Postcard From Nordrhein-Westfalen
I’m publishing another postcard today, this one from Nordrhein-Westfalen in Germany. The author, who has written under a pseudonym, is a professional musician and life has been tough, as you would imagine. But as he explains, he’s been more fortunate that most.
I live in a smallish town in West Germany and am a musician. Needless to say work has been pretty hard to come by but luckily I have been able to continue some of the teaching and we are back to some type of normalcy, face to face without a mask, after having utilised Skype in less than optimal circumstances. I have also benefited from a emergency state loan some of which may have to be paid back, any of the funds not paid back will be subjected to tax as income.
I am one of the lucky ones. I have a few English friends who are not as fortunate. One – an Echo winner of a few years ago – has seen his income dry up almost completely as he does not teach, lives in a different state where his loan is much less generous and has only a few recording opportunities. The rest were cancelled long ago. Another works for an orchestra which tours the world. At the moment they are trying to find ways of possibly giving concerts locally in the near future. Needless to say a full compliment on stage is impossible and the restrictions still being enforced mean the audience would be reduced to a figure of around 25%.
Worth reading in full.
Template Letter to Object to Mandatory Face Coverings in Schools
The pressure group Them For Us, which has been tirelessly campaigning for schools to re-open, has created a template letter for parents who want to object to mandatory face coverings in schools when they re-open in September. I’m reporting it in full below.
Dear [Governor of School, copying Headteacher and relevant Local Authority]
I am writing in relation to the [newsletter] from school dated XX July 2020 (the “Newsletter”). In the Newsletter, you explained amongst other things that:
“[insert relevant rule requiring wearing of masks in school.]”
(the “policy”)
I and my child have strong objections to this policy. I do not consent to [name of child] wearing a face covering in school.
I must also stress that I understand there to be serious legal problems with your policy and that, if implemented, your policy would be potentially subject to legal redress including by way of proceedings in the Administrative Court.
Public Health England does not, based on current evidence, recommend the use of face coverings in schools and this is reflected in the recently issued guidance (which you are required as a matter of law to have regard to) from the Department for Education:
“They are not required in schools as pupils and staff are mixing in consistent groups, and because misuse may inadvertently increase the risk of transmission. There may also be negative effects on communication and thus education.”
(the “Guidance”)
Your policy – the requirement for pupils to wear masks – is contrary to the Guidance, and could lead to the adverse educational outcomes referred to in that Guidance. Mandatory mask wearing is likely to have a disproportionate and damaging effect upon students. In particular, I am concerned about the effect face coverings have on:
* Breathing, especially if the mask is worn for long periods or during sport
* Restriction of interaction with peers compounding the existing mental health damage
* Limitations to learning and educational outcomes
* Increase in anxiety as a result of an alien environment and behaviour
In legal terms, the policy is accordingly at present irrational and disproportionate and therefore unlawful. You have failed to provide cogent and intelligible reasons as to why you consider that the school should depart from the Guidance.
In light of the serious welfare, health and learning, and legal issues at stake, you must reverse this policy immediately, and issue new school guidance to that effect. If you fail to do so, you are required to explain the policy in further detail, in writing, including providing me with a copy of all risk assessments you have undertaken in relation to such measure, and all supporting evidence by reference to contemporaneous internal documents.
I look forward to hearing from you as soon as possible and certainly within seven working days of receipt of this letter.
Yours,
Elusive Report Found
A reader has found the elusive report I blogged about yesterday and which shows more than 200,000 people dying as a result of the lockdown in a reasonable worst case scenario. It’s here. It was published last April, but received no attention until Sir Patrick Vallance mentioned it when testifying before the House of Commons Science and Technology Committee last Thursday. Makes for very interesting reading.
Number of People Testing Positive Dwindles to Almost Nothing
As the Government’s propaganda shifts from focusing on the daily death toll (approaching single digits) to new cases, a reader has looked at the number of people testing positive as a percentage of the total tested (see above). Turns out, the percentage of people testing positive is also rapidly approaching zero.
Bull Stat on the BBC
A reader flagged up a bit of idiocy in BBC News story:
There was an interesting Covid bull stat for you in aside on the BBC News story on govt pay increases today. They suggest that that more than 300 NHS workers have fallen to Covid 19. If we assume it’s 400, and there are 1.4m NHS employees, that is a fatality rate of 0.03% at this point, i.e. really very low given that presumably much of the NHS was at greater risk of exposure than the population as a whole, and fairly reliable given the decent amount of testing for health workers.
Chris Whitty Admits Virus in Retreat Before Lockdown
Chris Whitty appeared before the House of Commons Heath Committee yesterday and admitted that the lockdown may not have been necessary after all. According to the Times
The coronavirus epidemic was probably already in retreat before full lockdown was imposed, the Chief Medical Officer for England has said as he insisted there was no “huge delay” in government action.
Interestingly, he put a different spin on Sir Patrick Vallance’s testimony to the House of Commons Science and Technology Committee last Thursday, which was widely interpreted as Sir Patrick claiming Sage had advised the Government to lock down a week earlier than it did.
Last week Sir Patrick Vallance, the government’s Chief Scientific Adviser, said that Sage had advised on March 16 that more draconian measures were needed. Professor Whitty said today that Sir Patrick had not been referring to full legal lockdown but the advice on avoiding needless travel and socialising that Mr Johnson issued that day.
“Quite a lot changed that led to R going below one well before, or to some extent before, March 23”, when full lockdown was imposed, Professor Whitty said.
More Under-25 Year-Olds Died From Influenza in 16 Weeks in 2014/15 Than COVID-19 This Year
There’s a fascinating table on the website of the Winton Centre for Risk and Evidence Communication (see above) comparing the data on different causes of death in 2020 up July 3rd with the data for a typical 16-week period in previous years. It shows, among other things, that more under-49 year-olds died of suicide and injury/poisonings in 2018 than Covid in 2020.
Round-Up
Here’s a round-up of all the stories I’ve noticed, or which have been been brought to my attention, in the last 24 hours:
- ‘A second Great Depression? Unemployment crisis hits big cities hard‘ – Depressing news from America about the devastating economic impact of the state lockdowns
- ‘Masks Likely Do Not Inhibit Viral Spread‘ – Forensic analysis by Dr Joseph Mercola
- ‘A New Understanding of Herd Immunity‘ – Good piece in the Atlantic suggesting the Herd Immunity Threshold is less than 20%
- ‘We may already have herd immunity – an interview with Professor Sunetra Gupta‘ – Professors Gupta gives another interview in which she says we may have achieved herd immunity already
- ‘Nine out of ten leading causes of death were below average in June – or were they just wrongly attributed to covid?‘ – Interesting bit of analysis in InProportion2
- ‘Harmful lies spread easily due to lack of UK law‘ – BBC report on the House of Commons Digital, Culture, Media and Sport Committee report which argues that the spread of “misinformation” about coronavirus, e.g. that it originated in a Chinese biolab, makes the case for state regulation of social media even more urgent
- ‘Repeal the decision to implement compulsory face coverings in English shops‘ – Sing this petition on the UK Government petitions site and get the issue debated in Parliament
- ‘Medics and media stoke fear of virus “second wave”‘ – Another piece by the excellent Will Jones in Conservative Woman
- ‘Covid could become the new common cold?’ – Surprisingly sound piece from by UnHerd‘s Tom Chivers
- ‘Coronavirus deaths drop by almost one third in a week, ONS figures show‘ – Telegraph report on the latest ONS stats. The virus accounted for less than five per cent of all deaths in the week ending July 10th
- ‘SARS-CoV-2-specific T cell immunity in cases of COVID-19 and SARS, and uninfected controls‘ – Important peer-reviewed paper in Nature about the likely immunity to COVID-19 conferred by T cells
- ‘What It’s Like to be Cancelled‘ – Podcast for the Critic featuring Free Speech Union members Mike Mcculloch and Nick Buckley, as well as yours truly
- ‘Why is the Chancellor giving teachers a pay rise for failing to teach our children?‘ – Ross Clark poses a good question in the Telegraph
- ‘A cluster randomised trial of cloth masks compared with medical masks in healthcare workers‘ – BMJ study shows cloth masks are… drumroll… completely useless. The attempts by the BMJ to caveat this (“this study does not apply to COVID-19/SARS-CoV-2”) are laughable
- ‘Health experts have derailed Britain’s post-Covid recovery and transformed us into faceless paranoid creatures‘ – Excellent stuff from the Sun’s Trevor Kavanagh
Theme Tune Suggestions By Readers
Only one today: “Paranoid” by Black Sabbath.
Small Businesses That Have Re-Opened:
A couple of months ago, Lockdown Sceptics launched a searchable directory of open businesses across the UK. The idea is to celebrate those retail and hospitality businesses that have re-opened, as well as help people find out what has opened in their area. But we need your help to build it, so we’ve created a form you can fill out to tell us about those businesses that have opened near you.
Now that non-essential shops have re-opened – or most of them, anyway – we’re now focusing on pubs, bars, clubs and restaurants, as well as other social venues. As of July 4th, many of them have re-opened too, but not all. Please visit the page and let us know about those brave folk who are doing their bit to get our country back on its feet – particularly if they’re not insisting on face masks! Don’t worry if your entries don’t show up immediately – we need to approve them once you’ve entered the data.
Note to the Good Folks Below the Line
I enjoy reading all your comments and I’m glad I’ve created a “safe space” for lockdown sceptics to share their frustrations and keep each other’s spirits up. But please don’t copy and paste whole articles from papers that are behind paywalls in the comments. I work for some of those papers and if they don’t charge for premium content they won’t survive.
We created some Lockdown Sceptics Forums, but they became a spam magnet so we’ve temporarily closed them. However, we can open them again if some readers volunteer to be moderators. If you’d like to do this, please email Ian Rons, the Lockdown Sceptics webmaster, here.
Gone Fishin’
Thanks as always to those of you who made a donation recently to pay for the upkeep of this site. If you feel like donating, however small the sum, please click here. I’m on holiday in Italy until Saturday, July 25th and won’t be doing my usual amount of work on the site until I return. If you want to flag up any stories or links I should include in future updates, email me here.
Salem 2.0
I thought I’d give my readers something to chew on while I’m away: Salem 2.0: The Return of the Religious Police to the Public Square. This is a book about cancel culture that I’ve been working on for a while now, but which took a back seat during the coronavirus crisis. Hoping to get back to it as the crisis recedes – although that’s happening more slowly than any of us hoped. It’s a work in progress, so don’t expect too much.
To join in with the discussion please make a donation to The Daily Sceptic.
Profanity and abuse will be removed and may lead to a permanent ban.
Thanks Toby!
The trevor Kavanagh article is awesome. Good for the widely-read Sun!
Yeah, and look at. the comments. Those from zombies have been sturdily down-voted.
If the Page 3 masses are revolting (…) there is hope!
Hope is out there!
Those comments are encouraging, your right. Amazing coming from Sun readers.
Why ‘amazing’ from Sun readers?
Why? lol
That was an excellent article and this pretty much describes well what I’ve been seeing:
Should be circulated more widely and the architects of this shit-show should be forced to read this.
The article states : Health experts have derailed Britain’s post-Covid recovery and transformed us into faceless paranoid creatures. But it’s not the health experts that have mandated compulsory muzzling – in fact they have been very circumspect about the benefits of face nappies. I believe this has been mandated because of perceived public opinion. Excellent article though.
Fair point. But most of the Covicrap has originated with health ‘experts’. Who are actually killers, of mind, body and spirit.
The health “experts” are hand picked for the advice they are expected to give to fit the “narrative”. Like the dodgy dossier.
Puritan oppressors, masquerading as our liberators.
In a dramatic U-turn, US President Donald Trump has …… urged Americans to wear face masks …..
“We are asking everybody that when you are not able to socially distance, wear a mask,” he said. “Whether you like the mask or not, they have an impact. They will have an effect and we need everything we can get.”
Torygraph live 9.46am
and so trump plays us
just like the rest of the political establishmet
Yup, I was disappointed to hear Trump succumb to the mere exposure effect
More likely it is Trump playing the US press.
They automatically oppose everything he says, so now that he has said face masks are ok, they will attempt to discredit facemasks.
Remember the only reason the US left wing backed muzzles is because Trump opposed blanket use of them.
Perceived public opinion and lobby groups working against us to force social change…masks4all.org.uk
It’s all out of the SPI-B playbook. The ‘health experts’ just take the money and spout the nonsense. Contradictory is fine – just leaves us all more confused and feeling powerless. Remember though that we’re not!
About time The Sun printed something like this. The BASTARDS.
At this stage, I really think I have almost stopped caring. Everything is really really broken. It’s too late. Anything I can do is futile. The people need to live with what they have created. The people need to get themselves out of this.
To hell with it all.
Not futile! We are not alone. That’s becoming increasingly obvious.
Our quiet resistance sets an example. Talk to people, educate them. Many just need to know they are not alone either.
Get outside. Breathe. Stop trying to fix world, fix yourself first.
This comment deserves three gold stars!!!
On the rare occasion I look at The Sun comments section it looks like it is populated by uneducated / or paid trolls who put down any lockdown sceptics with a barrage of abuse and threats. I wonder if this is the work of the 77th Brigade? or if the readers are really like this?
https://www.wkyt.com/2020/07/18/hardin-co-couple-gets-ankle-monitors-after-covid-19-quarrel-with-health-dept/
Hardin Co. couple gets ankle monitors after COVID-19 quarrel with health dept. – wkyt.com
Sheesh!
Land of the free?
Home of the brave – or the deluded.
Ron Paul Exposes Big Holes In The COVID ‘Spike’ Narrative
http://ronpaulinstitute.org/archives/featured-articles/2020/july/20/big-holes-in-the-covid-spike-narrative/
Hospitals failed to test staff for coronavirus because they feared sending too many home, MPs told
https://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/2020/07/21/hospitals-feared-testing-staff-coronavirus-avoid-sending-home/
They could write the definitive textbook on how NOT to handle an epidemic!
Y o u ‘ d e v e n t h i n k i t w a s p a r t o f a p l a n . . .
Why is the Chancellor giving teachers a pay rise for failing to teach our children? AND COMMENTS
https://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/2020/07/21/chancellor-giving-teachers-pay-rise-failing-teach-children/
Please quote one or two.
Top two comments:
“What is Sunak thinking! Rewarding one of the key sectors of which the majority failed dismally to do their jobs during the pandemic. So many other people have lost all their income or taken large cuts, as well as so many trying to work as well as teach and care for their children.
I fear that those being paid by the public purse are faring too well and those in the private sector too badly. This is a new divide.”
“Good article. This Government is becoming more Socialist by the day – throwing taxpayers money around like confetti to the Public Sector who don’t deserve it.”
Agree 100% re teachers but can’t agree with the blanket public vs private sector statement. Far too simplistic.
I know tradesmen that have said they are folding their companies the very second the bounce back loans are recalled. I also know minimum wage local authority carers that have been truly shat on.
It irritates the hell out of me too but as I was saying, there are public sector workers that have worked through this as well (properly – not from home). If I had my way, I’d end furlough and recall all loans tomorrow. See how anxious everyone is about returning to work then…..
Rishi doesn’t do it for me I am afraid.
Agreed. Teachers are top of my ‘hit list’ as they’ve been having a jolly at the expense of the development of our nation’s children. How they can accept that pay rise with a straight face beggars belief.
Regarding the politicians – the term Augean stable springs to mind.
Augean Stables applies to the entire Establishment as far as I’m concerned! Neither has one single area of our public sector proven itself fit for purpose. I accept many good people work within it, but severe overhaul is long, long overdue.
I suspect Sunak is trying to soften them up so that they don’t refuse to go back in Sept on the excuse that it’s ‘not safe’. It won’t work – the more they are given, the more they will want…
Quangos, Charities, MPs, Public Health England and the National Health Service immediately spring to mind. Feel free to add to the list.
Just to mention tthe implication of the Dolan case ruling – schools were never shut. Too much for my brain, but exactly why were teachers not showing up for work?
2+2=5.
Some teachers have been working throughout, of course.
Yes, my daughter-in-law is a reception class teacher. She has been working throughout and has been providing work for her pupils who have not been in school, something which is very difficult to do for reception class children. As we have been caring for our reception-aged grandson throughout lockdown, she has also been sending work for him to do as his own school has sent nothing.
If you get a chance, listen to PMs questions from today.
Winnie the Pooh features, is this government in Britain in the 2020.
On the other hand maybe not listen until your blood is at a bit less pressure.
The whole cabinet are worse than the idiots we see on “The Apprentice”
kh why don’t you have a pricing policy for council workers who smugly work from their back garden pay more, and those in private sector pay less and more reduction if lost job.
Probably not ethical, legal or feasible but would take the smirk off their faces!
Certain public facing council staff here are due back Oct 1st. I am raising a lynching posse for the afternoon of Oct 1st.
My point. These various start dates are entirely arbitrary to the national need. But everyone already knows that of course.
I agree with you, the public v private issue is complex, but this is what it will descend into come the Autumn. When some millions from the private sector are made redundant post furlough or compelled to take pay cuts there will be fury at public sector pay rises.
Of course anyone with any sense will be wondering where the money comes from with the inevitable decrease in GDP, decrease in tax revenue and increase in welfare bill.
I’m dreading finding out.
My state pension just about covers stuff like council tax and broadband, plus yearlys like house and car insurance.
It doesn’t come anywhere near covering my very simple everyday living costs and I need to top up a fair chunk each year from my “savings” which will no doubt be plundered.
Hopefully some of your savings are in gold, Cheese ?
Those savings could well be inflated away.
Other possibilities include bail-ins, but I’m not sure that will happen as the government bunged money to banks to prop the private sector up (which they dutifully didn’t do).
Don’t worry though, the mask-wearing masses have carefully weighed up all eventualities with even greater diligence than the government.
I said from the start that the Corona responses have deepened the divide between civil servants and cs final salary pensioners the one hand and the rest.
This was and is even more pronounced in Germany, France etc..
Germany is one of the most indebted countries in the world if public sector pensions were capitalized, for example.
The Lockdown related destructions have already given those
people a 15%+ relative pay rise over most others, not to mention the even more increased safety of it and their income, and a much larger pay rise over those who really suffer and who are constantly asked by these lazy destroyers of their livelihoods to continue to show ‘solidarity’, while they themselves show none.
I have also stated from the start that this will eventually lead to a civil war between the have no mores and the still haves, whose start date Sunak has now just brought forward.
Besides the insulting injustice of this, it is simply not possible to finance, as the crushed private sector will eventuay have to generate all the funds for all government spending and borrowing.
And in the long run, what cannot be cannot be.
Interesting look at the money on Jeremy Vines show just now.
If you earn £1 per second it would take 11 days to earn £1 million.
To earn £1 billion (UK presumably) would take 34 years, scary
I have two children in school. One doing A Levels and one should have sat GCSE’s. Only two teachers out of about 12 seem to be spending a reasonable amount of time engaging with the children on a regular basis. One other is producing some sort of work and nothing from the rest. It’s disgusting.
Schools are crap. Look at the millions of high-calibre of brainwashed idiot they have filled the country with. Obedient compliant drones with no knowledge of anything that matters, no critical thinkers.
I really think that if millions of people just took their kids out of school and home-schooled in 10 years time we might see a renascence in the standard of education of our young people.
Schools are like prisons for children, even more so now. I would not send any child of mine to any school now. I feel lucky we don’t have any children. Really.
I homeschooled my son for just over a year and with little effort he was way ahead (at least a year) when he returned.
Plus, I really don’t want them to go to university because of all the bull shot that’s going on in them at the moment…
People come out of university now more stupid than they went in.They cant even say what a woman is.
I fail to understand why the left wing teacher unions hate the Tory government so much. This Tory government is so left wing they should be applauding them. Mrs Thatcher would have given them performance related pay. That would have resulted in an 80% pay cut.
The teachers who didn’t rise to the challenge should give their pay rise to the unsung carers COMMENTS
https://www.telegraph.co.uk/women/politics/teachers-didnt-rise-challenge-should-give-pay-rise-unsung-carers/
The Covid-19 vaccine news is promising, but don’t get your hopes up
https://www.thetimes.co.uk/edition/times2/the-covid-19-vaccine-news-is-promising-but-dont-get-your-hopes-up-3p75fkgrh
Why would I have “hopes” for a Covid vaccine when that will just create more opportunities for novel pathogens to jump the species barrier?
Not to mention all the MSM and covhitlers jumping up and down trying to force mandatory vaccination!
I think this will happen too, although I don’t think the vaccine will actually work at all, so it probably won’t.
Why would you want an unlikely vaccine for this mild infection?
Boeing Running Out Of Space For Newly Built 787 Dreamliners
https://simpleflying.com/boeing-running-out-of-space-for-newly-built-787-dreamliners/
Sad for them.
Hey, did you see this in the same publication?
https://simpleflying.com/united-uniforms-to-masks/
Have the Remainiacs given up on reversing Brexit or do they really think they can undermine the Referendum vote with their version of the Russia hoax and get a rerun?
I guess they might have a game plan of getting Starmer’s Labour (ie Blair’s Labour) to cancel the result (with the agreement of the EU) and reinstate our EU membership to be quickly followed by a rigged rerun involving a gerrymandered voting roll which will deliver a Remain victory.
All countries try and influence opinion in other countries. We do it ourselves. We saw during the Referendum campaign that both the US President and the Irish Tsaioeach tried to influence our vote. Whilst I very much dislike such influence it is a fact of life and countries like Saudi Arabia, China, Qatar and Iran have also had a v. insiduous effect on our country’s culture and politics. China’s influence via WHO on how we deal with the Covid epidemic has been very concerning. The focus on Russia has a malign and calculated purpose.
We’ve given up, and accept the shitshow that will ensue, along with the shitshow we’re currently enduring, because people (maybe you?)thought it was a good idea to vote for a known liar and wastrel, and believed his bullshit about £350m for the NHS. There are many of us on this forum who are not dyed in the wool tories, and who wanted to stay part of Europe, so why don’t you cut the insults and focus on the topics.
‘cut the insults … shitshow, liar, wastrel, bullshit, toreees’
BJ is of course the new Blair.
Suggested reading, Varoufakis ‘And the Weak Suffer What They Must?’ and Mody ‘Euro Tragedy’ to start.
Your suggested reading is patronising. Stating that Boris is a liar is fact, not insult, and if you don’t think our current situation is a shitshow I wonder what you’re doing haunting these pages.
Emma, don’t know if you’ve noticed this before but it may come as a shock to you that Politicians both sides of the divide lie.
You can talk about the “£350m for the NHS” but what about leaving the EU causing “World War 3” and the many economic scaremongering stories that filled our screen during the lead up.
Even if people didn’t vote for a Politician 1 who is a “known liar and wastrel”, they would’ve only then voted for Politician 2 who is a “known liar and wastrel”.
So what choice do people have? Either way you end up with a shitshow!
No, I voted for Corbyn, and I don’t think many people would accuse him of being a liar or a wastrel.
What an extraordinarily idiotic comment – what about, just as a starter all his lies related to the anti-semitism issue and his support for terrorist organisations? He is one of the vilest, most hate-filled liars in the country!
You clearly need to stop swallowing the narrative on that, as you have done on Covid.
This “Corbyn is an anti-semite” trope has pretty much got us into this mess. Pushed by every media platform in the elections Enabling a Tory landslide, giving them total control to roll out their fascistic agenda.
Corbyn is not an anti Semite, he is just critical of the state of Israel and the way they treat Palestinians.
It was actually the similarity of the establishment media falsifications about Corbyn that primed me to be alert when the same sort of fabrications and decontextualised exaggerations began to emerge over Covid.
When you see the dirty fingermarks of the security infrastructure all over a narrative – be it two ex-heads of MI6 dancing in partnership , a SAGE propaganda sub-group or 77th Brigade – you should start sniffing for dead cats.
He also just happened to support every past communist regime like Cuba and Venezuala. The man is an utter scum bag and I met him a few times when I was much younger and he was the same then as was McDonnell and Abbot.
Lest you forget Emma, Corbyn’s response to BoJo’s lunacy was to say “see? This insane spending in emergency circumstances totally justifies my economic policy”
I spoiled my ballot in the last election as I couldn’t endorse the tories either but Corbyn would be leading us into economic oblivion faster if anything, and that’s ignoring issues such as the proposal to let non british citizens vote in general elections which was put unveiled at the labour party conference. Many are angry with Johnson but it’s not like there was a good alternative.
Well you have him in the persona of Johnson so be glad.
Ye gods, not the £350m story again – this had no influence on the outcome of the vote AND it has been adjudicated as typical politico-speak. By comparison, the lies and Project Fear from the Remoaners undoubtedly scared some folk into supporting staying in the EUrinal.
Remoaners, remainiacs, EUrinal, ‘it has been adjudicated’ ffs grow up.
Emma. I am glad you post to LS. The same for ian and Julian skipper and all.
Each of you make this page stronger by differences. Thanks to each of you for adding to my own gloomy 2020. Not so keen on arguements because here on LS at least we have more more in common than what devides us, as the saying goes. But genuinely I appreciate all comments – i even miss grantm.
I’m not dyed in the wool, but did vote Tory last time out, and voted Leave. They have been a huge disappointment, but can you honestly say we would be better off, in relation to covid, under any other party? Or if we were staying in the EU? I think that’s a tough argument to make stick.
Anyway, there are few enough of us that I think we should try to focus on what unites us rather than what divides us. If Corbyn came back as leader, recognised lockdown had been a huge mistake and promised to get back to normal, now, and I really believed he’d do it, I would vote for him. Ditto for any other party. This virus madness seems a million times more important than every other political question, to me, at the moment.
It’s academic isn’t it? Who knows. I do think if you voted for Boris, and then he turns out to be useless, lazy and incompetent, well what did you expect? Maybe Corbyn would have taken the same path, but I don’t think he would have lied and dissembled his way through the last four months.
They’re all the same, how can you be so naive?
I think party politics is totally irrelevant now.Whoever was in charge I think we would have the same outcome.Has the labour response in wales or the SNP in Scotland been any different.Even the Brexit argument is redundant now.The divide is now between authoritarians and libertarians.
Hear hear.
If there is ever to be another general election, what will be the turnout? A record low is my prediction.
All depends on the economic fallout.People who have lost jobs and homes are unlikely to be apathetic.And if they allow us to vote again.
I didn’t expect miracles from him, certainly. Corbyn may be more honest, I just disagreed with a lot of his policies. Labour have been pretty solidly pro-lockdown etc. Anyway, as you say, academic, would rather focus on where to go from here.
I agree, Starmer is also a disappointment but then I didn’t vote for him.
It would be hard to imagine anyone more bungling and incompetent than the government we have but at least they are trying to get out of it. There’s a bigger risk with a Corbyn government that they would have used the situation as an excuse for cash raids of the “rich”.
Brexit sowed the seeds for this calamity. It was the thin end of the wedge.
I’m not sure how you get to that conclusion – maybe you could elaborate? Similar madness exists across the world. But unless it informs where we go from here, maybe it doesn’t matter too much.
THIS IS WHAT HAPPENS if people vote for a bunch of Fascists who have no opposition. I did try to warn people. Obviously I was just a conspiracy theorist.
I spoiled my ballot paper. Voting is pointless. Our electoral system is totally broken.
2-6 yes it is broken. You could have said if people dont vote you end up with the same.
Look to the west. Is Biden and Trump the best that 250 million people have? Boris/Corbyn the best we have? It is rigged in the sense that the people are presented with an illusiin of choice, the globalist goals have continuenty with succesive government from either side.
On the point of ww3. It is the politicians of the world that cause the wars. The people of the world are mostly not interested in fighting.
A spoilt ballot paper is not the same as a no vote. They are counted.
Yes spoilt are counted. But ineffectual. If people spoil or don’t vote the result will be the same. Not at all to criticise anyone who does either.
The citizens assemblies are another example of the pointlessness. Democracy is broken. Put selected (ahem at random) public groups in charge of policy. Pump selected citizens with government ‘independent’ information to guide their choice. Then get a policy decided upon by 1000 citizens. The system of governance remains broken.
I say spoilt vote or no vote amount to the same as voting for a party. Taxes up with less to show for them. More national debt, less freedom and wars carried out in our nations names.
Hitchens theory was that if enough people stopped voting Conservative, that party would die or be replaced or reborn by a small-c conservative party that reflected people’s conservative views. Sort of what UKIP did in a way – forced their hand on a specific issue, by threatening them with electoral irrelevance. It may be too late, and may never have worked, but I think there’s a strong argument that Hitchens was right.
I voted Remain, and I’m pretty disgusted with how the ‘remainiacs’ have weaponised lockdown to attack the government. However, I disagree that Russian interference is run of the mill and I think the government have behaved appallingly. Brexiteers have made hay with ‘democracy’, and I accept that remain lost, however, I think it is a mistake to brush off Russia like this. And whilst I now care more about protecting our institutions and the integrity of our system (see: Lockdown!!!), we are a broad church here, all united in our scepticism, and we need more and more people to join us. I don’t think it helps to be so combative. A very turbulent world is approaching, politically especially, I think it’s incumbant on us all to be respectful, even when we disagree. I think, give it 12 months, brexit really will be the least of your worries.
I haven’t looked into this Russia thing much – assumed it was mainly just a distraction tactic. Maybe I am wrong. I’m no great fan of Russia, but unsure why they’d be so interested in us. Anyway, without any Russian help we have managed to utterly screw ourselves up on our own.
The teachers who didn’t rise to the challenge should give their pay rise to the unsung carers COMMENTS
https://www.telegraph.co.uk/women/politics/teachers-didnt-rise-challenge-should-give-pay-rise-unsung-carers/
A load of reasons why wearing a mask is USELESS in protecting ANYBODY against COVIDS and why wearing one is INSANE!
https://www.primarydoctor.org/masks-not-effect
Good summary, from a quick scan. A lot of the research sounded like it was undertaken in lab conditions. Real world conditions will be far worse. Probably 60% will never change or wash their masks and 95% will be fiddling with their masks all the time, so facilitating face-finger-surface transmission routes for infections. Go exempt (if you have a valid reason- and you probably do) and treat mask wearers like lepers!
‘treat mask wearers like lepers’ indeed but make Them do the Covid Quick Step if they’re so worried.
Why are leaders around the world now mandating muzzles? Macron is clamping down. It really concerns me that Trump, the avid anti-masker, is now wearing one and looks set to make them mandatory. What is going on?
Yes – a very worrying development that he seems to be coming under the thumb of other powers-that-be: what levers do they have to pull on him and what next from him? Signing up to the Paris Agreement?
