The re-opening of England’s pubs has rendered me, ahem, unable to do a proper update today but will do one tomorrow.
In the meantime, here is a post from regular contributor Guy de la Bédoyère that will, I imagine, strike a chord with many.
Sky News this morning featured another of those bizarro-world reports the broadcast media seems to be fixated about pushing out. This one, by Alex Crawford in Houston, was about the dramatic increase in infections in Texas. It was straight back to the Good Old Days of Covid Death Porn – except that there didn’t seem to be much death. But Ms Crawford had clearly been watching back through the Death Porn archives to make sure it ticked all the boxes. But somehow it just didn’t work out like that.
Needless to say, the item began with a patient having a tube stuffed down his nose – the usual opening scene in any self-respecting Covid hospital report. “The awful reality of Coronavirus,” said Alex Crawford, who moved on to a hospitalised patient whom she reported as saying that “Coronavirus kills you”. That he seemed to be alive, conscious and on the way to recovery had apparently passed both him and Crawford by.
“Even survival feels like death,” Crawford opined, perhaps frustrated by the lack of body bags on hand. This was a faintly peculiar thing to say since it appeared to suggest it isn’t worth surviving the virus anyway.
Crawford hunted on through the wards. We were treated to another victim who had a mask on but was otherwise sitting up and able to bang on about the governor’s irresponsibility for lifting the lockdown. Crawford added the revelation and dark warning “it only takes one infected person” to catch the virus. She’s obviously been reading the Noddy in Toyland Guide to Epidemiology.
The numbers of cases have “tripled” (no numbers provided). The doctors are “frantic” about how they’ll be able to cope. One told Crawford “if you go out on July 4th you have the potential of dying or killing someone else”.
I’m not sure why that makes this year’s July 4th especially or unusually dangerous since unless I’m missing something there’s been no July 4th in history in which zero risk was an option, either from a car crash, catching an infection or being mugged, or not going out and falling downstairs.
“There’s no shortage of protective equipment here,” said Crawford, which seemed to suggest along with the systems in placed that everything was under control. Nonetheless the doctor in charge of the unit shook his head and said there were still some people out there and he just didn’t know how they could still be alive. How indeed?
But it turned out that a cocktail of steroids, vitamins and anti-coagulants costing $100 per day per patient has resulted in a 96% success rate of those hospitalised. “The infections in Texas have spiked but the mortality rate is much lower… and they’re getting results.”
Crawford was quick to quash any sense that might be good news.
Crawford interviewed a nurse who was keen to warn her “that a lot of people are going to die being ignorant and ignorance is never a defence… and they’re going to be an example to the rest of the country” as well as countries like Britain. “If they don’t take this serious [sic] they’re gonna die… point blank.” Then bizarrely the nurse added “and they’re gone get sick”, but presumably not necessarily in that order prior to the inevitable death she was promising, apparently not being aware of the 96% survival rate of those who were bad enough to go to hospital in the first place.
Just in case you hadn’t realized how serious she was she threw in “and it’s gonna be bad”.
For good measure the piece finished up with a nurse who had been infected because after all no hospital piece is complete without a health worker hero hanging off the barbed wire in No-Man’s Land. She too was sitting up in bed and was able to warn anyone who had mistaken her for someone still alive, conscious and in a reasonable state, that if you didn’t hug your loved ones they you might never do so again.
The entire premise of the piece seemed to be that catching COVID-19 is invariably a catastrophe and that death follows as night follows day. That this was not corroborated by any of the content of the piece did not bother the fearless reporter or the people she spoke to. Nor did it match the news that the surge in infections in Texas seems to be partly due to much younger people getting COVID-19 who, as we all know, are far less likely either to get sick or to die.
Presumably even now the BBC’s battle-seasoned Covid hacks are on their way to Texas for a slice of the action.
Theme Tune Suggestions From Readers
One suggestion today: “Compete Control” by the Clash.
Small Businesses That Have Re-Opened
A few weeks ago, Lockdown Sceptics launched a searchable directory of open businesses across the UK. The idea is to celebrate those retail and hospitality businesses that have re-opened, as well as help people find out what has opened in their area. But we need your help to build it, so we’ve created a form you can fill out to tell us about those businesses that have opened near you. Now that non-essential shops have re-opened – or most of them, anyway – we’re now focusing on pubs, bars, clubs and restaurants, as well as other social venues. As of July 4th, many of them have re-opened too, but not all. Please visit the page and let us know about those brave folk who are doing their bit to get our country back on its feet. Don’t worry if your entries don’t show up immediately – we need to approve them once you’ve entered the data.
Note to the Good Folk Below the Line
I enjoy reading all your comments and I’m glad I’ve created a “safe space” for lockdown sceptics to share their frustrations and keep each other’s spirits up. But please don’t copy and paste whole articles from papers that are behind paywalls in the comments. I work for some of those papers and if they don’t charge for premium content they won’t survive.
Shameless Begging Bit
Thanks as always to those of you who made a donation in the last 24 hours to pay for the upkeep of this site. It usually takes me several hours to do these updates (although not today), which doesn’t leave much time for other work. If you feel like donating, however small the amount, please click here. And if you want to flag up any stories or links I should include in future updates, email me here. (Please don’t email me at any other address.) I’ll try and get another update done on Saturday.
And Finally…
Can I ask for advice regarding the Young family holiday? We want to go to Venice and then on to the Dolemites in the last week of July or thereabouts and have found some nice places to stay. However, I’m worried about booking an airline ticket, only for the flight to be cancelled. How risky do people think that is? Are some airlines more reliable than others? And if they think it’s very risky, would they recommend going by train instead? Please email me here with any advice. Thank you.
Discussion
Comments
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Just watched a disgusting piece on BBC Scotland…..
Residents in social housing blocks in Glasgow are complaining that there stairs and common landings haven’t been cleaned since lockdown.
Something to do with it not being “safe” for staff of contract cleaning companies instructed by social landlords to attend weekly to clean the stairs.
Now there is 3 months accumulation of dried urine, vomit, drug detritus, spilled food and alcohol, dried spittle, dog sh~t, in summary a perfect health hazard.
One pale, anxious 20-something mother said she and her kids have hardly been out since lockdown as the kids are too frightened to walk over the stair mess.
God knows what this will have done to the immune systems and general health of the kids. Far,far worse than the damage CV could ever do.
