My routine has been cast into chaos the past several days by builders, so I have only this brief and sad story to offer you, via Peter Hammelrath at Achgut and Ferdinand Knauss at Cicero.
It is about Doris van Geul, a 74 year-old German pensioner who used to have a Facebook account. That is in itself dangerous in Germany, if – like van Geul – you are wont to comment on political matters.
On October 8th, 2023, van Geul encountered an image of our Green Economics Minister Robert Habeck on Facebook. In this image, Habeck was quoted saying that “Germany depends on immigration to meet its labour needs.” Van Geul commented as follows:
Blah, blah, blah. We need skilled workers, not asylum seekers who just want a good life here without respecting our values and culture. Send the ones who are here off to work. We don’t need loafers and freeloaders, and certainly not stabbers and rapists.
For these comments, the Düsseldorf Public Prosecutor charged van Geul with the crime of incitement, and last week, the District Court finally took up her case. The indictment accused her of “inciting hatred in a manner likely to disturb the public peace”. Van Geul responded that she only meant to express her anger at Habeck’s statements, particularly in light of high native German unemployment. She moreover said that she had “overshot the mark” with her words and expressed herself “a bit intensely.”. She even apologised for saying these simple words that, in any sane country, would require no apology.
Incredibly, the prosecutor objected that “it sounds as if [she] still doesn’t approve of [migration] policies”, and, in closing arguments, even opined that her “massive political critique” should increase her culpability. He further argued that her words were “anti-democratic” and could “cause division among the people”. Van Geul’s defence attorney pleaded that her political opinions are widely held in Germany and that “an ordinary citizen must be allowed to express herself in this way”.
The judge then found van Geul guilty of incitement and sentenced her to a fine of €7,950. He said her Facebook comment “addressed… people who have already come to Germany as asylum seekers”, and in this way spoke of “a part of the population… in such a way as to incite hatred”. The judge acknowledged that German society harbours many “fears and reservations” regarding asylum seekers, and also that van Geul’s statement closely echoes “these reservations and the media discourse surrounding them”. He nevertheless asserted that these reservations are “false” – in this way outright denying the objective fact that migrants to Germany do, in fact, stab, rape and draw unemployment benefits at rates far above that of native Germans. Van Geul has the wrong opinions, and she must be punished for them.
This is van Geul’s second speech offence. In 2022, she was convicted under our lèse majesté statute of “malicious gossip against a person in public life”, apparently for merely sharing an article that portrayed Green Party politicians in a negative light. (No details about this earlier case are publicly available; this is van Geul’s own account.) If our pensioner’s conviction is not overturned on appeal, she will likely be paying off her fines for the rest of her life. The poor woman lives on a monthly pension of €1,600, and the €50 monthly instalments will continue until she is 93.
This article originally appeared on Eugyppius’s Substack newsletter. You can subscribe here.
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Heh!
Here’s a t-shirt for you all.
Love it!!!
Sedition !
Great, are you selling?
It’s getting a bit chilly for just a tshirt, mind…
What about a jumper version?
Wear your thermals under it.
Get an extra large one and wear it over your jersey.
That is brilliant!
Great
I’m not sure about this. We need to point out that THEY ARE THEIR OWN WORST ENEMY without branding them and without confrontation. We don’t want to divide the population, we need them to help us confront the system.
I think the people on the bus I just got off thought that about me. Don’t think it will help me to wear that t-shirt. Probably just incite a mob.
I’ve worn worse than that without issues but then I’m 6’3″ and have learned to cultivate a, ‘Speak to me at your own peril’ vibe.
I wouldn’t advocate wearing anything that made anyone uncomfortable. Which is why I don’t wear a mask.
Chill. I wasn’t putting it there for any thing other than a laugh. It was 3am and I was sozzled!
Message from Peter Hitchens. Daily Mail
It’s time for MPs to do their jobs
ON Wednesday, Parliament must vote to renew or ditch the dictatorial Coronavirus Bill, which it enacted in a sort of mesmerised trance, without a vote, half a year ago.
It should scrap this nasty, despotic thing. And you can help. You need to email your MPs now, in large numbers. Do not try to reason with them.
Be polite, brief and acid. Say you have noticed that MPs have ceased to do the job for which they are paid more than £80,000 a year.
They are not representing you. They have let hundreds of thousands of jobs be destroyed without a squeak of protest.
I wrote to mine. It was not polite
Sort of polite to my MP but to DePeffle it wasn’t.
That’s the fascist who wants the army on the streets, shooting anyone who is out buying “non-essential” items. All businesses are essential though, if they weren’t then the market forces of supply and demand would have long ago ended them.
Surely, all his friends are in the 77th?
I wrote to mine. “No answer” was the reply.
Great T shirt mate!
Having read the above the line articles it’s a surprisingly upbeat set. Do we dare to dream?
I think we do.