One doesn’t get to a top position unless one is blackmailable, intimidateable, or mind controlled. Or a combination of these things.
Can anyone tell me what has happened with the recently introduced forums on this site? I can’t see any link to them. But some familiar names are missing from this comment thread which makes me think they must be on the forums…
Me to, tried the search function which just brought me back to the main page.
Try this link:
https://lockdownsceptics.com/
The we’re closed because they were spammed. Toby mentions above – they can be opened if people volunteer to moderate.
This is better though – the forums were a bit random and not hugely contributed for many topics (last time I looked)
Yes, a forum needs a certain critical mass of activity to actually get going and it never got there. Agree that this page is great, but it starts to become unusable once it hits around 700 comments, which tends to be by around 6 in the evening every day.
I don’t disagree. Just to add a small coment that perhaps there is more possibility of some comment and info being read by passersby on this thread than in a forum. I don’t know if it’s true. I think its important this thread is as public as possible.
Of course a forum does have all manner of benefits about accessing and archiving which this thread doesn’t.
‘More under 45s died of road accidents than Covid19 ‘
The road accident figures appear to be from 2018. Given that most private cars and white vans were parked up for three months I would expect this years figure to be lower but, as a result of being cooped up in a crappy flat with unstable parent(s) the numbers of murdered children and teenage suicides is, sadly, likely to be much higher.
It may well be higher this year as because of the reduced traffic on the roads more people are driving faster, people at home who are bored and turn to drink and drugs who then take the car out and smash it up, and with children not being at school then there is the likelihood of more of them being run over whilst out playing.
The stats are really interesting but appear to be compare apples with pears. Surely, the Covid-19 stats are just for part of a year whereas the other figures are for a full year. Or I have got that wrong?
No, you’re right. However, with Covid deaths dropping to nothing, the point may still stand come December.
If you follow the link the the study then took an average 16 week period and compared with covid for same period
Right now the UK government, my Quebec government, and many other governments around the world have told us that we cannot renew drug prescriptions, shop in grocery stores, bakeries, etc without wearing a mask and that they have the legal right to refuse us these daily necessities on pain of fines or jail. What happened to the United Nations Declaration of Human Rights? Crickets.
It lacks a 2nd Amendment, so they laugh at it.
Could you try working on First Nation people? If your omniprivileged hunter-gatherers decide that face nappies are against their Primitive Rights, it could start something.
Hey folks, we need a worldwide anti-mask, anti-lockdown movement, don’t we?
I play chess with a bunch of people in the bar on Mondays. Love it. Yesterday I got in a conversation / debate with one of my chess friends about whether the lockdowns were a proportionate response to this virus and tried to talk about the real statistics, the longer term effects on society, especially our youth etc. Turns out that one friend has swallowed the government / media propaganda hook, line and sinker. He was so upset with my point of view that he wanted a punch up. Luckily, he was the only one out of four of us who thought that way and the rest calmed him down so I do not have a black eye today.
I have been reflecting on this and have come to the conclusion that people’s belief in what they are being told is very similar to a religious belief but is actually more closely related to being addicted to drugs. The only way to recover from a drug addiction is to reach rock bottom. From there you can work your way up. Perhaps the only way the world can recover from this self imposed crisis is to reach rock bottom first.
Unfortunately, it takes a while……..
It’s a cult. All the descriptions of cult victims’ behaviour fit Covizombies exactly.
It’s curable, but takes time. Psychiatrists are going to be heavily overworked.
I have two friends – both singers – who have swallowed (and gold-plated) all the bait.
Both are still quarantining post and grocery purchases for 3 days (when asked what happens to chilled and frozen goods, these are apparently less dangerous and just get wiped with a disinfectant!).
Both unwilling to enter anyone else’s house, even well apart and with ‘panty liners’ on their faces.
Practice for a forthcoming charity gig (if it happens!) involves them standing in the garden 2 m + apart while I play piano inside, communicating by microphone only. I refuse to wear a face nappy, so the door can only be open a crack. Just as well, because it’s 34° out there!
They bring their own refreshments and even chairs – clearly our garden chairs don’t get enough UV.
Still finding it hard to believe how apparently sensible people can fall for all this cr*p.
Well done Alec for having the patience to deal with the ‘excentricities’. My tactic would to take the piss in the most facetious way. Entirely wrong. Well done you!
I would love to ask the pair where they feel this all gets back to normal for them.
I limited my sarcasm to expressing concern about the risks of lightning strike (“a lot of thunderstorms about at the moment”) and – with great difficulty in keeping a straight face – meteorite impact.
Both have swallowed the ‘only back to normal when we get the vaccine’ line.
beginning to wonder if they want to cull the stupid (with their amazing vaccine)
This has crossed my mind too, anon.
You need new friends, these people sound like a nightmare.
You’re right.
Both (and their spouses) used to be normal people – if somewhat left-oriented for my libertarian philosophy.
But I nearly described them as (former?) friends in my original post.
Both are good singers so the musical aspect continues but social activities have completely stopped since the house arrest phase. Both couples are ‘voluntarily isolating’ and shaking in dread of the second wave.
Can’t help wondering what the [expletive deleted] point is.
Alec, do you know if there is any resistance at all in France? I have been searching for a french “lockdown sceptics equivalent” but didn’t find any…
We had a classical concert in the local church a few weeks ago (before compulsary facemasks), public was mostly masked but thankfully the musicians behaved normal and were seated close to each other.
People really do take any counter-narrative against the cult of covid as a personal attack. It’s pretty ubiquitous.
I am not going to talk to anybody today. Getting ready for Friday! Actually the problem is my wife thinks I am talking too much about the corona thing. So today it’s going to be flowers, general chit chat, more compliments, more fun! I’m sure by the end of the day she will ask “are you feeling all right” and I will say …………… …………………………………………..
Have a good day!
It’s an ill wind, eh?
We all know the Covid death stats are also exaggerated by recording many deaths incorrectly as Covid. I know of a number of elderly deaths of Cancer but recorded as Covid. We will never now know the true extent of the data manipulation from the authorities because autopsies have not taken place and the evidence cremated. Why would they manipulate the data? Simple – to justify their actions and avoid cries of incompetence.
Dispiriting encounters with 2 friends yesterday, both of whom are committed adherents to the ‘we must prevent a second wave and stay safe mantra’.
The first is a good friend who has admittedly been under the weather-eye infection, not caused by Calamitous Covid, but who is now claiming that the Lanarkshire outbreak indicates the need for continuation of house arrests and listening to Nicola on a daily basis.
Some members of her family have been infected and are now enduring varying degrees of post viral fatigue- which has been around, as we know, for many years.
The second woman, who normally leads an active social and family life, told me that she’s been too afraid to go out for the entire lockdown period, apart from taking her dog for walks.
I’d always considered her to be a reasonably robust individual.
What particularly saddened me in both encounters was the dismissal of the damage which continues to devastate livelihoods and prospects as this lunacy drags on.
I mentioned instances of mass redundancies, lack of education ,penury, anxiety, missed medical and dental appointments to no avail.
My somewhat cynical conclusion is now that under this blinkered fear is a refusal to feel any solidarity with those whose lives are being destroyed: the collateral damage which unfolds as the mask madness continues.
One cannot win the argument.
I’m afraid a lot of us are losing friends over this bollox. Maybe when it’s over they can be re-socialised.
A member of our choir has e-mailed to stay she is ‘still shielding’ and won’t come out till mid-August, for which she (quote!) ‘can’t wait’. In other words, she has not been outside her house, and possibly garden, since mid-March. This in a small Welsh village bathed in sea air. Five months of living death, herself her jailer.
I sense an inner personality at work with your friend. Could a freshly baked carrot cake and flask of friendly tea be employed to save her?
A neighbour here self-jailed as your friend has been wincled out in stages (ongoing) by nervous picnics in a near by park.
She would probably have to quarantine the cake for 3 days – and the tea will have long gone cold.
Well, I guess the punishment fitted the crime!
I just dont understand people to be honest. I am 60 so not exactly young but have to admit I felt no fear of this right from Day 1 and have lived my life as near to normal as other people will let me, right from the start. Visits ,outside or inside or trips or handshakes ,hugs and kisses were all ok with me. I also instinctively thought why should I take orders about who I could hug or kiss or anything else from some Billy Bunter buffoon who has shagged everything that moved since he was at Oxford. It is beguiling when friends who you have known for years and thought they were logical and rational people suddenly start behaving like terrified mice and hiding indoors. Myself and all others on this site of all political persuasions clearly do not have the same genetic make up as these people. I am sure people will lose many more friends over this than over Brexit.
There must be psychological reasons for this. When you are in a state of fear the reasoning part of your brain is shut down and you just follow the herd or something.
Agreed.
Yesterday I saw drivers and many walkers out in the open air wearing masks.
This is completely irrational.
And sometimes masking little children, which is not only irrational, but very cruel. Dystopian.
Yes. Children as young as 5 by law here.. it is cruel and unforgivable.
Where is that? I’ve seen 2 young children here in the NW UK in them (aged about 7). It seems like child-abuse to me.
Why Great Britain of course. Allow me to quote directly from the Nicola Sturgeon laws of scotland –
Face covering exemptions
Some people are not required to wear a face covering.
These include:
children under 5 years of age
police constables or workers such as paramedics acting in the course of their duty
staff such as drivers or checkout assistants who are physically separated, by blah blah blah.
Child abuse. I agree. I do not see sturgeon is a proud person I see her as a fucking wretch.
Makes me angry just thinking about the evils that are cause these satanic ideas to be rolled out.
Yes it disgusts me that.
They also crap themselves if you get within 5 metres of them, even though they are wearing a mask and gloves. I guess in a months times they will be in full Hazmat suits!
On my way out of Morrison’s this morning, I approached a man who was clearly very anxious: as we risked meeting in a relatively confined space, he swerved round a bicycle railing, thus doing the famed Covid Scuttle.
I grinned and greeted him cheerily,so he muttered ‘no problem’ and went on his way.
Sometimes they exasperate me so much I walk close to them just to wind them up and see their reaction. I know i should not but sometimes they just drive you mad with their bed wetting.
Irrational and ridiculous.
It takes effort for me to walk past outdoor masked people without saying something. I have to tell myself to shut up don’t say anything. The sooner people realise the sooner we all get back to good old normal normal.
My immediate, natural thought is “Why the F are you doing that?” But you say nowt.
Sometimes I have asked without the F or asked for ghem to help me understand why. But it isn’t right to ask everyone I see. It is instinctual to just say “why the F?”
I have the conversation running through my head, ready, all the time: the simple path backwards, ie mask doesn’t work>virus scarce>case numbers inflated>miscounted tests>test doesn’t work…
But we’d be there all day.
One advantage we have they don’t is facial expression. A lot can be said in passing with eye contacts and a smile. No need to break a step.
“Under his Eye” or “Blessed Be The Fruit” are my favourite greetings.
Been thinking about it, trying to tell them why not to wear a mask is not working — rather provide advice on how to properly wear a mask (maybe 2 at a go) and how bad it is to repeatedly touching the mask, that it must be replaced every 40 minutes (will need quite a stash), then discarded in a hazards bin or kept in a plastic bag and then washed at 60 degrees.
Been thinking about it, trying to tell them why not to wear a mask is not working — rather provide advice on how to properly wear a mask (maybe 2 at a go) and how bad it is to repeatedly touching the mask, that it must be replaced every 40 minutes (will need quite a stash), then discarded in a hazards bin or kept in a plastic bag and then washed at 60 degrees.
Lunacy.
Fight, flight, or hide.
Smile cheerfully and say hello.
I have a good friend who won’t come out from behind his sofa. He joined the Tory Party some time ago, and seems in awe of the Government’s mantra and propaganda.He seems to think in fact that they are being too lax (like it seems a majority of the population iif we believe opinion polls). I am trying not to lose patience and thereby perhaps lose a friend. I’ve told him he must make his own decision on risk, as must everyone. At the start of this he sent me a foul picture declaring that people who ‘recklessly flout’ the ‘law’ should sign a waiver declining NHS treatment ‘when’ they get Covid. I told him it was contemptible as we live in a free country, denial of medical treatment is reminiscent of dictatorships and gulags, and people may consent to these restrictions but it’s conditional on the absolute need. Which has rapidly diminished to almost nothing beyond hand washing and *perhaps* avoidance of very large-scale mass hugging.
I’m happy to sign a waiver declining NHS treatment, but on the basis that I get all my NI contributions and Income Tax back that I’ve payed over the years including interest, that has gone to the NHS or has been used to invest in it’s infrastructure.
If only. They won’t hypothecate any taxes, (although the TV licence fee, almost a universal tax for the vile BBC, is an exception). ‘National Insurance’ looks like it might be a tax for health services but I doubt it is all allocated for health. I have long thought that the NHS could kill me by sin of omission or even commission, as much as it could save my life!
The NHS nearly did kill me when I was 6. I have avoided it like the plague ever since. I have had to visit others in hospital though and have rarely been impressed with what I saw.
Suspect that shortly no waivers will be necessary – just refuse to take ‘the vaccine’
The first friend, whom I mentioned in my original post ,is now fixating on the asymptomatic shtick; this seems to be the latest ballast in Project Barmy’s narrative.
I said that many tests were undoubtedly showing positive results-whether accurately or not is another story of course-to which she immediately replied-‘But they could be asymptomatic’.
She also invoked this as the reason why an affected family member’s other half had not shown any symptoms:’ He could be asymptomatic’.
Thus the fear and self imposed confinement continues……
It’s depressing (again) to see how many fools pick up on words and concepts they really don’t understand – “science”, “asymptomatic” etc.
Are we all asymptomatic measles carriers, if we had it in childhood ?
“He could be asymptomatic “
“You mean ‘not sick’?
Exactly, Matt. Something that is actually good, becomes a new ‘disease’ in their tiny minds. “He’s got the asymptomatics, keep away!”
As I’ve said before, what if we all got a disease that has no symptoms, what would we do?
Yes or “fine”. Maybe this can be the new normal. How are you? Asymptomatic thanks!
Perhaps this is some sort of ‘meme memory’ if you like of Typhoid Mary, who was said to be a carrier of typhoid, without showing any symptoms. But this is not the same beast, typhoid and Covid seem to be chalk and cheese.
I’m not so sure. It seems more like a version of clinging to the wreckage to me: evidence increasingly indicates-at least to the more grounded members of society- that The End Of Days is not upon us, but the blind faith must be maintained.
To me they’re reminiscent of the flat earthers, and before them, the church dignitaries who absolutely could not condone the work of Copernicus, Galileo and poor Giordano Bruno.
Exaggeration perhaps, but the motives are similar.
If he is representative of the new Tory Party then god help us. It really is a pathetic leftist rabble…might as well have Corbyn in.
Ask your friend if they happily went about normal life during each winter flu season, and if so why they were prepared to risk spreading or getting a virus which has resulted in far more deaths than Covid. By their own logic they should not have been entitled to NHS treatment.
The whole situation has become surreal, I have listened to various ‘Goddess of Gloom’ experts who predict that we will be in Covid turmoil for a long time and yet ONS death figures are way down and apart from a few hot-spots +ve test results seem on the decline. It looks like this pesky virus is not listening to the experts. The Government and the media seem locked into a gloom and doom scenario, will they all prostrate themselves and beg for forgiveness if they are proved wrong?
Don’t hold your breath.
What do you think?
Not about being right or wrong. Is about power, tyranny, and a global reset.
I’ve long noticed the same as well. A lot of my colleagues live outside London and have been afraid to commute back into the city. I have been telling them that its a virtual ghost town and that the rush hour has been non existent for awhile now.
A retired colleague recently wrote to me wishing me luck with the commute. I wrote back to thank her for her concern but I am not afraid of the virus nor taking public transport as I’ve been doing it awhile now.
The vast majority of people I know have swallowed the whole MSM and government propaganda whole. I feel like I’m recreating Custer’s Last stand every time I try to debate and reason with them.
Lastly had the misfortune into logging into my Arsebook account to check for any work related messages and saw that a former student of mine is cheering the mandatory mask policy in the Canadian province where she lives. Looks like I failed in my job in trying to inculcate critical thinking.
Jesus wept.
Classic herd thinking. Usually it’s vital for survival, but the same instinct sometimes works against us. This is one such situation. What has surprised me is the number of people who for years have told me they never believe anything the government says, nor a word printed in a newspaper, but who have swallowed this thing whole. Which comes from er, the government and newspapers…
Agree. The odd thing about this former student is her posts are usually about her dogs and the care packages she gets from her family back in our old country so its rather bizarre all of a sudden that she’s become this rabid lockdownista. On second thought however I shouldn’t be surprised as she comes from a wealthy family and is also doing very well in Canada so if it goes belly up for her, there’s her savings and the Bank of Mum and Dad to fall back on.
They are literally brainwashed/hypnotised/mind controlled, whichever term you prefer. Serious damage has been done.
Logic no good. Facts no good. Needs a hook/angle/joke at the right time just to get through.
The were bull shitting I am afraid….when it came to the crunch they swallowed the lot whole.
I’ve just spoken to another friend who recently visited someone whom she’s known for years: the invitation was qualified by an instruction to enter by the back door.
She was then given hand sanitiser to render herself harmless!!
The support for She Who Must Be Obeyed is widespread though; my pal thinks Nicola has done a good job, whereas I don’t .
She’s followed more or less in Westminster’s footsteps , while employing suitably significant delays in announcements to emphasise her wish not to be ‘dragged into ‘anything ;’dragged into, dragged out of’ are favoured SNP weapons.
Never miss a chance to spread division and rancour.
Actually allowing someone to enter has to be a step towards sanity, no?
It’s garden only – and well apart if not muzzled – for the lockdownistas I know.
Wow!!! That’s almost like going into a shop!
I am afraid there is no hope for much of the young and that means it will be hell for us when the buggers are running the show.
The comment about “the inherent art of living” from the Sunetra Gupta interview flagged by Toby rang true to me:
“The costs to the arts is I think also incredibly profound – the theatres and all other forms of performing art. But also the inherent art of living, which I think is being compromised.”
Those friends of yours have lost that “art” and may never fully be able to recover it.
They’ll need our help when this is all over.
I agree. Our help needed when over.
Our help needed now by setting an example. The commenter who is commuting and *still lives!* The example that one commute sets fot the scared stay at home colleagues is full of help I believe.
A beacon. I look at things conversely in a sort of though experiment. What if there were no skeptics? How dark would the mask wearers world be then? Without realising, we give hope to scared people that life can be normal.
You haven’t lost two friends, you’ve just discovered that they were never your friends
With friends like these.
It’s just the epitome of selfishness. The “I don’t care” thing about the damage caused is very common. Even my Dad said this to me as I reeled of the likely outcomes from this covid melt down, 9 million unemployed, don’t care, 2/3 rds of business going bust, don’t care, 1000’s of pubs shutting down never to re-open, don’t care….
I really did have a cry, in their kitchen. They didn’t seem to care about that either.
Yes, how right you are: the second friend, who owns a large well appointed house in a select part of this town, just shrugged and said -‘people should live their lives’ when I mentioned mass redundancies, impoverishment, family breakdown and loss of prospects and hope.
Yes its not nice discovering that your friends and family are actually on the other side of the barricades.
My somewhat cynical conclusion is now that under this blinkered fear is a refusal to feel any solidarity with those whose lives are being destroyed: the collateral damage which unfolds as the mask madness continues.
That is so well-expressed – I agree entirely. These people are the selfish ones, not us.
I believe that beneath it all, the believers have to believe because the alternative is too horrendous to contemplate – which is that the government has sold us down the river and that this whole Plandemic-scamdemic is not about protecting our health but IS about ushering in the New World Order that so many ‘conspiracy theorists’ have said is coming down the tracks. Imagine if you had to admit that they were right and you were wrong. The thing is, unless they wake up pretty smartish then the horrors waiting down the line will force them to. Of course, some will become the New Gestapo out of fear or – for some – with relish.
“There is no such thing as society”
I have not read this yet but here is a paper with what looks like a serious attempt to do a cost benefit analysis for the lockdown.
https://journal.sketchingscience.org/users/333926/articles/460021-living-with-covid-19-balancing-costs-against-benefits-in-the-face-of-the-virus
“The evidence suggests that the costs of continuing severe restrictions in the U.K. are so great relative to likely benefits in the numbers of lives saved so that a substantial easing in restrictions is now warranted”
The average age of death and loss of life expectancy for non-Covid was 79.1 and 11.4 respectively.
The average age of death and loss of life expectancy for Covid was 80.4 and 10.1 years respectively.
This is what lockdown-the destruction of our way of life, the economy and our children’s futures-has achieved.
An excellent read and analysis:
https://www.aier.org/article/when-will-the-madness-end/
The greatest trick the Devil ever pulled was to convince the world that it needed saving.
The Gupta interview is good – she is very hard hitting and doesn’t hold back, but does it in a way that is very calm, reasonable and logical.
One interesting point is that she says we should be more communitarian in our response, and that lockdowns have been the product of individualism.
I have generally thought the opposite – lockdowns and masks are a result of communitarianism gone mad, and that what will save us is individualism.
But I suppose her point is that if you’re being rational and thinking of the good of society, rather than fearing for yourself or virtue signalling for yourself, you will support the herd immunity approach because it’s the one that leads to the best outcome overall.
I think that’s a quite neat way to take the holier-than-thou arguments we are getting from the zealots and turn it back on them and show how it is THEY who will end up harming the vulnerable and OUR approach will protect them.
This was an excellent interview. Perfect reading for those who are still balancing on the fence.
Totally agree about the Gupta interview – and I think her analysis is absolutely spot on, both scientifically and philosophically.
And yes … the whole panicdemic is about *shattering* communal bonds that are the basis of resistance. The depth of evil (not a word I much use) being perpetrated surprises even an old time natural sceptic like me (an inveterate Groucho Marxist ).
That evil has reached the point, as I’ve previously pointed out, where child abuse is being officially sanctioned and normal rules of medical risk assessment are being turned on their head by the modern Mengele tribe.
Yes, it does look a lot like evil on the part of various groups, organisations and politicians with agendas or arses to cover.
Yes, I think this is a fair analysis of what is being done to us.
I also found this article very encouraging, not so much the science as her appraisal of the human/social/psychological costs of lockdown and distancing (which personally I am more and more sickened by)
That’s the axis of disease, but then there’s the socioeconomic axis, which has been ignored. But there’s a third, aesthetic access, which is about how we want to live our lives. We are closing ourselves off not just to the disease, but to other aspects of being human.
…
But also the inherent art of living, which I think is being compromised.
Acts of kindness are being eschewed. Someone was telling me yesterday that their mother said to them “please don’t come home, you’re going to kill us”.
I know a couple of people in less extreme versions of the above situation (their – healthy and not especially elderly – parents will only see them outside at a “safe” distance)
What is the “sceptics” view on the situation in the US? If Trump is now changing his advice (as did Johnson here), what does that infer?
What has Trump said? Must admit I don’t have much spare energy to follow US politics.
According to R4 news he is encouraging Americans to wear masks where social distancing is not possible.
Probably an attempt to disarm the opposition
An update
Four days now from when I first ventured out
Day 1 A trip to the newsagent
Day 2 Waiting for ‘Kneel’
Day 3 Wrote ‘Why the police are a mirage’ (whilst watching back episodes of Homes under the Hamster)
Yesterday plucked up the courage and confidence to walk 5 miles from my village to the nearest town (Who writes this crap? FFS you ain’t gonna be flying a Spitfire, your only going for a fecking walk)
A pleasant Victorian seaside town of 30,000 souls. In the shopping streets the council had cordoned off all the on street parking; so they could introduce their one way system for pedestrians.
The hundreds of bollards used to cordon off the parking spaces are now bolted down as the shop owners kept stealing them in the middle of the night
The 140 year old Pennant Stone paving slabs had been defaced with day glo arrows and instructions for the plebs to follow (seeing as you ask, yes it is a conservation area, but council graffiti doesn’t count)
At least 50% of the prisoners were deliberately walking the wrong way. I caught the eye of a few, they gave me the ‘East German’ look ( I’m with you, can’t say anything here, we will be denounced, I have a family and children. There is a secret meeting in my basement this evening)
Strolled down to the beach front esplanade. It was was like a premiership football club (pre covid) crowd had just kicked out.
The only social distancing was in the queue for the fish and chip shop, Prisoners in the queue complied with the painted crosses on the road. The owner said he wouldn’t serve them unless they complied
The owner told me the local Stasi had told him they were just looking for an excuse to close him down; unless of course he wanted to make a contribution to the widows and orphans fund, and then everything would be fine
Two PCSO’s were hiding in the back of one of he cafes drinking their free coffee
Returned home for sundowners with 30 others on the patio of the village rugby club (and thereby hangs a tale)
But enough for today
Tomorrow: How our local bowls club turned professional under Rishi’s covid money laundering scheme
Great reporting!
Brilliant! Loving your posts!
Looks like Trump has suddenly changed his tune…
“Mr Trump also asked all Americans to wear face coverings, saying “they’ll have an effect” and show “patriotism”.”
He added: “We’re asking everybody that when you are not able to socially distance, wear a mask, get a mask.
“Whether you like the mask or not, they have an impact, they’ll have an effect and we need everything we can get.”
https://www.bbc.com/news/world-us-canada-53494766
I watched most of the press conference. He was significantly less combative that normal, and my take away was that there was less than a hair’s breadth between him and Boris – he even assessed his ‘performance’ relative to the original ICL prediction of millions of deaths in the US! Lots of talk about vaccine and therapeutics, and yes, the shift on masks, although note, despite what he said at the conference, he was spotted a few hours later in a crowded foyer without it on. He has an election to win, and his problem is Florida. Texas seems to be coming under control. He isn’t worried about California – it is luvvie Democrat central. He was blind-sided by the question on Ghislaine Maxwell – or so it appeared – but then she likely has more dirt on the Democrat aristocracy than she does on him.
Note however that any dirt she has on the dumocrats will be ignored whilst anything on Trump will be megaphoned throughout the universe!
Is it not just a simple fact that – due to the geography of the US – they will continually be at the ‘height’ of the outbreak in some portion of the country or other. Hence the need for (pretend or otherwise) earnestness
Someone pulling his strings? Didnt think he had any. I don’t the like the way this is shaping up. Every government on the planet is going mask-mad. WHY?? What do they know that we don’t? Or is it a control exercise, to see how much pressure can be exerted on people? A step to world government, of the kind we don’t want.
Trump – like all politicians in the U.S- is owned by the big banks/corporations so to expect him to act independently and against such interests is not realistic.
Unfortunately this is increasingly looking like the Iraq war scenario, where a decision had already been taken and the “evidence” was manipulated and cherry-picked afterwards to justify it.
In the Iraq war the public was told that it was the “intelligence” which said that Iraq had WMD and needed to be invaded. Now we are told the “Science” dictates that everyone must wear masks, social distance, take vaccines etc.
What is most disturbing and troubling is that most governments around the world seem to be following the exactly the same script and with hardly any internal political questioning or opposition.
https://unitynewsnetwork.co.uk/gordon-brown-and-tony-blair-call-for-global-government-to-tackle-coronavirus/
He has been a huge disappointment. Still better than the alternatives, but pretty unreliable. I thought he had balls, but was unprincipled. Turns out that he lacks balls too, when it really matters.
Quite – is he just being ground down or do they have something significant on him (Epstein-related?).
I think he just wants to be re-elected and he has been told or decided himself that this is the way to do it. He’s a flake, like our PM, and like most politicians.
Curious by Pompeo in light of Trumps mask W-turn –
World Health Organization
Mike Pompeo attacks WHO in private meeting during UK visit
US secretary of state said the World Health Organization was responsible for Britons who had died from Covid-19
The US secretary of state Mike Pompeo launched an extraordinary attack on the World Health Organization during a private meeting in the UK, accusing it of being in the pocket of China and responsible for “dead Britons” who passed away during the pandemic.
Pompeo told those present that he believed the WHO was “political not a science-based organisation” and accused its current director general Tedros Adhanom Ghebreyesus of being too close to Beijing.
More here (its free):
https://www.theguardian.com/world/2020/jul/21/mike-pompeo-attacks-who-in-private-meeting-during-uk-visit
Yes it is very curious, especially in view of the fact that although the US announced it was withdrawing its funding from the WHO (leaving Bill and Melinda Gates as its biggest funders) it made a huge contribution to the (Bill Gates founded) GAVI (which is the biggest funder of the WHO after the BMGF!)
https://www.thelastamericanvagabond.com/vaccine-bait-switch-millions-pulled-from-who-trump-gives-billions-gates-founded-gavi/
The WHO evidently is propped up by huge funding from US – based organizations…would the US government allow it to be controlled by China?
Switcheroo. These folk in suits are identical to any other con tricksters ever. Give it a name and tell people how it works. They lose power.
Interesting. The whole administration has been a disappointment – it had potential, but lacked consistent, intelligent leadership.
Trump is the one pushing whole Epstein thing. I think it’s more to do with optics being it’s an election year because let’s face it the majority of people are pro mask.
To all on here.
It’s now been 4 months since this lockdown began, and now more than ever we need to be coming together as one so that that we can take mass action against the continuing lockdown.
We all seem to be taking individual action and resistance, which is great, but in effect doesn’t achieve much as we just get labelled as the “odd nutter” as everyone else is drinking the Kool Aid.
I had always hoped that Toby was going to architect this, but it seems that he hasn’t the time with all his commitments.
I think it is now time for us on here to start making a difference. So, I was wondering if anyone had any suggestions on how they think we should get more organised?
Hunger strikes?
Maybe when we’re all in the Gulag.
Currently fattening self for coming Gulag
My initial thoughts were as follows:
Also, Politically neutral, with the pure focus being on the COVID-19 Lockdown and nothing else.
Absolutely, Skipper. The strength of this place is that we don’t get the “X are crap cos I always vote for Y (or vice versa)” mob on here, but rather reasoned, thinking people. Except for Emma below, who will be gone soon.
I agree with this. The Keep Britain Free group is similar but it might well be worth having other groups of a similar nature going on to so people have more than one choice.
The thing I don’t like about the Keep Britain Free group is that there website sells merchandise, it just looks like a money making exercise to me. By all mean ask for donation for the upkeep of the site, but selling caps and t-shirts is just a way to make a profit for the person who owns the site.
I can’t believe they make much, if anything, and frankly don’t care as log as they are of use to the movement.
They probably don’t make that much based on the turnout at the anti-mask event on Sunday.
Someone said that to me on the lawn of Parliament Hill, Ottawa, Canada, at a Stop the Vietnam War Rally in 1969 when I pooh poohed Joan Baez’s contribution to the movement. Still cannot make up my mind about that.
