world. The principal cellist taught Sheku Kanneh-Mason, the esteemed young cellist. I’ve taught alongside the co-principal in a London state school, taking music out into communities at a grass-root level. Many players partake in community music initiatives. In fact, there is a big drive in the classical music world to bring opportunities to everyone, particularly children who otherwise might not be exposed to it.
Orchestras obviously must ensure that, when advertising and selecting people for audition, it’s done in a fair and inclusive way.
The issue, I guess, is that, in terms of skin colour, many musicians have white skin. They’re not necessarily British. Far from it. We have many Russian and Eastern European players. Of the non-white musicians, players from the Far East probably make up most of those numbers.
I can’t believe I’m talking about people’s skin colour like this – it feels uncomfortable but this is… Read more »

Mark
Mark
5 years ago
Reply to  richteabiscuit

“I can’t believe I’m talking about people’s skin colour like this – it feels uncomfortable but this is the territory towards which we are being pushed.“

This is the tell-tale sign that you are approaching a societal taboo issue.

In this case, there is an intentionally manufactured cultural taboo dating back to the mid-late C20th around “racism” that was designed to suppress dissent on multiculturalism and mass immigration.

“So, in order for it to be diversified, it needs to be given more time and financial support in the state education system. We need to provide opportunities for everyone from any culture to learn to the highest level if we are to have diversity at the highest levels of performing.
This simply cannot happen NOW. It takes years and years of training to learn an instrument to the level expected in the profession.“

This issue is one of the harms inflicted upon our society by mass immigration.

But how it should be addressed (apart obviously from halting ongoing mass immigration to reduce future harms – that should be a gimme), it falls into the distinction between top down, coercive authoritarian solutions preferred by authoritarian radicals and bottom up, longer term naturally… Read more »

richteabiscuit
richteabiscuit
5 years ago
Reply to  Mark

I realised that I question the term “diversity” too because I’m not sure, in the context of ETO’s actions for example, that it means inclusivity in the broader sense. But I’ll have to think further about this before I come to any conclusion.

RickH
RickH
5 years ago
Reply to  Mark

“This issue is one of the harms inflicted upon our society by mass immigration” ( (re. educational deprivation)

Of course it’s not down to that. Only a total migration obsessive would come to that conclusion.

Mark
Mark
5 years ago
Reply to  RickH

You appear to have misinterpreted what I wrote. I was not addressing educational deprivation. I was referring (pretty obviously imo) to the supposed need to “diversify” every body and institution, in response to problems directly and obviously created by mass immigration.

I suppose your rather perverse misinterpretation is likely related to your seeming desperate need to pretend that issues around antiracist totalitarianism in response to supposed “racism”are magically nothing to do with the mass immigration your side has spent decades pushing on the country.

Like so many of the predictable and predicted consequences in this area, these things “just happened”. Who could have foreseen such consequences eh?

RickH
RickH
5 years ago
Reply to  Mark

“ I was referring (pretty obviously imo) to the supposed need to “diversify” every body and institution”

Apologies for misinterpreting.

But you’re still wrong. The imposition you are writing about is not an inevitable consequence of diversity per se – it is a bureaucratic-style imposition – originally a virtue-signalling exercise from the uninvolved, like the ‘community cohesion’ question that used to wind me up when it was on the Ofsted check-list of the blindingly f.ing obvious characteristics of a school to any seasoned observer.

I agree that the use of diversity as a hammer has become more sinister as it has been taken up by the powerful.

Mark
Mark
5 years ago
Reply to  RickH

“The imposition you are writing about is not an inevitable consequence of diversity per se – it is a bureaucratic-style imposition – originally a virtue-signalling exercise from the uninvolved“

The supposed problem that this imposition is supposedly aimed at solving is an inevitable consequence of diversity created by mass immigration – it is unavoidable that such a policy will create different levels of penetration of senior or desired positions in many if not most areas of the victim society. How could it not?