So it’s off to bed for me, all the worse for two bottles of red. I’ll see you guys on the morrow. XXX
You know what? I do sense a strong change in the air. Things are changing. My husband and brother attended the demo yesterday in Trafalgar Square (I was unwell but was there’s in spirit) and they said it was a fabulous show of strength and unity, AND respect shown to the police. Any negative reporting was because of what looked like agent provocateurs kicking up trouble, nothing to do with the real crowd, and the crowd KNEW it. It was just another pathetic attempt to create a negative scene for MSM to do dreary, predictable reporting but the massive crowd know (and filmed) the truth!
I have been informed that the thugs that beat up the peaceful demonstrators yesterday were from a private security firm, but have not been able to verify whether or not this is accurate. To rub salt into the wound, the assaults were after the protesters had held a minute’s silence for the police officer who was shot in Croydon. The person who ordered the attack must be placed high on the list of those who will need to answer for their actions.
https://www.facebook.com/photo?fbid=758023388115213&set=a.131225477461677
Another sleepless night, but general anxiety dispelled by reading two-six’s comment on yesterday’s page: ‘fuckeration’.
‘got through all the important sceptical key points and started talking about the total fuckeration of society.’
Brilliant! Sums it all up.
My congratulations to two- six; may the force be with you.
lol thanks, glad I did something good yesterday.
https://www.spiked-online.com/2020/09/25/rishi-sunaks-job-destruction-scheme/
Another good one from Spiked
I would have liked to see a mention in today’s article of Mike Yeadon’s latest Twitter thread:
https://twitter.com/MichaelYeadon3/status/1309793649069260806
If you read nothing else today, make sure it’s this ^^^^
Of a dozen people I chatted with yesterday not one of them mentioned their delight at having downloaded the NHS app, must be the company I keep.
My sceptical son told me he was going to have to download it in order to be allowed to play football, but said he would just delete it afterwards. Good idea, but afterwards I thought – what if you can’t? Like I can’t get rid of the Pinterest app on my iPad….
Easier to read version https://threadreaderapp.com/thread/1309793649069260806.html
Thanks!!
The T&T thing is interesting. Went into multiple independent establishments yesterday. Some displaying the T&T QR code some not. One not even bothering to to take details manually. But even those with QR codes displayed aren’t checking whether you have scanned it or not. Vote with your wallet and use the independents and not the chains.
He gets my vote
Daily Mail: PETER HITCHENS: Boris’ great idea? Burn down the house TWICE to get rid of a wasps’ nest.
https://www.dailymail.co.uk/debate/article-8776033/PETER-HITCHENS-Boris-great-idea-Burn-house-TWICE-rid-wasps-nest.html
Liverpool Echo: Chaos in city centre as huge crowds spill out of bars and restaurants after 10pm curfew.
https://www.liverpoolecho.co.uk/news/liverpool-news/chaos-city-centre-huge-crowds-19004892
Well well. Time, victims, please.
They are clearly trying engineer a second wave imo.
They have been doing that since May
They ordered hospitals to be cleared a few days ago.
I thought that was plague…
“Victims”??
I mean victims of government terror-bullying.
Okay thanks. I wasn’t sure what you meant. It is a slur often thrown at Liverpudlians following Hillsborough you see. In 2012 it was proved the Government had colluded with MSM to shift the blame of the tragedy to Liverpool fans. Government collusion with the MSM to perpetrate a falsehood is something we are currently seeing too, ironically!
Err, hello ?
Seen your explanation below. Ta.
Inevitable. Sweden doesn’t have covid problems because they don’t push people around. people who make their own decisions will be rational and responsible, people under government diktats will let the dear leader do their thinking for them, and everybody will lose out.
Daily Mail: Ex-Supreme Court judge LORD SUMPTION denounces No10’s rule of muddle and authoritarianism.
https://www.dailymail.co.uk/debate/article-8776267/Ex-Supreme-Court-judge-LORD-SUMPTION-denounces-No10s-rule-muddle-authoritarianism.html
Why, oh why, is this man not running the country?
Great, as always.
I have just posted this and explained his query over the Act of Parliament that they used for all this allowing them to do it all without scrutiny or consent when they could have used anyone that gave them all the powers they needed BUT it would have meant debate and consent. He explains it all in a Triggernometry interview on YouTube (if they haven’t taken it down!).
He also explained it on the Telegraph’s Planet Normal podcast. You should still be able to get that – if not, let me know and I’ll upload it somewhere and share a link.
I wonder what percentage of the UK population would need to declare allegiance to Sumption’s policies instead of Johnson’s so as to give us herd immunity against oppressive lockdown policing. How many Brits would have to say “Sumption is my PM” to make Hancock utterly impotent.
Daily Mail: Coronavirus UK: We must learn to live with covid, says ROBERT DINGWALL.
https://www.dailymail.co.uk/debate/article-8776423/Coronavirus-UK-learn-live-covid-says-ROBERT-DINGWALL.html
Excellent, clear, sober article.Could somebody explain it to Boris and his Hell- gang in VERY.p easy words that they just might understand?
If this really was about a virus, surely they wouldn’t be pushing the surveillance agenda and locking down the immune sector of society, in the face of all evidence?