Unbelievable in the 21st century.
Yes keep them indoors, no fresh air, no sunshine and no movement. Perfect recipe to get Covid or other diseases
Why not get a bucket, a mop and some bleach and do it yourself?
Couldn’t the residents get some buckets and mops and do a bit of cleaning for themselves?
Does anyone else find this story, at this point in the game, a bit weird?
https://www.theguardian.com/politics/2020/jul/05/met-police-urged-to-investigate-dominic-cummings-trip-during-covid-19-lockdown
Madness. I thought Cummings was pushing his luck, and him and the PM and others who defended him, especially the eye testing bit, were insulting our intelligence, but I think we’ve moved on. Some scores being settled, or someone hungry for publicity, and The Guardian obviously haven’t forgiven him for Brexit.
He should go, for his role in lockdown.
Not clicked through, but sedwill and may might have a guardian phone number.
It seems most of the clappers were officials of some sort – and Annemarie Plas looks a right twit in that frock!
Grad, live news, 17.16:
It seems the turnout for tonight’s clap hasn’t been enormous. On my street in central Brixton, not a single person clapped.
Over on Twitter, scores of people are reporting the same, with some saying they had no idea a clap for the NHS was on, and others stating that they deliberately didn’t join in.
Heard a bit of distant clapping here but none of the regular Thursday night clappers were anywhere to be seen. Looks like a damp squib. But the beefeater down the road was packed out.
Absolutely none round here. I confess I didn’t know either!
I’m feeling unreasonably pleased about this!
THREE CHEERS TO IVOR CUMMINS!
Thanks to another sceptic who posted this, the best 25 minute summary I have seen of the last 3 months “madness”.
mathematics, logic and data = science
politicians, ivory tower public health expects, imperial college and the majority sheep that now inhabit the uk = “the science”
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cSKjcltDkng
Brilliant piece and I have a number of Swedophobes I shall send to.
I LOVED this.
Anyone been to the pub yet? How are they collecting “your details”, and what do they want to know? How about coffee shops, are they the same?
Pub I went to was using a notebook on a table. And a pen for everyone to use. 🙂
Name, address, phone number. They probably won’t get Matt Handcock on the phone number I gave.
So how often is the communal pen sanitised 😉 ?!
Which sort of pub goer might you be? “Its all a hoax you know…”
https://www.theguardian.com/lifeandstyle/ng-interactive/2020/jul/04/stephen-collins-on-pubs-in-england-reopening-cartoon
Not sure I’d want to be in a pub with Stephen Collins.
I’m the sort of pub goer who doesn’t go to the pub, disapproves of loud, drunken people (no offence intended to anyone here) but believes in letting people live their own lives and make their own choices. I’ve got enough problems of my own without wanting to spend my life telling the rest of the world how to live theirs, and heartily sick of being micromanaged by the government and busybodies.
Afraid I’d be the one in the corner whipping out my phone to show them the graphs that prove what nonsense it all was…
Yes, because in Guardian World anyone who disagrees with lockdown is a loony conspiracy theorist who thinks it’s all a hoax…
I went and was not asked for details. Rural free house though.
Same here.
I went to my local Sunday afternoon – to check out their rules. Surprised and delighted to find everyone practising ‘as you were.’ No masks, gloves, plastic screens, hand gel stations, one way system or name and address required. I stood at the bar, ordered a half and was informed that I could sit inside or outside in the garden – just as I pleased.
Just had a text from my DiL, very newly qualified pc.
She was on duty last night and had to help empty and close a pub because everyone was hammered and there was a massive bar fight. (No idea which town she was working in.)
She and her partner spotted a guy trying to carry his drunken girlfriend 6 miles home. She’d thrown up in the taxi. He’d had to pay for the taxi cleaning bill and was left without a ride.
My DiL and partner turned their police car into a taxi for the couple. Happy days!
Marvellous, the old normal
Normal normal nothing old about it!
Is this how we will remember lockdown lunacy in the future?
A particularly evil and corrupt government once declared that the human immune system was no longer fit for purpose. Policy became that only governments can successfully control immunity from disease. So they locked us up at home, bled us dry of our old T-cells and B-cells and transfused us with J-cells and H-cells instead. These were administered mixed into a lurid black and green plasma of propaganda donated by the BBC and other media outlets.
The T-cells and B-cells would fight the bacteria in our bodies, but the J-cells and H-cells merely blustered at them and threatened them with ‘the science’ and they were NOT sore afraid.
We became so ill that we all had to give up work, stand far apart, and wear masks whenever outdoors. But it made no difference, society was sick, and only our NHS heroes and the government could save us.
But then someone said “Wait a minute here, if we got rid of the J-cells and H-cells and went back to using T-cells and B-cells again, would we not get better?” Of course such an idea was unthinkable to a government… Read more »
I feel there is an analogy to be found in this 43 seconds of public health advert.
https://youtu.be/6tQsXJEza6A
Hahaha. Clap for the NHS? It’s blowing a gale and absolutely pouring down!
Why?
And not where I am.
Not raining here but no one out clapping either I am glad to report. If anything, from looking at a few MSM articles on clapping at 5pm, the majority of comments would appear to show people have had enough.
Lockdown Sceptic take: people have had enough of the BS.
MSM/govt take: people are disgusted and frightened that the evil Tory government has abandoned them to their fate by forcing them to leave their homes to go shopping. That people they might pass are evil disease spreaders after going to the pub. Aarghhh!
No clapping here. That’s cheered me up a bit.
When is the clap due?
It was at 5pm.
! Not a thing. That was an embarrasing fail.
They would not have gambled with that last clap, they’d have anticipated full nationwide support.
Well let’s face it, celebrating 72nd anniversaries is never going to catch on.
Oh damn I missed it. My collection of 8,763 (and declining) toilet rolls needed rearranging.
No clapping here which is good as a month ago they were all rabid.
Only heard one person from around the houses in our street of largely doctors, teachers and academics. Thursday night claps had been very loud. It is very windy, but I wonder whether people have just forgotten?
No clapping here. Great.
Or here 😉
I forgot about this, saw zero sign of it happening round here.
Watch this instead….
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cSKjcltDkng
Thanks. Ivor C is great!
All quiet here, apart from the wind blowing.