“form a committee” now there’s your problem right there.
It’s just a suggestion, we’ve not done anything yet.
All great ideas. I think the place to go for organisation and action is lockdowntruth.org. I haven’t been over there recently so don’t know what they’re up to, but worth having a look and seeing if you want to join in with that.
It’s not used much, had a look at the Forum, not posts for over two days.
Since the middle of March, 2020, this has been ‘a right horror show’, but not in the way that Malcolm MacDowell meant it in A Clockwork Orange. I was thinking that all of us could compile video clips, letters, personal experiences, comments, photos, news events, press conferences with Ministers, health officials, Experts and the PM, of course, ad infitum and come up with a documentary of it all up until now. Throw in some footage from the good old days in East Germany, the Soviet Union, Fascist Italy, Nazi Germany, Fascist Spain, quotes from famous writers defending Liberty and Freedom of Speech and Assembly, etc. Then we could create our own Oscar ceremonies with prizes for best this that and the other. Tongue in cheek, sarcastic, satirical: Ex: Best sycophant in a supporting role to the PM, Best hypocrite, Best Bedwetter … knock yourselves out.
I think we are already making a difference by sharing information, writing to MPs, talking to friends and others trying to put our case, posting on social media and comments sections on news sites, signing petitions, refusing to wear masks, crowdfunding initiatives, voting with our feet.
But it would be good to do more.
Simon Dolan has some money and some kind of organisation going, as does Toby Young. Beyond that, I think our best hope is to try and prise away some of the more freedom loving wing of the Conservative Party – the ones that have spoken against masks, maybe Baker. I’m no fan of the Conservatives, and I am not trying to make this political, but I can’t see much scope for any support from any other parliamentary party.
It may be a very long campaign indeed.
3 weeks flatten the curve.
Now running at something like ten months. Imagine them giving us wrong information!
Quick before anyone else does, create a website named ‘Lockdown Sceptics’
An important aspect of this is to have an agreed and shared fact base. There is a valuable set of links on this web site but there is now an awful lot to read through.
So is it feasible to produce a short factual document (leaflet or pamphlet form) that brings together the agreed facts with references that can be used as a basis for discussion with the fearful ones?
Or has this already been done?
Prof Heneghan points out that testing will always produce false positives so we will always see cases even when the virus is no longer circulating: https://www.spectator.co.uk/article/how-many-covid-diagnoses-are-false-positives-
Might this explain the situation in Victoria, Australia (also today, a single “positive” was reported in Tasmania after an extended period of no infections), New Zealand, and Scotland?
Yes because we’ve all probably got some traces of this virus inside us. The PCR test uses an arbitrary number of cycles to declare a positive test. If that number of cycles were to be increased, we would all test positive.
That’s not because you’ve necessarily got any traces of the virus. The test just sort of starts detecting itself if you cycle it too many times.
It’s unlikely that it will ever not be circulating. But it will be at a low enough level that you will need a big sample size to be sure you haven’t just found false positives.
“Quite a lot changed that led to R going below one well before, or to some extent before, March 23”, when full lockdown was imposed, Professor Whitty said.
What the wha?! Why is somebody not sky-writing this quote?!
Also we’re all going to sign the petition against mandatory face masks right?!
All the builders currently working on my house are going to sign it. I’m afraid the only result of me sharing the link on Facebook is that I’ll be blocked by everybody. This has already started happening to my husband, so I’m sharing the old-fashioned way: word-of-mouth.
I’ve signed but like you I don’t dare share it on Facebook for fear of reaction from all the people desperate to wear masks.
As I said a few days ago, one or more of them will not be able to live with their conscience for much longer and will break ranks. He cannot ignore what other high profile medics (Karol Sikora and Carl Heneghan) have been saying about this and/or the collateral damage of lockdown for much longer. There has been tension, in my view, between him and Sir Patrick Vallance for some time now. The cracks can only widen.
I really value your comment on this. Make it so!
Please god those cracks break and open up a chasm!
Mrs TJN and I have been saying this for a while: someone is going to break ranks soon. Problem is, a watched kettle never boils …
I am sure that you/we are correct though. Everyone’s going to be scrambling to cover their arses, and sooner or later that’s going to lead to accusation and counter-accusation. Wouldn’t it be wonderful to see the whole pile of garbage come tumbling down.
It also needs a Cabinet minister to resign and do a Robin Cook. I have also made the plea to Therese Coffey, SoS for Work & Pensions, to dig deep as the torch-bearer for Chemistry at Somerville College, Oxford (Mrs T’s alma mater) and salve her conscience.
Yes, but who in this cabinet of nobodies is going to step out? So far we have only about three MPs.
Someone with a science background? That narrows the field a lot.
Still, very early days yet and the going is still very easy.
I often wonder what Mrs T, with her forensic and practical mind, would have done with this lot. I reckon she’d have destroyed Ferguson in minutes.
“Someone with a science background?”
That’s not much of a criteria, given the numbers from the Mengele School of Public Health with such a background who are keen on perpetuating the myth.
I meant a cabinet minister with a science background! Pretty thin on the ground.
And in science itself there is s world of difference between an independent scientist and one chasing the next research grant or committee position.
Quite, hence the Climate Change mantra of ‘97% of scientists agree the science is settled’!
I think increasing numbers of people are waking up to the groupthink and sheer dishonesty which runs through ‘science’. In time, some incidental good may come from the covid debacle.
Sorry to be a party pooper – but *What* conscience? We wouldn’t be here if that entity existed.
Exactly why I won’t share it on my Facebook. I’ve gotten into way too many pointless arguments for posting stuff in the past
What I find depressing about FB is that nobody wants to engage with the debate. Apart from the morons who can come up with not better argument than ‘utter bollox’ (e.g. for the excellent Peter Hitchens article the other day).
Signed it as well and will be sharing to a friend and Mr Bart but apart from that, won’t be sharing it on Arsebook as I don’t have the time or energy to battle with the lockdownistas many of whom I work with.
I think he’s only saying it now to silence the voices screaming that we should have locked down earlier.
Pam Popper on UK Covid chicanery and a worldwide call to arms!
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=g-hphj3Q40k
The place I work for reopens to the public tomorrow and while I and everyone is resigned to the fact that antisocial distancing and the looming economic crash will mean that we won’t be swamped with visitors, I have not been sleeping well for the last fortnight or so. And this is because of the OTT cleaning regime we have been subjected to and the possibility of being snitched on by colleagues to management for failing to adhere to cleaning and antisocial distancing.
It’s really sad if it has come to this – a disproportionate response to a virus in retreat and distrust of people one works with.
I have decided to boycott my staff area and take my breaks elsewhere, that means no-one will hold it against me because I have not been in the space.
Pre-WW2 Germany increasingly springs to mind. I used to think such things could never happen in the UK.
Yep. During my traning session, I have manage to suss out a few people who would possibly have joined the Stasi if it came to that.
“One of these days, all these people who’ve participated in this snitching and are co-conspirators with the criminals who are doing this are going to get their day, believe me. What goes around comes around.” Dr Pam Popper, July 9 2020
Indeed. If not in this life, in the next life.
Yes. One has to be careful of parallels, but the evil being done is immense from so many perspectives – and the latest we now have emerging is alumni of the Mengele School of Public Health getting airtime for their scheme to stick experimental needles in all and sundry.
There is an excellent series on BBC iplayer called Rise of the Nazi’s, I watched the episode which was called Politics and covered 1930 – 1933. Truly the parallels to today with a gradual erosion of diplomacy that then reached a tipping point until no one could challenge the situation, are frightening and instructive for all of us.
Funny how the BBC can see that in relation to Germany in the 1930s, but completely fail to see it in the here and now.
Yes! Or indeed anyone who watches that particular episode.
Good luck Bart, this whole thing is totally crazy and wrong and is setting people against people. Sadly some people seem to get a kick out of being a snitch etc, some. I guess are probably still completely terrified so will do everything they can to feel safe, even reporting on other staff members.
Thanks. That’s what Mr Bart has said – they’ve become so neurotic that they perceive anyone who is not doing it “correctly” as a threat and think that reporting them to management is keeping everyone safe.
Thank you. I’m determined to do my job to the best of my ability and will not be treating the visitors like lepers despite what we’re told. They are human beings worth of dignity and respect and without them we are nothing.
Good luck too Bart. Hill Street Blues chief used to say to team after the morning meeting – “get out there & let’s do it to them before they do it to us”!
Thanks a lot!
As long as you don’t become a racist like Father Ted. (I’m too busy of course).
Don’t be surprised if something sneaks up behind you, that’s all i’m saying
?
I think the point is a warning we are all looking in one corona/mask/vaccine direction. The classic slight of hand – focus on the right hand while the left reaches for a club to beat you with. That kind of a deal, I assume.
Yes, that’s occurred to me on the masks business. While we are talking about and concentrating on this, what are we missing?
Government being reshaped is something no reports are coming out about. EU military unification. Global reset implications. I think Russia invading is a no go, if only they would! But these are all known knowns – the unknowns are where to look.
At this point, I’d see a Russian invasion as liberation
See this – great poster to put up: https://twitter.com/Tolstoy36538752/status/1285857338075881472
Good one!
This?….
https://off-guardian.org/2020/07/20/the-great-reset-fraud/
I hesitate to grant that this lot have the gumption to organise a decent conspiracy. But that doesn’t mean they won’t take advantage of the mess they’ve created to foist God knows what on the plebs.
Taking advantage of, rather than organised by. Agree with you, TJN!
The organisers are obviously intelligent and competent, although seemingly unaware and spiritually sick.
Raining heavily here today; rather a tricky one for the outdoor mask wearers. Supermarket queues will be somewhat miserable. A few consecutive days of heavy rain might help to dampen the ardour of the extremists.
As I’ve always said, no-one wants to queue in the pouring rain, howling wind or the bitter cold. I predict low level violence if shop staff try to enforce antisocial distancing in these conditions as well as muzzling.
I doubt that many shop staff will try – but watch out for the muzzlezealots!
Indeed. A lot of the fights will be instigated by the muzzlezealots.
They haven’t just muzzled their faces, they have also muzzled their minds.
Yes. Self imposed water boarding won’t catch on.
Can i ask an administrations favour. I leave this page open with comments so that i can monitor updates during the day. However when the new page is created for the next days blog, that is not indicated so i have responded to comments when the page is out of date. And it is not as if the new blog page is created at the same time each day. Currently it seems to be in the early hours. In the past it was in the evening
I am not the only one confused by this
So can i ask that when a new blog page is created, the previous days comments are updated with a comment to advise that the new page has been created.
I always click ‘Lockdown Sceptics’ at the very top of the page before reading and it will load the newest page.
yes but if you do that it also relaunches the current page (if no update) and that then loses the tracking of new posts which, given there are hundreds of posts, is the only way of monitoring what is new (as the posts you havent read a coloured) . That is why i dont want to update the page
I tend to open a new tab if i remember and keep refreshing that but it is not the best solution .
If you’re using a tabbed browser (I think they all are these days) right click the banner at the top and select open in new tab. If it is new, then you can close the old tab if it is the same, you can close that. A bit of a manual work around but it will do the trick.
It’s much appreciated that even though Toby is on holiday, he’s been creating a new page almost very day – makes navigating the comments page much easier!
Sign up for the newsletter, you will then get the new one once its published.
Where do I submit a tune for the day?
I guess to the same email:
If you want to flag up any stories or links I should include in future updates, email me here.
Week commencing 20 July – 0.42 suspected cases per 10,000 patients in RCGP RSC Network (211 in population of 4,967,302). None confirmed:
https://app.powerbi.com/view?r=eyJrIjoiZTU5ZDE5MGYtMzUzMy00ZjRmLTg4MGEtMTM3ZGJiZDNhODFkIiwidCI6IjZiOTAyNjkzLTEwNzQtNDBhYS05ZTIxLWQ4OTQ0NmEyZWJiNSIsImMiOjh9
That admission by Whitty is enormous isn’t it? He’s more or less said that the lockdown was unnecessary. Is this being reported on widely? If not, is there any way to get it out there? It seems to me to be the key to the govt admitting this was all a mistake and that it must never happen again.
So why were Whitty and Vallance banging on about further lockdowns over the next 5 years just the other day?
“So why were Whitty and Vallance banging on …”
Group think and the Order of the Brown Nose is a powerful incentive.
Both have links to Bill Gates – says it all…!
“Is this being reported on widely?” Not by the BBC.
Absolutely pathetic that our media are in thrall to the official line.
I’ve been bombarding them with emails to “Have your say” suggesting stories for them to cover.
The guy just off-camera holding a sawn-off shotgun ?
Yes, I thought the same. I haven’t had time yet to listen to more of his evidence session but it is fascinating that they now think this.
Also suggests the SAGE group must think Ferguson is a cretin, given his latest paper was still trying to prove that the lockdown was essential….
The evidence has been out there for months, so there must be a reason they’re talking about it now. Have they finally had enough?!
Yes, it’s one up to Fergoid, definitely. Hooray!
https://swprs.org/a-swiss-doctor-on-covid-19/
This certainly opens up the can of worms!
This particular can of worms has been quietly there all along. It is an essential reference for those not prepared to suck up second-hand media sh**.
Great information thanks. Very useful summary of the real information that it is definitely not a pandemic.
Interesting Twitter post from Prof Francois Balloux on a study just out in the Lancet. I’ve not read the paper yet but the Prof made the observations below:
https://twitter.com/BallouxFrancois/status/1285854066690719744
A country level analysis measuring the impact of government actions, country preparedness and socioeconomic factors on COVID-19 mortality and related health outcomes
https://www.thelancet.com/journals/eclinm/article/PIIS2589-5370(20)30208-X/fulltext
The paper reports that low levels of preparedness in early detection/reporting, limited health care capacity, and population characteristics such as advanced age, obesity and higher unemployment were key factors associated with viral spread and overall mortality.
Conversely, border closures, full lockdowns, and a high rate of #COVID19 testing were not associated with statistically significant reductions in the number of critical cases or overall mortality.
“15 says, 30 days, just a little bit longer, just wear a mask, maybe for years, new normal, Walmart is okay but Jim’s Bakery is not, we’re releasing prisoners but arresting people for not wearing a mask. BLM protests okay but street parties are not, you can be sick but have no symptoms. Hospitals are war zones but the nurses are making music videos all day, etc.
“But these same people hold the keys toy your ‘freedom’?
This is break your mind.”
Biderman’s three ‘D’s’ of torture:
Dependency
Debility
Dread
Used in Amnesty International’s definition of Torture.
25 minutes
Your Body is their weapon – We’re all Patients Now
https://youtu.be/jeVf8Bq1knk
Amazing Polly youtube channel gives a remarkable information always based on tangible documents and records. Corona virus views and much more from a Canadian standpoint.
She broke the Wayfair Gate story recently.
For anyone who has not picked it up, I would strongly recommend the interview with Sunetra Gupta referenced above.
It’s a model of sanity and good science – and a quietly devastating condemnation of the farce that we are now suffering :
https://reaction.life/we-may-already-have-herd-immunity-an-interview-with-professor-sunetra-gupta/
Funnily enough however, her husband is working on a vaccine, while she goes around arguing that we don’t really need one!
So?
So one doesn’t necessarily trust her ‘independence’.
I just thought it seemed like a bit of a conflict in interest, nothing more.
They’re divorced, it seems.
Ah, then I trust what she says a lot more.
100 more badges just came through the door!
You can buy them here: https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/154016480170
I would have this on a badge but some people might find it a bit crass:
Special Agent Mask Exemption – Licence to Kill
I have a few more designs in the pipeline, actually the covid 1984 writing is pretty small, people have to get pretty close to read it. The not brainwashed words are detectable at about 2 meters by those with good eyesight. The logo is hard to see unless you get really close.
I like Carl Vernon’s very subtle ‘2 + 2 = 4’ T-shirt.
I note that the Spiv Party in parliament have voted down measures to prevent health falling into the hands of foreign and big money corporate interests.
Well … who’d have guessed that the ‘follow the money’ explanation of this confected crisis would yield such easy and obvious results?
Easy Peasy
Christmas is on then.
https://www.edinburghlive.co.uk/news/edinburgh-news/edinburghs-hogmanay-christmas-markets-to-18639676
Only locals will know of the anger felt toward the edinburgh council and private underbelly who have repeatedly wrecked the city centre park staging the christmas market. Underbelly is not a local business. Last year the entire market was put on a giant scaffold structure which did not have planning permission.
This gives you an idea of how seriously the corona virus should be taken – very seriously until you are in trouble financially then just ignore it.
Good news though, the second wave isn’t happening in Edinburgh.
…. despite the coronavirus pandemic.
They really do need to get their vocabulary up to date. That is so 4 months ago!
But Christmas is off in parts of Wales.
“It may only be July but some annual Christmas events have already been cancelled in Wales.
Pugh’s, which has garden centres in Radyr in Cardiff and Wenvoe in Vale of Glamorgan, has announced its annual Santa experience will not go ahead this Christmas.
It said it would “be irresponsible for us to run our experience given the current pandemic situation”.
Caerphilly town council has said there will be no festive light switch-on.”
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-wales-53496428
given the current pandemic situation
And again!!
Jaw dropping. Just when you think these jerks couldn’t get any more stupid…..
New manifestation of Civic wokeness, see which of lives little pleasures you can cancel to flaunt your Covid Awareness.
What’s funny with this Christmas market is that when we used to live in Edinburgh, it wasn’t as all encompassing as it is now. Not to mention that the whole Princes Street gardens looked lovely with the lights in the trees.
Now that we’ve moved out and are now only visitors, its sad to see how the Christmas market seems to be too commercial and to add to the insult, the council have stopped putting the lights on the trees located on the Edinburgh Castle side of Princes Street Gardens making the place look dark and depressing.
It is too commecial. Go to Prague for the same experience. Prices so high that certain local post codes are given vouchers in an effort to quell the talk that locals cannot afford an £8 cup of hot syrup wine. £80 (couple of rides and a bite) for an afternoon with your kids at a fair is a little steep. But i’m old fashioned and way off topic!
Yes it used to be lovely, now- 6 months of build and removal for a month of comercial tat.
The grass always looks trashed at the end of it and it takes them ages to replant it. It’s like Charlotte Square at the end of the Edinburgh book festival then it takes them 2-3 to replant the grass!
Usually after easter the new turf is layed. Mud bath until April. They don’t show that in UNESCO world heritage brochures.
My first time in Prague was part of a summer spent inter-railling around Europe. It was so cheap that we could feed 5 people with a beer each for about £5. Last time I went a meal for 1 person cost more than it would back in England where I lived at the time.
I seem to be just as old fashioned as you Basics. There’s also always a wee bit of the Scottish in me that doesn’t like to pay more than I need to for things.
We went to Zagreb for New Years Eve last year. Excellent. Shortly afterwards they all had to stay indoors cos of Virus. Then they all had to stay outdoors because of an earthquake. Happy 2020!!
It’s the same with the Hogmanay celebrations. It used to be a case of turning up on the night and was more of a spontaneous celebration with some fireworks.
Then it started to get busier year on year and they started issuing tickets and herding people around for safety reasons. One year there was a mighty crush on the Royal Mile so they started to limit the numbers. Now you have to get tickets in advance and naturally tourists snap them up or pay ridiculous sums (in my eyes anyway) to get them.
For me it’s become too contrived and feels unnatural. Sadly it’s not somewhere I consider going anymore.
Agree. My husband and I only went once because we were given free tickets, it was a good experience but it was crowded and the food was overpriced. After that year we never went again ever.
When I lived there, my workplace would send us all home by noon as the buses are diverted and its hard to get home especially as many of the buses go past Princes Street!
I read the piece from the Scottish nurse you mentioned above. It’s interesting that she admits that she had never been inside an adult ICU before and she had volunteered to work at one of the Nightingale hospitals, which didn’t open. She is usually a paediatric nurse in a children’s hospital.
Searching for what it’s like to work in an ICU, I came across this article:
https://image.ie/life/icu-work-intensive-care-unit-143660.
It sounds equally as bad as her description of life on a Covid ward, if not worse. She obviously wasn’t prepared for how bad it was likely to be.
This mask wearing nonsense could easily be brought to a halt. It would take some sceptic with kids to send them shopping dressed as an old person to buy alcohol (like in that funny video) and to raise hell with the store head office. Imagine the mandatory face muzzle removing to verify ages, the backlash would be massive.
Also, the opportunity to dissapear into an albeit thin crowd for a criminal. A couple of nasty armed robberies with muzzle wearers who look like everyone else could bring the whole lot down.
I’m not encouraging the second bit of course…. but the first would be funny. Especially a card trasaction which can be tracked :>)
I wonder if parliament would have to return for any reason, as it looks like this lot who’ve created this mess are disappearing for a month and I don’t think I want to wait any longer for them to delay opening the country properly.
Seen Twitter threads of kids doing just that already, with latex masks..!
Brilliant idea.. Unfortunately i dont have kids that age. I might try it robbing a building society as i will run out of cash soon
I did mention a couple of days ago an article about teenagers renting e-scooters (can be done remotely via bank card) and terrorising pedestrian precincts – under the anonymity of masks
It’s inevitable – I don’t suppose the nudge unit that assumes we’re all sheep, took that aspect of human behaviour into consideration!
Always remember to wear wrap-around, preferably mirrored, sunspecs wherever muzzles are compulsory. Allows making rude gestures at the CCTV watchers (if that’s not already a ‘hate crime’ in the UK).
It’s an offence if you’re driving past a camera.
It’s amazing that hardly anyone has thought about the security implications. What happens when a robbery or assault happens while in a train or the underground? Will the police have to seal off the whole train plus the station to catch the perpetrator? I can imagine lots of pissed off passengers.
Imagine the description of the perpetrator… Average height, average build. No features…
They will have to stop and search everyone on the train and the station!!!
And given the economic problems that we are due to have when furlough ends and even more redundancies happen, those millions who will be skint will have a greater incentive to commit crimes
i committed a white collar crime . .Anyone know where i can fence 30 stolen shirts ?
(I’m still here all week)
I’ve just received a letter from the council, urging everyone to follow the covid rules.
We haven’t beaten the virus yet.
Using some colourful graphics, we’re urged to stay 2 metres (!!!) apart, wear a face covering, wash hands, stay away from crowds and follow T&T instructions.
Overleaf, there’s a letter from the council top brass. Here are some excerpts:
Thanks to your efforts, some of our freedoms have now returned. But we can’t yet go back to normal.
We can’t shake hands with our friends, hug our loved ones and we must keep apart even in social situations. It is hard, especially after so many weeks in lockdown ……
Even if you think the virus isn’t a threat to you, it could be really serious for people in your family and for others……
I know we were recently on the scary spike list but really, who needs MSM propaganda when the council does it for them? I presume this has gone to every household. More of my extortionate council tax wasted.
The good news is that my brilliant Not Brainwashed badges have come.
I’m now wondering while I can get away with claiming I’m mask exempt while wearing a sceptics badge.
Can you identify the council? That really is shocking.
It’s Kirklees. We were on the Government’s lockdown hitlist recently. They’ll be desperate to avoid being the next Leicester.
I wrote to my local councillors about a month ago, pointing out that they might as well plan to convert most buildings in the town centre into homeless shelters. (No reply!)
Apparently, I’m not the only one to realise the high street is doomed – though evidently, this thinktank didn’t consider the looming unemployment figures!
https://www.theguardian.com/society/2020/jul/22/uk-high-streets-could-be-turned-into-housing-says-thinktank
Promises by government ministers to revitalise high streets with a new breed of shops should be abandoned in favour of turning town centres into residential hubs, creating at least 800,000 homes, according to a report that aims to influence a Downing Street review of planning laws.
The Social Market Foundation (SMF) said the decline of the traditional high street could not be reversed by policies that “turn the clock back” to a time before online shopping, especially after the trend accelerated during the coronavirus pandemic.
“Residential HUB! What the hell is that! A hub is part of a wheel.
I’d do what I normally do with unwanted election leaflets…write rude words on it and send it back to em….without a stamp.
A letter written by another freekin idiot.
Definitely one to return to the Council Chief Executive, with a covering letter.
Just been to our out of town M and S. When this first started, a lot of the staff were wearing visors-today not one of them was. They have also got rid of the silly indoor queuing system for the food hall too. Amongst customers there were a few designer muzzles about but not many. I find it hard to believe that come Friday, someone somewhere will flick a switch and they will all be masked up.
Next door at B and M they have taped off the parent and child parking spaces in order to reintroduce the queuing system which has been absent for weeks now. Are they expecting a rush of muzzled customers on Friday?
Does the M&S have a cafeteria? The one I visited a few days ago at Teesside Park does. The sight inside was miserable. All the tables were surrounded by seven-foot-high plastic screens. Eat in a box!
Didn’t venture any further than the food hall but yes it has a large, and usually very busy, cafeteria.
I think the rush will be on Thursday.
Friday might be like the day the UK changed to decimal currency. That was before the supermarkets took over and food shopping was mostly done in town and at the indoor and outdoor markets.
Mum and I went shopping and the town was almost deserted even though shops were pricing both ways – my butcher still does!
Anyone noticed that happening re masks in Scotland? Did people stay away at first then relax the mask-wearing once the novelty wore off? Or were people keen to model their fancy new muzzles?
I need to food shop tonight, so hopefully things will have settled down by the time I need to go again next week.
Didnt see any difference myself. No stocking up before masks and not a real increase in people in supermarkets after.
Local shops have been doing well all through that remained open.
The footfall to food shops, supermarkets had really tailed off in the month before masks. An eg.one Sainsburys had a 100 person limit. Each visit I asked how many were in 67, 78 etc in a large superstore during peak times. Places felt deserted, not check out queues for example.
Pedestrains are more outside shops now but don’t think shopping per se is working out well. I look forward to some financial data about the matter.
I’m going to go local shops shopping tomorrow – will report back on the muzzle situation. Have supermarket delivery booked for Friday – then like you I’m hoping that things will have settled down and people will be sticking 2 fingers up at the mask edict. If not, Amazon Fresh here we come.
In my local M&S, only one member of staff was wearing a muzzle (again must be a newbie as I don’t recognise her), the second door has been reopened and all the one way systems (which people have been ignoring anyway) have been removed. At Morrison’s the antisocial distancing stickers leading to the self service tills have been removed, their staff are not wearing muzzles.
I started my rush Wednesday last week. Went to the Sainsburys 5 miles from my town. First time I have been there since March. There were quite a lot of people wearing masks ~ 40% maybe. I have just returned from the store this morning having done another ‘bulk buy’ today: Curiously a lot less pepole wearing masks maybe ~ 20%…. but this DID include a child of 5 – 6 years old with two masked parents.
I went to my local hairdresser yesterday – first haircut since January! I expected to have to queue but I was the only customer. I asked if they were expecting to insist on masks for customers from Friday and they said that they didn’t know. They said that they had customer last week who is a doctor who put out the government line ‘Yes masks would be necessary’ but the lady cutting my hair said that there was just so much information which they find too confusing and contradictory (a statement which I agree with), so they will just wait and see what happens.
Following text message just received this morning from my doctors
Dear Patient, We need to do all we can to stop the spread of Covid-19 so we asking all patients who have a face to face appointment or a general query at Reception to please wear a face mask when attending the surgery. We ask that you wear the mask at all times unless instructed to remove it. Unfortunately the surgery will not be able to provide masks and we ask that patients wear their own. Thank you for helping to keep us all safe.
Sad to see that the medical profession actually think that this is medically correct.
Given that bulk packs of disposable masks are very cheap, the fact that they are unwilling to provide any is disgraceful.
What about oldies who don’t normally go out. Where are they going to find a mask?
Indeed, one of the most worrying aspects of this whole shambles is the number of health professionals who have been shown unable to absorb and process fairly straightforward data.
It’s called the “mere exposure effect” (Titchener described it, if my memory is right), the basic premise is that people end up believing anything by mere repetion (coloquially it’s known as “brainwashing” but takes way less effort than in the films!) and this is how a lot of advertising works.
Personally, I hear masks-masks-masks so often, that I, too, beging to think that well, something must be there, but then I look at research, and go “really?! your p-values are more than 0.5 (or approaching 1) and you want to persuade me?!” but then doctors etc have better things to do than study research…
Apparently, Jung’s view:
“Roughly, and simply speaking, “participation mystique” refers to a collective human compulsion to project an identity on to a group of people that is largely imaginative or symbolic. This is probably where a concept like “herd mentality” originates, or even a more common phrase we are hearing these days, “sheeple” — people who seem to follow blindly an official narrative”.
https://off-guardian.org/2020/07/19/the-scarlet-letter-of-covid19/
Sheeple is a product of a long term effort to de-educate people en mass, dumbing down maths, sciences, promoting degrees like “Beauty” etc.
Jung’s archaic identity potentially helps in looking at the deeply devisive tactics used nowadays through group-identity (everyone now “belongs” to some “group”—there’s literally no place for individuality) but you have to push people into a group to begin with, which is where the mere exposure effect comes in, or as my 73 year old mother says “keep telling people they are stupid, and they will eventually believe you”…
“promoting degrees like “Beauty””
Nah!- Even tho’ the general process of education has indeed been subject to rot and backward ‘progress’ ever since Kenneth Baker was the key Spiv Party operative in the field.
(.. and no, don’t tell me about the Blair governments and Blunkett etc. and all the other tossers – I know)
No, the main damage has been done by pointless individuals like our lying and narcissistic Mr Toad pretending that quoting Latin and Greek tags demonstrates intelligence and ability after wearing a topper and tails at school.
Or worse – like Cameroon boasting a ‘First’ in the duggy’s degree of PPE at Oxford as an entry into occupations well above the ability level of the holder.
At least ‘Beauty’ has *some* minimal applicability to the real world and the market.
As well, keep telling people that you are an Expert and they might eventually believe you.
Kendrick being a notable and heroic exception!
I Absolutely share your view Rick. Thought seems to be trained out of highly responsible people.
I had one of those last week. I emailed back & told them I won’t be doing so. It does worry me that ‘so called ‘ intelligent people still believe the guff that HMG/PHE send out. Surely their own observations with the patients should show them its all wrong.
fortunately, despite being an old fart i appear still to be fit as a butchers dog so hopefully i wont ever need to go (and if i do expire it will be at a HMRC office and will be highly entertaining). But i can sleep in the knowledge that i am keeping them safe
How the medical industries continually invents epidemics:
https://archive.org/details/VirusMania/mode/2up
This was published in 2007. Talk about plus ca change!