Can’t be so enthusiastic about Dingwall I’m afraid.
Dingwall says that before flu vaccines, about 20,000-50,000 people died from flu annually.
But, as far as I can ascertain, about 20,000 people die from flu annually, and 50,000 died 2017/18 even with the vaccine.
I posted in April
‘ I don’t know anyone who knows anyone who knows anyone who knows anyone who knows anyone who knows anyone who knows anyone who has caught this virus ‘
Still true seven seven months later despite a prediction of 800 deaths in our local community
A couple of care workers tell me of deaths of residents put down to Covid, one is certain that there has never been Covid in that home, the other says they might have had Covid but it’s not what they died of.
I did recently meet a chap whose elderly dad had Covid as the cause of death but he was in his 80s and had both dementia and diabetes. Despite that he is sceptical of lockdown and that was before the mission creep of recent weeks.
By and large it is true that people don’t know anyone who knows anybody who has had it.
You should let David Rose know about care homes and people who have evidence of this.
I thought about that but they are very junior staff and I wouldn’t want to put them at risk, I expect they should not have told me.
Truth must out! Proof is something else though.
We know several people who have been seriously ill with Covid including 2 relatively young people who you would have thought were unlikely to be affected. A friend of mine has had 3 of his friends die from Covid. It has been the news reports of these alarming and dramatic cases that are real and personal that helped fuel the unbalanced over reaction to this virus.
Sorry but Can’t believe one person Knows 3 people who died of the ‘vid.
I have a fellow retired ex-colleague who tells me he knows of 3 ex-workers at our firm who’ve died aged 62, 64 and 68, with Covid and no known co-morbidities. He has named them to me. Either he’s the unluckiest person or (I suspect) they did have some other hidden problems.
I know of 3 people who died ‘from’ covid, back in the early days of lockdown. They were all elderly relations of friends of friends – so a tenuous link. More importantly, they were ALL in hospital, seriously ill from something else.
I also know of 2 people who presume they had it back in the early days when there was no testing apart from in hospital. One was my daughter, who caught a train back from London at the end of half term and sat in front of some young people who were discussing their skiing trip. She was very ill, but then she finds that respiratory viruses tend to go straight to her chest. Got an emergency doctors appointment, and the doc thankfully gave her steroids which had a very beneficial effect. She was lucky to recover quickly, but still reckons she is a bit sub par still. The other person was a near neighbour, in her mid 60s but otherwise healthy and fit, who got it pretty bad but shook it off in the end without medical assistance.
This time round, I know of absolutely no one who has tested +ive.
WITH or FROM covid.
But how early on was that?
Deaths peaked in April.
At which point there was no mask mandate.
Virus is now a pale shadow of what it was back then.
Do you know anybody who knows anybody who knows someone who died of Covid (primary cause of death) after June?
Bad things happen somewhere, but statistically this kind of unfortunate event is pretty rare, we feel for you Steve, but we also feel for all the people who’ve lost liberties, jobs and family businesses to lockdown. We feel for the people living under fear of cruel fines and pointless quarantines. We feel for the people living in pain because the N”H”S cancelled their treatments or diagnosies to become a covid only service. All added together there are more people in these “casulaties of lockdown” category than as casualties of covid.
You mean that it wasn’t necessarily that widespread, though it has affected several people you know.
The tales of some of those severely affected have been sensationalized, or perhaps used deliberately to scare people, but they’re not a majority.
My sister-in-law (a nurse) has tested positive for the antibodies. But nobody else in her immediate family as had “it”, nor was she at any point aware of being ill.
Good trip yesterday ?
Wonderful, see below :o)) (or above if you read newest first)
I know someone, a complete bed wetter, who believes they have had the ‘rona’ and are still suffering from the after affects.
How did they come to this conclusions; they had flu like symptoms and have felt a bit achy ever since (3 months on), also the friendly doctor at the other end of a phone told them that they more than likely had the dreaded lurgy. No test (not that that means a lot), no unusual symptoms, no face to face with the doctor.
It seems to be very much like the current trend in self identification with one group or another, gender, species, race etc. Now they’ve just added an illness to the list!
It’s all attitude. My son had a whopping cold at the beginning of lockdown and the congestion knocked out his sense of smell. He never goes anywhere and I didn’t get it so we assumed it’s not the Rona. And we’ve never wanted to get tested. But if he’d wanted to engage with the Rona drama he could have labelled himself a Rona “victim”. Funnily, it could have been another coronavirus causing the problem.
I had a cold a week ago. My wife, against my strong wishes, asked me to get tested. I did so, while reminding her that if it was a false positive, then our weekend away holiday would be voided and that it would entirely be her fault. I went to the walk-through centre, like a child, creeping snail-like to school.
Test came back negative. I am wondering (I know it’s a bit conspiracy-type-thing but I wonder if there was a wish to lock down “certain” areas of the UK with positive tests but we are in an area where there are only the false positives to contend with.