Yes in theory we could have elected wise conservatives who, after putting a crash halt to further mass immigration to limit the ongoing increase in harm, decreed that this is a problem that should be left to resolve itself organically over a few generations. That would have avoided the problem of the disastrous top down woke discrimination “solution” we are facing, though doubtless it would have involved problems of its own.

But if you claim to believe that would have been allowed to happen, I am going to say you are lying.

RickH
RickH
5 years ago
Reply to  richteabiscuit

That’s a lot of observed sense (despite the illiterate constant finger-twitcher)

“many musicians have white skin. They’re not necessarily British”

… and, indeed, if you talk about origins rather than colour, then that’s patently the case, and the diversity is seen throughout Europe.

There is the hard fact that classical music derives from a dominantly white European culture – so historical dominance of European musicians is hardly a surprise. Doh! (The dominance of black American musicians in the fields of Jazz, Soul, Blues etc.is similarly unsurprising).But, as time has moved on, so this simple definition is changing without assistance from those with twisted cultural knickers who attribute everything to colour bias.

“This simply cannot happen NOW. It takes years and years of training to learn an instrument to the level expected in the profession.”

Precisely. And the pressures against inclusion, starting in the early years, are more wealth and class based than racially skewed. Thus my previous comments about the need for attention to educational opportunities.

Hugh
Hugh
5 years ago

No such thing as positive discrimination, just discrimination. Fair chance – yes. Discrimination – no. Margaret Thatcher had it right: “there’s a system – try it”. No woman only lists for her.

tom171uk
tom171uk
5 years ago

What if an orchestra sacked 14 black musicians to create jobs for white players? That would be called racism!

Cristi.Neagu
Cristi.Neagu
5 years ago

So… these people were racially discriminated against. They should sue, and let’s see the hard decisions that judge has to make: either admit that white people are people too, or admit that racial discrimination is legal now.

rtaylor
5 years ago

This is what happens when you have 2 generations of corrupt public servants after being ‘schooled’ through the education system.

I’m an English Hindi with Indian heritage, what I’m seeing is straight up racism against those from Anglo-Saxon heritage since the 2008 financial crash/ Obama era. All the woke bs is coming from the corporations – and we all know which same old families run them.

stewart
stewart
5 years ago

The one group with no diversity whatsoever is the billionaire class.

Where is the outrage about the lack of diversity in that group?

NeilofWatford
NeilofWatford
5 years ago

First they came for the trombonists, then the wind instruments…

Nearhorburian
Nearhorburian
5 years ago

Strangely, the same approach isn’t used when selecting the England football squad: there would be more South Asians than Africans

sjonesy1999
sjonesy1999
5 years ago

I no longer watch any TV with adverts because of the constant diversity rammed down my throat.

Mark
Mark
5 years ago
Reply to  sjonesy1999

Report yourself to your nearest Diversity Centre for reeducation, citizen.

Until you have done so, your Freedom and Health Pass will no longer allow you the privilege of access to social facilities such as shops, pubs, gyms etc., and in any case your National Digital Wealth Wallet has been disabled until you have demonstrated a more responsible and pro-social attitude.

Baron_Jackfield
Baron_Jackfield
5 years ago
Reply to  sjonesy1999

We record everything and almost never watch “live” TV… That way we can skip through all the advert breaks at 30x speed, it shortens the programs (especially those from the satellite channels with 20 mins of adverts per hour) and insulates us from all the woke crap.

kzv
kzv
5 years ago
Reply to  sjonesy1999

Don’t watch TV at all… you’ll feel so much better

RickH
RickH
5 years ago

It’s ironic that I recently used the changing composition of orchestras over the last (say) 50 years as an example of real change – citing the use of ‘blind’ auditions as an example of positive initiatives to counter subliminal prejudice. Similarly, the creation of the Chineke! Orchestra (mentioned in the article) is a positive initiative aimed at addressing fundamentals.