The pharmaceutical companies and top scientists rake in enormous sums of money by attacking germs and the media boosts its audience ratings and circulations with sensationalized reporting …… “The primary purpose of commercially-funded clinical research is to maximize financial return on investment, not health,” says John Abramson of Harvard Medical School.
After last year’s barefaced lies regarding the plant-based diet, I doubt if anyone from Harvard Med would be so honest nowadays.
Absolutely, could have been written yesterday.
We’ve been pointing our guns in the wrong direction. The UK government paper that the Telegraph exhumed explains the rationale for the lockdown. It was produced by Health officials, statisticians and actuaries. The scandal of Covid deaths is dwarfed by that of the ancillary fatalities. Here’s why:
Initial estimates of Excess Deaths from COVID-19 Department of Health and Social Care, Office for National Statistics, Government Actuary’s Department and Home Office 8 April 2020
https://assets.publishing.service.gov.uk/government/uploads/system/uploads/attachment_data/file/892030/S0120_Initial_estimates_of_Excess_Deaths_from_COVID-19.pdf
This is the paper that assumes about 200,000 non-covid fatalities in the event of a 6 month lockdown, that’s about 1,100 per day. I would expect these figures to be pretty sound, they’re taken from real life by actuaries who do this stuff all day long.
Essentially the maths balances the deaths on one hand of the 500,000 Covid19 fatalities that Imperial were forecasting against the 50,000 fatalities in the event of a lockdown plus the ancillary deaths caused by the lockdown, cancer deaths, heart attacks, organ failure, suicide etc. The key point though is that the Covid19 fatalities were expected to have foregone about 10 years of life. In other words they expected fatalities to have an average age of 70. So they multiplied the 500,000 by 10 to give 5m years of lost life in the event of no lockdown.
On the other side of the equation, in the event of a lockdown, they had 50,000 covid19 deaths with 10 years lost life each plus 200,000 ancillary fatalities with an average of 4.2 lost life years each.
Thus, the equation was 5m life years v about 1.5m life years. Lockdown and save 3.5m life years. Who wouldn’t go for that?
We now come to the real world. In actuality the average lost life years was not 10 years. The age of the average Covid19 fatality was about 80, about the same age as the expected age of death for the UK population. Thus, the Covid19 fatalities shouldn’t have had their lost years multiplied by 10 but rather by 1 lost life year.
Now let’s redo the equation with the lost life years at 1 for Covid19 fatalities and keeping the 4.2 for ancillary deaths. This time the Imperial model would show 500,000 lost life years v 50,000 lost life years +(2000,000 * 4.2 lost life years) = 890,000 lost life years.
The do nothing scenario would have produced 40% or 390,000 fewer lost life years.
If average lost life years are 1 and not 10 the key driver to the decision becomes the ancillary deaths (cancer, heart attack, dehydration, neglect, suicide etc) as they attract a multiple of 4.2 lost life years.
Thanks Nick. Helpful analysis. You make it very clear.
Good stuff Nick. Is this also a hangover from the dataset provided to ICL for modelling – from China – where I see the life expectancy of a man is 74 vs 80 in the UK?
Thanks for this Nick. As we know, this is very abstract because the theory was wrong to begin with! Looking at Sweden, the lesson is that we don’t need to lock down healthy populations. A lesson that had to be relearned after centuries of experience dealing with infectious diseases…
This is excellent analysis (but not in a good way). I’ve been wondering where the hell this the calculation was, as it seemed to me to be significant dereliction of duty if it hadn’t been completed.
My understanding was this handn’t been performed in March as Hancock admitted this when asked during one of his proclomations.
This does leave me with the suspicion that this is a post hoc calculation that was never going to produce a figure that didn’t support the lock down.
I have have a couple of other issues with what is omited here.
1) What is the sustained impact on the economy? How many jobs will be lost over period of time and how many deaths will this incur?
2) What is the sustained reduction in tax revenue and how will this impact public services? E.g. the 2007 financial crisis resulted in between 100 and 200 thousand deaths (depending on source) as a result of austerity measures.
Now, additionally, we all know that IC’s model is fundamentally flawed* and IMO incapable of producing a figure that could be regarded as useful for anything. However, that model could be out by as much as a factor of 10 and certainly at least 2. It has incorrect, or out of date, values for the CFR and makes enormous assumptions regarding rate of infection and doesn’t consider die-back during warmer periods.
Your estimate is a good one and shows how the government’s calculation is flawed using the data they had. However, it could well be that this policy is actually costing millions of lost life years taking those other points into consideration.
Do not expect this to be admitted. Ever.
*I was going to say bollocks but it wanted the main thrust of my post to sound a quarter way intelligent
I think really another key point from this is that people with underlying health problems are 4 x more likely to die from their health issue because the NHS has gone awol than from Covid.
Of course the whole 500,000 deaths is predicated on the IFR of 1%. We now also know that this varies enormously with age & health condition.
I don’t know a doctor (and I know a few) who doesn’t take vitamin C, D and zinc. Why doesn’t Government advise this & advise exercise rather than stewing at home & getting fat & depressed?
For anyone seeing my OffGuardian posts will know I’ve been ranting about that since March. The policies of staying indoors and avoiding fresh air and vitamin D will have a greater negative impact than the avoiding spreading the virus outdoors, which we can now see to be a virtually non-existant phenomona.
“Stay indoors. Save lives.” This mantra will have had the opposite effect. Maybe signifincantly in the case of the BAME community.
I’ve not been out much these past few months, and that’s mostly down to lethargy and running on emotional fumes rather than listening to those idiots in government. It’s definitely not been good for my health and fitness. At least I had an okay starting point though.
At the start of this, recommending vitamin C, D and zinc may well have helped a whole lot more than any lockdown.
And now masks to make our immune systems even more weaker
Nick, David Miles etal did a similar analysis:
https://www.imperial.ac.uk/people/d.miles/document/7583/Miles%20Stedman%20Heald%20NIESR/?Miles%20Stedman%20Heald%20NIESR.pdf
The Abstract ends: “The evidence suggests that the costs of continuing severe restrictions in the UK are so great relative to likely benefits in numbers of lives saved so that a substantial easing in restrictions is now warranted.”
But this calculation was not done before the lockdown, as Matt Hancock admitted on 10 April 2020 at the Coronavirus Daily Update. The government introduced the lockdown without making any attempt to assess the number of people who would die as a result of the lockdown measures.
I suspect this analysis was in draft form pre the lockdown, it would take a few weeks to know it up, it’s a substantial report, try reading it! then was published on the 8th April.
I read the sections on the lockdown deaths. They were clearly trying to minimise the number of deaths it would cause. For example, they looked for ways in which the lockdown measures would reduce deaths and expected these to be significant, but expected obvious increased death factors to be negligible. They definitely under-estimated the impact of non-provision of health care, the negative effect of lack of exercise, the harm to mental health and the harm from the damage to the economy.
As for the publication date. I missed it at the time, and so did apparently everyone else, including the Secretary of Health and Social Care. Does that not strike you as rather odd? On 10 April 2020 Matt Hancock knew nothing about this study.
It’s always a cockup, never a conspiracy. Organisations of any size are too porous to ever effectively organise a conspiracy. This is just a lot of cockups.
I never said it was a conspiracy, so I don’t understand why you are telling it wasn’t one. As for your assertion that is a lot of cock ups: the idea that the government introduced the lockdown by mistake is not something I find persuasive.
Matt Hanock knows nothing. No further qualification needed, Steve.
When the independent inquiry questions him, I would not be surprised if he played the “I have no knowledge of that” card.
They love to project all kinds of horror stories with their multiplication tables and faulty modelling. That’s what they are paid to do.
I’ve been meaning to post this link for some time. A friend created this interactive website that shows positive test results by area for all 250 odd areas of England. The data comes from the daily csv file that the NHS publishes which is now over 100,000 rows in a csv file, this makes it far more digestible. Specify your area in the dropdown box click on ‘Trend’ and you can see the daily positive tests going back to early March. You can also see modifications in daily data from when pillar 2 tests were added. There’s also a calculated R figure and a map feature. It’s very neat.
https://davehawkins-shiny.shinyapps.io/CV19/
Thank you very much for the link.
Excellent but rather shocking.
It shows that my contingency has been locked down for on average of less than 5 cases per day throughout!!!
Shocking indeed!
Latest report date: 2020-07-20
New cases reported at all regions on latest day: 53
My area has confirmed cases that work out at 1.02% of the overall constituency population…
I think the NHS assume actual cases are about 5x the tested figure which is why daily reported cases differ so much from the number of positive tests.
I don’t for a second think that mask will work. I don’t like the idea of wearing a mask but I think that the government knows they have made a mess of this and they see this as a way out and masks provide a psychological effect by making people think they are safe even though they were anyway!
https://www.thelancet.com/journals/eclinm/article/PIIS2589-5370(20)30208-X/fulltext
Bombshell article published today Lancet, complicated but this phrase is quoted“Lastly, government actions such as border closures, full lockdowns, and a high rate of COVID-19 testing were not associated with statistically significant reductions in the number of critical cases or overall mortality”
In our study, an increasing number of days to border closures was associated with a higher caseload, and more restrictive public health measures (such as a full lockdown compared to partial or curfew only measures) were associated with an increase in the number of recovered cases per million population. These findings suggest that more restrictive public health practices may indeed be associated with less transmission and better outcomes. However, in our analysis, full lockdowns and wide-spread COVID-19 testing were not associated with reductions in the number of critical cases or overall mortality.
Am I missing something, or are these two findings directly contradictory? It seems to be saying that full lockdown means more people recover (so presumably fewer people die) but also that full lockdown is not associated with a reduction in the number of deaths?
I found the article discussion full of ifs, maybes and inconclusives.
The bit about smoking is quite ridiculous and can be summed up as “we don’t know”.
The last paragraph sensibly sums up the only thing they can be sure about from their study – and it doesn’t tell us anything we didn’t already know.
The important thing is no reduction in total mortality and it has been published in Lancet. The other is very vague discussion about reduced transmission better outcome but in the end deaths is the only interesting thing.
Recovery seems like a dodgy metric. I agree the hard endpoint of death is ultimately the only important thing. They tried to beat up the recovery finding in the conclusion but it did come across as vague.
This should make you laugh!
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/technology-53485569
I’ve just read through it again, looking for some quotes for you but honestly there are just too many bits that are hilarious. Do have a look!
You couldn`t make it up!
Working in the industry, this was always a fear of mine and the reason I have not been pushing holidays in the short term:
https://www.thesun.co.uk/news/12188250/brits-coronavirus-spain-quarantine/
Could open up so many cans of worms.
I do get a sense that this lockdown hokey cokey might just be a means of grinding people down to such an extent that they willing queue up for a vaccine if it promises to end this nightmare
You’re obviously not wrong.
The narrative is so obviously ludicrous when tested against real world data that this is the obvious rationale – keep the Scary Fairy running until we can justify the universal Pricks.
Have they suddenly started doing more testing? Or did their overly stringent lockdown prevent a proper first wave everywhere?
A lovely combination of both I would assume.
Must admit that we’ve now cancelled 2 planned trips to Spain – Cadiz September and Tenerife for 3 weeks of winter sun in Nov/Dec. These were booked pre-madness. Obviously we’re not frit of the virus but the mask wearing lunacy – worse than here – and reports of fervent enforcement by the Spanish police have left us unwilling to trade misery with rain here for misery with sun there.
Very bad experience in the Stirling branch of Ramsdens who refused to sell me Euros on the grounds that I was not wearing a mask. I conveniently had a copy of the relevant statutory instrument with me but the manageress initially refused to look at it, although I eventually persuaded her to at least have a cursory glance; she still refused service despite the clearly worded exemption for foreign currency exchanges. There is an obvious reason why banks, currency exchanges etc are exempt from masked wearing.
She sounds like an extremist
Sounds like Karen
go back again wearing a mask .. and carrying a gun. You get your euros and they wont know who you are!!!
The ‘Elusive Report’ looks like corporate manslaughter
Some truth in the media?! WHAT IS HAPPENING?!
https://metro.co.uk/2020/07/22/nearly-three-times-people-dying-flu-pneumonia-coronavirus-13021417/
Start of masking up for flu narrative?
Really wouldn’t surprise me
Does this include “Man flu” (a very serious condition!)
That is exactly where this is going.
Telling line in the article:
If that is true then based on Toby’s figures above, around 670,000 were infected. If 400 died then the IFR would be 0.05%.
Also shows how the virus was really spread in the nosocomial environment rather than community.
Does it also mean they have no excuse to not be at their workstations now as they have already had the virus… oh, silly me… you can get it multiple times, hence the need for an annual vaccine!
Most went undetected? But it’s deadly!
Schrödinger’s virus. Both deadly and not deadly at the same time
917 flu and pneumonia deaths in the week ending July 10th. How did they catch it? I thought the only reason a second wave of Covid-19 wasn’t raging through our barely-exposed population like a fire through dry grass was all the restrictions? But flu viruses can get past them OK?
Yes, that very thought occurred to me too… Must be because we haven’t been wearing enough masks.
Only problem is that no one is reading the metro at the moment.its given out free to commuters at railway stations
Good to see our own Scotty87 kicking it on Simon Dolan’s Twitter thing. Getting lots of anti-mask support, plus light relief from a nutjob who says Scotty will kill all his customers.
30th February 2021
The Times Newspaper
Headline FACE MASKS PREVENTED SECOND WAVE
To day the Prime Minster Sir Matt Hancock released a report proving facemasks had prevented a second wave. The report by independent advisor’s Conrad Whitty and Liberty Vallance pointed out there had not been a new coronavirus case since August, which vindicated their face mask wearing policy
Sir Matt said “I knew I was brilliant, but this just proves it”
The Prime Minister also announced that pubs would remain closed until October to prevent a third wave
The whereabouts of the previous Prime Minister still remains a mystery. Police have confirmed the last sighting of Mr Johnson was on New Years eve in the company of Jimmy Hoffa. They appealed for information.
Super. Have you read the words to the great Gene Pitney’ song ‘The man who shot Liberty Vallance’? If we cast Boris as Liberty Vallance, and Sir Patrick Vallance as the man who came to reclaim his own name!
If I recall correctly, he wasn’t that brave, he shot Liberty Vallance in the back.
Amendment
“The Prime Minister also announced that pubs (that had not already gone out of business and been converted to hostels for those made bankrupt and homeless due to Lockdown) would remain closed until October to prevent a third wave”
Trouble is – they *need* a ‘second wave’. It’s part of the narrative for the Mengele brigade to institute ‘Pricks for All’ (and profits for some).
I went to TKMaxx yesterday with my wife. We were at the top of the stairs and were told to wait to go down as 1 person was coming up! Then the guy behind us radioed down on his walkie-talkie ‘I’m sending 2 down’, the reply ‘All clear’! It cracked me up, it was like a SWAT team!
oh man get hold of one of those walkie-talkies.
you could have some fun eh
How about a protest rally with everybody carrying walkie talkies, all talking at the same time from different scripts?
t’s not just a mask – it’s a line in the sand.
Just nipped to Tesco to stock up before the mask muppetry starts on Friday. At least 70% of the people in there had no masks. Doesn’t that just confirm that most people 1. don’t wish to wear a mask and 2. that they are not scared of this virus anymore.
Why of why Mr Buffoon are you imposing this NOW when you seemingly also want the economy to get back to normal? #snowflakepandemic
Time to get a grip, how much more evidence do the Government need that people have had enough and want their lives back?
Why the media doesn’t get it together and really start sharing the real stats I don’t know. Presumably too dimwitted to think it would be a better story than peddling the Government lies?
It’s being imposed now to perpetuate the Big Lie and the fear so that the government can cover its arse and not have to confess to having got it all wrong, for so long, and can continue to be able to micromanage our lives, forever. If you’ve got power, and power is all you want, why would you willingly give it up? I think we have to assume there are NO good intentions here.
As for the media, the same applies, plus certain sections of it (Guardian, BBC, others) are fully signed up to wider agendas that are served by the power to control people’s lives.
It’s an evil coup.
After Friday be sure to talk to people in masks, they will be the same without today. Show them the light!
Just been into M&S for the same reason, not a mask in sight, not even the assistants. Its ridiculous, and infuriating. I wont be wearing one ever, at the end of this malarkey it will be my badge of honour.
It’s being done so that they can extend the Coronavirus Act and all it’s power for another 6 months (review due end Sept) to continue the lie and so that people will go for the vaccine.
Cressida Dick has said she hopes members of the public will ‘encourage’ other people to ‘comply’ with the muzzle mandate. Also says she hopes people ‘will be shamed to comply or shamed to leave the store’. She said this on LBC. What a disgrace. Encouraging more schisms in our society and people turning upon each other like informers to the Stasi. Disgraceful!
She’s a wrong’un
As wrong as they come.
Priti will do for her before long
Doubt it, Priti talked a good game for a while, but don’t they all, right up to the moment they need to act!
Priti Patel has shown no signs of life. Said ages ago we need to get used to the new normal. Guilty as hell.
Shes common purpose.
Also was in charge of operation that led to the killing of Jean Charles da Silva e de Menezes.
From wikipedia so do not know this is factually accurate: On the basis of Frank’s suspicion, the Met’s Gold Commander Cressida Dick authorised officers to continue pursuit and surveillance, and ordered that the suspect be prevented from entering the Tube system.
Coercive manipulation via social shaming. She is intelligent to understand that her actions on the radio described above will destabilise community. Is she working against peaceful coexistence?
She got ‘removed’ for that, then came back
Looks up ‘Removed’ in dictionary… Promoted after a short holiday.
She got promoted.
The first ‘witness’ interviewed at the scene on the day was a very calm man, who mentioned that he had called his boss to explain to ‘her’ that he would be late into work. Yes, she was in charge of operations.
Member of the public hopes Cressida Dick will ‘fuck off’.
ticks every box for being a senior policeman …. except the “is he a good copper” box (gender use deliberate)
Have you seen her in uniform? She looks like a sack of shit tied in the middle.
Like binder-twine tied round a leg to stop the rats running up there.
Some people do, they really can’t help it. Especially when they are a sack of shit.
Well she would do, wouldn’t she!
Cressida is about to be disappointed because, I assure you, I feel no shame when it comes to resisting this ridiculous overreaction. It’s telling that she’s come out and said that though, as she is attempting to distance policing from any over zealous shop owner/manager that might be expecting police to come running around the corner to support their bed-wetting, nappy wearing, inclinations.
‘no shame’
The opposite perhaps? I don’t know what the inhabitants of Sturgeon Land on here might say in the light of their experiences – rather than ‘no shame’ actually feel about a foot taller?
Do you have a link to what she actually said, I want to see if what she said can be construded as councelling, procuring, aiding, or abetting vigilantism?
Can she be done under the ‘Equalities Act 2010’ for this? or if not under hate speech as you’ve potentially got her actively encouraging the shaming of disabled people and people with medical conditions, or their carers, who are exempted for wearing masks.
Probably not, it sounds way too much of a stretch… Don’t know why you’d be downvoted though…
Her actual word were “My hope is that the vast majority of people will comply, and people who are not complying will be shamed into complying, or shamed to leave the store, by the store keepers or by other members of the public.”
Shaming will no doubt lead to conflict, so she is inciting violence. Someone will end up getting hurt or killed due to this reckless statement.
Also, a lot of people aren’t wearing masks due to mental health issues. Shaming them could well end up pushing them over the edge.
Of course, even more people ARE wearing masks due to mental health conditions!
Or mental deficiency conditions…
Thanks! That’s pretty much what I said in my complaint: serious lapse in judgement and failure to appreciate the consequnces/risk.
This is absolutely disgraceful. By saying that in the media, the Met Chief Police Officer is inciting public disorder and ignoring the fact that a proportion of non-mask wearers are medically exempt. The stores themselves understand this, what is her game? This should be a sackable offence (I know it won’t be!)
She has already had many sackable offences but she ticks all the diversity boxes so will remain. Boris’s tories will love her being the metro liberals they are.
The sack of shit should be prosecuted for incitement to cause a breach the peace as a minimum.
terrorism act? inciting terror?
fucking witch
(common purpose agent iirc)
Escort all of them to the Tower.
Calling them “the filth” is now highly appropriate.
Has she forgotten that we all saw her ignoring social distancing so she could clap for the NHS?
Has she got any credibility, if she has I dont know how.
If people should be “shamed” they should be shamed today. Or indeed, since the edict was announced last week. The government is trapped by its own lie. They cannot admit that masks are nothing but theatre and superstition, so they have to continue to pile lie upon lie. If that quote is correct, she should be told to resign. It’s bordering on incitement to violence. Imagine if Nigel Farage had said something similar.
I don’t think I’ll listen to the person who oversaw the *open-verdict-that-would-have-been-unlawful-killing-if-not-for-coroner’s-intervention* of one Jean Charles de Menezes. Clearly a bad ‘un.
Yes – I heard from someone who had seen her incompetence in that matter at first hand.
We should say, if accosted whilst out…
Shame on YOU for being a bully
Presumably this is because the police are not intending to enforce the muzzle rule themselves. What a nasty piece of work!
Her comments are a disgrace. She’s pretty much encouraging discrimination against the disabled and this is abhorrent. Like Khan, has been useless as well with dealing crime and needs to go.
Khan is a Sadiq.
Dick by name and dick by nature.
Jeremy Clarke’s story of visiting his uncle’s war grave on the Somme
https://app.spectator.co.uk/2020/07/15/low-life-21/content.html
Having read it, and having been there, I think the entire population of this country should be taken to Becourt Cemetery and made to walk past the graves one at a time before being delivered back to England, where, in the meantime, the Commonwealth War Graves Commission will have removed every single vestige of ‘social distancing’. A collective slap round the head is needed.
Ventured out this morning. Saw more mask wearers but they only accounted for a maximum of 12-15% of the shoppers out + about. And also there were more people around in general; more like normal levels! No one seemed to be veering as far away from others as possible, nor did anyone say anything when I went the opposite way round the one way system in Superdrug. So rebellious
Treated myself to a Caramel Cloud Macchiato + sat people watching. Not bad for a Wednesday.
Most people weren’t wearing masks in Scotland and now almost all are complying so I hope that the English population are more freedom loving with braver hearts but I wouldn’t be too optimistic.
Yes, I was maskless in a small Scottish town at the weekend and was very much in the minority. I was challenged by a visored shop assistant who said that she didn’t disagree with me when I told her masks were pretty ineffective. The fear of being out of line is quite depressing. I hope the English have more spine to them.
I am more optimistic because Scotland awash with the cult. England has stronger regional identities, I mean less government following in regions.
Local daily shops in the Scottish city here are operating at 70% masks I’d say. Supermarkets much higher. I put it down to the cult.
Maybe I’m being over hopeful but… does anyone else feel like the narrative is being changed this week? First the 200,000 dead from lockdown report, then Whitty admitting R was below 1 well before lockdown, and now the Lancet article?
I agree, it does seem that the wheels are coming off. The increasingly hysterical media coverage is getting so bad that it is exhibiting symptoms of severe mental disorder. A complete detachment from reality has taken place. We must remain calm and steadfast in our resistance.
I’ve felt this way since March. Still hasn’t happened.
Mm I know exactly what you mean unfortunately
https://www.thesun.co.uk/news/12168610/health-experts-derail-britain-covid-recovery/
A few more courageous journalists like this in the heart of the MSM will start turning the tide.
Nasty bug isn’t co-operating with them. Maybe need to order a new one from somewhere?
Yes, TJN household picked up on this too. Maybe wishful thinking, we’ll see.
Perhaps the media is starting to smell blood, as I always thought they would eventually. There is scandal after scandal there, of every sort, waiting to come out.
(Lancet article: PHE deaths fraud?)
I wish I could believe you’re right, but the media are part of the scandal – a huge part. They have almost as much interest as the politicians in keeping this crap going forever. And the BBC and Guardian have, IMO, more sinister motives
The media also have no morals, whatsoever. A sniff of increased sales through exposing a scandal or grabbing into a new public consciousness and they’ll go for it.
Yes, but there are plenty of other scandals. The BBC and Guardian will NEVER admit that this whole thing is a crock of crap. Maybe other newspapers might change their tune; let’s hope so.
I don’t think they are going to say that the virus is like flu and we should go back to normal.
The roles of the Beeb and the Groan are slightly different.
The Beeb has always been the voice of the establishment. What has changed is the extended degree to which it is now compliant with government propaganda, increasing after Cameroon’s victory in 2010.
The Groan was reasonably independent until the Scott Trust became a limited company just after the Snowden affair. Viner became a compliant editor, and investigative reporters were sacked and replaced largely by time-serving churnalists. Significantly, it accepted a place on the ‘D Notice’ committee – a link to the security services that it had previously eschewed. It was like a newbie being ‘made’ by the mafia.
Since then it has earned the sarcastic title of ‘House Journal to MI6’ – essentially meaning that it’s a different conduit for establishment propaganda, aimed at a particular readership in regurgitating certain gobbets of propaganda fed to it. This was seen in the fabrications about Corbyn that any decent journalist would have pulled apart – whatever their political allegiance – and which foreshadowed the brown-nose job over Covid that even the most naive might have sussed out.
I thought that BBC capitulated following it’s attempt to challenge Blair over WMD. That seemed to me to be the point at which the BBC just went along with government narrative. It hasn’t questioned any major event since: 2007 financial crisis, Libya, Syra, Skrpals, Covid.
The Guardian definitely looks like a takeover to me. It’s quite clever really, as The Guardian, traditionally, would be viewed as the quality paper that questions the establishment more than any other, yet it’s even more in lockstep with official narrative than the BBC. It leaves the odd situation where the Telegraph appears less establishment than it.
Ooh I forgot the PHE fraud as another example. The Lancet article is mentioned further down the comments. Basically shows that lockdowns had no effect on mortality.
Thanks.
I think the PHE numbers scam is largely irrelevant.
The key thing is the alteration of procedures for death registration that occurred under ’emergency’ legislation, whereby the normal checks and balances of diagnosis were abandoned.
John Lee was on to this way back in March (as a former consultant and Professor of Pathology) – and his strictures have now come to fruition :
https://www.spectator.co.uk/article/The-evidence-on-Covid-19-is-not-as-clear-as-we-think
The results of this distortion are given substance by the data in this article :
http://inproportion2.talkigy.com/cause_of_death_20jul.html
… whereby deaths from ‘normal’ causes have suddenly declined magically and dramatically.
I mean the one by which (as someone here pointed out), if Johnson, Cummings and Hancock were shot then their deaths would go down as covids, as they had previously had the bug.
It’s showing signs of crumbling + I for one cannot wait to have a ringside seat
Wish I could agree. What is crumbling? The government is about to make masks compulsory in shops. They are not going to go back on that any time soon, are they? Check out BBC news – no positive stories at all about the virus all but disappearing, just crap about masks, vaccines, second waves, more cases in Australia, etc. We’re nowhere near the Big Lie being admitted on a big enough scale to stir things up.
It was all so easy the first time around that they have decided to give a trial run to a new narrative about a second wave. Power corrupts. Absolutely. And it’s not Fabulous, darling.
Buy popcorn and enjoy the
meltdownshow.It’s been constant misdirection since the government killed 10s of thousands of care home residents
Cressida Dick today advising mask wearers to *shame*non mask wearers in the shop.Police fed now advising food shops to refuse entry to non mask wearers…..that’s it,beat up on,and starve the disabled.Phoned police to make complaint.Adised disability UK.
Have never loathed a government or police,as much as I do right now.
Cressida Dick being a moron again then. Somebody comes giving me grief over muzzle wearing (not required in Wales btw, the Turtle’s Head seems to be anti-mask), the police may still be required to attend. Possibly ambulances, too.
Edit: They really know how to bring out the worst in people, don’t they? The police are supposed to help keep the Queen’s Peace.
Talking of the Queen, what do you think she thinks of all of this? Or have ‘they’ got to her too?
I don’t suppose we’ll ever know, but I haven’t seen any images of Her Majesty in a mask, at least! And I found it heartening to-day to see Prince Philip taking part in the ceremony at Windsor Castle as he transfers his role as Colonel-in-Chief of The Rifles to the Duchess of Cornwall. He spoke to the soldiers there and didn’t seem to be engaging in any social distancing and he definitely didn’t wear a mask!
It’s interesting as the CMO in Victoria, commenting on the now (well in 30 minutes anyway) mandatory masks in Melbourne (all public settings, not just shops and public transport) said don’t cause trouble for people not wearing them because they probably have a legitimate reason. Shame that they were mandated in the first place, but better than Cressida Dick’s shameful ‘advice’ certainly.
Afternoon, DDS.
Links?
The aptly named Cressida Dick didn’t get where she is by standing up for law and order!
Why doesn’t she just have her force Jean Charles de Menezes non mask wearers. It would short circuit the process.
As my old Latin Master used to say at a time like this “if the fires of hell are licking at your feet it’s time to put on your boots and get the hell out of there”
Churchill: ‘If you’re going through Hell, keep going’.
Is the reason they are pushing for vaccines in this country because of the Blair Foundation closely aligned with his friend the Gates Foundation? Asking for a friend.
at this point I would assume they want most of us dead
or at the very least zombified
Daily figures from Scotland –
Scottish numbers: 22 July 2020
10 new confirmed cases of COVID-19
0 new reported death(s) of people who have tested positive
3 people were in intensive care last night with confirmed COVID-19
295 people were in hospital with confirmed COVID-19
9,720 new tests for COVID-19 that reported results
4 new suspected COVID-19 cases in adult care homes on 21 July
Since the start of the ‘outbreak’ (gov word)
47% of COVID-19 registered deaths related to deaths in care homes, 46% were in hospitals and 7% were at home or non-institutional settings.
https://www.gov.scot/publications/coronavirus-covid-19-daily-data-for-scotland/
Pop 5.5 million
Half of all Scottish deaths were in carehomes.
All will be kept hidden. You have your information move along.
The othe 45% odd were hosptial deaths, again underlying issues there? 5% died out of care settings. My figures are rounded. Look at link for actual.
The carehomes ought to be sturgeons epitaph.
If you want to know about excess deaths in Scotland during the covid19 period, (weeks 12-29) nrscotland.gov.uk has some interesting tables. 2,365 excess deaths above the 5-year average in care homes, 229 FEWER deaths in hospital and 2,717 more deaths at home, including 950 extra deaths from cancer. As at 19th July there have been 4,193 deaths in Scotland where covid19 was mentioned on the death certificate (which therefore does not necessarily mean that these people died of covid).
‘Covid-19’ on a death certificate means sweet FA.
“10 new confirmed cases of COVID-19″
That slippery ‘cases’ again. They’re down to using that.