They’ll probably be out at 8pm
flicked tv and both BBC and C4 showing it live. And as usual it was loads of NHS staff standing in the hospital carpark standing on exact 2 metre distance markers painted on the tarmac clapping themselves
Well, they have to do something to pass the time. Even when they used to have nearly full wards, most nurses spent half the time standing around chatting and ignoring distressed patients who kept bothering the nurses with requests for help!
They think they’re the best thing since sliced bread. Apparently they’re now demanding a payrise because they “saved Boris”!
Some people came out of their houses round here, but the clapping wasn’t very enthusiastic and most just gave up and started chatting instead. I went out once the clapping had ceased and the chatting began. Everyone was agreeing that this marked the end of lockdown and that we should move on with our lives. So at least that’s something. Two neighbours were talking about holidays and flying off somewhere to get out of the ridiculousness here in the U.K.
A couple of things that have cheered me up and I hope will do similar for you.
My 86 year old Mum lives circa 3 miles outside the Leicester barricades. I called her last night from the Eurotunnel, just before escaping to the Alps for a few weeks. I asked how her much anticipated hair appointment had gone yesterday morning. All good she reported, despite a little trip wire. The long questionnaire that the hairdresser made her complete beforehand asked whether she had ‘left the area in the last two weeks’. She had, as I took her on a grand day out to the county of her birth on Wednesday. Faced with the hairdresser’s question, she ticked the ‘no’ box as the thought of waiting another few weeks was not appealing. Legend. I arrived in the French Alps this am. What a relief to escape the UK madness. Over here, face muzzles are mandatory accessories in the supermarkets and alike. I was absolutely determined not to wear one if possible when I went to the supermarket on route. Thankfully, it became clear that only 30% of people were bothering. I called a friend who lives out here just now. She… Read more »
Have a great time!
Thank you. 🙂
Mandatory facemask wearing must be something regional. As far as I know the french government advised it but left it to shopowners to impose or not. Here in the Auvergne only few shops impose and we just avoid them.
The French can be rather ‘creative’ when it comes to interpreting the rules in my experience. I was out here as student in the early 90s when they tried to ban smoking for the first time – they got nowhere. French friends tell me its the revolutionary spirit in their DNA.
Great photo, it conveys the message
Fuck the Covid fraud
We are having a good time
Matt Hancok is a smarmy tosser
Fuck the Dictatorship
Perhaps there is hope for the young after all
And here we have another lapse by the Dear Leader’s ‘protect Scotland by diverging from RUK plans’:
https://www.scotsman.com/news/politics/no-covid-quarantine-checks-carried-out-scotland-2904406
This lot couldn’t organise their way out of a paper bag.
Meant to add- this puts yesterday’s ‘keep the f out of Scotland’ into perspective doesn’t it?
She Who Must Be Obeyed has yet to comment on the ugly border incident, let alone the quarantine oversight.
The contempt is palpable – is it melt down in the murrell household? She has little talent around her for support – must be pretty lonely in those heels now.
Minds eye swings to streets full of people in Callender and Largs.
Mandatory Mask Monday is it –
Mouthless Monday
Better and great!
Wouldn’t it be great if the MSM picked up on that as a headline!
Yes, but to the MSM it would be ‘Momentous Monday’
Ugh!
My daughter flew to Scotland today to stay with a friend for a week. Social bubble was to be her answer if asked but nothing. No checks and straight through. First time flying alone and she was understandably nervous but no need. Flying was also half the price of the train!
Good for her. Could she spare a moment to rid us by some means or other of the Grate Leader? Plenty of precedents in Scottish history.
Peter Hitchens linked to this in his Twitter feed.
https://t.co/943qcBAqRb?amp=1
“R4 Broadcasting House plainly alarmed when Punch Taverns exec Hugh Osmond
lets rip with savage and well-informed attack on government’s disastrous promotion of doom and gloom – begins at 19 minutes 40 seconds. BBC not supposed to transmit such things.”
I’d start around 19.10 to get a bit more context. Osmond is magnificent. You can almost hear the steam coming out of the presenter’s ears in places – the usual spluttering, does-not-compute reaction when someone goes off narrative big-time. They can hardly cope.
Well said, Hugh. Top drawer.
Could do with a few more CEOs and the like letting rip.
Anyone thinking of listening to this, should. Hugh Osmond is bang on the money and the geezer from the BBC is typical of how out of touch these people are.
Excellent stuff! 👍
This is absolutely classic thankyou
Damn you! Building up like that to a bbc details at the door link! Thoroughly missing out here – was it good?
Oh it’s brilliant – just a few minutes from 19.10 onwards, well worth a listen.
Hugh Osmond posted it on Dropbox, so you can listen to it there. It’s his whole interview.
Sorry – this is the correct link!!
https://www.dropbox.com/s/8ufe2kxrze1wkjs/Radio%204%20-%20Paddy%20O%27Connell%20with%20Hugh%20Osmond%20-%2005.07.2020.m4a?dl=0
Thank you Edna!
Brilliant man Osmond – so very well put by him, and sticking at it.
What a gulf of expectation BBC Paddy O whomever had. Really revealing. For the interviewer to say ‘but, but you are getting furlough bunged to you from gov so really ought not to be saying young people’s lives ruined or people dying in care homes… !!!
Paddy really thinks covid caused all of this – what a limpet for a brain he must have! Cuckcoo land at the BBC.
Paddy appears to have some conflicting thoughts their if he takes time to think for himself.
That has done some good across the radio audience.
Ah sorry, just realised you meant you’re non-BBC. It’s on YouTube too: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EMzh2OQia-s
My son’s boss and a new hero! Hadn’t heard that so thank you so much!
Is it the job of a fucking BBC presenter to continually peddle the government’s propaganda and find ways to wedge in support for the government at every fucking opportunity. Fair play to the pub guy for sticking to his guns.
Yes, the BBC presenter tried but I’ve noticed that when faced with someone who can speak up for themselves and isn’t intimidated, like this chap Osmond and Lord Sumption, most of them fold pathetically. I suspect they are not used to confident, prepared people who refuse to be silenced, who don’t agree with them.
Paddy has a background in finance presenting so it was interesting he scurried there for his wimpy effort to surpress.
Yes of course it is ….. don’t you know anything????? 🙂
Bloody brilliant,you could feel the indignation of the presenter,so used to talking over people and putting them down,didn’t manage this time did he ?.