The other (drive-through) testing centre has just had the staff completely changed over. Neither testing centre has any online availability but when I drive past (which I do on a regular basis) there is never any queue and you can just go and book in on the spot (but only if you say that you are symptomatic – if you say you aren’t, they turn you away).
As “The Slog” would say, “It’s all bollocks, and that’s official”.
If you look at the areas under local mockdown, or its threat, your hypothesis holds water.
There was an unknown virus circulating around the same time earlier this year.
There was certainly a virus that gave everyone a long-lasting cough, but i don’t think it was CV19
People LOVE to identify themselves as:
IMMUNO-SUPRESSED
just about everybody who is a believer thinks they are:
IMMUNO-SUPRESSED
ANOTHER KEY PILLAR OF THE PSY-OP
It says:
You have no immune system. The only thing you can do is get a vaccine
Haha! I am the opposite. I think my immune system is the dog’s nuts. When my siblings got rubella and mumps, I got nothing. I get 1 cold a year. I have never had flu. I believe most infectious disease is self limiting, as long as you look after yourself.
All women tend to be tough as anything. Immune system built like a tank. My wife is the same; viruses run away screaming.
The yearly cold should be embraced as you clear a load of gunk out with that mucus.
You might have had rubella without knowing, I got tested before trying to get pregnant and was astonished to be told I’d had it already! But then I’ve never once had flu, either.
If they have no immune system, a vaccine won’t help. Could be fatal.
I think I had it, very early in march. At the time I would have wanted a test, both to know if i had it (and feel smug I’d then be immune and never get it again) and also to confirm my, very uncertain at the time, hypothesis that the virus had spread much wider than the media were saying and hence we were already nearing herd immunity. Thought back then that more test results would get people to see that the virus was widespread and mostly mild. Now though the panic has taken on a life of its own, perhaps substituting for all the living not being done by UK people as a result of illegal lockdowns and brainwashing BBC fearcasts. Now though we know, tests only cause panic, soon they’ll be finding ways to generate panic from antibody test results not just antigen.
That covers just about everyone in the world, so you might wanna knock a couple of ‘anyones’ off.
Perfect health is a well established symptom of Covid.
Watching too much BBC is a symptom
Or maybe watching BBC gave you “covid”.
Same here and here in Ireland where the ‘six degrees of separation’ is only three degrees of separation, you’d have thought I’d have heard of someone who had it.
I know OF one.
Fat. In her late 50s. Works in admin for NHS. Had an armful of jabs a couple of months before becoming ill. Experienced a few days very ill with a flu-like illness but was not hospitalised.
I met one on Friday. Young sales girl in a hippie shop. We got talking and I explained various things about the numbers, and got her half convinced. But then she said ‘Oh, but my friend told me a 5 year old child has died’. So, apparently we must kill 200,000 cancer sufferers (and other such illnesses) to avoid the risk of another 5 year old child dying with goodness knows what co-morbidities. Poor kid may just have fallen down the stairs and tested positive.
In addition instead of a mask (probably useless) she was wearing a face shield, which in context is totally and utterly useless unless she gets a lot of customers spitting at her.
I despair. We are producing people with intelligence, but no common sense or ability to think logically. .
I suspect the friend was mistaken. If a 5-year-old had died of CV19 it would be all over the news.
As its not, I don’t believe it.
I know of one person who the hospital said died of CV19, but he’d also had severe bronchitis, which was why he was there in the first place.
Another was supposed to have died with CV19, but was 90+ with congestive heart failure, and post surgery.
I don’t know of anyone who had it outside hospital.
I’m pretty sure I had the unknown virus that was doing the rounds early this year, the one with the long-lasting cough. It wasn’t flu, and my symptoms didn’t fit CV19. I wasn’t particularly ill, but the cough still bothers me even now.
One friend died of it (tested positive), Londoner, early 70s, heavy smoker in youth, liked the good life. Young relative’s office all 30’s or under, had nasty coughing fluey bug, muscle weakness, between Xmas and end March. Kings Cross offices, central London. Friend, local teacher in London commuter land, had not 1 but 3 horrible bouts of cough, Jan Feb, treated only with antibiotics, recovered.
My impression is quite a few people here live in the country, might not have seen the amount of infection running rife in London from Jan to March.
The only person I know of is a nurse friend of my daughter in another town, who I believe has what they are calling “long” Covid. No-one else. Amazing isn’t it?
I know a few people who’ve had symptoms and confirmed by test. They were mildly ill (bad cold / light flu).
Apart from the past 6 months* I’ve been reading Charles Moore in the Telegraph for upwards of forty years. I can’t recall ever disagreeing with a word he’s written.
*the Telegraph is currently on unpaid furlough for being Covid Crazeee since March, this is under periodic review.
It’s starting to recover. There are several sceptical articles most days, thankfully. Just need to ignore the others.
Or get into the comments section!
Scoffing at the government’s incompetence setting up the track and trace system is like Jews scoffing at Nazi’s for taking too long to set up concentration camps.