“Half of all Scottish deaths were in carehomes”
.. that’s where a lot of deaths happen. It’s just ‘life’.
Masks appear to be a signal to the politicians that we have been subjugated, if it was for ‘our own good’ they would have closed the borders immediately. But they didn’t.
What would be the point of closing borders?
As Mask Friday approaches, those of us who intend to resist may find it useful to have a plan or script. This is mine. “I have an exemption on medical grounds” (and a card as back-up). If asked on what grounds: “Medical matters are confidential and I don’t discuss them with strangers”. If feeling generous: “But out of courtesy I’ll tell you that having my nose and mouth covered gives me severe anxiety”.
Keep it low-key, stay polite, don’t start arguing about the technicalities or politics of masks. Ignore any abuse from other shoppers. It’s highly unlikely that the police will be summoned, but if you cause a disturbance you’re creating an excuse for that to happen. If the shop continues to refuse entry, walk away saying you won’t be back.
In case police do get involved, carry cash only and no form of identification. Maintain silence for as long as you can – I think I could cope with a few hours in a cell, to waste as much police time as possible.
I’ll say I thought it was next week and so on
Dan, just hold your head high and breeze in. Any questions, just say you’re exempt. Don’t provide any reason or proof unless you feel the situation may get out of hand if you don’t. Buddy up with someone if you have to. Good luck. x
Pretty well what I’m going to do. Except I’m not giving any more details other that saying I’m exempt. Reason for exemption (i.e. sanity, a rare psychological condition) is my business only.
You don’t need a plan, the police aren’t gonna arrest you and most shops won’t say a word if you’re wearing a mask or not. Honestly don’t give it another thought. This is what is happening in the Peoples Demoncratic Socialist Republic Of Scottishstan.
Thanks Biker, you always cheer me up!
Thanks for the benefit of 12 days’ experience of this nonsense. I reckon you are right. As long as a situation doesn’t get fraught – and the non muzzle wearer can avoid that – it will come to nothing.
My work in a Supermarket (i’ve handed in my notice, can’t be arsed with it any more) has shown me that almost everyone will wear one and you’ll be out on your own but no one will say anything. However one of my workmates (security guard), a big fat english fella from Leeds as it happens, said to a customer that he needed to wear a mask (he’d been told by the boss not to mention masks but he thinks he guarding the gates of heaven), and he’d better hope he didn’t catch the virus and die. The customer reported him and the store manager came down and gave him short shift for this abhorrence. He was also given a written warning. The big stores want your money and know this is all bullshit and nothing more than a threat to their business. They want you in the shop not online buying shit from them wankers at Amazon.
The sniff of money is a great motivator. The big stores know that there are too many of them, and that they are walking a knife edge of going under.
And where’s the upside for them in enforcing muzzles? What do they get from it? Nothing.
That hadn’t ocurred to me:
You’re so right; though we don’t yet know exactly what the law will say, we do know that the guidelines say that it’s not up to the shops to enforce it, so why on earth would they given that enforcing it will mean turning away customers?
Was at my local Waitrose around 2.30pm today and for the first time there was a staff member with a counter at the door.
I’ve not found Waitrose easy through all this. It’s the only shop in which I’ve been told off for not standing in the right place. Three times!
I mentioned this several days ago.
I noticed staff at several shops counting muzzled v non muzzled.
Sums are being done.
Good man.
I’m back ‘haime’ this Friday and look forward to being muzzle free.
I’m hearing of across the board compliance there – what has happened to Scotland since I left !
How many stans does that make now?
Good one, Edward. I am not going to show any exemption card or ‘proof’ unless I feel a situation might get heated, because I’m very conscious of this country creeping towards a ‘Papers Please’ totalitarian state. I am not going to help build that. Proof, for me, is a very last resort.
‘If the shop continues to refuse entry, walk away saying you won’t be back.’
Maybe instead say that you will be writing to Head Office citing the following:
https://threadreaderapp.com/thread/1285491835415285761.html
‘I think I could cope with a few hours in a cell, to waste as much police time as possible.’
I’ve been thinking about that too! I’ve never been in trouble with the law. I guess you just don’t know till you’re there. Many years ago I read Papillon several times – I know it’s mainly made up, but anyone reading this must wonder how they would deal with he solitary.
Sleep. Hours and hours, if not days, of peaceful uninterrupted sleep.
Do not say anything other than you are medically exempt, you do not have to tell them anything at all. Staying calm is he main thing, Police say they will only attend if there is violence.
I would also have my mobile start recording before entering the shop, then if anyone does try to question or shame you just point it at them, and record them, they’ll soon back down if on camera, and you also have it in evidence in case the Police arrive.
I would expect it to take a fair while for the Police to get there, so unless they are going to physically manhandle you which you can record, you can just walk out.
Excellent advice.
Unfortunately a phone is an indicator of ID. I’m not very worried about police involvement, the only possibility of it would be if somebody started getting physical with me and I retaliated, and it might be hard to prove who started it.
If you’re serious about keeping it low-key and polite, Edward, I’d stop after
Absolutely. I’ve simply been saying ‘I’m exempt’ on the buses if asked. Drivers have been fine, and I won’t be getting into any discussions at the supermarket. You really do not have to go into any detail.
I think it’s always worth remembering that it’s not the poor bloody infantry’s fault
Yes, that’s very much my view. But there is the occasional jumped-up twerp who revels in the opportunity to boss people around. Incidentally there seems to be a view that Lidl should be OK, and I may keep going there, but my local one has a bossyboots on the self checkouts and when something goes wrong with the scanner (which happens all too often) she tells you to stand well back, even though she’s wearing a mask which most of the staff aren’t.
You could be right, I’ll erase the other bit from my script.
If they refuse you entry tell them you’ll sue them for disability discrimination
Why walk away ? Refusing you entry is discriminating against you because of your Disability, ask for his/her name.
Henry David Thoreau was sent to jail one time because he refused to pay taxes to support the US-Mexico war. Emerson popped by to see him and asked ‘what are you doing in there’? Thoreau replied ‘what are you doing out there’?
As my old Games Master used to say as he whipped my buttocks with a leather strap, “son, why do you always forget to bring your kit”?
Are you smoking the garden plants again?
We are the rotting flowers in a garden of weeds.
I hope we smell really bad, then.
As pungent as cat piss
Hello everyone. I’ve already read some positive stories on here from people who have tried out not wearing a silencing muzzle. However, let’s not forget D-day is not until Friday. I know we will do this anyway but let us all share as many stories as possible. I wonder if there could be a specific tab for these? Or a specific forum?
Only one full shopping day left till English Muzzle Day.
It’s been years since I’ve known such a laugh. It’s going to be so boring when all this is over.
Just over 3,000 signatures now
https://petition.parliament.uk/petitions/331430
Long post. Bit of a journey. Out and about in leafy East Yorkshire. Called into Sainsburys and Waitrose to stock up on essentials in prep for Friday and also to ask about mask policy. Someone said last week that Sainsburys do a lanyard – they do – ask at Customer services – for Hidden Disabilities Autism, Dementia and Anxiety. It’s thick bright green coloured with sunflowers and the board with their policy was up on display. I’ve got one. I’m not wearing a mask to go shopping in spite of what my MP said yesterday. East Yorkshire has the lowest number of cases in the county and as we know the risk of coming across someone with the virus is 1 in 2300 and the risk diminishing each day. I live on my own (widowed last year), green leafy village, rarely have someone round (Toby mentioned a LS dating app on his London Calling podcast -yes please Toby I’d sign up!) so I am 100% sure I don’t have the virus – so I’m not going to pass it on – and anyway why would I want to get up close and personal enough to breathe all over a random shopper?
But I do get anxious – first noticed with a high stress job some 13 years ago – heart palpillations, beta blockers prescribed. Not had any reason to take them again until March 13th this year when it all kicked off as I was due to go skiing on March 14th and the swirling black clouds were everyone – very stressful. Saved a load of hassle and didn’t go. But heart definitely didn’t like it and as my GP was closed, didn’t bother them – just worked out I probably needed to step back abit and calm down and take the pills again. Better now. But I’m not going to put a muzzle on as it might well cause the anxiety to come back. So as I’m going to wear the Hidden Disabiliity lanyard (and badge if it every arrives) I now feel uneasy. I’m not breaking the law according to Sainsburys (they get my custom from now on) but how far do I push it? I’m off to France end next week and – again like an earlier post – feel I’m not up to pushing against the French state (my language isn’t good enough!). But I’m normally happy to comply, I pay my taxes, don’t break the speed limits that often, think I contribute to society in many ways etc.
But this makes me feel I’m on the lines of becoming a rebel – someone who may well break these crazy, ill thought out ambigous rules that have no grounding in science that I can see and appear to being made up on the hoof by immoral, vacillating and incompetent politicians.
No, No, No. I am simply not going to comply.
Good on yer! A but of true Yorkshire stubbornness is just what’s needed! Go for it!
Your last paragraph sums all this nonsense wonderfully. Well done. And please, there’s nothing wrong with being a rebel!
Thank you Annie & blue moon! I can feel a streak of rock in my soul breaking out.
In Edinburgh . Used to work here 30 years ago. Place is all but closed with shops guarded lest an unmasked virus carrier tried to spend any money. Hardrock Cafe takes your temperature then asks for face muzzles if you want to visit the shop part. And yet Wee Jimmy is popular. Does not compute .
I have now done five mask free shops in Scotland without any problems. However and rather perversely I was refused service today for not wearing a mask in Ramsdens, a business exempt from the mask wearing regulations in Scotland! My general policy is to stick to small shops – they appreciate the business.
To be fair, to my mind if I decide to go abroad knowing what the rules are wherever I am going I probably ought to abide by them – it’s not my country, I don’t have to go there, and essentially I’m a guest. So I won’t be going anywhere where they mandate muzzles.
This doesn’t apply if I visit Scotland of course.
In my own country things are different though.
Well said, I’m with you all the way. I too will not ge wearing a mask, ever! I will be using the exemption strategy. If the shop will not let me in I will sight the disability & discrimination act. Tell them I will be writing to Head office for a full explanation & informing them that they will be receiving notification from my lawyer!
Rebels are desperately needed. There is no sitting on the fence anymore. Being a ‘good ctizen’ ain’t gonna wash
New Kansas album, “The Absence of Presence’.
“The absence of presence fills the air, I know you’re here but you’re not really there…”
That about sums it up.
A memorable quote from R.D. Laing’s <i>The Politics of Experience</i>: “We conform to a presence that is everywhere elsewhere.” An existential observation pithily stated – Laing’s trademark – mirroring perfectly our current madness: mask as a symbol of concern for others everywhere present but somewhere else because few care for anyone but themselves.
UK Column today introduces a new government research document that lays out the strategy for the coming winter. Important viewing I suggest.
You do have to be wary of some UK Column obsessions – but they have done a good job on Covid.
Their detailing of the background to the pompously titled ‘Academy of Medical Sciences’ was a fascinating exposure of a government front organisation, using graduates of the Mengele School of Health Sciences.
Afternoon fellow sceptics. Just reading the comments about Freaky Friday, and the sheer bloody insanity of it is so great that I think it’s easy to lose sight of because it is causing so much anger and distress.
At the end of the day, we are finding ways to circumvent an idiotic prohibition so we can buy food. No-one here is talking about discretionary spending. No-one.
How on earth does this square with rebuilding a collapsed economy? Because nothing says “retail therapy” like covering your face with a wet rag during a heatwave, does it?
It would be funny if it wasn’t inducing panic attacks.
Someone referred to a YouGov poll indicating that the people who have said they will shop LESS because of masks outnumber those who say they will shop MORE, by 8 percentage points. Own goal. But this was never about helping the economy, it’s about helping the evil ones keep the lies going.
Absolutely, subjugation.
Yes, and Crocodile Dickhead wouldn’t be so vocal if she didn’t expect widespread resistance.
Good point!
Similarly, nothing says “retail therapy” like queuing in the wind and rain to get into Matalan.
Ordered mayonnaise and other dry foods from https://www.realfoods.co.uk, good prices, great service and with me the next day.
Ooh, thank you for that link – I think we’ll be ordering some things from them!
Shopping is already a dystopian, miserable experience with the antisocial distancing that muzzling will simply hasten the demise of the shops.
This is what we get for not having economists on Sage. Bet Whitty and Vallance never had to go shopping.
I think we should force the entire government together with Sage to go on a “shopping spree” with all the insane measures they’ve put in place. They have to do it one whole day with no toilets and not much choice for lunch or coffee.
See how they like it.
This was posted here a couple of weeks ago and I have only now had a chance to read it. In that couple of weeks things have changed to make it even more relevant, and I would urge people to read it. I don’t know how long people want to pretend that this is just rank incompetence worldwide. It’s more than that. Twelve minute read and then do a bit of your own digging if you’re not convinced. I am..
https://www.gracevanberkum.com/post/we-are-being-played-please-read
Apropos of which: My IT guy visited me today in full fuck-off bomber pilot face mask with detachable washable filter, which he proudly showed off. I said take it off or lose my business. He did. He has young children. I wondered if he knew how terrified children are of seeing that day after day. I told him he had a responsibility NOT to wear a mask, that this was a massive con and/or over-reaction and he was perpetuating the fear. (Over-reaction if not a con, but it is a con). .He’s a grumpy sod but has a great sense of humour but you can’t see it in his eyes, you have to see his mouth. All his’ cheekiness’, his rebelliousness (and he is usually rebellious), is expressed through his facial expressions and mostly his mouth. I told him this to pacify him. He didn’t get it. He thought he was keeping people safe. I told him he’d been had. He took my PC away. When he returns it I told him to come without a mask.(Oh and gloves. What good do fucking gloves do?)
I saw the Grace Van Berkum post via Keep Britain Free forum. I logged into the World Economic Forum and saw it with my own eyes. All the evidence now points to this being a global plan with most countries complicit and signed up for, rather than incompetence of our government. At least 50 years in the making and Covid-19(84) seems to be the trigger.
Don Diego de la Vega wore a mask and no one knew he was Zorro.
Good news for me – I haven’t seen my mum since the beginning of March. She may not even remember me. But I’ll remember the f*ckers who condemned thousands of old people to die alone and frightened. They’ll rue the day.
https://www.gov.uk/government/news/families-and-friends-to-be-reunited-with-loved-ones-in-care-homes-as-visits-restart?utm_medium=email&utm_source=CampaignMonitor_Editorial&utm_campaign=LNCH%20%2020200722%20%20Charles%20Stanley%20%20JO+CID_fad290dbddadd0025810b0a17bcd0685
I am looking forward to hundreds of class action lawsuits.
Radio 5:
Trendy wokes kicking off because their details which they gave to go into pubs etc has been sold on to marketing companies.
F*****g priceless. Didn’t see that one coming did you f**k heads
One lady said the landlord phoned her and asked her out.
Outraged they were.
Give out your details to any old Tom Dick or Harry and what do you expect.
Funny as fuck.
GDPR my arse.
Is Tom related to Cressida?
Love it !.
This is so funny!
“Didn’t see that one coming” no, because the dimwits are busy looking out for an invisible ‘killer’!
Not ‘funny’ at all, this creature of the immoral fascist right that is now the Tory Party in government,. Forget the ‘woke’ typification – they’re irrelevant.
The Unherd article Toby links to is perhaps ‘surprisingly sound’ by Unherd’s standards. And it does read well until you get nearly to the end where a nasty shock awaits the reader. (The emphasis is mine):
‘Even if we don’t ever eradicate the disease, we will probably end up in a place where we can live with it. In the meantime, though, it’s still absolutely crucial that we control the disease. Beale in particular says that “policy-wise, it’d be completely insane to let it get out of control now,” because “by this time next year” it’s likely that we will have an effective and widely available vaccine. “Better to lock down even at considerable economic cost and wait for that,” he says, although he acknowledges the calculus changes if the vaccine will be much longer coming.” ‘
That would be Rupert Beale of the Crick institute. Partners: Medical Research Council, Cancer Research UK, Wellcome and three of the UK’s leading universities – UCL, Imperial College London and King’s College London. But don’t worry, they’ve signed up to BLM!
I enjoyed the Conservative Woman and Sun articles though – excellent!
Yep. Graduates of the Mengele School of Medicine are all over this like a rash.
Even at considerable economic cost. Has he seen what’s happening with gold and silver? And I bet he has a nice nest egg and cash on hand so he’s alright Jack.
These people should never EVER be allowed to drive policy.
In The Spectator interesting news about a Norwegian randomised study on the use of masks that concludes they are ineffective and recommends AGAINST their use.
Could you post a link? I can’t find it
I found it here:
https://www.fhi.no/globalassets/dokumenterfiler/rapporter/2020/should-individuals-in-the-community-without-respiratory-symptoms-wear-facemasks-to-reduce-the-spread-of-covid-19-report-2020.pdf?utm_medium=email&utm_source=CampaignMonitor_Editorial&utm_campaign=LNCH%20%2020200722%20%20Charles%20Stanley%20%20JO+CID_fad290dbddadd0025810b0a17bcd0685
Thank you!
Worth reading and quoting extensively
Sarcasm alert!
I’m sure Andrew Marr will be challenging our wonderful politicians about just this issue (or similar), on his next programme.
Is anybody here an expert on child development?
I’m wondering what effect the obliteration of faces will have on small children’s ability to interpret expressions. I believe the smile, signalling friendly feelings, is universal (though it can be fake), but many other expressions are surely culturally conditioned and need to be learned?
Are the Fascist pigs breeding up a generation of emotional imbeciles?
I work in education and have done so for the last 20 years.
I am not aware of any study of this sort. There is the well know study withholding physical contact of babies, which was stopped early because the babies started dying.
https://stpauls.vxcommunity.com/Issue/us-experiment-on-infants-withholding-affection/13213
But frankly, do we need to conduct a scientific study to conclude that putting masks on children is a terrible thing?
Some things are just self evident.
The President of Belarus calls it child abuse to put a mask on a child.
Belarus, population fatality rate: 5 per million – no lockdown
UK, population fatality rate: 75 per million – lockdown, facemasks
And copious amounts of vodka consumed.
I do too. I can feel the red mist rising when I see a masked child.
When very young children draw Mummy & Daddy – or whatever other persons they are ‘parented ‘ by – they invariably draw huge balloon like faces and tiny stick like bodies. I am sure this is because it is faces that are of paramount importance in human communication and interaction. My daughter, nephews and nieces all did this, despite their very different personalities.
Hiding behind masks is passive child abuse
Ye, you can get special pictures of people (I forget what they are called) that show the areas other people pay the most attention to increased in size. Heads/faces enormous.
I don’t think that you need to be an ‘expert’. The measures inflicted on children are child abuse – pure and simple. No doubt a lot of individuals who quail at the notion of paedophilia actually endorse this much more widespread abuse.
We have been back to normal with our grandchildren since May – but we well remember how on first meeting they flinched away from coming close.
I’m glad to say this was quickly eliminated by normal behaviour – but, having a number of educators in the family, we remain very aware of how child abuse is being enforced in schools.
This is an area where the underlying evil (let’s not mince words) is being writ large.
They will end up terrified of strangers, being in close proximity to anyone else, psychologically dependent on face masks, and suffer from OCD about the possibility of infection.
And will have weaker immune systems because of the excessive cleanliness, sanitising and the masks. We’re raising a generation of people who will grow up physically and psychologically damaged
If only there was some evidence based research to say it could take 200,000 people to wear face masks in order to prevent 1 single infection per week surely it would be enough to stop the new compulsory rule in its tracks?
Luckily there is:
https://www.fhi.no/globalassets/dokumenterfiler/rapporter/2020/should-individuals-in-the-community-without-respiratory-symptoms-wear-facemasks-to-reduce-the-spread-of-covid-19-report-2020.pdf?utm_medium=email&utm_source=CampaignMonitor_Editorial&utm_campaign=LNCH%20%2020200722%20%20Charles%20Stanley%20%20JO+CID_fad290dbddadd0025810b0a17bcd0685
From the document Marvin (above) has quoted:
‘Given the low prevalence of COVID-19 currently, even if facemasks are assumed to be effective, the difference in infection rates between using facemasks and not using facemasks would be small. Assuming that 20% of people infectious with SARS-CoV-2 do not have symptoms, and assuming a risk reduction of 40% for wearing facemask, 200 000 people would need to wear facemasks to prevent one new infection per week in the current epidemiological situation.’
I wonder whether we should suppress that information, if true. One new infection would be enough for the loonies to say it was worth it.
Its a bit like how they stop 140000 people from smoking weed to stop one case of weed induced psychosis.
They are obsessed with the number 0. 0 cancer deaths, 0 road death accidents, zero deaths for anything, etc. Zero zero zero.
I’m absolutely bloody furious,my wife has just been to Matalan (in England) and a pair of muzzled up middle-aged arseholes had a go at her because she wasn’t masked,’there’s always one ‘ was one of the things they said.It’s lucky for them that I wasn’t there !.
I have tried over the weeks to engage with these sort of people to show them a different view of things but I’m done now,no more being nice,no more smiling and trying to make a joke of things,they are so far gone they are beyond help.That’s up to them but they can damn well leave us un-brainwashed alone,we can make our own decisions thankyou very much.
These masked types make me sick,not the elderley ones that shuffle around looking absolutely terrified but the ones who walk around,heads held high,in that self-righteous I’m a better person than you and I do as I am told way.They all seem to have homemade muzzles made out of old curtains aswell.
For months all of us have been trying to carry on and retain as much normal as possible,but now these imbeciles have decided to crawl out from under their stones they expect the world to change to make them feel better,I will not do that for them.
Hi Paul
Sorry for the unwanted & unwarranted attention your wife has received, if my wife had received such attention, I would be livid aswell.
Have you heard what the Chief of The Met police, Dane Cressida Dick said about mask wearing…
Speaking on LBC, to Nick Ferrari
“”My hope is that the vast majority of people will comply and people will be shamed into leaving the store.
“If somebody is concerned about what’s going on in their store, then yes, of course they should call the police and we will try to assist.”
No hope
Shame on you Cressida Dick, now you are shaming the people with disabilities and severe anxiety. Totally unacceptable!!
Have just made a complaint on the Met. Police website saying the same thing. Let’s shame Cressida Dick for a change.
Wow, just got a reply within thirty minutes. Must be a record for police response. It appears that my complaint doesn’t meet the requirements of the Police Reform Act 2002 and I have no right of review on this decision. Well you could have knocked me down with a feather!!!
Complain to LBC. Just about the only outlet that may make something of it anyway.
Just over a year ago Cressida Dick said:
“Overall police detection rates nationally are low, woefully low I would say in some instances, and the courts are emptying, not filling”
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-48780585
Seems enough to be getting on with without policing the Government’s bizzare edicts.
The suggestion about the British public policing mask-wearing came from Hancock himself…
As rightfully angry as Paul is, it shows the measure of him that in his anger he understands with compassion there are many who are victims of all this and are vulnerable in need of sympathy.
There’s something really good about seeing that.
Very sorry to hear that Paul. I actually emailed my line manager flagging up that it could happen to us.
They should count themselves lucky that they’re not in Glasgow or a dodgy part of London. I can assure you that they will be beaten up for their “interference”
Yes,she’s okay now thankyou Kh,to say my blood was boiling would be an understatement,she’s a really kind and easy going person and it is so wrong for her to be picked on,this must be about the eighth time someone has had a go at her in the shops in the past few weeks,she been told to ‘step back !’,two metres,two metres !!’,’distance !’,’people like you spread the deadly virus !’,the funny thing is no-one has ever said anything when I am with her,they are just bullying cowards of the worst order.
i don’t think i will be able to contain my anger with an “inner voice” and i think if anyone says a duff comment i am likely to lash out loudly and sweary and tell them not to be a bleep sanctimonious mask nazi! That’ll get them scurrying and tutting. think i’ve reached the point of not caring a jot what people think of me!
Or maybe just smile sweetly – oohh i forgot can’t smile as will be masked – (well in my case i wear bandana thing round my neck and will just pull up when needed to get in the door and it isn’t tight enough so will constantly slip down, great shame!
It really is, I see so many old folks really struggling with a mask on. They clearly look unwell. I would not be surprised to see an elderly person collapsed in the street in the not too distant future. They would be struggling even if they were unmasked.
People in Wuhan wearing masks were filmed collapsing in the streets, viewers were left to assume they were collapsing from the covid when it was really CO2 contamination.
Just booked onto my online banking. As I did, flashed across the screen in huge letters was
” Beware Coronavirus scams”
Have they only just noticed its a con job?
Another Carl Heneghan article. He’s on a roll!
https://www.spectator.co.uk/article/the-uk-needs-to-be-more-open-about-covid-risks
Government communications currently seem to avoid telling people where their risks from Covid are actually low. There is a general reluctance to speak openly about how risk is assessed and the trade-offs there are with other competing health risks and economic impacts. The key questions aren’t being articulated – often the information the government is using to answer questions is not publicised and any hypotheses about the answers aren’t being shared.
Efforts to help the public navigate these new risks are being hamstrung by this absence of open and mature communication. For this reason, those of us involved in that effort have written to ministers to ask them to show more trust in the public by offering clarity about their thinking on the risk factors, transmission and trade-offs of the disease.
I think he is probably pretty angry by now but doing a good job of staying calm and professional.
The above is very eloquent, and to the point.
He’s been a real star through this.
We’ll make him Minister for Science (not “the science”) when we found Freedonia.
That’s a good assessment. His CEBM group and their published data has been a rock of sanity, and he has always been careful to understate the obvious conclusion that the official narrative is a load of bollocks.
A marked contrast with the assorted graduates from the Mengele Academy of Public Health with their pursuit of official favour.
“Mengele Academy of Public Health ” In the New Freedonia, you can be in the charge of the Ministry of Communication
Yes, in his most recent interview he definitely looked like he was working hard to keep his cool!
Professor Heneghan has been the calm voice of sanity throughout this farce.
Unfortunately a lot of people have this view of statistics and probability:
And they all tend to look like the dumb and dumber geek in the photo!
Maybe he’ll start to think there’s another agenda at play….
My mum + stepdad just received the masks they ordered online. They genuinely make me really uneasy. It’s not normal. My mum, a supermarket worker, is already saying how uncomfortable, hot + claustrophobic it is; “This is going to be hard for 7 hours. Don’t think I can even wear it for 7 minutes”. They are being strongly advised to wear them but it’s not mandatory. And only on the shop floor, not behind the till as they have screens.
Who else thinks that people harping on about just wearing them, who have never tried, will soon realise they’re absolutely HORRENDOUS to wear? They’re not natural or normal outside of a medical setting
The sad thing is, once those wearing masks start getting headaches (and, yes, there was a randomised controlled trial where people reported headaches [1]) those headaches will be written off to either “stress” or fantom COVID-19 manifestation…
1. Jacobs & al. (2009) Jacobs JL, Ohde S, Takahashi O, Tokuda Y, Omata
F, Fukui T. Use of surgical face masks to reduce the incidence of the
common cold among health care workers in Japan: a randomized
controlled trial. Am J Infect Control. 2009;37(5):417-419.
doi:10.1016/j.ajic.2008.11.002
As someone who has always been prone to headaches + migraines, this is a big concern of mine. That plus the fact I have heat intolerance, have trouble regulating my body temperature, regular shortness of breath, heart palpitations…the list goes on
(I have a condition called POTS, in case anyone was thinking what the heck is wrong with me hahaha. It doesn’t make me anymore vulnerable though)
I am tempted to seek exemption as I have a genuine issue but feel like that’s taking the easy road
I’m yet to wear my mask at all. It came free with some clothes I ordered a while back + is one of those washable ones. I don’t often go into shops anyway but will likely make a point of avoiding them further. No more mooching in bookshops for me
‘It came free with some clothes I ordered a while back’ – so companies were marketing masks *before* the law came in??? Were they given advance warning?
You get some seriously disgusting people in your shop. I wouldn’t dream of clearing out my bag and leaving my rubbish behind on a cafe table. Yuk!!
That’s pretty sinister.
Given that masks measurably decrease available breathable oxygen saturation (some health and safety dude Stateside did an experiment on himself) and there was a study of surgeons where their SpO2 was measured prior to and after an operation where they wore masks and the SpO2 was found to be measurably lower, but also their heart rate raised drastically [1]; quite frankly, it’d be stupid of you to wear a mask in the circumstances—especially if you get light-headedness due to PoTS.
1. Beder & al. (2008) Beder A, Büyükkoçak U, Sabuncuoğlu H, Keskil ZA, Keskil S. Preliminary report on surgical mask induced deoxygenation during major surgery. Neurocirugia (Astur). 2008;19(2):121-126. doi:10.1016/s1130-1473(08)70235-5
You can’t seek exemption, by the way – nobody can exempt you but yourself. A GP could write a note, but they’ve been told not to waste their time doing it. It’s self-exemption only and whether or not you want to wear a badge is up to you. The badge proves nothing in reality, but may temper the negative reactions of idiots somewhat.
I am taking exemption and have not set foot in a doctor’s for 25 years. I don’t want to wear one, detest the sight of them and won’t wear one. No No NO Mr Hancock. If they were proven effective I would toe the line. Looking at America it won’t end here, certain Bolshevik’s there would make muzzles mandatory at HOME.
The most ironic part is that prior to COVID-19, the use of masks in operating theatres was being questioned: https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC4480558/ — Da Zhou, Charlie et al. “Unmasking the surgeons: the evidence base behind the use of facemasks in surgery.” Journal of the Royal Society of Medicine vol. 108,6 (2015): 223-8. doi:10.1177/0141076815583167
Easy road is better than making yourself ill by complying.
Besides we need lots of non mask-wearing examples out there!
The headaches are caused by reduced O2 and increased CO2.
Together with a flushed complexion, first signs of hypercapnia.
Indeed, but why would anyone admit to a causal and obvious reaction when you can blame it on something opaque like stress and still be good to mandate the mask wearing?
Masks may help in some circumstances we are told, but only if you are infected. If you’re not infected they do nothing to stop the spread and may have negative effects on health.
Given the low prevalance of the virus the vast majority of people can be considered healthy with no infection. Therefore the vast majority of people are doing nothing to affect the spread of the virus and taking on the risk of harm for no real benefit.
The balance of risk will swing depending on the prevalance of the virus but as things stand currently, most people are doing no good wearing a mask.
Can they not get visors instead?
Visors are even more of a damp squib, what exactly do people think they protect from?
If it’s not mandatory, she absolutely mustn’t wear one. After all, shopworkers haven’t needed them for the last 4 months!
I tried wearing a face covering and it made me feel dizzy and had a headache which lasted until the next day. And it was a very bad headache where I felt I’ve been hit by a sledgehammer.