If only more companies had a CEO like Mr Osmond.
While walking our glorious coastline today, and liberating it from Covviemuck, I hatched an interesting train of thought:
I’m sure any trained logician could demolish the above within a nanosecond, but I like it.
Works for me.
A wonderful piece of chop logic 🙂
However the reality is the two separate people who thought I was such a bio hazard that the sensible thing to do was to step out into the road, with their back to the traffic. One was wearing ear buds and was totally unaware of the Range Rover heading her way until I yelled at her. No thanks, just a sanctimonious ‘we have to keep our distance’.
There’s nothing wrong with the logic, even though it is, of course, nonsense, which is why it is delightful, much like Alice in Wonderland.
You should send it to Matt Shuttlecock and our Dear Leader Annie
“A and B are both assuming that they themselves have the bug.”
I make no assumptions.
No indeed. But in the Ideal World of the Covid totalitarian, we are all assumed to be guilty and told to think as such.
Remember the Communist pep talk in Down witn Skool?
‘Who invented the first railway engine?’
‘Stalin.’
‘Are you guilty of everything?’
‘Very guilty indeed.’
11-15 new cases out of 3500-4000 tests a day in Scotland. Jason Leitch acting or actual CMO of Scot Gov BBC news.
so no deaths and next to no new cases – they need a new measure of the ongoing covid disaster – the lockdown must continue to be justified
We do! Scotland is going for ZERO! That’s the mighty plan.. zero.
To be clear I don’t know about deaths – I see my post could look like news from the daily death count press conference. It was an interview about under 12s being allowed to not socially distance.
zero employment?
So what would they do if it ever did go down to zero? My guess is: introduce new, harsher lockdown measures, because of the great danger it might go up to one.
The moment one case appeared (as it surely would), they would shriek about a 1000% increase in cases and lock everyone down within a 50 mile radius…
I suspect when it got to zero they would declare zero is not healthy and we need to go up a bit…
https://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/2020/07/05/lockdown-really-worth-telegraph-writers-experts-give-verdict
This is the kind of article that really makes me despair (especially from a source like the Telegraph)
To be fair, there are some sceptical voices further into the article. But it gives the impression that the overwhelming consensus from doctors and scientists is that lockdown was unavoidable, that the Imperial College 500,000/250,000 death prediction is gospel truth (hence, lockdown saved hundreds of thousands of lives) and that opponents of lockdown are equivalent to “First World War generals and nineteenth-century colonialists – people who regarded others as little more than a herdable commodity”.
Fair enough for someone to be saying this in early March – 3 months on, though, this kind of attitude from the “general public” is bad enough, but I somehow expected better from scientists and healthcare professionals. Surely the scientific mindset is to question things and look at the numbers, rather than following the consensus? It’s like these people are inhabiting some kind of alternate reality where Covid-19 really is as deadly as it was believed to be 3 months ago.
See earlier in these comments for some robust treatment of that DT garbage.
The comments below the article itself are pretty robust, too.
Thanks, not sure why I didn’t see that! (I did try and search through the comments for Telegraph links, to see if anyone else was discussing this article, but couldn’t find it. Probably my browser hadn’t finished loading all the comments)
My usual answer to anyone claiming that the lockdown saved all those lives is to explain how it is that now we are re-opening everything, why are we not seeing the dreaded “second wave”, given how infectious they claim it to be, that they claim there is no prior immunity and that only maybe 10% of us have been exposed. Why are cases not increasing exponentially? Is the virus now afraid of the government’s formidable test and trace (but no tracking)? Is it being contained by the social distancing that people are very often not actually doing any more? It is being contained by the masks that people are often not wearing that don’t really work anyway?
Grab your sick bucket before you read the article!
Re the vaccine discussion and access to data such as ingredients, side effects, raw data of trials using true saline placebos, etc v our rights and liberties
“The medical ethical principle of informed consent, arrived at only after the horrors of Nazi human experimentation came into full light during the Nuremberg trials, requires that those who undergo exposure to health risks be fully informed of them, and not just the purported benefits.
Without access to information of this kind, without which informed consent is not possible, medical and/or the tech industry’s practice and products violate fundamental human rights.”
Do we need a vaccine at all?…..
https://off-guardian.org/2020/07/02/no-one-has-died-from-the-coronavirus-president-of-the-bulgarian-pathology-association/
well if a vaccine can cure; heart and cardiovascular disease, Type 2 and old age – then yes we do
Not following the NHS dietary guidleines would cure the first three. Old age is part of life.
Absolutely right Victoria. Informed consent is difficult to achieve when vaccine giving staff do not know the associated risk/benefit, ingredients and have no time in which to discuss in any case. There are lists of useful questions out there to help people understand and accurately be informed enabling a meaningful consent decision.
Alliance for Natural Health have a good video on this!
https://thecritic.co.uk/keeping-the-lid-on-the-bbc/
Well worth reading and pertinent to what we discuss here.
Agree, excellent. Oddly was heartened to see that while Robin Aitken doesn’t appear to be a Lockdown Sceptic, he clearly states that this side of the argument should be heard, but is being shut out.
Yes absolutely. Fair reporting for a welcome change.
“The smart way to keep people passive and obedient is to strictly limit the spectrum of acceptable opinion, but allow very lively debate within that spectrum, even encourage the more critical and dissident views. That gives people the sense there’s free thinking going on, while all the time the presuppositions of the system are being reinforced by the limits put on the range of debate”.
(Chomsky)
Bang on!
Interesting take on the Covid forecasting debacle from Cliff Mass, University of Washington, “Weather Forecasting is Fifty Years Ahead of Epidemiological Prediction: That Must Change”
Like, weather forecasting must be made less accurate? Like, every slight breeze becomes a raging hurricane laying waste whole continents?
Hmm. Maybe he’d like to rephrase that?
My daughter has just told me about her first visit to her favourite pub last night,seems to be promising.
No asking for name and address etc,sanitiser if you want it but not compulsory,silly arrows and signs but no-one taking any notice,no masks and the place was quite busy.
I hope that this is indicative of a lot of establishments and that the council busy-bodies don’t clamp down and enforce things.
It’s really is a very strange world to be in when hearing that a pub is near to normal is something that cheers me up quite a lot !.