The system is being built and it is designed to enslave us. The mishaps will eventually be resolved and we will eventually find ourselves thoroughly tracked and traced.
When this panic is over, all the shit surrounding it will be over too.
You mean like all the security measures that were put in place after the 9/11 panic? Biometric passports, passenger lists shared with security services, Homeland Security etc..
This is going to be just like that. The measures they are putting now are just the beginning, because the fear of being infected by others has rapidly become ingrained. There is no going back now.
Difference: Islamist extremism and terror attacks are still ongoing. ‘Rona pandemic is over. History. Most people understand this difference. You might be right, but what the scenario you outline is no given. People only accept stuff when they can see the reason for it. They’re beginning to see through the Continuity ‘Rona scam.
Are they actually though?
I should say that terrorism is largely over too, as the more dangerous loonies kill themselevs off in atacks only the incompetent ones are left. They can do little more than thuggish street murders with machetes, although the media hypes them up thesedays to make them sound as big as the 11th Sept atrocity was back then.
While the number of Sceptics is increasing other people seem to think that because the government is increasing lockdown measures the Covid ‘must be getting, stands to reason’
‘Covid must be getting worse. .’
Don’t you believe it
Project endless misery must continue
I think you are right. The noose is gradually being tightened and the herd are taking very little notice at all.
It was being gradually tightened before corona insanity took hold, now we are choking to death but still the herd does not notice.
They keep walking round the pole the rope round their necks is attatched to and it gets shorter and shorter…
I watched a Ben Fogle thing once, he was in Mongolia, that’s how the Mongolians kill their horses. The horse strangles it’s self, falls over then they stab it through the heart with a big sword.
It was one of the most traumatic things I have seen on TV. It’s was horrible to watch.
What the government are doing to us is a bit like that.
Reminded, as so often, of Camus’ La Peste. When something bad starts (quoting and translating from memory),
‘people always say, “It won’t last, it’s just too stupid.” And stupid it may be, but that doesn’t prevent it from lasting. Stupidity is always persistent [la bêtise insiste toujours].’
And how.
But resistance, courage, hope and good sense can be very persistent as well.
Hearts up, fellow human beings.
If you tell me this all ends like in Camus’ story, I’ll sign for that right now.
I was fortunate enough to read this book just before this nonsense and it has genuinely helped me through. Camus was incredibly insightful.
I read it too last September- incredibly relevant to now especially accepting it is an allegory for the Nazi occupation of France
‘la bêtise insiste toujours’. Insightful writer.
Also this, perhaps where Orwell got some inspiration from:
‘But again and again there comes a time in history when the man who dares to say that two and two make four is punished with death. The schoolteacher is well aware of this. And the question is not one of knowing what punishment or reward attends the making of this calculation. The question is one of knowing whether two and two do make four.’
I’m reading it at the moment Annie,along with his biography,written by Olivier Todd.
if only we had a Camus for the here and now.
Paul Weston. The One Covid Lie That Will Bring Down The Government.
https://youtu.be/06yja21V7xg
10 minutes Shareable video that explicitily sets down the PCR lie and explains the seriousness of the fraud. Criminal act/court room/investigation. All explicitly mentioned.
The video also gives JHB the simple interview recipe -two questions- that she can use to end matt hancock. An excellent video.
Our governmemt hangs by a thread. Some one needs to stand up and snip it.
Given the way it’s behaved (UK AND devolved governments), is it really “our” government at all? A thought for the philosophers perhaps.
Oh, I was chatting to a piper on Westminster Bridge yesterday. We discussed the craziness of not being allowed to play bagpipes in Scotland, thanks to a very tartan government! Weird world.
Tartanitarian government.
Very nice – Using it thanks!
Excellent clarification.
I am not interested in what might or might not be happening regarding common cold coronaviruses in the Amazonian rainforest because I can have no idea as to how reliable those data are.
But I am interested in overall mortality figures compiled by ONS for England
Aug 2020 ONS monthly mortality analysis (next release 23 Oct):
‘In August 2020, there were 34,750 deaths registered in England, 2,060 deaths fewer than the five-year average (2015 to 2019) for August’
‘The coronavirus (COVID-19) did not feature in the top ten leading causes of death in August 2020, in England….’
‘In England, COVID-19 was the 24th most common cause of death’
‘in both England and Wales, the COVID-19 mortality rate continued to decline for the fourth consecutive month.’
‘….registered by 5 September, 365,889 deaths occurred in England (33,003 more than the five-year average for January to August)’
https://www.ons.gov.uk/peoplepopulationandcommunity/birthsdeathsandmarriages/deaths/bulletins/monthlymortalityanalysisenglandandwales/august2020
Those are the only useful, reliable, numbers, less than 10% above the five year average; broadly comparable, adjusted for population increase, with mortality 1999/2000.
These are not figures commensurate in any way with the (over)reaction of the government.
They are in no way indicative of a ‘pandemic’.
They do not justify draconian restrictions on personal liberty.