I also get panic attacks and that’s what I started feeling before the headache. It was awful and how the government can mandate what is akin to torture is bizarre.
Just checked my risk level at https://www.covidodds.com/
From none other than Prof Pants down too!!
I am more likely to die from non covid than covid.
I have a preexisting condition but it doesn’t put me in the vulnerable category, so just selected that I don’t have any
0.03% chance of death. Are you happy setting foot outside?
It’s a tough one, I’ll admit. A real dilemma
But if you went out 1M times you would die 1300 times.
I wonder if he’ll submit the source code to git hub so everyone can take the piss out of it again.
How that guy still has a job…
“The figures provided are subject to various errors”
He meant ‘bugs’
Bunny?
Corona virus?
Did you notice the fall-about joke in the bibliography on this site? :
Ferguson, N. M., et al. Impact of non-pharmaceutical interventions (NPIs) to reduce COVID19 mortality and healthcare demand. 16 March 2020.
‘… may not be fully representative of other countries’ and … ‘The figures provided are subject to various errors and uncertainties that are hard to estimate’ should be accompanied by a warning label. This is Junk Science Newspeak.
My risk as a 54 years old male is 0.48% if I catch Covid and 0.72% from all other risks. Looks like I’ll have to stay in from now on, because of all those other risks out there…
I’ve got more chance of drowning in rocking horse shit than dying of “it”.
My mother (in her eighties) has been in hospital and they won’t discharge her because she is anxious. She has been in eight days and they won’t tell her (or me) anything,of course she’s anxious. Finally they are going to send her for respite care for two weeks. Care home phoned me, but no, it’s not respite, she has to be in solitary confinement for two weeks despite having negative Covid tests (twice) before she can actually see another unmasked human being. Yes, that’ll do a lot for her anxiety.. So can someone tell me what is the fucking point of the test? Positive and they close down Leicester for weeks, negative (as in my mum) and solitary confinement for two weeks. So the world has gone insane. I said this was abuse, they hung up on me. Now tell me this is just incompetence.. If you have a negative test why the hell do you have to be in isolation?
That is disgraceful!! If this is happening regularly, why is it not being publicised?
Oh wait. It doesn’t go with their narrative
They used to torture, burn and drown people for being witches and heretics and people would clap and cheer because it was all for the greater good. Things haven’t changed very much since those times.
Yellow, Lazy Journalism.
Your only mistake is to assume that there is rationality in this charade.
There is an objective – but that’s different.
I know that. I said to the care home manager what about sunlight and Vitamin D? You run a care home, you must know vitamin D is essential for battling respiratory diseases. She wouldn’t budge. I know what the objective is Rick – I’ve been banging on about it for weeks – but do not think for one minute these (stupid) people are complicit, just ignorant. But they are not fighting for those that need the support. That sickens me.
Exactly!
Can you ask Francis Hoar for legal advice on this? A negative test should be enough…
I could, but care home manager says under no circumstances will they change their policy
You might be surprised how much difference a bit of weighted legalese can make. Worth a try.
Any journalists who might take up your case? Allison Pearson is collecting stories. Peter Hitchens. Any other suggestions?
Fighting is better than just feeling frustrated.
Haven’t got the words Bella. You sound so calm – I can’t think for anger after reading . As Carrie says is Legal a route? Some kind of second review needed.
So inhumane!
I can’t impagine how these people compute.
I think it’s possible to have CV19 and not produce antibodies, assuming that’s what they’ve tested for.
https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=AuKAg52mz4s
COVID-19 Antibodies: Why is Everyone Testing Negative? – NEW DATA
(I haven’t watched the video, but came across it earlier today)
The care homes are being ultra cautious because so many were infected and died, in many cases because people were sent from hospital into the care home, without anyone realising they had CV19.
You’ll need to make sure she has entertainment, e.g. radio, tv, whatever will occupy her.
There’s another way to look at this:
Wearing a mask requires an extra level of attentiveness and discipline, not to mention it being the correct type, for there to be minimal (if any) benefit. However any lack of discipline and use not only makes it ineffective, it also increases the risk of getting other conditions.
It’s like if you go on a diet to lose fat. The ones that work are those that are easy to maintain, that can withstand cravings and even going off course. The stricter the less the adherence. The stricter the more chance of yo-yoing and ending up in a worse place to where you are.
This is also the reason why masks were proposed as it is a “nudge”. But the problem isn’t the nudge, the problem is the mask success is so sensitive to be unworkable.
You can see this with social distancing. It is easier to maintain if you don’t go out that much. The more you interact the more you ‘cut corners” as it were. You push to see what it workable. And you end up reverting to the norm.
There are a core of people who are wearing masks now. It’ll be interesting to see how sick they get and what will break their adherence. In fact they probably already do with all the fiddling.
So actually doing nothing will save your health and be a habit you can maintain.
Ice cream vendor today: takes mask off for p lunch break. Puts same mask back on.
I ask for cornet. He takes one ine in bare keft hand, tskes tissue in bare right hand, wraps tissue round cone.
Ooens freezer, pulls down mask, peersinti delths if freezer, pulls up mask, scoops out ice cresm, guves cirnet to me.
I lay cash into hus bare hand.
He puts chsnge into my bare bsnd.
EpEr…
Sorry, above out of place and can’t edit or delete it. Please ignore.
I suppose bare hands are better than gloved ones. Might have been washed at least once in the interim.
Presumably he’d take the gloves off to wash his hands!
I’m confused. As from today in Scotland, I can get a tattoo done or get a leg wax or my nails done but I cannot get an eye test (several months overdue). There is no sense in this.
or get any sort of decent treatment at a dentist
Nicola knows best, apparently she is reading the science (yes) herself and taking real (yes) responsibility (yes).
I thought she had outsourced it to Devi Sridhar, friend of Chelsea Clinton?
Devi is in the ear. May be pulling all the strings. It has definitely been announced how some expert or other was impressed with sturgeon reading along. Reading Devis book and so on perhaps.
Sturgeon has also answered in the daily press conference midway back that she is getting the SAGE info and has a Scottish pool of ‘talent’ (my word) to translate for the scottish senario.
You are thinking Scientifically, my comment above was about the presented politics.
Actually you have me wondering if devi took too much critism and has been pulled back from public facing. She will be back!
Devi is no scientist, she is a public policy wonk, aka politician! If Ms Sturgeon had been serious about a genuine and learned scientific opinion she would have consulted the highly respected Hugh Pennington.
Unfortunately he’s reputedly a Unionist, so his opinions are of no value in the SNPeople’s Republic…
Oooh. No wonder she kepts getting re-elected…
Slight update form the high street of Edinburgh. Not the actual High Street – that is dead as a dodo. Princes St where the chainshops are –
With a few exceptions all chain shops have removed bouncers/staff and barricade in door ways preventing customer access. Exceptions in the main being phone/tech shops.
Two or three shops are wearing plywood windows – break-ins I presume not insurance measures. Many (easily half) have Sale signs 50% the usual figure. If you work in a jewellers, I wish you luck. 10 or 11 shops are permanently closed most of those were before April.
Apple store is an absolute disgrace and so I spoke to two of the three(!) door staff. More staff than queue. Everyone gets laser temperature test – small security man fueled up on himself and his black uniform including baseball cap and black mask was too pleased to announce if you refuse the temperture test you don’t get access. Apple clearly pride themselves on dictating to the world coming technology. With their shop security they look like boifacists who think they have a right to take personal data. Deeply unpleasant and out of place in Britain.
Finally spotted graffitti on starbucks shop front – tax evaison costs lives #NHS – black pen on a black wall. Woke.
Sadly “out of place in Britain” refers to a Britain that no longer exists, and is never coming back. Even if by some miracle this can be turned around, that which comes after will still be unrecognisable from before.
Sadly I believe you are correct, we do not have children, but we do have nephews & nieces. What is life going to be for them going forward?
No what it was this time last year.
All of the other shops were doing an equivalent of the ridiculous Apple shop. The have virtually all rowed back. You can feel the desperation in the sale signs. Smaller independents are not offering Sales. Noticeable difference in marketing.
Same here in Central London. Apple still has the ridiculous queuing system but I’m noticing that less and less people are going in and you’re spot on with the sense of desperation, I could sense it even walking past, I see shop assistants looking on in anticipation if someone would walk into their shops then sense the disappointment if they simply walk past.
I’m not so sure about the Atlantic article on herd immunity: https://www.theatlantic.com/health/archive/2020/07/herd-immunity-coronavirus/614035/ (may be behind a paywall)
It seems to misunderstand the idea of herd immunity, and get it mixed up with the R number – and seems to be very much in favour of the “new normal” and mask-wearing as the key to defeating the virus.
Other wealthy countries could hypothetically create societies that are effectively immune to further surges, where the effective herd-immunity threshold is low. Even in the U.S., it’s not too late to create a world in which you are not likely to get the coronavirus. We can wear masks and enable people to stay housed and fed without taking up dangerous work. But, judging by the decisions U.S. leaders have made so far, it seems that few places in the country will choose to live this way. Many cities and states will push backwards into an old way of life, where the herd-immunity threshold is high. Dangerous decisions will be amplified by the dynamic systems of society. People will travel and seed outbreaks in places that have worked tirelessly to contain the virus. In some cases, a single infected person will indirectly lead to hundreds or thousands of deaths.
Small preventive measures have big downstream effects. In other words, the herd in question determines its immunity. There is no mystery in how to drop the R0 to below 1 and reach an effective herd immunity: masks, social distancing, hand-washing, and everything everyone is tired of hearing about. It is already being done.
Not an expert by any means but from everything I’ve learnt over the last few months, it looks like this article seems to have got its science rather mixed up! I would have thought that most places that have reached herd immunity, or near to it, have done so despite any measures that were taken, not because of them.
Lockdown measures, if done early enough and hard enough, would delay the point at which herd immunity is reached – maybe almost forever if you’re New Zealand.
That’s what Whitty and Vallance meant at the beginning of March when they said it was too soon to lock down.
The big question now is why we’re still locked down four months later, when there’s barely any sign of the virus and the economy is tanking beyond redemption.
Also now known as New Zealotland!
It’s been said from the start that suppression, aka New Zealand, is an all-in bet on the uncovered cheque of a vaccine.
If that cheque remains uncovered, Kiwis will have to make a choice to either take it on the chin in one drove, or continue to live like the Sentinelese for good.
I wonder how history will regard Ardern then.
There’s a lot of waffle in there and the stuff about butterflies and chos is nonsense– epidemics are nothing like the weather and are not chaotic.
You can drop the herd immunity threshold by a lot with small measures, and the more partial immunity you have, the less measures you need.
Right now in the UK we clearly don’t need more measures than we had in the week before 23rd March when infections had already started dropping.
Yes, the epidemics may not be chaotic, but this bullshitting government certainly is!
Stitch or paste 2+2=5 at the front of your mask.
Don’t forget 4 legs good, two legs better.
doubleplus good!
stay home stay safe!
BLM!
~~healthy citizens never remove the face covering~~
Hi all
If you know who produced the graph for the section above titled “Number of People Testing Positive Dwindles to Almost Nothing” could you please ask them to contact mail AT lockdowntruth.org
If it was you, please get in touch as we want to use it for our legal action but want to check the source etc.
If anyone else knows the source or could produce the same graph that would be helpful.
Thanks
LT
It was posted on yesterday’s page. I believe it referenced ONS as the source of the data – and the point as made that, while the data was available, this graph wasn’t published as a graph. Can’t remember who, sorry.
It was me, and yes the source was ONS
Done
A thing worth checking is whether the April and May data are directly comparable with the data from June and July. They may not be. At some point the range of testees expanded from ‘Pillar 1’ to include ‘Pillar 2’ (wider public) as well. Of course Pillar 1 (mainly including hospital patients) showed a much higher proportion of positive cases. By now the overall positivity ratio is right down to 0.5%, but the April-May data might be artificially high by comparison, because back then only Pillar 1 data were included, I believe, whereas now both Pillars 1 and 2 are. I made a graph of the Pillar 1 data from 6th March-30th April, at the end of which the positivity ration was down to 10%. It had been around 40% in early April. In ONS figures released for yesterday 21/7, Pillar 1 was down to 0.15%, even lower than the Pillar 2 data (0.73%). Hope this helps the action.
I have asked a couple of times but can anyone point me in the direction of the graph that shows Sweden has lower excess deaths than Denmark and Finland, please?
Is it this:- ?
http://inproportion2.talkigy.com/nordic_comparison_4jul.html
As my old Governess would say “a gentleman never tells” something i’ve lived by all these years.
Financial Times: Covid-19 unmasks weaknesses of English public health agency | Free to read.
https://www.ft.com/content/e149101a-1c93-4b0a-bc12-14ca8bf11b0e
OMG, I think the governments LSD is working on me, I thought I was immune to it.
Yes I am scared of the virus
Yes I need to wear a face mask
Yes it was all worth it
Yes we all had to make a terrible sacrifice to stop the virus
Yes wearing masks will help stop the virus
Yes I need a vaccine
Yes I like working from home
Yes life is much better actually than it was
Yes we need to protect shop workers by wearing masks
We just got a reply from our lovely MP and she said this:
Dear Mrs Two-Six,
The Government’s decision to require people to wear face masks is, of course, in response to the extraordinary circustances we find ourselves in. It is part of our national effort to slow the transmission of the virus, allow the re-opening of the economy and most importantly protect those most vunerable to Covid-19 as evidence now shows the efficacy of such measures in enclosed spaced.
Furthermore, recent data has shown that sales assistants, cashiers and security guards have suffered disproportionately in this crisis. The death rate among shop assistants is 75% higher among men and 60% higher among women than in the general population. So as we reinstate shopping, we want to keep those workers safe also.”
I do appreciate the over-arching point you make about parliamentary scrutiny.
The Coronavirus Act was indeed an extraordinary piece of legislation which did receive full scrutiny and unanimous support from the House. This legislation and the powers it provides the government and necessary agencies will be reviewed and monitored by Parliament regularly, as will the work of Ministers and Civil Servants.”
OH OK then.
Now where are my gloves….
Sounds like another Common Purpose drone to me.
Isnt that the same line as another MP served up to another LS just a day or so ago? I distinctly remember the 60 70 men women BS being looked at in detail.
Yes it was dispatched probably shortly after it was delivered throught their door (by hand). A template response but to be fair Mrs 2-6 did use Simon Dolan’s template letter.
The ‘disproportionate’ effect on shop workers was discussed several times. The percentage figures are correct, but mostly because the absolute numbers are tiny.
yep I am gonna write to her and state that fact, what was it 74 people who were shop workers?
Indeed, and it was Matt Hancock himself who spouted these technically correct but deliberately scary comparisons about a week ago.
The male shopworker death rate per 100k male working age population was 34.2, which was 175% of the overall male rate of 19; the killer fact he failed to tell you was that the total of male shopworker deaths over the whole period was – 43! (Sadly neither 42 nor even 33.. .) Females 15.7, 162% of overall rate 9.7; total deaths =64.
Thanks to you and Matt for the recap. If the MP has been whipped to spout about low numbers perhaps they might be interested to correspond about the higher numbers of deaths above the 5 year average and the c19 deaths. Pointless trying.
“the extraordinary circustances we find ourselves in” They indeed extraordinary, but not in the way she means
Please will you send a copy to UK Column. They are monitoring boilerplate answers. Ta.
https://www.ukcolumn.org/
yes, probably
“allow the re-opening of the economy”
that says it all really wow
Well it won’t. Do you think they’ll notice?
Hi Two-Six,
Here’s my reply to my MP who gave me the same boiler-plate ‘shop staff at risk’ stats:
“Thank you for your prompt reply.
I have now had an opportunity to review the source of the statistics you quote. The data is wholly inadequate to justify a policy which, quite literally, changes the face of the people in whose interests you govern. The data is being used (I may say abused) to justify a policy decision that has already been taken.
** The report says in its summary:
“our findings do not prove conclusively that the observed rates of death involving COVID-19 are necessarily caused by differences in occupational exposure.”
Now, compare this to the evidence of my own eyes. I have been to various supermarkets locally during lockdown; the staff have not been wearing masks (if they felt that they were in a dangerous workplace they would surely have done so). Almost without exception, they have told me that none of their colleagues have caught the virus. They have been cheerful, not fearful; it was some of the shoppers who were fearful, after a relentless diet of uncontextualized data provided by the government and media.
I would urge you to reconsider the decision to enforce mask-wearing – there is yet time to recognise the mistake.
Yours sincerely,”
Well played sir! (Or madam). Straight bat.
Definitely a ‘sir’, last time I checked
Excellent reply – will be interesting to see if they reply to your 2nd letter!
Nice, thanks
Copied to clip board
Sounds like your MP is using some sort of template.
Section 4a Public Order sates
A person is guilty of an offence if, with intent to cause a person harassment, alarm or distress, he—
(a)
uses threatening, abusive or insulting words or behaviour, or disorderly behaviour, or
(b)
displays any writing, sign or other visible representation which is threatening, abusive or insulting,
thereby causing that or another person harassment, alarm or distress.
It would appear that Mrs Dick is inciting people to commit a criminal offence
Incitement to commit an offence is of itself an offence
Worth copying that down and keeping ut with you. Have the law on the buggers.
Or fir beung a Jew, or black, or…
Yes. And who better knows about that than the Police, better contact th… oh wait.
For the life of me I can’t understand why people like Simon Dolan who can afford it don’ t chase every one of these people through the courts on these issues.
If I could afford it I would be a cross between rumpole of the bailey and victor meldrew on speed hauling these scum up.
Some good news for a lot of people – though no details yet about what obstacles will be to circumnavigate:
The families and friends of some care home residents in England will once again be able to visit their loved ones, the Government has confirmed, ….
…. the Department of Health and Social Care (DHSC) has finally issued long-awaited guidance detailing how visits can resume, once local directors of public health and local authorities decide it is safe to do so. Risk assessments will be completed prior to homes being reopened, and visits that take place will involve face coverings and social distancing measures. Visits should also be limited to a “single constant visitor” per resident where possible.
“We are now able to carefully and safely allow visits to care homes, which will be based on local knowledge and circumstances for each care home,” said Matt Hancock, the Health Secretary.
“It is really important that we don’t undo all of the hard work of care homes over the last few months while ensuring families and friends can be safely reunited, so we have put in place guidance that protects everyone.”
From the Torygraph live
The only reason they are allowing this small concession is because of Simon Dolan’s court case… Every rule must now have a little ‘out’ (ie minor relaxation) clause in it, so as to undermine and invalidate his challenges.. Like with the schools, that because some schools allowed small numbers of pupils to attend, the government claimed that ‘schools were not closed’…
There is one thing I find odd considering we are supposed to be in the middle of a deadly pandemic. I would think that if large numbers were dying or so ill they couldn’t go to work, society would suffer as workers would be lost eg food deliveries not getting through due to a lack of drivers, power plants not being able to operate due to losing key workers. I have seen no evidence at all of labour shortages being created due to a pandemic and services not being able to function.
This is one of the key “tells” that to date there has not been a pandemic at all. I am certain that things will be very different in the “second wave”.
Uncle Bill certainly thinks so!
There was a total breakdown in any kind of normal service at the beginning – delivery times stretched, basic items unavailable. Terrible drop in service levels for… everything. But that had more to do in reality with companies failing to adjust rapidly to a sudden shock than anything else. It certainly made it feel like an apocalypse though.
Yes that was just panic buying but it did set the mood rather. Just after that were stories of more doom as delivery drivers and tube drivers were dropping like flies…!
But of course all total BS
The other big tell is the enthusiasm with which the politicians, media, and so-called scientists greeted the huge crowds of protesters who were not anti-social distancing or all wearing masks because a man in another country died, probably as a result of a heart attack brought on by the drugs he’d taken.
All the advice they’d been bombarding the public with went out the window for this politically fashionable cause.
…And that the likes of Bill Gates and others of his age group (the supposedly at risk group) have been happily out and about, not seeming worried about getting the virus…
Already posted here this morning via a link to the scientific journal Aurora. Someone with the time and appropriate skills would be able to compare it with the LSE Centre for Economic Performance occasional paper 49, published in April, which examined (also based on QALYs but refined into WELLBYs!) the optimum date for ending lockdown. As I recall it was 1 June 2020.
This was meant to be in response to Swedenborg’s post of the Imperial article below, fat fingers I’m afraid!
Got to give them credit for determination!
The head of the UK Vaccine Taskforce, Kate Bingham, has suggested that a coronavirus vaccine may be rolled out even before it has full authorisation from regulators. Frontline workers, the over-50s, under-50s with co-morbidities and black, Asian, minority ethinic groups are likely to be prioritised when allocating vaccine supplies, she added.
From Torygraph live
THANK GOD!
Speak for yourself – I’m over 50! I will take one for the team though and donate my dose to any politician, journalist or scientific or medical expert who has played a part in this evil madness. They can have my dose every year.
Mine too – and the 6-month boosters.
Me too (front line worker over 50). I would like to sacrifice myself and donate my dose to Bill Gates, Fauci or Ferguson.
And Boris can have mine!
I think we should also insist upon a politician being present at each vaccination round of say 50 people, and then swap the syringes randomly, so that he/she doesn’t have a chance to get the placebo intended to be given to him/her…
Very very good idea !
We can hunt them down and give them all our doses.
At the same time.
Surely they’d appreciated the 20000th dose
Is that illegal to use unauthorised products in a medical setting?
I’ve been offered the flu jab every year for about…5, 6 years now. And I always refuse. Obviously I don’t want to jinx it but I rarely get unwell on top of the ongoing condition I have + have never had flu. The last time I was really ill was when I had bronchitis (extremely unpleasant!) a few years back, maybe 2015, 2016ish. The germs were so bad that we all got ill (but with different things, like my step brother got pharyngitis)
Touch wood and all that!
That’s not going to encourage the uptake. What is Plan B, forcibly remove us from our homes, or get a warrant to enter with vial ready to jab the upper arm? Making it mandatory seems inconceivable if it has not gained regulatory approval. I am not sure the Hon Kate has thought this through unless she has been speaking to her father (Lord Bingham) beyond the grave.
Moves do seem to be trending slightly towards enforcement certainly reworking access to homes. I cannot do the subject justice but was covered in ukcolumn today perhaps second half. Ireland and Netherlands at the fore front.
Good luck in the country areas in Ireland with that!
Isn’t there a clause in the act that allows them to forcibly remove you if you are suspected of having the virus and to force treatment on you? They can just make up something to justify their suspicion that you have it and bingo! They arrest you…
Great, so when the BAME drop like flies because it’s not tested correctly will BLM chant bad Blessed NHS or will they thank and salute those needless deaths?
https://d197for5662m48.cloudfront.net/documents/publicationstatus/39936/preprint_pdf/8e1d81d439ccd85376216cd0ec705046.pdf
This is the article about the costs of the lockdown and the costs with them to continue. One of the most shocking documents I’ve seen and impossible if they are not in the hands of the government and the SAGE committee. I have quoted below but the whole article is worth reading. The whole NHS is built upon quality of life adjusted years and it should not cost more than £ 30,000 per year. Cancer treatment, hepatitis C treatment etc everything has that price tag. This is evidence based public health medicine. Astonishing that these calculations were not in the decision-making process early on in the lock down process. Even in the ludicrous scenario of 500 000 deaths ( Ferguson’s model) which should be avoided with lockdown is not even cost effective according to NICE guidelines.
The conclusions are obvious. We must immediately end all restrictions. We cannot afford to save Covid-19 lives which in the best scenario costing 7 times more (worst scenario 125 times more) for each case than other diseases like cancer. It is a national catastrophe to continue with prioritising Covid-19 against everything else.
Qoutes
“The guidelines in the UK set out by NICE are that treatments that are expected to increase life expectancy for a patient by one year (in quality of life adjusted years, QALYs) should cost no more than £30,000. We apply that figure to possible total numbers of QALYs saved by restrictions to estimate their benefit.”
“Even if lives saved are as high as 440,000, each of which means an extra 10 years of quality-adjusted life – and when the lost output (assumed to be a sufficient and comprehensive measure of all costs of the lockdown) is simply the likely shortfall in incomes in 2020 – costs are still over 50% higher than benefits of lockdown (benefits = £132 billion; costs = £200 billion).”
“This result reflects the fact that the economic costs of the lockdown – even on the most conservative estimate of £200 billion – is far larger than annual total expenditure on the UK national health service (which runs at around £130 billion); the benefits of that level of resources applied to health and using the NICE guidelines would be expected to generate far more lives saved than is plausibly attributable to the lockdown in the UK.”
“Application to potential future scenarios showed in the best case a QALY value of£220k (7xNICE guideline) and in the worst-case£3.7m (125xNICE guideline) was needed to justify the continuation of the lockdown. The evidence suggests that the costs of continuing severe restrictions in the UK are so great relative to likely benefits in numbers of lives saved so that a substantial easing in restrictions is now warranted”
“The lockdown is a public health policy and we have valued its impact using the tools that guide health care decision in the UK public health system. On that basis, and taking a wide range of scenarios of costs and benefits of severe restrictions, we find the lockdown consistently generates costs that are greater – and often dramatically greater – than likely benefits.”
Thanks for this.
It is truly shocking that this was not done at the time, and has not been done since, and that no-one even seems to have noticed that it wasn’t done, present company excepted.
One of the contributors is from Imperial College!
Even if the Government and SAGE have not seen the article, which I severely doubt, it is difficult to imagine it was not circulated around the Treasury and the Bank of England, given that David Miles was a former member of the Monetary Policy Committee.
If anyone is on Twitter perhaps they could alert Simon Dolan and Peter Hitchens to this
I had that discussion in April already.
The discussions/reactions were:
1. You can’t put a price on life.
Yes we can/already do/must.
No, you’re into euthanasia.
2. The cost of each Covid death is 100million currently, that money is going to be amiss for chemos&surgeries soon.
You must think about the millions saved from death.
Well, even if that was close, it’s still out if whack.
1.
Conclusion, as always:
You can’t reason with fanatics.
In the country of the blind, the one-eyed man is a pariah.
I’m having a dark, dark day today. A nifty little blend of high anxiety, high fury and deep misery. Partly a result of the approach of fucktard Friday, partly brought on by a conversation with my mother, who called last night. She thinks I should stop being silly and just wear a mask “you’ll get fined!” oh and while we’re at it, she thinks I should get my sons used to wearing them as well. They’re 6 and 8. She’s a doctor and doesn’t believe any of the crap any more than I do, or anyone else here does. Depressing. Infuriating. Between that and the recently discovered fact that my brother in law is a mask-warrior on facebook, I’m fairly sure I can’t go home for Christmas (he, along with my sister, lives with my mother) assuming Johnson doesn’t become the second British leader in history to cancel the bloody thing anyway.
Went to the shops. Was virtually the only person in M&S not wearing a mask who didn’t actually work there. Have you noticed how little of a crap maskless shop workers give for social distancing? Anyone would think that they didn’t realise they were dropping like flies. Greengrocer, butcher fine, but my morale was too low to have the conversation with them about the fact I won’t be wearing a mask next time I go.
What’s the point in “keeping everyone safe” when we’ve taken everything out of life that made it worth living, anyway?
Yes, quite, I am having much the same feelings – added to by a pathetic email reply from my MP, leaving me incandescent. No wonder our MPs are so against American gun ownership!
Err, our Declaration of Rights came first, Ian, and was quite clear re firearms.
(Unless one is a Roman Catholic, I guess.
).
So sorry to hear about your dark day Matt. I wish I could think of something uplifting and encouraging to write, but I’m feeling pretty much the same way. The closer we get to Friday, the more my mood blackens.
The closer I come the more violent I feel. Never felt like this in my life
Well you are certainly not alone in that!
I’m self-medicating as fast as I can; St. Austell Tribute pale ale at the moment.
“Well, you can’t do anything about it, so it’s not worth getting worked up about”
If that’s true, when is _anything_, _ever_ going to be worth getting worked up about?
Makes me want to strangle people.
I used to work in an office where we had the top floor (8th) of a glass and steel tower and also a mezzanine above it. The office was arranged around an atrium, which went down to the first floor. Glass walls floor-to-ceiling around the atrium. You could have thrown yourself with all your weight against that glass and the worst that would have happened to you would have been a bruised shoulder and a bit of explaining to do. It was amazing how many people – even years after moving into the office – would tell you how scared they were about walking round those glass walls.
There was a steel spiral staircase up from the main floor to the mezzanine. You were out “in the open” in the atrium, but the bannister rails on the landing and on the staircase were chest-height. You could do yourself a nasty injury, or worse, but you would have to climb up the rails an hurl yourself off. There was no way (deliberately, of course) that anything could ever possibly happen by accident. Many, many people would flat refuse to go to the mezzanine because they were too scared.
That’s what we’re dealing with, folks. Compliance, born of fear, against the obvious evidence.
But to cheer us all up:
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jack_Churchill
Yes exactly. If something is right, if it is the morally right thing to do, getting “worked up” is a duty.
I take some comfort in knowing that this is a moral issue, and whatever happens I know I did my best and didnt just do the easy thing. There must be a limit to what our government can do to us. It is morally wrong to withdraw healthcare, isolate children and all the other incredible things that have happened.
It’s my internal monologue too and it’s what picks me back up (slowly, sometimes). Resisting this – loudly or silently – is morally the right thing to do. It’s a duty and if I back out, I won’t be able to look at myself in the mirror in the future.
I’m no Jack Churchill (I’d get arrested if I walked around with a longbow and a claymore, with or without a facemask) but at least I can do this.
I felt so angry with the human race today I was at the point of almost needing to be physically restrained from going up to mask wearers and giving them my full wrath.I just cannot take anymore of this,I feel like I’ve been abandoned on the wrong planet.
This is what bothers me the most too. Why is everyone so accepting of all this godawful nonsense? Don’t they see they’re collaborating with criminal lies? Surely we all have a moral duty to resist.
I went to the local M&S today, and had one of my usual minor strops, to which I claim entitlement as a long-suffering shareholder! Today it was due to the over-the-counter Anadin Extra tablets causing the scanning machine to beep loudly for attention of a supervisor. Why does the shop sell OTC medications if they require the intervention of a member of staff at the self-service till? She shrugged. Last week, standing in a long queue with a full trolley, I spotted the store manager, so shouted to him ‘you need to get some of the other checkouts working, can you get one of those three stood chatting to each other to open one up?’. The accent probably makes them feel either scared or embarrassed, but always works a treat – two of the three sent to open checkouts! [I should say I was on the British Airways difficult customer list in the 90s when I still worked. It stemmed from my insistence that I would not check hand baggage that I deemed within the size limits – I carried a tape measure – unless the nice American businessmen on the connector flights had their oversized hand luggage removed first]. I was probably the first Karen!