And make no mistake – prejudice can and does play a part in selection in many areas.

However, this sort of reverse discrimination is entirely counter-productive, as it doesn’t tackle any root problem and labels any musician so employed as ‘not really up to it’ and resented by colleagues. It’s just the same in any field that tries this sort of stunt.

Pointless.

I think this extract from the quoted letter sums it up well :

“You’ll remember that my resignation letter contained a warning about the obsession with Equity and Diversity being necessarily zero-sum and divisive, as well as useless in addressing any real prejudice and disparity or redistributing opportunities.”

There is a job to be done – but it isn’t this. Much more important is to tackle the inherent class bias that has worsened with the shrinking resources put… Read more »

KidFury
KidFury
5 years ago
Reply to  RickH

There’s no such thing as “reverse discrimination”. There’s just discrimination.

Noumenon
Noumenon
5 years ago
Reply to  RickH

I don’t think Monteverdi, Mozart, Liszt, Wagner or Shostakovich did blind tests or similarly “scientistic” gimmicks for trying to improve orchestras extra-musically.

How on earth did they outshine everything in the last 50 years!?

Stephanos
Stephanos
5 years ago
Reply to  Noumenon

This quotation from Die Zauberfloete might help to put things into context:
Papageno: Bin ich nicht ein Narr! Es gibt ja schwarze voegel in der welt, warum den nicht auch schwarze Menschen?

RickH
RickH
5 years ago
Reply to  Stephanos

Not sure of its relevance – although Papageno is a bit of a Narr 🙂

RickH
RickH
5 years ago
Reply to  Noumenon

I think your missing the point. Big time.

For a start, they weren’t known as orchestral players, or in a competitive job market.

… and that’s before you get to narrow confusion over limited subjective listening preferences!

huxleypiggles
huxleypiggles
5 years ago

Somebody has leaned on the ETO. Probably one of Bozo’s cohort or possibly one of his NWO gaffers. Either way the intention is to cause tension, fear, misery and worry for both the dismissed and the remainers. This will also cause upset across the industry.

All deliberate.

Wherever it is possible to sow divisions within society an excuse will be found.

Evil, evil people now running the show.

Annie
Annie
5 years ago

Odd, you’d think that a professional orchestra would want to engage the best players.

martinbritnell83
martinbritnell83
5 years ago

I can honestly say that I absolutely hate being alive right now. What’s the point? Covid bullshit regulations and the wine brigade stops everyone enjoying their lives. Life is for living not just existing. That’s what’s happening right now… we are existing!

rayc
rayc
5 years ago

To make you feel like shit and eventually act out is the slave masters’ plan. They want to identify and pick out and register early on any potential troublemakers, so that they can be put under observation and more cost-effectively curbed in the future.

KidFury
KidFury
5 years ago

Stop being a little bitch and pick your chin up.

Jesus you think you have problems, you have no idea what real damn problems are

Noumenon
Noumenon
5 years ago
Reply to  KidFury

Yes sergeant Hartman!

Sergeant_Hartman.jpg
Norman
Norman
5 years ago

Look, I am terribly sorry for being a white man, but there is nothing I can do about it since blacking up is likely to get me prosecuted.
I am sorry my family has come from a long line of Essex peasants who were exploited over centuries by the lords of the manor and were illiterate until the late 1800s.
I am sorry that my great grandfather left the village and went south of the river to better himself, and that he and his son (my grandfather) managed to improve their lot and ended up living in a small terraced house with no indoor facilities until after WWII.
And I want to apologise for my father who by dint of hard work progressed from telegram delivery boy at 15 to head postmaster some 35 years later.
I dread to think what would have happened if my family hadn’t benefited from white privilege

KidFury
KidFury
5 years ago
Reply to  Norman

Enjoy that privilege old chap!

thinkcriticall
thinkcriticall
5 years ago

Off the immediate topic but:
NHS Nurses. You are angels, but It’s time to make a stand!
https://twitter.com/jetixfreddy/status/1439503464485302275?s=20

rayc
rayc
5 years ago

The road to hell is paved with good intentions. The best cure for authoritarian activism is to let the activists taste their own medicine.