The government, and those who support these measures, look increasingly ridiculous, month by month. That, ultimately, will remove the masks and, eventually, the government
It is a huge criminal fraud. These people politicians, scientists, clinicians, statisticians are all complicit.
Our police force turns a blind eye while eagerly enforcing laws that would have been unimaginable last year. They aid and abet thugs as they destroy public property and violently shut down public protest. Perhaps they should be on your list too.
We have seen political policing which is the road to lost consent – they only police with our consent. Or, at least that is the lay persons view how it is reasonably expected to work. I don’t know that they are complicit in the economic collapse on the back of a scientific fraud. The police do have foundational questions to answer about their position in our society imo – the ought to be free from political bias.
They say the are policing and enforcing public health measures – this is the intended new system of curtailing our freedoms as per ‘Normal’. Everything for the public good, nothing allowed that is individual right upto and including coughing. The fact is they are policing and enforcing based on a giant statistical lie and clinical quackery.
They have not investigated deaths as they might well have. They have not investigated, or sought, risk assessments of the diktats they are clubbing people to enforce, they might well have. Derelictions of moral duty, I’ve no expetise to say more.
They are a sympton not the cause to use an analogy. Happy to be corrected, I don’t feel I have fully thought through my comment.
It does seem increasingly apparent that a huge criminal fraud is taking place. What organisation is responsible for investigating and gathering the evidence required to prosecute a huge criminal fraud?
would common law courts be an option here?
Ridiculous to us but the majority have been very brainwashed.
Will it?
This crisis is showing precisely how awesome the power of the state is. There is almost not a single reliable fact that supports any of the measures the government is taking. And yet, popular opinion is in favour of all of them.
For every sceptic view in the media, there is a barrage of government supported views. Those who organise protests are arrested. Social media is censored. The situation for sceptics is absolutely hopeless.
Communism was a completely fraudulent system and it lasted for over 70 years in Russia, with a very strong west making the contrary case all the time.
The notion that governments can control viruses by controlling the population is a fraud that has taken hold and is going to be with us for a long time, I’m afraid.
Are your shrubs “Covid secure”? More OTT #Coronaphobia #Edinburgh Don’t venture out without your secateurs and tape measure
https://mobile.twitter.com/JoannaBlythman/status/1309913351988928512
Edinburgh Council putting up micro manzgement insanity signs so insane I cannot understand what, why or where. Never the less bush trimming accuracy needs to be to within 5cm (2ins) or else..? Or else you get a letter? A fine? A talking at?
It is not possible to express how Edinburgh Council are loathed across the city. Despised isn’t nearly strong enough.
Sinister that aomey logo appears on yhe hoarding. Also the odd purple colour is the same colour as the london eye illuminates at present – sky news chose to show the london eye immediately after boris made his latest lockdown address before cutting back to the studio. Why?
Interesting the incite other to tyranny. Like 33 etc. it keeps cropping up.
well spotted
Message from Peter Hitchens. Daily Mail
It’s time for MPs to do their jobs
ON Wednesday, Parliament must vote to renew or ditch the dictatorial Coronavirus Bill, which it enacted in a sort of mesmerised trance, without a vote, half a year ago.
It should scrap this nasty, despotic thing. And you can help. You need to email your MPs now, in large numbers. Do not try to reason with them.
Be polite, brief and acid. Say you have noticed that MPs have ceased to do the job for which they are paid more than £80,000 a year.
They are not representing you. They have let hundreds of thousands of jobs be destroyed without a squeak of protest.
She will be replaced by an MP from the new Reclaim party. Whohooo!!!
Can’t vote for them unless they’ll be explicitly anti-lockdown. Saving our heritage can be tomorrow’s problem, saving our liberties must be attended to first.
….. or if no party is overtly anti-lockdown you can vote for nobody/spoil your vote (indirectly voting for either Labour of Conservative) or vote for Labour or vote for Conservative. Go for it!!
It’s only useful to spoil your vote or abstain in a one party state. Otherwise, you have to pick a side or put up with the consequences.
Yes, no mention of lockdown, so really an irrelevancy. It’s unfortunate.
More anti-woke than anti-mockdown I thought.
Well said!
Ello ello ello what’s going on ere then – you look 46 if not a day! No, mister I’m 45 in January honest mister.
Unpoliceable. Spi-b mocking us. Drifted out for them to study tge response.
Trafalgar Square Protest, 26th September 2020
This is the third protest I attended at Trafalgar Square. Having a problem with the car, I travelled down by train, arriving pretty early, about 9am. The Square had changed a little, with parts of it cordoned off and “CCTV in Operation” signs everywhere, presumably to deter people from attending the demo. Police vans already cruising.
As usual, took a good long walk around the surrounding streets (old habits, I’m afraid), to discover eight police vans parked up, complete with officers, on Horse Guards Road. Police were stood around; unfortunately one of them had been among the riot police I faced last week, and you can always see recognition flare in other person’s eyes. So he knew.
Minutes later, I saw my first Territorial Support Group van, so already had the feeling how the protest in the Square would end.