Well, well, take with the left hand, give back with the right. The leader of the new NHS service announced today by Sir Simon Stevens for long term rehab of CV survivors is – Prof Sally Singh, from University Hospitals of Leicester NHS.
Well that’s convenient.
Leicester has specialist breathing equipment. They used to fly in people from other parts of the country. The appointment would probably make sense on that basis.
(How do I know? My brother in law’s sister used to work on a covid ward in the city. She went back to her old job about a month ago as had nothing to do.)
That’s interesting! About the breathing equipment
For those interested in whether increased positives from increased testing is being spun to demonstrate a spike/outbreak, in order to proclaim a lockdown, see:
“https://www.politifact.com/factchecks/2020/jun/24/donald-trump/donald-trump-wrong-greater-testing-driving-coronav/
Actually the conclusion that Trump is wrong seems to me to be itself wrong. It assumes an increase in positive tests is a bad thing. If they’re among a healthy younger age group, who will recover and have acquired valuable immunity, I’d see that as a good thing.
I think younger people in general (US/UK) have cottoned on to the fact they have been sold a pup. They are getting together in full knowledge they might get the virus/deliberately trying to get it, as part of their own civil dissent. Who can blame them?
That is how I see it too.
Magical times when having a good time is dissent. Just one of the lovely situations this sorry saga has bought about.
In my life I have broken law by sitting in a park alone at a time when it was illegal – at least, police with megaphone shouting “this is not a holiday” leads me to think it was illegal. I tbink the young people have expressed themselves in an equally positive way!
You can imagine what these things do to respect for authority.
In many senses I take comfort from the fact that the young people I saw on the news/in papers drinking in Soho and other town centres last night – without any obvious social distancing – were behaving ‘normally’. There is no ‘new paradigm’, there is no ‘new normal’, there is just human behaviour as always was, and as there always will be. Good. Sure, some had consumed a bit too much, but I am not aware there was any genuinely bad behaviour.
The thing with authority and respect, is that once it is called out by the behaviour of its endorsers (think Cummings, Ferguson, some of the Police forces in the early stages of the lockdown) it takes a generation of hard work to get it back. Not sure our current government has enough common sense, skill and experience to realise that, let alone resolve the mess they have created.
Two points well made. Soho was really refreshing, not least because I’ve come to expect younger people to be the worst zealots, and yet they they all were, looking for all the world like it was still the old normal.
And yes – dangerous times ahead for a while.
Normal normal!
Giant amounts of sense written there.
I love this:
https://www.theguardian.com/politics/2020/jul/05/sunak-considers-500-vouchers-for-all-uk-adults-to-spend-in-covid-hit-firms
First you tell everyone they’re going to die, and then you make them choose between death and free beer? Genius.
Classic example of a financial incentive to re educate people away from their current ‘loss aversion’ cognitive bias. ( which, put in the crudest possible terms, leads them to prefer not to lose granny over regaining their own livelihoods). Doubt it would fly at that £3Bn price, or that that much is even necessary. Couldn’t it do the trick for the cost of a modest meal for 2?
£30Bn price!
When did the 1970s labour government get reincarnated as the 2020 conservative government? This is madness.
Despite my saying the economy is ruining since the start of this fiasco, I would never suggest that government tells people where to spend, indeed I just want everyone to be able to operate their businesses without government preventing that.
It reminded me of the time that people were paid benefits as coupons which could only be spent at Tesco.
.
Shocking collection of guff in the DT. But look at the comments!
https://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/2020/07/05/lockdown-really-worth-telegraph-writers-experts-give-verdict/
To the right of the article was Matt’s latest cartoon:
https://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/0/matt-cartoons-july-2020/
Brilliant!
Brilliant!
Not every contribution is guff. But those that are guff, are guff on steroids.
Yes it includes the usual guff about the Imperial College modelling and more guff from Paul Nuki who has been writing guff in the DT all through the ‘crisis”.
What crisis?
https://off-guardian.org/2020/07/02/no-one-has-died-from-the-coronavirus-president-of-the-bulgarian-pathology-association/
Did you notice that the Imperial projected corpse count had been more or less halved from what it was originally? Dear, dear, lockdown just failed to save 200,000 extra lives.
The comments are class. I’m so glad so many people are finally coming across to our point of view. Now where DID Sky get 83% from???
I’ve a work medical booked for next week so made booking at the usual GP’s clinic I use as he does these privately.
I have to pay myself and claim back from the company so I asked the receptionist “do you want cash as normal or is it card only?”
Her reply was “we have a card machine but prefer cash”.
I guess they’ve not heard that cash is dirty and will kill you.
If the GPs are not worried about handling cash why the big hoohaa about it in the big shops and on the council’s pre-opening checklists?
And ask yourself why they prefer cash for these private certificates. A lot of businesses like cash for the small transactions they don’t put through the books. See “ash cash”.
cash is king
I’ve been reading:
The Health Protection (Coronavirus, Restrictions) (No. 2)(England) Regulations 2020
which have just come into force.
Is there a lawyer in the house? It seems to me that you can now have up to 30 people in your private house (para 5.1.b.i ) – all the provisions re risk assessment etc relate to public gatherings under 5.1.b.ii and iii.
I must be misreading the Act – it’s densely worded to say the least – but it seems to be a sea-change in the law that’s received little attention.
Simon Dolan has tweeted about this – you are correct. Let the house parties commence. Personally I wouldn’t want 30 people in my house even in ‘normal’ times but I know that young folk like to socialize with friends 😉
😊 and there was me (a new septuagenarian) thinking 28 would make up a nice 7 tables for bridge 😊
Amazed it isn’t 33…
This virus is clever, you know … not dangerous if 30 people meet, but suddenly if 31 people meet it is lethal..
Another question – why is 30 people (of potentially all ages) in your own house *not* a risk, but a class of 30 kids in a school too dangerous to be allowed???
My dear Carrie, you are trying to apply a bit of common sense.
Isn’t that illegal these days?
Maybe this is to facilitate that.
smileymiley posted a link a while ago, to a very good summary of the new law in that esteemed journal The Watford Observer. More on the case than the BBC.
https://www.watfordobserver.co.uk/news/18561496.30-people-limit-gatherings-new-coronavirus-lockdown-rules/
But you can’t have a wedding reception with 30 guests… totally illogical ‘rules’ as ever..