I hope this rant has given you a bit of a laugh – chin up!
‘as a long-suffering shareholder!’
Me too. Haven’t dared to look at the price since early March.
They’d better not deny me entry after what I’ve already endured at their hands. I think they’ve said they won’t challenge anyone though.
To most posters above – don’t worry, in a few weeks time you’ll look back on this time as great days.
I bought in the anticipation that someone would put the then management out of its misery. Then along came a knight in shining armour in the shape of Archie Norman – still waiting Archie! It’s 96p, by the way!
In my local M&S not a single member of staff has had the virus, according to the manager. Very few masks – let’s see how it looks on Friday when I stock up on my breakfast pastries.
96p – I didn’t want to know! I paid about £4. (So what do I know about anything …).
Seriously, I haven’t dared look, especially as I was one of the chumps who bought into the rights issue.
Down here in deepest Devon hardly anyone at all, let alone in M&S, has had the bug – except for the vast swathes of us here who had it just after Christmas. The TJN family picked it up in Exeter services, Saturday before Christmas, and started coming down with it Boxing Day. Of course, we hadn’t heard of covid back then. Couldn’t taste food from about Boxing Day on, till about the second week of January.
Great minds and all – my in cost is £4 too!
Or we’ll be in far worse captivity
My guess is that Johnson has overplayed his hand, and that this won’t stick.
I hope so but given how much he’s gotten away with, what won’t anymore?
He’s a fraud and will be found out.
It did give me a bit of a laugh. And then I remembered that I haven’t a hope of keeping my status with BA this year and that made me sad again.
Surely status will be frozen?
Not that they’ve let me know so far.
kindred spirits TT! I hate seeing shop staff hanging around while queues for payment tills! Go girl!
Sorry to hear that matt. At least your mum doesn’t believe any of it. But as a doctor, she surely knows masks are not good for anyone, never mind children ?
I’d be telling my mum (or daughter) to do one if they ever suggested masking my grandkids though.
Tomorrow is another day !
Trying to think of ways to put a positive spin on masks, at least we won’t be able to see their gaping mouths when they point at us!
Your mother is an intelligent doctor who knows it’s all crap but is living apparently peacefully with your sister and her zealous husband. She deserves a medal. Don’t fall out with your family over this. Religious tolerance is a good thing although it can be hard sometimes. Absolutely fundamental to a free and civilized world is for people to be able to disagree and stay friends so it’s important to make the effort to make that work.
While I realise you’re right in principle, he’s an aggressive, loud mouthed wanker, with an inferiority complex and verbal diarrhea and I don’t trust myself to keep my lip buttoned.
Bet you love him really.
Where such codes hold sway, guy, people should not advocate a course of action that is harmful to one’s children.
I completely understand the feelings you describe. I feel a sense of loss too. The country isn’t quite the country I thought it was. Somehow without me noticing, we have become scared of living. No longer up to fighting, for preserving rights, striving, taking risks and living. Rather showing our virtue by “staying safe” in our individual houses, avoiding colleagues and neighbours.
Feel depressed about it.
It can be unsettling. But I think it is more a case of how powerful today’s mind control techniques are. Needs a quite unusual personality type to resist, especially if one still watches the tv and/or reads the papers.
Thanks all for this place !
My old Nanny used to say at times like these “what’s for you will not go by you”. Something to bare in mind when you’re looking out from behind a mask.
Just read an article by Grant Shapps.The Government will be looking to make face coverings mandatory in other enclosed spaces.Time for the tumbrils
You beat me to it. Headline: ‘UK coronavirus death toll in hospitals rises by 11’– Bedwetters run out for extra masks. Story: The number of people who have died in hospital with coronavirus has risen by 11 – one of the lowest daily jumps to date. Bedwetters don’t read this far..
As Jonathan says, Grant Shat doesn’t say “shops”, but “enclosed public spaces”
Statutory Instruments coming on Friday and Saturday…
If Grant Shapps backs it – you *know* it’s a moronic idea.
At least you know that they’re desperately busting a gut when the spun story is so thin.
…once MPs are safely away on their summer recess of course..
Totalitarian tip toe. It is aliteratively apt. But of course, it ‘makes sense’ because we already do in shops. Without action by us the people masks are here for a long time.
The grinnning fucking weasel isn’t wearing a muzzle in the vid – he’s at home. But if you are so gung ho, why not set an example??
And why do they always go on about ‘Pret’? I haven’t got one of those, I don’t fucking live in London! I live with the other 87% of the population that live in the real world.
SO ANGRY.
It will be outdoors soon enough if Spain,France are a guide.It is obvious that governments worldwide are following a script.The important thing is who and why.
The important thing is what do we do about it?
If someone has an idea then I’m all ears
I look back to the pre iraq days. Millions on the streets. With this current situation we can each simply protest by not complying. This is a big advantage the way I see things. The Robin Cook as mentioned by TT needs to be assured there is support for dissent in the cabinet. There is no Robin Cook in the cabinet, they don’t make mistakes like allowing that twice. This is a disadvantage.
Time to rise up if you don’t want this for the rest of your lives. There is no rationale for masks everywhere, none at all
Jeezus F Christ. are they trying to restart the economy through the sale of masks? there can be no other explanation
Which will eventually include inside our homes. I have used the following phrase to colleagues over the last few days: “You will be wearing a mask everywhere for the rest of your miserable life.” The reaction has been mixed.
Agreed.They test the waters.Then move onto the next absurdity/atrocity
Inside homes is being mooted in Ireland, Netherlands too.
I heard a lot of politicians liked wearing masks at home. Different type mind
Actually I think at that point people might actually wake up to what is going on…
…despite them saying only about a week ago that it would NOT be mandatory in workplaces. Hmmm, bet MPs in the House of Commons will be exempted on some spurious grounds…
The confusion is deliberate.A totalitarian technique to demoralise any opposition
As my old Gamekeeper used to say, “in times like these never use a Shotgun to shoot a Quail”.
Shotgun – no indeed: a bazooka would work much better (or perhaps a small nuke aimed at Westminster?)!
The most depressing thing to me right now – even more than masks in schools (we have already pulled our kids out and are going to homeschool) – is that the once great National Review is in full panic mode, ignoring all but the most twisted worst-case-scenario interpretations of everything it sees. Toby, I said it before and I’ll say it again. I know you have connections. Get over there and slap some of those pathetic dipshits around, will you? How about a nice long article? Please?
The
Government’s insane over-reactionvirus has me afraid to go out of the house. Yeah, I am afraid I will punch some fucker.Enough… Enough now.
Me too. And I used to be ‘no violence at any cost’. It’s got that bad
You guys surely remember that advertisement … I think it came from your side of the pond … that featured the heads of “climate skeptics” exploding, basically promoting violence toward “deniers?” I thought “think God I live in the USA.”
Now it seems like you’ve got all the skeptics and we’ve got all the bed-wetters. Or maybe this site misrepresents the numbers a bit…
Oh yes, I remember the truly funny one that showed the fate of very young school pupils who did not worship at the altar of Gaia. Laugh? Nearly wet myself! [ not ]
p.s. Plenty of bed-wetters over here too, alas.
We have plenty of bedwetters here too. It’s a wonder we’re not ankle-deep in urine.
And, just when things seem to have reached the very pits of Hell, I see that HMRC is to bring in a new, complex and expensive to administer system for the self-employed, the so-called MTD system (making tax digital). See https://www.telegraph.co.uk/politics/2020/07/22/final-proof-hmrc-hates-britains-self-employed/
As Janet Daley observes, HMRC REALLY hates the self-employed!
This has been in operation for a few quarters.
MTD has already made my relatively straight forward VAT return a pain in the ass.
Out and about update:
Metro bank – no masks, no hand gel, staff ignored plastic partitions, sat next to a bloke waiting for appointment and neither us nor anybody else said anything. All normal, normal, normal. Apart from some looney who came in with a face visor, mask and gloves. She did get a few stares. Sanity is out there. But then so is total fuckwittery.
Decide on a few cheeky wee aperitifs as the sun was fair taking it out me. Local boozer in Ealing. All a ok normal apart from signing in as Billy Bunter at the bar. New northern lass behind bar admitted she was fed up with the nonsense and said some folk are just stupid.
Stupid is as stupid does on the bus however.
Lazy me decided to jump on a bus for two stops rather than walk home as it was sitting there. Two folk saw me maskless and moved upstairs, ‘social distance mate’ said they young fella as he was dragged upstairs by his misses.
‘ Aye, whatever’ was my less than witty retort.
Bring on Friday.
“Britons should abandon handshakes and adopt Japanese-style greetings to prevent future pandemics, a professor at the London School of Hygiene and Tropical Medicine says.”
“Professor Dame Anne Johnson, the vice president of the Academy of Medical Science, said a cultural shift was needed to stop a second wave emerging in the winter and suggested that even people with colds or flu would need to stay at home”
Professor of what exactly? Can you believe that they made this idiot a DAME!!!!
How exactly does she think the virus get aerosolised from the hands? :pmsl:
The sad thing is that decades of ‘flu research are being thrown out of the window just for the sake of some attempting to make a name for themselves…
“attempting to make a name for themselves” whilst making the rest of us look like a bunch of masked morons! Does anyone else think like me that we’re just part of some weird experiment?…
I think it’s a fair point to make. It’s widely accepted you do not trust a politician ever. Yet here is one talking with all the confidence given to him by mask compliance. People have forgotten not to trust politicians. Perhaps reminding people of that fundamental life priniciple can do some good.
I already said yesterday that this whole COVID-19 “experience” feels like a giant Milgram experiment in obedience
Someone else commented that the Stanford prison experiment could be applicable too, and I said while I was dismissive of that initially, the megalomania of rule setters was starting to draw analogies… I went and re-read the study, and guess what, in the prison experiment, they did cover the faces of “prisoners” to make them more de-individualised and more like a herd to be controlled! Literally, can’t make it up!
Never ‘elbow bumped’ and never will – fucking ridiculous!!!
Agree and same applies to elbow cough (remember that?). Both of which are signs the public can resist if they choose.
I will definitely resist. Not going to comply. I live in sunny Cardiff, muzzles on public transport (27.07.20), I use the bus most days. I will not be wearing a muzzle and I will only show my ‘exemption badge’ if necessary. Have lived in Cardiff for 20 years or so, the bus drivers are a great bunch. I don’t want to make life difficult for them and I won’t, but I will never wear a mask.
Makes for some awkward situations as you extend your hand.ends up like Rock Paper Scissors
And this is what’s ‘doin’ my f*cking head in’. What makes anyone, anyone think that we should listen to these utter morons on how we should lead a normal life.If human beings weren’t meant to come into contact with any ‘bugs’, wouldn’t we have evolved to have face flaps? And I didn’t even need to be a professor to work that one out!
I’m just going to carry on as normal (wish me luck!). I’m hoping that people – bus drivers et al – will apply common sense as it were. I am a bit apprehensive about my first bus encounter as a no muzzle wearing traveller – but here go I. Shall keep you posted, the bus drivers of Cardiff are as sound has hell….quietly optimistic……….
Best of luck, let us know how you get on!
I think the Dame might be a touch light on her knowledge of Japan and the Japanese. My Japanese friends, who to be fair I have not seen for a few years now, greeted me with a hug. I worked for a Japanese firm many years ago and we were told never to bow to a Japanese, but to shake hands. I know it is often on TV, but I think she might have watched You Only Live Twice a few too many times!
Shameless re-post from yesterday:
They can fuck right off. I will grasp the empty weapon hand of my friend when we meet, to show that we bear no ill will to eachother, til the day I die. I am a free Englishman. And yes I know we didn’t invent it.
Thank You. I’ll be here the rest of my life.
“I think the Dame might be a touch light on her knowledge” and a fair few brain cells….The woman is so obviously deranged….
She has an MA from Cambridge in Medical Sciences and specialized in Epidemiology. My degree was in Microbiology. I’m amazed that someone at her level has come out with that crap. We MAY get a second wave but 1) ther’s no guarantee of it (particularly if we’re close to herd immunity), 2) if we do, it’s because SARS-Cov2 is in the system (like all cold and flu viruses) and , of course, may be implicated in the SEASONAL FLU season (!).
How asinine to say ‘even people with colds or flu could need to stay at home’. ANYONE who catches flu is UNABLE to to leave home, it’s NOT NICE! Nasim Taleb has a term for highly educated people like these, IYIs (Intelligent Yet Idiots).
DavidC
ANYONE who catches flu is UNABLE to to leave home,
Quite right: if you’ve never had the flu, it’s easy not to realise how bad it is! Ironically, I have always wished people with colds would stay at home and not give it to everyone else. Beware of what you wish for….
Unfortunately this woman is no idiot. See my post, above. I think she knows exactly what she’s doing. I had no idea that so many scientists were so bloody bent! (Obviously naive).
Good term, ‘bent’, Miriam. Sums up a lot of the messages and behaviour we’ve seen lately.
Just a note – if she has an MA from Cambridge, she did an undergraduate degree. You probably already know this, but I wouldn’t want anyone thinking she has an actual masters
There seems to be an endless supply of these ‘scientists’ ready to pour out yet more totalitarian bilge when the money is right. UK Column reckons the AMS is a product of the Invisible College who they reckon spawned the Royal Society, current purveyors of bullshit to the ‘Government’. AMS has produced a very sinister document indeed about the ‘second wave’ called Autumn spike: The Academy of Medical Sciences…Preparing for a Challenging Winter 2020/21 https://www.ukcolumn.org/ukcolumn-news/uk-column-news-22nd-july-2020
Meanwhile, the professor at the LSHTM is this sparkler: https://www.lshtm.ac.uk/aboutus/people/piot.peter Guess who he has ties to? Yes, that’s right, you’ve got it in one! Oh and Imperial College as well.
These people should move to Japan and see for themselves the reality of what they’re proposing. They seem to want to make the populace neurotic and psychologically scarred.
And while we’re at it, perhaps she wants to introduce hara-kiri here as well? She can start with herself when this all goes belly up.
will probably have to give the nazi salute before long! utter shite these so called ‘experts’ – my hamster has more brains than the lot of them.
I often give nazi salutes when out shopping with my wife …
My little Grandaughter age 6 has stopped eating , she is now scared she will die of Covid , “it’s on the adverts between my programmes, and everyone is wearing masks”
Im beyond angry at what this is doing ….her parents have been so careful to downplay it , it seems there is no escaping
I’m so sorry to hear that. So sorry. The psychological damage that this is doing to people is off the scale, but the affect it is having on children is absolutely unforgivable.
Parents can mitigate most, if not all, of it.
A young boy around eight years old, walking with his father, gave me a look of disdain as he passed me by this afternoon. Muttered something about a cigarette. There was one in my hand, but it was down by the side of my right leg, almost completely out of view. Intolerance of smokers is being taught in school to children of all ages in Quebec these days and adverts urging children to fear smokers used to be posted inside public buses. Yet the official line of consecutive governments for the past 15 years or so is that Quebec is 100% a tolerant society. It has been plummeting towards zero in the past four months. And counting.
This is all about the implementation of fear…We as adults and who haven’t bought in to the bullshit ‘narrative’ will get through this….we bloody have to! But, to inflict this on children makes my blood boil.
Was your son/daughter unlucky enough to get one of those televisions without an off switch ?
Not that easy as they go to relatives and friends houses , plus children talk to each other
So sorry to read about this and hope she gets better.
As well as the fear propaganda, it’s also the lockdown itself which has caused mental health problems in children.
Social isolation and being denied school, friends, sports games, play areas etc…
Our son’s austism has got progressively worse and he has become more and more anxious.
Hopefully things will start to improve.
I hope so too , hope your son begins to improve , so difficult to do and say the right things . x
Sorry if I sounded too snarky. Lots going on.
But young kids surely don’t visit relatives or friends in the summer to watch tv ? Footie, tree climbing, parks, playgrounds, beaches, zoos, woods, etc ?
Kids talking to each other is normal. Their conversations won’t have visual nasties and NLP-driven nudging shite built in. Semi-distant adult input should ensure a particularly affected one doesn’t upset the others.
The current situation is certainly an additional challenge to parenting – but not an insurmountable one. Imho.
True cost of Lockdown #423.
OMG that is so sad…and outrageous that it’s been allowed to happen! what is this country and world coming to! I am so sorry for your grandaughter.
at least is is a change from being scared she will die because of global warming. ! Not being flippant .. This is just how they indoctrinate the kids.
When i was 6 we were threatened with nuclear war ….. I dont recall ever being made to feel so scared.
When I was six, it was the coming Ice Age. No, not the one that melted 10,000 years ago, before some wag jumps in, lol.
Back in the 70s American scientists – yes that lot again – were indeed predicting an ice age.
Class/group actions.
Has there been any definite decision on whether shops refusing entry or service to non muzzled shoppers being potentially guilty of disabled discrimination if the non muzzled person claims medical grounds?
Is there any reason why a list of shops behaving in this manner can’t be hit with collective claims?
Should this be the focus of attention post Friday?
Is this a viable option?
Yep! Sue them all!
Collectively I mean.
On an organised, collated, crowd funded basis.
In the First World War, young men – boys – lied about their age to join up and get killed to defend their country. Could you see yourself doing that now?
But then you wouldn’t need to. We don’t have a country anymore.
I would not die for this cess pit.
Its often said many signed up to fight with their friends. They fought for each other and for their local areas. To them their ways of life were worth fighting for. At least that is what we are told. I don’t imagine most would have felt the stale mate of the trenches and the over the top lads fighting was a good way to support their nation. Frankly God knows what motivation got them into a frontline trench.
It’s a good point you pose Sam. Each of us might use it to reflect on at which point might you fight for your way of life. Trenches are not going to be dug for us to line up in, posters are not going be pasted saying your country needs you. But our ways of life are under threat. Equal to what the Hun, or the Gerries for that matter, threatened? Some are saying its already a coup.
Do your friends and family deserve the opportunities of normal normal? Have those simple and valuable norms been lost for good or can they be saved by standing up like the boys who did so years ago?
Perhaps the nation isn’t why people fought. Maybe the reason to fight was for the patchworks of peoole who make the nation.
Things could be worse – just. Unless you live in Washington DC, where things couldn’t get much worse. This from The Telegraph:
The Mayor of Washington DC has announced an executive order that residents must wear mask whenever they leave home.
“Basically what it says is, if you leave home, you should wear a mask,” Muriel Bowser told a press conference.
“This means, if you’re waiting for a bus, you must have on a mask. If you are ordering food at a restaurant, you must have on a mask. If you’re sitting in a cubicle in an open office, you must have on a mask.”
Ms Bowser added “there will be enforcement language in the order,” but didn’t specify what that would entail.
The new order does not apply to children under three or those eating or drinking.
Last night, Donald Trump has urged every American to wear a face mask if they cannot socially distance in a marked change in tone.
Even children aged three and above will have to submit to this outrage!
Fuck sake this is beyond a joke. Such an effective method, that they never put an end date on it.
This link will take you to a tribute to one of Africa’s least known-undeservedly so-musicians, Philip Tabane:
https://theconversation.com/philip-tabane-the-african-musical-genius-who-played-for-the-spirit-96931
Been out for a lovely day in London, walking the Lea River and then back to the south bank for a pub lunch. 800 comments on here so I probably won’t be able to catch up.
Trains definitely busier even than last week but enough room for all of us. Masks in full flow there and on the tube and a few to be seen outside as well.
It seems different pubs interpret the COVID guidelines in different ways. I had earmarked the Anchor (Green King) near London Bridge as a sensible place to eat, right by the river and ate there a few months ago. But walking from the tube station I passed The Old Thameside Inn which looked interesting and after peeping at the menu walked up to the door. ‘Can you just scan this QR code please’. ‘Sorry, no mobile phone’.’Sorry, we cannot allow you inside. Everybody has a mobile phone these days’. ‘Well I don’t. Sorry, goodbye’.
On to the Anchor. I saw a similar QR code on the wall. The chap asked if I was able to download their app. Sorry, no mobile phone. Not to worry, he says, here is the menu, just order at the bar down there. And don’t worry about that QR thing. Nice meal, not crowded (in fact almost deserted), and no COVID stuff thrust in your face. Some can do it, others go out of their way to make it impossible.
As others have commented, the green folding stuff soon changes opinions and rules.
I’ve refused the app, just in for one drink, no problem. I don’t think many pubs can afford to have arsehole staff right now.
I have just been into town, for the first time since pubs opened. One thing I noticed, a lot of the mental keep 2m apart signage was gone from the town centre. Especially the things they sprayed on the roads and paths. Perhaps my letter to the BID woman made a difference here…
There were tables in the square outside the spoons and they were busy, people looked happy. Nice to see. A few chaps had trendy scarves at the ready. Looked a bit “piratey”.
I had a kebab and sat in the park to eat it. I had a chat with some people I know and gave one of them a badge.
Then I went to a pub, an unprotected young door bloke was there. So I said how does this work then? Well he said, you need to wait here, until there is a table, inside or outside, we have inside tables only now. So what about the track and trace thing? He said you can write your name in this book, I said I won’t do trhat, OK he said. So what else? We have a one way system, How does that work, (getting fairly amused now) and what about the bogs? You have to wait outside, one in one out, So what if i wanted to walk about inside, well you can, if you don’t have to walk too far he said. We had a bit more of a chat, he was borderline case, could be pushed into a more sceptical position…slightly.
So anyway, I didn’t go, cos I didn’t really want to then but some other time it could be OK.
I then went to see my other favourite pub, a long time local. Two of my mates were in the garden, I haven’t seen them for ages either, they were fairly into it all but a little chat really put the cat amongst the psychological pigeons. I studiously ignored the one way system and the sanitizer and took the piss out of the mental screens around the bar (with little beer flaps). This talking the piss thing really does have potential….Could be a lot of fun.
On my way home I saw an older chap I know and we had a chat, I had been quite worried about him, he could have gone “either way” and been hiding under his bed since March, thankfully he was a borderline sceptic and hadn’t been bothered in the slightest by it all. He had been in regular contact with his family and friends..Phew. Great to see him. He earned his badge!
And you went home because why? You clearly have a flare for converting – more kebabs and beer the nation needs you to!
Hi all here is an email I got today from Morrisons. I had offered to show my exemption card as I thought it might make it easier for the staff, who I don’t blame for this crap and I note Hollie has taken me up on it. It isn’t clear how people without a card might go on:
Good Evening Miriam,
Thank you for contacting Morrisons. I fully understand your concern of returning to store but rest assured if you have an exempt card available to show to store staff you can continue to shop as normal.
From the 24th of July, it is mandatory for masks to be worn. However exceptions are given to individuals with disabilities, Children or anyone who has a medial condition preventing them from being able to wear a mask.
Colleague and customer safety remains our priority and we’re continuing to follow all Government advice and Public Health England guidance.
We look forward to seeing you in our stores soon Miriam, Take Care!
Kind regards
Hollie Turner
Customer Service
Wm Morrisons Supermarket Plc
ref: xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx
She doesn’t actually say that people need an exemption card. You’d already told her you have one.
Hopefully they won’t be challenging people, as it would increase anxiety in those with mental problems.
Maybe try to walk in without showing your card and see what the reaction is. You can always produce it if asked.
That’s what I intend to do.
Good idea, I’ll try that.
I do like how they appear to imply that from Friday not wearing a mask would be the opposite of “Colleague and customer safety” unless you are exempt, while prior to that there was no such fear
Yes, I know what you mean. It doesn’t read like the work of someone all that clued up really, I felt it was a form letter, going through the motions.
Another article I can’t actually read but that title sums up my feelings exactly
https://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/2020/07/22/lord-sumption-right-publics-overwhelming-obedience-has-immensely/#comment
The comments are mostly very good too
I thought that too. They’re often quite good actually, for the most part
watch this in full: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rdrKCilEhC0
Here’s a good one:
BREAKING: Matt Hancock has announced today that from the eleventy first of August every person will have to wear knickers on their head in all public places.
“We all have to do our bit; I expect total compliance. Its for our own good. All hail the NHS”
In anticipation of a knicker shortage, civil servants have been desperately sourcing knickers from abroad, and have reportedly paid £112 billion for a shipment of knickers from Mozambique, although there are questions as to whether the knickers meet the NHS knicker standards ISO80081355.
Polling reveals that the public thoroughly back the move. When interviewed, a man on the street said, “I’m already wearing a mask so a thong on my pate is no bother at all.’
From my local London newspapers website:
TfL said:
“Since July 4 we have stopped more than 35,500 people from travelling on buses until they put on a face covering. We have found that people generally want to do the right thing and keep others safe…
“Fixed penalty notices [fines] are a last resort but they are used where necessary – with 127 fines already issued by TfL officers to those refusing to comply.”
Reading this you would think that only 127 people have refused to nappy up.
I see more than 127 on a daily basis.
Brits on Facebook sites here in Sweden keep telling me that it’s just a matter of time, we will be forced into wearing masks here as well, but so far it is not looking imminent. This is from today’s ‘Aftonbladet’ newspaper:
‘Recommendations regarding mouth protection on trains are not currently relevant in Sweden, according to state epidemiologist Anders Tegnell. Keeping distance is still the most important measure to keep down the coronavirus infection.
New recommendations from European authorities state that masks should be used in rail traffic if distances of 1.5 meters cannot be maintained. State epidemiologist Anders Tegnell points out that keeping distance is still the most important and best measure to keep the spread of infection down. Masks should only be seen as a complement – something that also the European recommendations make clear.
– We believe that it should be possible to keep distance, especially on long-distance trains, and SJ (Sweden’s national railway company) has also adapted more and more to this, he says.
Uncertain effect
As previously reported, the effect of masks on reducing the spread of infection is very uncertain. The Swedish Public Health Agency continuously monitors the issue and follows up on new studies. But at present it is not relevant to update the recommendations for Swedish trains.
– Especially not now when we have a rapidly declining rate of cases. This is not a situation where you bring in new restrictions, states Anders Tegnell.’
Why would anyone listen to a country that’s followed the science?
So envious of the swedes having a logical thinking adult advising the gov, instead of a bunch of panicked hysterical shits.
Am I the only one who now has an aversion to the word “safe”? I hate its monosyllabicity and its childish sound; its supposed message of concern, and the implication that life can be made non-hazardous merely through collective rituals and gestures. Most of all, I hate the people who use it.
The word ‘safe’ can go fuck itself – I am painfully aware that what i just said makes no sense at all………
‘Live life, take risks, don’t watch the BBC’
You’re not the only one. When one of the customers I was delivering to to told me to ‘stay safe’, I had to bite my tongue to stop myself making a rude comment…
I just smile and tell them I’m a BASE jumper. Risk and safe not in my vocabulary. Most have no clue what it is so I explain I throw myself off buildings and cliffs with a parachute! You can see the open mouthed expression even through a muzzle.
“Stay safe” is a trigger for me, as is “new normal.” I don’t want to stay safe, I want my old life back! We should start telling people to stay safe whenever they get into their cars, cross the road, ride a bicycle, etc. Maybe they’d realize how stupid it is…but probably not.
https://twitter.com/Kassie917/status/1285960715946168321/photo/1
https://twitter.com/JordanSchachtel/status/1285958254560980994
“Scott Gottlieb, Pfizer board member, hits the jackpot. Congrats America, you got played. You can thank the media and high profile pundits for continuing to elevate his Big Pharma propaganda.”
“BREAKING: The U.S. enters a pact with Pfizer for 100 million doses of a Covid-19 vaccine which Americans will receive for free”
Scott Gottlieb was FDA director until 2019.After that almost daily reporting for CNBC, one of the Covid-19 fearmongers in the US media. Highly respected expert. And that man was in charge of FDA regulating the pharma sector, sits on Pfizer’s board. Any comments from left-wing media about this blatant corruption?
To be fair, if he was allocated stock on the day he joined the Pfizer board, he is still wearing a 10% loss even after today’s announcement.
Nice to see revolving doors and regulatory capture are alive and well!
https://www.cnbc.com/2019/07/02/former-fda-commissioner-gottlieb-defends-decision-to-join-pfizer-board.html
In Quebec the government introduced a 9 meter social distancing rule around five years ago for people puffing on pipes, cigars and other tobacco products near open doors or windows. That is more than four times the current 2 meter rule for Covid-19. I guess that makes secondhand smoke four times more deadly than Covid-19 and everybody should have been wearing masks five years ago.
Just got back from Aldi, usual weekly shopping time, so I don’t know what it’s like in daytime.
More masks tonight than I’ve seen over the last several weeks combined – usually there are none.
Older customers acting quite normally. All mask wearers were twenties and thirties. Idiots!
On the other hand, I went to the park this afternoon. It was busy. No obvious social distancing and not a mask in sight.
The ‘virtue signallers’ will get bored – at least I hope they do!!!
That’s my hope. Masks have a certain amount of novelty value right now. A few weeks of wearing them in high summer and they may lose their appeal even to the fanatics. Then it will be either stay in or rebel.
Overall, which supermarket chain looks the most relaxed? Other than online shopping I think I will just try the small local independent shops and see how they react. I am not on Facebook, the wife is though, there are a few local people on the village social group saying they are ready to hurl abuse and shame those without a mask. How depressing how quickly our “evolved” society can so quickly fall back on the same behaviour seen before world war 2.
Had a few drinks at local pub, all seemed relaxed only dissapointment was seeing the deep clean of a garden table after some customers left. Apart from that pubs so far are the sanest places to go so far, at least in my experience, but I can’t go to the pub frequently forever, not great for the waistline or wallet.
Actually I’ve found Waitrose has actually been pretty good, the staff pretending to go along but at checkouts if you actually ask how they feel it’s like a weight is lifted, and they can speak freely.
Probably a case of trying a few different ones and seeing how it goes.
Cannot agree with Aldi – most staff are really good. But their door man was a really bad idea by them. Lidl have been good, with statements and in practice. Sainsbury’s too. But quite honestly don’t overthink it. Just get on and prepare for the depressive aspect of it.
Thanks, sounds hit and miss depending on the area, possibly store manager. Roll on Friday!
There is no hope for the young.
Had an idea today- what if covi-steria splits the West? It’d be a new Iron Curtain: some countries end up virtually normal (probably Nordics) whilst others are still mired in it. Not a serious expectation, just a (hopefully unrealistic) thought.
Ideas are not allowed in the new normal! Be very careful!
Though I have close ties to other European countries, England is the country of my birth and I love it very much, with all its faults. Or should I say I loved it. I don’t love the country we now find ourselves in.