Trafalgar Square began to fill from about 10am. The usual groups, the usual placards. From a personal point of view, it was good to see more placards simply attacking the lockdown or government policy, without any “added bits”. By noon, the Square was full, so probably as many people attending as on the 29th August, and more than last week.
I had feared last week’s heavy-handedness might put people off, but clearly not.
I rarely listen to the speakers at rallies because I attend to show support for the anti-lockdown faction, and don’t need further conversion. And I like to know what’s going on around me, so tend to keep going for walks.
Police strength built up at Charing Cross nick, with the vans parked along William IV Street. These weren’t the blue TSG vans, but normal white police vans, so the police were being sneaky. One bobby was already booted and spurred, complete with riot helmet, so the cat was out of the bag. This was about 2-30pm. Maybe I ought to have taken my walk a little earlier, but who knows?
I passed a warning on to the security around the stage, but this was probably too late as, minutes later, the liaison officers (in blue surcoats) disappeared and the riot police joined us in force.
There was no upswell in the crowd before. No taunting of police. Nothing at all. Just in they came. This group was kettled by us, and we were in turn kettled by the other groups of police. If any order came to disperse BEFORE, I certainly never heard it.
This is when things kicked off a little. There were (plastic) bottles thrown, though this was quickly stopped (by us, not the police) and batons were certainly drawn. One disabled woman was carried away from harm. This stand off didn’t drag on like last week, but that’s because we were off on the march to Hyde Park Corner.
Now this was truly gratifying. I was somewhere in the middle and it was quickly apparent that this was big. All I could see was people ahead and behind, and traffic brought to a complete standstill. I’ve not seen any video of the march yet, but I am looking forward to seeing it. Many people believe these things do no good, but perhaps they do no harm either. It was certainly a show of strength.
There was more trouble at Hyde Park Corner, but the crowd dispersed peacefully enough afterwards, leaving me to a mad dash through London to catch the absurdly-early last train home.
Next time, I’ll ensure the car is in full running order (a tyre is illegal and can’t get replacements until Tuesday).
Another mostly enjoyable day!
Thanks for the report Nick and was gladdened to see the pictures of those in the protest.
Glad to hear it!
Please explain?
That his lawyers in Germany and UK are talking to each other.
At least the tide has turned. Let’s hope it’s not too late.
It’s not over till it\s over. We are in the fight of our lives. The corrupted UK government has declared war on its own people and it wants most of us dead. There is absolutely nothing to lose by solid resistance.
Thanks nick for another great report! Are there any more protests planned do you know?
I’ve not heard anything Sue (hope you catch the answer, I’m a bit late, responding). The site to check is the StandupX site:
https://www.standupx.info
And click on events :o))
I’m sure someone on fb mentioned another protest next month. I’ve posted a request for more info.
Markus Haintz, the German lawyer, actually published the phone number of the police station and urged people to phone it.
Link?
13.00 BBC R2 News Saturday
“Thousands of demonstrators are gathering in Trafalgar Square to protest about lockdown measures.
They have been warned to observe social distancing measures by Police”.
That was it, in full.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=J-HmV7S7UPA&ab_channel=UNIVERSIDADDEASTROLOGIACIENTIFICAYHERMETICA
This is how it happened
Embarrassing that this man is lauded back home in Germany for his work, yet here we throw him into a police van.
Ironically arrested a stones throw from “speakers corner”
I hope other countries start to realise just what is going on here.
The police forced themselves through the crowd of peacfull protesters, shoving people to the ground and hitting them with batons, to get to the stage and end the event. This happened just as the Doctor was beginning to speak.
The police’s action was dangerous (both to them and the crowd) and provocative.
The Doctor was arrested at Hyde park later, apparantly he was talking to a small crowd of about 50.
You’re welcome!
Thanks for going on behalf of the many who couldn’t. Also for your comprehensive report.
Here is the event in full.
https://youtu.be/HWGg_V_b87U
Worth listening to the speeches. You can see the riot police move in completely unprovoked at 2.32. This is after the organisers were going out of their way to fit in with police requirements earlier. MSM reported this as between a few hundred (Evening Standard) and 15,000 (Mail). Given that the capacity of the square is about 35000 and the demo was spilling out onto the side streets it is likely to have been 45-50000 present. Draw your own conclusions.
If we genuinely are on the brink of some catastrophe in hospitalisations, why is the Nightingale in Glasgow being decommissioned?
Exactly! Just what I was thinking. This is the most positive thing I can find this depressing morning,
I think they have realised that the people are so gullible that such theatre is just not needed.
You lucky ducks, I love this man!
Please don’t make fun of the “NHS” Track and Trace App.
They will throw our money at it until it works, then it will go on to become a “health passport”, which will be used to lock non-compliant people out of work, leisure and travel.
Decline to be tested (at your expense!): No football. Then later on, miss your Coronavirus booster jab: No travel.