I’m guessing the new law is to prevent mass protests when the furlough scheme ends.. or against local lockdowns, mandatory vaccination, or indeed against any other new laws that people might object to…
Noticed earlier that some medical types are following this discussion.
Question: Why is Covid 19 not attenuated by relative humidity?
Is it not more probable that it is a contact transmitted virus like Norovirus?
After all we were originally told its not a flu ad nauseum.
It may be affected by humidity, evidence not strong as yet though:
https://www.medrxiv.org/content/10.1101/2020.04.14.20064923v1
AFAIK the evidence is that it is not attenuated by humidity.
All other flu viruses cannot spread in the high humidity seasons in the southern US, Brazil etc.
As these are still experiencing Covid 19, that means that either Covid 19 is the only respiratory aerosol spread virus on the planet not affected by humidity or that it is spread primarily by another method.
Doesn’t follow. It’s a lungs to lungs virus, unlike norovirus, which is faeces to mouth to gut. But both can live on cold hard surfaces, cardboard, other human beings, whether deposited from someone’s hand (norovirus) or by a sneeze, mucous (colds, covid). It’s highly contagious, sunlight and humidity kill/disperse it quicker, but it can still pass from person to person. Even in Brazil. Like a summer cold.
From what I’ve been reading the primary vector is contact and it is not especially contagious otherwise the Diamond Princess would have shown a lot more cases.
It didn’t despite them being hot housed in perfect conditions for over 2 weeks.
Evidence is that the primary method of transfer is fecal contamination, especially prevalent in care homes.
From what I’ve read “every single airborne (aerosol-transmitted) virus is responsive to the inverse of absolute humidity. That is, as the mean temperature rises aerosol viral infection efficiency is suppressed. This is why we have a flu season”
Covid is active depite high humidity in southern US states indicating it is not primarily an aerosol borne disease, normal flu and colds decline when flu season ends.
Whole article about it here:
https://market-ticker.org/cgi-mt/akcs-www?blog=Market-Ticker
Sir David King chairman of alternative SAGE is favoured by the BBC and Sky as he towes the ” official ” left line . He was wheeled out last month to warn against opening schools , because it would lead to a second spike .
https://schoolsweek.co.uk/coronavirus-june-1-too-early-for-schools-to-reopen-says-group-of-scientists/
He is very much a political scientist and his area of specialisation 30 years ago was chemistry not medicine . You might as well ask Alistair Campbell to comment. He is 80 years old and a great fan of Tony Blair .
His legacy is the response to Foot & Mouth in the early 2000s, ably assisted by the modelling of Neil Ferguson. His preferred legacy would have been the Nobel Prize for Chemistry, but he was a tad unlucky!
No-balls prize for witchcraft would be more in his line.
Is this ‘Rona panic as simple to divide as left/right?
In my experience age appears to be the biggest driver, the most zealous group of lockdown fanatics being your 50-70 age group. The older age group 70+ are sagely cracking on.
There is a marked correlation with political leaning . All the people that I know who are hiding in the wardrobe for the next 5 years only leaving if rubber gloved and masked up tend also to be those people who last year were wearing their yellow ” Bollocks to Brexit ” badge.
haha… Fair enough. Guess it depends where you live. I’m finding the exact opposite…
I’ve noticed the same with people I know.
I’m 67 and all my left-leaning contemporaries are wetting their knickers as are all the left-leaning writers we (used to) read. There don’t seem to be any exceptions.
We have an interest in public transport and we get screaming emails from the RMT union about how dangerous it is to relax 2m on trains and they were the ones desperate to get all passengers in muzzles. I usually reply and ask them why they are so desperate to destroy their own industry.
At the same time, I live in a High Peak village where many people are right-ish, monarchist and great supporters of UKIP and the vast majority of them are also brainwashed and terrified. There are some shining exceptions but I don’t know their political leaning.
We are now convinced that for many people this whole thing has been their finest hour – maximum drama, victimhood and virtue-signalling with a chance to indulge in a cult-like self-abnegation. We think that some people are actually loving this and this ‘Stockholm Syndrome’ (or whatever it is) will be the hardest to de-programme.
So for me, not a right-left split – just brainwashed v. not brainwashed, I’ve said before, I think we… Read more »
I think its more a questioning/unquestioning thing. most people can’t be arsed going beyond the headlines.
If a group of scientists all hold the same political ideology, it does suggest group think and that scientists with the wrong ideology aren’t welcome.
group think = bad science
That sounds right Major 👍🏻
tbh – I’m not that overly interested into delving into the demographics of it all. That would be falling into the same trap as BLM etc. To paraphrase the government’s own propoganda – ‘this panic affects all people from all age groups’
Hence the ‘97% of scientists agree climate change is man made’ needs to be set in context. It is really 97% of the scientists who got funding based on their support for the favoured political stance that climate change is man made agree. Of the original scientist pool of the early 2000s, how many are still involved in academic research? Many were cast adrift in earlier funding rounds!
At one time, the University of East Anglia was employing an artist full-time to draw pictures of climate change.
Fact. Cross my heart.
UEA were the ones doctoring the hockey stick graphs, weren’t they ? Someone should have gone to prison for fraud for that one.
Yes – and VERY bad government!
I’m finding the left-right divide really interesting. I’ve always considered myself midly left wing/liberal (though perhaps more accurately apolitical), and vaguely on the side of Remain, but it appears I became right wing overnight back in March…
I’ve also found throughout this whole debacle, and to a lesser extent previously, that my right wing friends are far less judgemental and willing to listen or engage in debate. The left wingers on the other hand are dismissive, if not outright hysterical, at any suggestion that lockdowns etc aren’t worth it, and will “cancel” people at a moment’s notice for saying the wrong thing. It’s almost like the two sides have swapped places!
You echo my previous leanings/experiences almost exactly A.C. It’s not really a left/right thing anymore. I’ve now seen the pain a government can rain down on its own people. Suppose I’m an anarchist now 🥺
My experience entirely. With you on all counts. Politically I always identified myself as ‘of the left’. Can’t do that anymore. I’m not ‘of the right’ either, nor centre so directionless I guess. ‘Give me liberty or give me death.’ The left don’t stand for liberty anymore.
Exactly, I don’t have a clue who I would vote for if there was an election tomorrow. I’m a nothing!
I remember a jokey article by Bill Bryson deriding the state motto of New Hampshire: ‘Live free or die.’