I am Spartacas
I am Spartacas
5 years ago

Diversity is the acceptable face of anti-white bigotry.

Julian
Julian
5 years ago
Reply to  I am Spartacas

I don’t think it’s as simple as just anti-white bigotry. Not in the UK anyway. It’s a combination of people with chips on their shoulders, often manipulated into that way of thinking, and evil bastards who can see that using “wokeness” or whatever term you want to use will allow them to grab power and be important.

James Conway, ETO director general, is white. I don’t imagine he hates white people. Gerry Cornelius is half white and I suspect an awful lot of his friends are white and I doubt he hates white people either. They either sincerely believe in diversity or it suits them to pretend to do so.

I am Spartacas
I am Spartacas
5 years ago

I wonder if black people get tired of wealthy white middle-class liberals telling them how disadvantaged they are?

I certainly would.

KidFury
KidFury
5 years ago
Reply to  I am Spartacas

The soft bigotry of low expectations.

I am Spartacas
I am Spartacas
5 years ago

“Can you cite one speck of hard evidence of the benefits of “diversity” that we have heard gushed about for years? Evidence of its harm can be seen — written in blood — from Iraq to India, from Serbia to Sudan, from Fiji to the Philippines. It is scary how easily so many people can be brainwashed by sheer repetition of a word.”
― Thomas Sowell

RickH
RickH
5 years ago
Reply to  I am Spartacas

“Can you cite one speck of hard evidence of the benefits of “diversity” 

Yes – the UK.

Mark
Mark
5 years ago
Reply to  RickH

Ok, explain how the supposed benefits to the UK of “diversity” outweigh the costs. And not the benefits to the corporate types who enjoy the benefits of undercutting wage bargaining strengths, the radicals who enjoy the benefits of weakening traditionalist resistance to their policies (“rubbing the right’s noses in diversity”).

The costs include:

Loss of freedom of speech

Loss of freedom of association

The institutionalisation of discrimination

Relative loss of support for traditional attitudes and institutions

Security issues consequent on large culturally distinct communities with uncertain external loyalties

Totalitarian attitudes, laws and structures put in place to address those uncertain loyalties and consequent threats

Introduction of race- and ethnicity-based conflict where it did not exist previously

The outright destruction of numerous indigenous working class communities and the immiseration of large sections of entire generations of those communities, who just didn’t like having their society, culture and racial balance changed willy nilly around them.

Hugely increasing population levels in an already sufficiently populated island.

The response of mass immigration pushers to most of those costs is just to deny them or to say that it’s the faulty of the victims for not liking their “enrichment”. Which is the usual response of… Read more »

RickH
RickH
5 years ago
Reply to  Mark

You have illustrated your cart-before-horse myopia perfectly in your list of ‘costs’ – attributing causation of these to an non-causal variable that seems to occupy your whole horizon.

I have actually lived in a very culturally diverse community, and none of your alleged consequences emerged as salient characteristics in any serious sense. Yes – I can, for instance, recall a minor argument about religious sensitivities to public art – but what I remember is its resolution within a coherent community framework. Similarly, one candidate for a headteacher post once accused myself and the appointment panel of discriminatory attitudes … when we had actually appointed a woman to the post – a fact that I pointed out; the accusation didn’t fly.

No – this argument is not about actual diversity on the ground.

Mark
Mark
5 years ago
Reply to  RickH

The fact that these problems don’t manifest in every community within the nation obviously doesn’t mean, as you try to imply here, that it is not, where it does occur, a result of diversity. That’s a simple logical failure on your part. Not all communities are vulnerable to the worst harms, but many are. But all the things I listed have clearly been consequences of mass immigration and the resultant “diversity”.