So if there are countries not afflicted with covi-steria, and they are not beyond the pale in other ways, we’ll be off, and will be glad of somewhere to go.
I think maybe a split would be for the best. Do we really want to live like this?
NO!
I love this country, its geography, it’s history, its flora and fauna, its art, music and architecture. It’s people? Increasingly less so I am afraid.
Sorry about random incorrect apostrophes. I hate autocorrect so much!
AngloWelshDragon,
That made me smile!
DavidC
I feel exactly the same way. I used to always give people the benefit of the doubt, I cared about people, was a generous person. Now I can’t tolerate people, I feel not at all generous, give nobody the benefit of the doubt, and actually find myself wishing ill on all of the sheeple who have brought this down upon us. My husband and I consider our family a fortress and are simply out for ourselves and the protection of our kids, and the few family and friends we have that feel similarly about this whole dystopian “normal.”
I feel the same way. When someone says “you wear the mask to protect me,” all I can think is “fuck you. You don’t demand that I do anything for you. And stop claiming it’s about life. The only life you care about is your own. Go crawl back under your bed and protect it, just leave me the fuck alone.”
Best way to get around this bullshit from Friday is if you get questioned for not wearing a mask, say you’re exempt. If they ask anymore questions after that or for any proof. Get your phone out and start filming them. Say you want what they are saying on record. Inform them they are breaking the law on two counts 1) asking to see your medical records and 2) discriminating against somebody with a disability.
I very much doubt anybody will want to be recorded refusing you entry to a shop knowing they are breaking those laws.
I also doubt that many shops will actually care. I’ve spoken to a few shops over the last week and they said they won’t be enforcing it. It might vary from branch to branch but the ones who do try and enforce it will very quickly stop when they realise others aren’t and/or they are losing customers.
Still no legislation for face coverings in shops on the legislation.gov.uk pages. Looking out for it for follow up to this:
The coronavirus police state (5): the wear-a-mask-to-shop deception
And, an idea for signalling protest
Another T-shirt to wear at the supermarket
https://twitter.com/Ruptly/status/1285967846242160640
Video from Lima, Peru .Face shields together with facemasks to be mandatory on public transport
The Cressida Dick comments today are beyond disgusting. Her resignation should be immediate and we should all write to request it. I cannot believe someone in her position would encouraging shaming others, it really is a new low. I shall be writing to the Met and encourage others to do the same.
This is slightly different from Scotland. The police making statement to encourage social shaming. Police Scotland as far as I know did not say such a statement – I could be corrected here. Pol Scot did declare they would not be chasing after buses without masks. The Scottish Police trade union DID announce police cannot be asked to attend shops to enforce masks.
My point is the difference may suggest without a nation in love with the first minister compliance is not a done deal. Dick and Essex stepping in to encourage in the absence of respect for political leadership. Time will tell.
Cracking article: People are acting hysterical because they have suffered a collective trauma
https://www.rintrah.nl/people-are-acting-hysterical-because-they-have-suffered-a-collective-trauma/
Very good indeed.
‘Just because it seems that almost everyone considers what’s happening now normal does not somehow make it normal. ‘
Sums it up. Hold to that.
Following on from todays Christmas is on… Hogmanay has now been cancelled.
In a statement on Twitter, the event’s organiser Underbelly said: “As has been reported, exciting and positive discussions are taking place between City of Edinburgh Council and Underbelly in relation to the Hogmanay programme for 2020.
“However, it is clear to all parties that the famous Street Party cannot take place in its current form in 2020 and tickets are today being taken off sale.
“Customers who have booked tickets will be contacted in the next 14 days to be offered a full refund”
https://www.edinburghlive.co.uk/news/edinburgh-news/edinburgh-hogmanay-street-party-tickets-18645535
With Underbelly at the helm I suggest this episode may have been a tedious publicity stunt.
“Exciting and positive discussions”?
Did someone redefine the whole bloody language while I wasn’t looking?
I honestly think people are not aware of how bad local government is until they look under the bonnet of edinburgh council. This language oozes out of anything they do.
If it helps, in my opinion that line you picked on says something about these guys having a three (?) year contract to honor and have no appetite to crank up their operation for yet another year of poorly planned stress and seat of pants bluffing. Superlative nonsense often hides internal fractures.
Just got time to read the Sunetra Gupta article. Isn’t she just brilliant – saying all of the things that I’m sure we’ve all instinctively known over the last 4 months but she has the scientific expertise and says it all so well. The last para is very telling – how she had her team had ‘calumny heaped upon them’ (I had to look that word up!) for going against the accepted groupthink. Truly awful – but given what we know now, not particularly surprising.
Meanwhile in Bovine TB
“Bovine TB vaccine trials get go-ahead in England and Wales
“Field trials of a cattle vaccine for bovine tuberculosis have been given the go-ahead as part of moves to phase out badger culling to tackle the disease.
“The trials are due to get under way in England and Wales to accelerate deployment of a cattle vaccine for TB by 2025, the government announced on Wednesday.”
https://www.theguardian.com/uk-news/2020/jul/22/bovine-tb-vaccine-trials-get-go-ahead-in-england-and-wales-badgers
5 year plan to get to market.
Feels strangely coincidental with vaccines, cattle, ferguson. Just one of those things i suppose.
Did badger culling ever prove to prevent the spread of bovine TB?
I remember at the time the culling started opponents said it would not stop the spread of the disease.
Works in theory. Never proved to have worked in practice.
A bit like lockdown.
they made the mistake of not making the cows wear masks
So glad I’m a vegetarian.
For all those who thought the 5G/covid link was a myth and who wanted to disassociate themselves from the so-called conspiracy nuts. See this link https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/32668870/. Scientific paper that clearly states 5G can be used to create corona viruses in cells. The only reason why these conspiracy guys are considered to be nutters is because the mainstream media have labelled them such. I would hope people have learned that if the MSM say something the opposite is true. And they will keep an open mind. After all, everyone on this site will be a conspiracy nutter according to the press and yet we are all right to say the lockdown was a mistake.
People should have listened to people like David Icke 10 years ago when he explained exactly where the world was going i.e he said we were heading for compulsory vaccinations, microchipped population (exactly what Bill Gates wants to prove you have been vaccinated), total surveillance (track and trace) a cashless society (cash is now contaminated by covid) and a society run by technocrats (scientists on the payroll of big pharma). He specifically said a number of years ago to watch out for the influence of Bill Gates. Spot on on all counts.
Had more people listened to him instead of believing what the media said about him maybe we wouldn’t be in this mess.
A stopped clock can be right on occasion. But I wouldn’t buy it.
So is it a virus or not?
constructing virus-like structures such as Coronaviruses (COVID-19) within cells.
I’m not a biochemist but the abstract contains some very sloppy and subjunctive writing. Besides, COVID-19 is the illness, not the virus.
Not sure we do ourselves any favours entertaining such complete drivel.
Maybe,but the powers that be got rid of him pretty quickly from Facebook and you tube after he linked 5g and Covid;after tolerating him for years.
Exactly
That’s the Davide Ike who was cancelled by YouTube just as the ‘crisis’ he’d been predicting got going.
Deleted
Just trying to find small comforts. At least I wasn’t daft enough to vote for this bunch of Spivs, Liars and Chancers. I didn’t buy the snake oil.
… but it is only a *small* comfort
I think it’s a real comfort. I wouldn’t ever, ever want to join the zombies and surrender my humanity. We are still human. We represent the human race. It may be painful, but it should make us proud.
Remember, always remember, that sanity is not statistical.
We are right. They are wrong. Has anybody here ever doubted that for a single second?
https://twitter.com/JoshuaRozenberg/status/1286022948667691008?s=20
As the peasant who looked after the Peacocks on my estate used to say in times like these “we should fill up the moat and pull back the drawbridge, the villagers are getting restless.”
https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=ZtYU87QNjPw
Help, I’m being repressed!
What are masks distracting us from?
We know they have little to no genuine medical reason.
Is it just to lower our ability to have a casual chat? Depress people a bit more?
I honestly don’t know. But I’m pretty sure there are no good intentions behind it.
It’s to soften us all up to have the vaccine
Do you want a list?
Etc …..
It’s not too difficult when normal democratic checks and balances, imperfect as they are, go out the window, and parliament ceases to function (remember – Mr Toad started down that road before all this kicked off)
Brexit isn’t a fuck up and i can’t wait to get them euro fleas off my back.
America is cool and i’d rather be with them than the bloody Germans.
You grasp of economics is looser than the stool of a baby.
Anyone who say’s “Big Pharma” is a total moron with no health issues.
again you’ve no clue about economics.
If it’s inbreds you’re looking for i’d suggest the council estate chavs who, like you, appear to know didlly squat of fuck all and cost us rich people a fortune to keep like animals in a zoo..
What you posted makes less sense than wearing a mask
etc
Just posted on Telegraph. SI tomorrow with additional places for masks – cafes and takeaways!
https://www.telegraph.co.uk/politics/2020/07/22/face-masks-become-compulsory-takeaways-government-tightens-law/
Well that could end my trips to the local chippy.
Im expecting to see shops cutting holes to the street and serve through them as ice cream used to be.
My re-opened chippy did just that, works while it’s sunny and warm.
My initial reaction was pretty extreme. And then I realised that I can’t remember the last time I bought a takeaway coffee and my only takeaway food in 4 months has been 3 deliveries. So the idiots may as well just destroy another few percent of the economy.
It can only be deliberate. Pretty sure Boris didn’t mention it at this evenings 1922 committee meeting. Tomorrow they are off on their long-deserved and fully-paid holidays!
It seems that the 1922 committee would have applauded the idea and begged for a new template letter to send to their constituents.
But I hope that they enjoy their holidays. Gawd bless ‘em.
They can just fuck right off frankly
Well colour me unsurprised that it’s been expanded.
Whats the big deal, it’s only hospitals and GPs?
What’s the big deal it’s only hospitals, gp surgeries and all shops?
Whats the big deal it’s only hospitals, gp surgeries, all shops, cafés and takeaways?
—
A big fuck you to all the twats who kept telling me its only X stop fussing.
Next it will be outside in public.
Christ – please don’t give them any ideas!!
It’s too late, it’s very much already part of the schedule.
How will that work in Costa then: you go to the counter, order your coffee, then sit down. The bloody place only opened on Saturday! Sounds like it will now be shutting again.
the comments are not complimentary to the government! there’s a lot of unhappy people in this country – shame there isn’t a single unifying force/party/rebellion to counter this madness as i think everyone needs to unite under one banner. But apart from a few individuals there isn’t any real opposition for people to support.
How long is it now since Super Saturday? Where is the resulting spike? No spike = no virus = no masks required.
That sounds like observation and logical thought… which is not required thank you!
Oops sorry Lord Handjob of Gates, please spare the children…
And the Bournemouth beach ’emergency’, or Lverpool fans celebrating, or BLM protests, or the ‘illegal raves’, or when we all went… To the parks!!
How people still lap this up is totally beyond me :/
“It’s still out there”
No it isn’t.
“Well, I’d rather have to wear a mask than not be able to leave the house”
Don’t be stupid. Why do you think it’s reasonable that the government should ever have told you to do either of those things?
“I hope you and your family have all kept safe”
Of course they have, as has virtually everybody else in the world, you moron.
Just 3 of the conversations I had to stop myself from having today, because clients and/or colleagues were involved.
Lol
You’ve more control than I. My boss brought it all up again today thinking the fact trump was no backing masks must have got me on side (which is odd as I’ve no love for trump at all) but instead he just set me off on a 10minute lecture unloading a whole host of actual facts on him… I could see it was actually starting to sink in too, that look of self doubt was creeping onto his face (but he’s still gonna mask up)
What can I say? I deal with clients. If I hadn’t learned how to stop myself from telling people they were stupid, I’d have lost my job a couple of decades ago.
But , as Trump is the epitome if Wrongness, aren’t masks now wrong?. Or, if they are right, doesn’t that make Trump right? A nice puzzler for Americans whose brains contain enough neurons to fire occasionally.
A mass triggering of cognitive dissonance in the ‘orange man wrong’ ranks?
The concern is once they can’t beat him with that stick they’re gonna just move onto something else, unfortunately, which means we’ll have another nonsensical restriction coming down the tracks shortly.
As for Trump himself, he’s undoubtedly not on ‘our side’, Trump is on his side and his side only, he cares about number 1 and has done since the day he was born into the multi millionaire elite circles he moves in. That said, the fact he only gives a shit about himself and what he thinks is right sometimes means he is right, and on masks and the threat of this virus he was undoubtedly right, unfortunately that has no succumbed to what that was doing for his chances of winning again in November so he’s simply U-Turned like all the other spineless politicians and is now backing stuff he doesnt believe in at all.
With Matt Handjob and Cresssida D!ck whipping up the mob by suggesting people shame those not wearing masks into leaving shops anyone care to guess how many days it will be before someone with learning difficulties or mental health issues or otherwise exempt is attacked? Even if it doesn’t get physical we have had plenty of instances of people shamed on social media committing suicide. How much more blood do these clowns want on their hands?
Exactly
Dick should resign for making such a rabble rousing suggestion, given there are literally hundreds of reasons why people can have completely valid exemptions under the law. We know she’s trigger happy.
Indeed. Isn’t incitement a crime?
It’s bloody stupid, this is just going to create a load of have a go heroes. There’s been fights and arguments on the footpath that runs past my house during lockdown because people have supposedly got too close. It’s gonna be kicking off in shops and superstores.
They should be ashamed of their comments – its inciting hate, discrimination as well as sowing seeds of discord and distrust. Both Lieutenant Gruber and this Dick woman should be careful what they wish for, when the shit hits the fan they could be first in the firing line and no-one will ride to their rescue.
We are way, way past the time when we must be asked to endorse this government confiscation of our basic rights in an election. This is a coup.
as the man who used to bring Elvis his water and scarves used to say in times like this “Don’t Cry, Daddy
Daddy, please don’t cry
Daddy, you’ve still got me and little Tommy
and together we’ll find a brand new mommy
https://youtu.be/N6W5RB50fXk
Enjoy. It’s fabulous.
I have just heard Cressida Dick commissioner of police say that she hopes people will be shamed into wearing masks — Many people have a medical reason for not wearing masks – So our police commissioner wants us to be shamed. How dare she.
What sort of society are we living in. Our Government and it’s ill thought out rules is now causing shaming of innocent people …….
I dread to think what effect her words will have on the kind of people who can’t tell the difference between a pediatrician and a pedophile.
It’s happened before.
DavidC
She’s an incredibly stupid person.
I guarantee that her IQ is below 100.
Did she call for shaming of BLM protestors who broke social distancing rules.
She’s Common Purpose, the only reason she’s got that job
Somebody here quoted St Augustine yesterday:
Lex iniusta non est lex.
(An unjust law is not law)
Her majesty’s government does not effect law telling her subjects what they must wear, who they may see, where they may go and how they might interact.
I’ve built my morale back up through the day. I do not consider this government’s laws to be legitimate. I will not follow them.
If anyone asks me why I’m not wearing a mask I will say that it’s pointless and we have a duty to get the government to back down.
Absolutely, because still stating you’re exempt is going along with it and using a loophole they’ve created. We need to be steadfast in our resolution that they are entirely political and should not be shamed or have to prove we don’t have to, when the truth is masks do incredibly little if anything. And also, surely we want it to be spread more widely for more people to be immune, the longer we drag it out the longer all these measures are in place given a vaccine is unlikely in a best case scenario!
https://arxiv.org/abs/2007.07154
From Corrnell Univ
Interesting hypothesis that there was a milder version spreading of SARS-Cov2 before a more virulent strain later. This could explain some paradoxes that countries with much direct flights to China not that affected and herd immunity reached earlier than expected.
Interesting. If true, it could explain a lot, and it come be game changer. However, it’s at odds with the current global narrative, so even if it’s 100% accurate it will probably be swept under the table.
Yes v interesting. Would accord with the experience of many in the UK who in the Autumn experienced a very very stubborn respiratory disease that took weeks or months to disappear though people could very often continue working through it. That sounds like a Sars style infection.
That was being speculated a month into the ‘crisis’ when California had only about 10% cases/deaths than New York because almost all flights from China and hundreds of thousands of Chinese tourists come into Californian airports.
New Yorks covid carriers came later, from Europe.
Activists hold up banner saying ‘England get out of Scotland’ at border during protest
Campaigners from Action for Scotland insist the border should be closed to English people, although, they say they are not anti-English.
Activist Sean Clerkin said: “All people must stop travelling from England to Scotland for non essential reasons to protect the people of Scotland from Covid-19.
“New cases of Covid-19 are 5.5 times higher in England than Scotland and Professor Rowland Kao a mathematical biologist at Edinburgh University stated recently that if there is increased travel between England and Scotland it is inevitable that cases of Covid-19 will increase in Scotland.
More at
https://www.edinburghnews.scotsman.com/news/politics/activists-hold-banner-saying-england-get-out-scotland-border-during-protest-2921243
Fuck these people. I’m embarrassed that people think Scottish people are all like this scum. It’s no wonder though what with Sturgeon and her gang being bunch of fucking bigots. The scary thing is they’ve lied so much they actually believe they’re not anti english. You folk think it’s bad in England, you want to try and live in this socialist hell hole. I really believe they won’t be happy till we’re all wearing mandatory kilts and forced fed Porridge.
I’d rather have mandatory kilts than mandatory masks.
I was about to make a flippant comment about the highland clearances.
But actually, a serious point occurs to me – is Covid now an English thing in the mind of Sturge Un’s most fanatical supporters? Has it always been an English thing, or only now that Scotland is so orgasmically close to eliminating it?
(I note that essential travel is fine. Wouldn’t want the overwhelmingly northbound supply chain to be interrupted, would we?)
who knows what the average snp punter thinks, they don’t know themselves
It is an attempt to fuse Covid to English. The truly concerning bit is that some snp supporters will think this is a bright resonable idea. Why not protest around motherwell where tge track and trace outbreak occured or why not protest at Kilmahog to keep the central belt out of the hughlands. There is a lack of condemnation by even a few hours that is read into as encouragement. Last border protest the Justice snp Yousaf claimed the protesters were racists… again another encouraging sign – condeming on one hand but declaring English as a different race on the snp other hand. Ugh.
It’s more upsetting than realised – it is done as a smear the English whether the mathematician know it or not.
From The Guardian (where else):
https://www.theguardian.com/world/2020/jul/22/female-leaders-have-been-better-at-tackling-covid-19-says-ecb-chief
No. Men are better leaders, generally speaking.
Doesn’t have the highest deaths per million rate and a female leader?
Belgium?
Yes sorry for omission.
https://twitter.com/HaraldofW/status/1286042647128416256/photo/1
This is all cause death different age groups adjusted for population week1-26 from 2000 Sweden
2020 not worse than 2015 but the most striking thing is age below 65(working age) death all causes continuing a downward trend.
I think you need a subbie: “Sing this petition on the UK Government petitions site and get the issue debated in Parliament” Sing?
Because singing is now illegal, it’s an act of defiance.
We should gather hundreds of protestors outside Parliament, singing out the names of the petitioners at the top of their lungs.
The Finance Minister of Canada, Bill Morneau, paid back more than $40,000 to WE Charity just hours before he was to testify before MPs.
Theme Tune suggestion [inspired by Sun article]
“Let me take you by the hand and lead you through the streets of London
and I will certainly show you something that will change your lockdown mind
A friend tells me that the Co-op in Linton, a large village near Cambridge, has been closed for the last four days, and no date for re-opening set, because one employee tested positive for coronavirus.
My friend, who has swallowed the poison narrative whole, isn’t the least bit angry. Like most of the sheeples, she will put up with anything.
There is no other food shop within five miles. We have another friend there who is ninety-six and could never cope with a bus journey (supposing a bus were available anyway), or with going round a big supermarket. She will be supported by her neighbours, but what about others?
No grief, folks. You will starve, but you won’t get the Bug.
Should have taken the Co OP 2 days to deep clean the store and bring in staff from elsewhere.
Maybe the good sheeples ofLinton actually want to starve to death in order to save lives.
How about Linton Food and Wine supermarket, a stone’s throw from the Linton Co-op?
Here’s the story…
https://www.cambridge-news.co.uk/news/local-news/fury-linton-co-op-shuts-18638072
Very begrudging coverage of Sweden on R4 Today Show this morning. Stressing repeatedly the high death toll compared to its neighbours (but not mentioning excess death figures which are of course lower) but also mentioning the steep decline in deaths and ICU admissions in the last few weeks. The tone could not have been less enthusiastic – you think they would have mentioned the fact that the kids of Sweden have been in school the entire time so not had their education suffer) – and concluded that only time will tell if they were right and everyone else was wrong.
I think we already know who was right and who was wrong. Which is why those countries who got it wrong just can’t drop it. Sweden is a right royal thorn in their side. I’m glad about that, really glad. A little old-fashioned this, but huzzah for Sweden!
By the way, shouldn’t we now be well into the expected spike from ‘Super Saturday’ and when all those common people went to the beach?
?20200705191803
I hope Rod Liddle is feeling very foolish.
Have you got any plans for the weekend? Going to a rave? Or just down the pub to breathe over as many people as you possibly can.
Here’s my big worry. That Super Saturday will be followed, five days later, by Terrible Thursday.
From the Evening Standard:
Super Saturday revellers ‘clearly unable to stick to social distancing rules’ as hundreds of thousands hit the pub amid packed scenes in Soho
But what, in fact, happened? Oh…
Surely this, on its own, should be enough to argue that this whole thing is b*ll*cks.
They’re all speaking through their arses. We now need to completely replace the Establishment. We can start with a properly written Constitution, ensuring no power grabs like this one can ever happen again.
Edit: No power grabs without the express consent of the people in a referendum, with further referenda every six months if necessary. At least we will know where the blame lies then.
They’d just override it. Spain had a constitution guaranteeing political liberty throughout the Franco era.
And as they are trying to do in the US too. But it would be a start.
Will over the border in Englandistanshire on Saturday, more precisely in Chester. Just to see how weekend shopping is going with or without muzzles, fights, etc.
If anyone is about, I’ll be somewhere along Foregate or Eastgate Street, pad and pencil in one hand for taking notes, and a large bucket of popcorn in the other, in case there are any punchups for entertainment going on.
I might be about… Saturday afternoon?
Late morning to afternoon certainly.
Just wanting to see what’s what at the shops. Will folk roll over? Or not?
As for the residual noise stretching out at the end of this graph, it’s most likely false positives.
Government paper on PCR test accuracy:
When only a small proportion of people being tested have the virus, the operational false positive rate becomes very important.
https://assets.publishing.service.gov.uk/government/uploads/system/uploads/attachment_data/file/895843/S0519_Impact_of_false_positives_and_negatives.pdf
Basically, the virus has gone.
It’s bumping along the ground all right, as you say this could be false positives. I do hear (wish I could remember where, but am reading so much from many different places now) that the vaccine trials are under threat because attempts to infect the
guinea pigstest subjects are failing.It might return over the winter, then we’ll find out how good or otherwise the herd immunity theories are!
Herd immunity cannot be seen to be the reason why a second wave is prevented; we will all be forced into a pointless lockdown as soon as there is the slightest suggestion of a couple of cases in Wuhan and when we emerge Johnson will have his Canute moment….
Unfortunately no future lockdown will be as successful as the one we are apparently emerging from. Many people will be disregarding it, especially as the P45s will be flying around by then.
My co-operation with the last lockdown was sketchy at best. It will be non-existent for any future repeat, assuming the government is stupid enough.
Oh, they’re stupid enough.
Buy sandwich, sit down? NO. Sit down, order sandwich? YES.
Because virus.
But surely the enforced wearing of masks will ensure a second wave of something, with everyone’s immunity compromised?
Funnily enough, I think the opposite will be the case, as I expect a bit of an epidemic of sickness and diarrhoea as people forego washing their hands, as the face nappies make them invincible, and then spend their whole time pulling the sodden wraps off their faces with their filthy hands.
All the selfish, granny killing bastard beach stories began in late April. This graph really puts that into perspective.
https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-3044819/Not-cloud-sky-Millions-head-parks-beaches-enjoy-warm-weather-Britain-continues-course-hottest-April-record.html
People with treatable cancers are going to die because hospitals have been laid empty due to Government scaremongering, an NHS nurse has warned.
An NHS nurse called Holly* has said that throughout the lockdown period “hospitals were empty” beyond the ICU units and Covid wards and that people have died as a result. “We’ve been saying for months now that services just aren’t running at anywhere near normal capacity and we’re building up more problems than Covid has caused by a mile.
“We have a lot of deaths in my area but we’re going to have an awful lot more from cancers that are going undiagnosed and strokes that haven’t been treated….those who will die as a result of measures put in place to protect the NHS will include “young healthy people who had treatable cancers and treatable issues”.
https://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/2020/07/23/people-treatable-cancers-will-die-due-government-scaremongering/
https://www.bing.com/videos/search?q=liverpool+fans&&view=detail&mid=9A24360873B6D448BF549A24360873B6D448BF54&&FORM=VRDGAR&ru=%2Fvideos%2Fsearch%3Fq%3Dliverpool%2Bfans%26FORM%3DHDRSC3
The Dick woman will have blood on her hands when someone ends up dead after a row about face masks.
The big countdown is on. Less than 24 hours till lift off.
This time tomorrow the mighty England, once ruler of the seven seas, the nation that invented the modern world, who’s art’s, music, science and literature dominates popular culture on nearly all parts of this blue marble will be subjugated, broken, torn apart and rotten.
And most of the English will be just fucking dandy with that.
The country that stood alone against the evil Bosch, who took Africa from the lions and made America have become cowards sitting back watching their country destroyed by outside forces.
With smart phones in hand and masks on their faces
they take their places
in the faceless society.
The mask of the beast on every street and in every home
the sun has set on the empire, it’s gone
With parliament disbanded now an empty building,
haunted and totally ruined
The good ship Albion has hit the rocks
Boudica’s children will wear masks in shops
will it ever stop? I hear some cry
but with a whimper she dies.
No longer the common man under common law
without the heart to fight for
liberty, at any cost
Englands Paradise lost.
Churchill quote (there’s always a Churchill quote), slightly adapted:
What he [Johnson] has done is to kindle a fire in British hearts, here and all over the world, which will glow long after all traces of the conflagration he has caused in England have been removed. He has lighted a fire which will burn with a steady and consuming flame until the last vestiges of Woke tyranny have been burnt out of Europe, and until the Old World — and the New — can join hands to rebuild the temples of man’s freedom and man’s honour, upon foundations which will not soon or easily be overthrown.
To quote John Lydon, “there no future and Englands Dreaming
‘When there’s no future there cannot be sin’
I think you will be surprised at how many won’t wear a mask and how many refuse to go into shops and how many shops won’t comply. Already on trains many don’t wear them despite the propaganda photo’s the media put out.
I hate to tell you this bro but up here in Scotland almost everyone is wearing them and i suspect the same will happen in England No i don’t suspect i know 100% without a doubt
Re-post on new page just out?
Have ordered the exempt badges…spent yesterday having to wear a mask on an empty train, and while visiting a museum..They should be for the paranoid only…had a conversation with a bored transport policemen, who said he didn’t have to wear a mask, but was…Unless medical grade, and put on correctly are pointless..and probably sources of disease..would love to know if there is a surge in TB , Hepatitis etc as a result of these being discarded…
New page is live
An update
Five days out now
Day 1 A trip to the newsagent
Day 2 Waiting for kneel (he still hasn’t turned up, staring to get worried, will check the canal again)
Day 3 The police are a mirage
Day 4 A visit to the seaside
Sundowners
Yesterday evening we sat on the patio of the village rugby club. A group of refuseniks gather each evening to take in the sun. Mine is a pint of cider on ice. It’s BYO, as the club has still not reopened yet.
Our group gets larger each day. We all take our litter home with us and leave it as pristine as we found it. In an act of defiance we drink from pint glasses that we bring with us (yes women too, it’d that kind of place)
Sat next to me is my partner of 40 years (Jesus, I’ve started doing it, she’s not my bleeding partner, a partner is someone you play cards with, she’s my wife)
Things been cooking round her for a long time. Neolithic axe heads, an iron age hill fort, roman remains and a Norman castle
On the village square the union jack flies next to the war memorial. Three ancient inns front onto the square. None of them have reopened (inside or out) threatening phone calls from the local Stasi soon put paid to that
The then Lord of the Manor gave the land for the rugby club to the villagers in 1882.
He also gave the land for the cricket, tennis, and bowls clubs. His other contributions were the Scouts Hall and a lovely Parish Hall built in 1907, in the Arts and Crafts style
He was a General in the British Army in India (thank god there are no statues to him)
In the Great War he came out of retirement to set up the local red cross hospital for casualties
When he passed on the Scouts lined the funeral route to the 14th century church. Heads bowed resting on their staves
My thoughts drift off. I think about John Owen Jones, my great uncle. He died of his wounds in Flanders in July 1917 aged 24. (funny how they are nearly all great uncles, few living long enough to have children of their own). I visited his grave a few years ago and placed flowers upon it. Possibly the first person ever to do so
His memorial plaque and victory medal sit in a display cabinet at home. They sit next to my late mother and fathers wartime medals. My father used to joke that the war would have ended two years earlier if my mother had not been involved. I wonder what it was like to be a 19 year old on D Day, and resolve to pass on his legion Du Honnour to our eldest son
Then my thoughts turn to the betrayal and the lying, my feelings spin out of control
“What are you thinking about”
“Nothing”
“Yes you are I can tell”
“No nothing”
Another thought crosses my mind, if he’s shagged everything that’s moved he’s not likely to stop at us
I am back in the room, and the conversation turns to ice packs, the fact that none of us will give our names in order to go into a pub, and what’s for dinner
Tomorrow: Rishi Sunak sponsors the bowls Club
Mr Trump last night – ‘50% of virus deaths from 1% of the population’. Of course we all know that, but his comment, along with the ‘I am happy for my son and grandchildren to go back to school’ sat well with his return to calling the virus ‘Wuhan flu’ and the ‘Chinese plague’. He is announcing in the next week or so, research from the US about children’s inability to catch and transmit the virus. Let’s see whether this will convince teaching unions, with their over-riding concern about the education of children!
The problem is that at least half the world assume that whatever Trump says must infallibly be the opposite of the truth.
And he has started spotting a face nappy – which sends an entirely different message altogether.
I have just watched excellent interview by Charlie Kirk with Dr Simone Gold who gives a lengthy but extremely clear exposure re Covid, treatment and risk, and in particular issues around Chloroquine.