To me, this is no longer a joke. It’s a sensible exhortation.
Not sure who Bill Bryson is, but he sounds like a right twat.
maybe you should look him up before hurling insults
Took your advice. I couldn’t track down the derisive article, but did find this …
“All you really need to know about Bryson is that he was born and raised in Des Moines, Iowa, but now speaks with a British accent.”.
More or less my feelings too. Up to this year I would have considered myself more or less left-wing (in a non-woke way, if that’s still allowed), but after the liberal media’s response to the virus and lockdown (all the mainstream media, to be fair, but the BBC, Guardian and Independent seem to have been the worst) combined with the acceleration of identitarian culture warfare and “cancel culture” from June onwards, I’m really not sure where I stand anymore.
Yes, me too. Remain, liberal left leaning. Suddenly I seem to have changed sides! I do feel though that some left wing friends support lockdown because they believe they should rather than exercising independent thought.
Strange you should say that, I never though I would ever lean towards being on the right of the political spectrum.
like me you were centrist but the goal posts have moved and you’re no longer standing in the centre circle.. and even though your opinions have not changed, they suddenly put you in the oppositions penalty box
Yes, I feel like I’ve been standing still, but everything else has moved around me.
I think left/right is a bit out-dated but we all use it as a shortcut.
One alternative I like is the “somewheres” vs “anywheres” (David Goodheart). Somewheres have a sense of belonging to a place. They appreciate tradition, respect the history of their country. They value individual liberty as well as personal responsibility. They think that regional and national identities such as being “Cornish” or “English” for example have some meaning.
“Anywheres” don’t give a toss about all that and want more globalism. Anywheres like authority and big public sector institutions. They LOVE experts to tell us what to do, especially academics.
Somewheres don’t have any political representation.
times a few more thumbs up
Love this.
I actually hate this.
It posits that intellectuals can’t be attached to place/identity as strongly as the stuck-together working classes.
Obviously the sensible person accounts for grey areas but it’s used in too shorthanded a way, and henceforth becomes reductionist. I always hear this argument bandied about by neo-liberals for e.g. when they brand the ‘Somewheres’ as Little Englander gammon.
It also pisses me off as I regard myself as a person of Many Somewheres whereas this hypothesis puts me firmly in the Anywhere camp.
It should be and is way more complicated than that. (Tbh I think the author of the book always intended it to be, but it’s never used like that any more. Brexiteers = Somewheres Remainers=Anywheres for e.g. whereas I think we all know this is bollocks).
Basically I hate anything that tries to split people into two camps on purpose because it can be (and usually is) used for evil ;D
My solution for the political parties?
The Common Sense Party versus the everyone else AKA The Batshit Crazy Parties lol
No in all seriousness. I don’t know. Personally I’d like a *genuinely* old school (what I regard as ‘common sense’ anyway) left of centre party that didn’t subscribe to woke bullshit whilst wanting to regulate a capitalist economic structure sensibly. That doesn’t exist any more and hasn’t since BLiar trashed proceedings.
If such a party existed though I’m sure it would also appeal to many on the moderate right- as I’m beginning to realise we’re basically the same other than on ow to run the economy. But if we can all agree on capitalism as the base- which I’m pretty sure all moderates can at this juncture- then the rest shouldn’t be too hard to sort out surely?
Apart from an 80 seat majority in the House of Commons.
The division that seems to me the most useful at present is Authoritarian/Libertarian.
Lol me too. Although….. Actually I think my baptism into neo-nazism came a few years back when I refused to buy a man tampons, and I’ve only got worse since……
Lets face it, politics ruin everything. Including responses to viruses. Especially in the US in the middle of a freaking election year and the US president is the most hated man in history
really? the most hated man in history? I think he is an ar*shole but i think you will see that Hitler was not that popular nor was Stalin and they were probably hated by more people than Trump
Hang-cock must be on the longlist, at least.
Try and find in the MSM Trump’s recent sell-out rally in Arizona. You won’t.
Try and find in the MSM where the rally before that then Police actually shut the stadium gates and walked away leaving most of the ticket holders outside and unable to get in. The the MSM showed photos of a mostly empty stadium and said he was unpopular. You won’t see this reported either.
He is very, very popular across most of the demographics of the US population but the leftie controlled MSM won’t report it.
no, Trumps just mis-understood
Up early today Grant? P*ssed the bed did you?
Well, in my experience, it is the 50-70 age group that is most sceptical (Toby Young, Peter Hitchens, me and my wife included).
For every Toby Young, there are 10 Matt Hancock’s though. I’m inclined to go with what the Major said 👍🏻
I’m in your posited ‘lockdown fanatics’ age group, and I can assure you I and my contemporaries are sceptics!!! In my experience it is younger people who have swallowed all the lies…
Sorry Tom, I fall (along with a great many friends/neighbours) in your 50-70 group and they are largely sceptics. My approach/experience is a little simpler than yours, you’ve probably had a colleague at work who is so poorly prepared for life you wonder how they survive, that’s my take on it. If you know somebody who regularly gives you a chuckle because of strange things they do/don’t do you’ve found your lockdown fanatic. They have little self awareness, they can’t calculate risk reasonably and are scared of their own shadow. Age has little to do with it, except your point on the over 70’s, they’ve seen it all before, as one said to me “I remember the good old days, when we all had polio or rickets’. They’ve seen it all before and know you can’t run away from a virus.
Like I said… maybe it depends where you live. I don’t care either way
I think this is a comment worth posting. Not to irritate by naively bragging, but! Yet again it seems the trust your gut instinct about these boffins works, I was right again!
Don’t be awed by these guys professor status and the bookshelves behind them! Just from their human characteristics with what they are saying and asking always *why* is he saying this, and who is allowing him to.
I’m perhaps not talking to anyone of the commenters here.
i think King also follows the party (i.e. BBC) line re the Climate issue and similar spouts pseudo scientific comments for which he has no qualification
Seems to be the UKs answer to Fauci
http://tmp.americanthinker.com/blog/2020/03/what_did_dr_fauci_have_to_say_in_2009_about_the_deadly_h1n1_pandemic.html
Got bored for the roast to cook so put a complaint in about the latest batch of Government adverts. You only get 500 characters so cannot put much:
They are deliberately lying on the adverts so that they can mislead people into thinking that a “positive test” is an active and on-going case of covid-19 when it is not. A positive test only means antibodies have been detected, nothing more.
https://www.asa.org.uk/make-a-complaint/quick-report.html
The one our local radio plays ad nauseous about the “care worker” who tests positive and self-isolates is driving me bonkers – trying to be emotive and pressurise me into “doing there right thing”.