You don’t need laws against free speech to suppress “racial hatred” if there is no problem of racial division.

You don’t need laws against freedom of association to suppress “racial discrimination” if that is not a significant problem in the country.

You don’t need race-based “positive discrimination” practices if there is no significant racial diversity to address.

Etc.

I am Spartacas
I am Spartacas
5 years ago

The racial discrimination of “diversity”.

Tee Ell
Tee Ell
5 years ago

I don’t think diversity of races was the problem, it’s diversity of playing standards that’s the real issue here.

They’re all really good, it’s impossible for the lay person to get in.

It’d be far more exciting if they let lots of incredibly bad gong players join.

Julian
Julian
5 years ago
Reply to  Tee Ell

I guess you’re partly joking, but it’ll come to that. Especially in the US they have minority quotas and preferences for entry to universities with different criteria applied from one group to another. Equality of outcome is a bone-headed way to run a society.

KidFury
KidFury
5 years ago
Reply to  Julian

Yes because Asians work so hard every school would be basically be all Asian. So they’re punished.

It’s fucking ridiculous.

I read a story once where a girl who was half Asian and Half Latino got rejected from loads of scholarships, and her dad told her the next year to put her ethnicity as Latino instead of Asian..she did and was flooded with invites.

RickH
RickH
5 years ago
Reply to  Julian

‘Equality of outcome’ isn’t really the issue. Inequality of opportunity is – and is undeniable.

But I do agree that trying to create a proportionate outcome without addressing fundamentals is bone-headed.

Julian
Julian
5 years ago
Reply to  RickH

Well, equality of outcome seems increasingly to be what is used to measure progress and by extension is becoming an objective in itself. Obviously measuring equality of opportunity is trickier, equality of outcome is simpler, but I believe it to be ultimately unhelpful.

KidFury
KidFury
5 years ago
Reply to  Julian

It’s not only unhelpful, it’s reductive. Trying to blame an outcome on a single variable like race is fucking dumb. Anyone doing it has an agenda.

RickH
RickH
5 years ago
Reply to  KidFury

Not everyone has an agenda – it can just be stupid, short-sighted naivety.

What they do is identify the superficial – be it race or gender – as the fundamental issue, whereas you have to unpick a lot more to understand imbalances, and what to do.

What is really stupid is not to recognize that short cuts are more likely harmful than helpful.

RickH
RickH
5 years ago
Reply to  Julian

“equality of outcome seems increasingly to be what is used to measure progress”

I agree that it is used by advocates of the mickey-mouse solutions to multi-faceted issues, and adopted by ‘controllers’ as a useful divide-and-rule technique.

(When in active politics – quite a while ago – I used to ask holders of safe seats who were advocates of ‘positive’ discrimination “Why don’t you resign your seat so that you can be sure of getting a female elected?”. It never seemed to happen).

RickH
RickH
5 years ago
Reply to  Tee Ell

It’s an incredibly competitive occupation, so there’s always a surplus of fine players – that’s where the control comes from.

But because of this, a full-time orchestra has a tremendous incentive to pick the best rather than quotas. And, actually, diversity has actually increased because of that pressure – although, in ethnic terms, this has tended to benefit players of Asian heritage and women.

TheGreenAcres
TheGreenAcres
5 years ago

The sacked musicians should form their own alternative touring orchestra and allow the paying public to vote with their wallets

I am Spartacas
I am Spartacas
5 years ago

If I were black and I discovered that the only reason I had been hired was due to the colour of my skin rather than my talent then I’d feel absolutely insulted and tell them to poke their job.

Julian
Julian
5 years ago
Reply to  I am Spartacas

I suspect a lot of people from “minority” groups feel exactly like that, and rightly so as they are being used and patronised. But the grievance industry uses powerful propaganda to fuel enough people’s resentment to allow this kind of thing to continue.

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