The right thing is to string up everyone from Bill Gates down and let the world go it’s merry way without centralised psychopaths in charge.
The virus has all but bloody gone (in its potency anyway) so what’s the real reason for these campaigns? Clue: rhetorical question.
LOL. Just more of the same strategy the govt has been using since March. Shaming, fear, heroes/villains.
I don’t suppose there was an advert of a child saying, ‘I forwent on my education for nothing’ or someone in a psychiatric unit with the caption, ‘I got sectioned because of this government’.
Ignore, Ignore, Ignore
The “I wear a mask for you” ones are the most rage-inducing of the lot. The people who don’t find it so must surely be a different species…
That advert should be renamed as “I wear a mask because I’m a virtue signalling twat” because its not about other people. If they want to carry on breathing their CO2 fine but to insinuate that they’re doing it for me is patronising and insulting.
I wish we could put out some alternative ones of our own..but where? They’d likely be taken down..
Ah, these simple, straightforward, honest, sensible people. How governments hate them.
Could you get a poster made for the window of your business with that slogan, and some identical small flyers, and do some kind of mail drop? or at least get flyers put up in say, the windows of local newsagents? Might get you some new business!
What would be clever would be to in some way copy the style of the ‘official’ posters, maybe in the font or something, so that they actually look like they are official government-produced ones 😉
That’s why i boycotted Classic FM – all those adverts were simply manipulative and misleading. Then BLM came along and put paid to me ever supporting them.
That bloody ‘I wear a mask for you’ one constantly pops up on websites and I think,’that’s nice,but I won’t be wearing one for you’.There is also the constant ‘thanks to our NHS and Keyworkers’ crap that scrolls across my car radio when Jazz FM is on.
Another one just popped up on DT website,’Enjoy summer safely,whatever you’ve missed enjoy it again safely,follow Covid 19 secure guidelines’,jesus wept !.
Who came up with that awful phrase, “Covid-secure”?
SAGE or that behavioural group, whatever it is called, I should think..
Do we stand a chance with figures like these:
The majority of the British public think pubs have reopened too soon and the country should brace for a second peak of coronavirus cases, a poll has revealed.
Analysis carried out by polling agency Opinium found that 52% of Brits think the hospitality sector has gone back into business too early.
It comes as pubs and restaurants reopened on Super Saturday, with images showing vast crowds flouting social distancing rules in London and across the UK.
Over half of those surveyed by Opinium, 55%, said they are braced to go back into full lockdown before a coronavirus vaccine becomes available.
And a massive 73% of people think there will be a second outbreak of COVID-19 this year.
The government’s disapproval rating is at 49%, with just 30% approving of its performance during the pandemic.
A total of 52% think the government under-reacted to the situation, while just 30% believe it has reacted proportionately.
52% think the government under-reacted!!!! Speechless
Do we believe these surveys, or are they just quoting them knowing people would check they are genuine? The aim is clearly to try and coerce people into ‘checking their thinking’ (hate that phrase), ie to make people question whether their own judgment is right, or whether they maybe ‘ought to’ think as those in the surveys do…
You can get polls to say anything. Save your sanity and ignore!
They are simply duckspeakers: it isn’t the brain speaking, it’s the larynx. And ‘provided the opinions quacked out are orthodox ones’, the pollsters are happy.
Control,control, control. Advertising is another form.
An early pioneer of advertising many years ago defined advertising as ‘creative persuasion’.
A local story part of a national scandal. Care home death and a concerned family asking why their family member was moved into a care home against their wishes.
https://www.edinburghnews.scotsman.com/health/disgusted-scottish-health-secretarys-letter-uses-wrong-name-midlothian-pensioner-needlessly-moved-hospital-nursing-home-where-he-picked-covid-19-and-died-2904051
I know it is the Mirror but the head of NHS is defending what they did:
https://www.mirror.co.uk/news/politics/nhs-chief-defends-sending-potential-22304229
Thanks Offlands. Mirror I grant you but the men in suits say 20 years of fruitless talking comes to catch up with them.
It is surely only a matter of time until people wake up to how much suffering and death has been caused by the policies of care around hospitals and carehomes.
The excuse that the men in suit didn’t know guv isn’t so great really, looks a bit lame really, a little bit insulting perhaps. Depending on if you have a soul or not.
I am not sure they ever will. I am dismayed at the number of people I know still 100% buying into everything, eagerly following at the cost of their own livelihoods willing to turn a blind eye to the extreme harm being caused by these measures and ultimately their willfull ignorance and compliance.
The only people I know who can see through this saw through it very quickly. The rest are looking like terminal cases to me now.
I agree with this. Most lockdown-zealots only seem to care for their own skins, even now when there is virtually no chance of getting sick, even if you’re older. These are the people who look blank or even get defensive of angry if you mention the scandal of the care home deaths or the destrucion of our economy and culture.
To me this is the most sickening aspect of the whole thing. I will never wonder again how decent German people were persuaded to go along with the Nazis’ policies.
Could be. If you’ve (one) gone along with the scam and lost everything I can see it being pretty hard to realise you’ve been had.
But I’m still positive there’s a human spirit about. And looking beyond our shores there are going to be plenty of examples where countries have essentially rejected the scam to a greater or lesser extent.
I echo Miriams comment about how Nazi Germany happened – always a puzzle from history for me but not anymore. Didn’t our leaders since ww2 do well not to employ such operations on the public until now.
It feels to me as if we’ve taken a step or two further down the road this time. However, I hope it’s not wishful thinking on my part that the narrative is now starting to collapse. I don’t think they will quite get away with this one. I expect the PTB will have learned their lessons and it’s definitely a wake-up call for those of us prepared to wake up (as opposed to being ‘woke’ 🙂 )
Don’t you get a horrible feeling that the zombies would stand and clap as ‘super-spreaders’ were loaded on to trains bound for extermination camps?
It isn’t a remote analogy. Nazi propaganda regularly referred to Jews as deadly bacilli infecting society.
before c19 it was incomprehensible