Already, some pubs are turning away people who do not have this app. Ultimately it will become a full Chinese-style social credit system and destroy our freedom – if we let it.
So by all means criticise it, but remember that it is no laughing matter.
Dont download end of.
pubs will stop turning people away when they are empty and going bust
Agree. Pubs turning punters away for not having the app is suicide. Do they expect all the old boys, regulars aged 70+ to have apps downloaded, many won’t even have a mobile. Senior citizens who are regulars, maybe not food orderers, but nevertheless regulars, across the whole UK must contribute a fair chunk to takings each year.
Looks like they want to go bust and I cant say I have much sympathy. That’s not necessarily such a bad thing as it provides an opportunity for new business that actually values its customers.
Perhaps once we have stopped the government(have to have hope) the new business that replaces these businesses might be more likely to stand up for themselves and their customers against future government overreach.
They won’t go bust. They’ll be propped up in exchange for implementing government measures. So will the airline industry.
The government will use our tax money to bribe (and threaten) companies to implement their health surveillance system.
I fear you’re right.
Yep – wetherspoons wouldn’t let my daughter in yesterday unless she sat on a separate table from her friend – wtf has it got to do with them?
Correct. Nothing to do with them. Wetherspoons is a corporation and they are driven by real or perceived liability and conformance with gov’t laws/guidances and all that.
Make as much fun of it as you want to, if you don’t you legitimise it!
Mark makes a good point about the seriousness of the app – what it is the thin end of the wedge for. Hapless bumbling it is not, it is an atempt to drive techoncracy forward. As sinister as dna altering vaccines in it’s own fashion. A life limited by the technology in you pocket.
Wit and humour can be a great asset – razor sharp wit. The danger is by calling it bumbling etc. is to miss the point of how dangeous it is.
Everyone know all this anyway – I just enjoy typing to myself, ignore me!
You legitimise it the moment you download it and every time you use it. No amount of making fun of it after the fact will change that.
The COVIDSafe app here in Australia was deemed a failure back in May. Bit late for the UK to bother.
Daily Mail: Boris Johnson abandoned plans for a second national lockdown over fears Rishi Sunak could QUIT.
https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-8776943/Boris-Johnson-abandoned-plans-second-national-lockdown-fears-Rishi-Sunak-QUIT.html
Sunak is okay with where we are at now? Oh dear.
Small victories but thank goodness for Rishi Sunak.
Unless you’re a small business owner or contractor. He should have abolished IR35 for both public and private institutions. But no and I suspect there’s some influence from his father in law about that.
MPs voted to bring it in next April for the private sector after delaying it. The inpact on businesses last Feb and March was fun. The same fun is happening now too.
Sunak is trying to come across as someone who supports business but he feels much more like someone who wants employees only.
Sad state of affairs
Its no surprise that Boris cannot grasp economics.Just look at his own trail of overspending, loose living and irresponsibility. He has no shame.
Great and optimistic round up today Toby and thanks a lot for your efforts.
Its clear that the tide is slowly turning but its still not enough. I should know from personal experience having to put up with work colleagues the majority who are still asleep with not even the threat of redundancy nudging them to ask “why” we are at the risk of losing our jobs and how lockdown and “Covid safety” measures are destroying our workplace and sector.
Perhaps the hope lies with the parents of the young inmates of the Gulag Archipelago which is our universities scattered across the whole of this country with the most notorious being the prison camps that pass off as Edinburgh, Glasgow and St Andrews Universities, etc. Of course I would not discount the fact that many of these these parents would have been the most rabid lockdownistas and mask zealots having enjoyed lockdown due to their large homes, living in beautiful neighbourhoods, being on full pay or working in sectors that have not taken the hit. They would have also been most likely been virtue signalling on their antisocial media accounts and shaming those who have not been muzzled.
Now that their darlings are being subjected to treatment that is pretty much what the have nots have had to put up with over the last few months, they are now up in arms and hopefully waking up to how much government’s insane policies are damaging not only the economy but the well being of the nation.
I for one would welcome their intervention and conversion to the sceptic cause. But we must never let them forget that they were active collaborators of this farce in the first place.
True, but to be honest I’m pretty much prepared to forgive and forget anyone who wakes up.
Indeed. Especially if we want to actively convert them to our cause.
A friend of mine was complaining how people who were bedwetters in April are now saying things he was telling them back then to no avail. I’ve persuaded him that it matters more that they’ve signed up than that they were there in the beginning.
I’m reminding myself of that given I’m seeing a colleague or two slowly waking up. Better late than never.
Victory is more imporant than revenge.
It has to get worse before it gets better , things are pointing to a cold winter as well , come spring things will be a lot different.
Indeed both literally and figuratively. Even the comparatively well off I suspect won’t be able to escape from the fall out of all this.
Agree.The country is sleepwalking into something worse than the Great Depression.
It will only take something to set off the downward spiral.The death of the Aviation,travel,Retail and hospitality industries will happen unless these restrictions are removed immediately.This will lead into systematic collapse of bank and mortgage lenders as commercial and retail property goes first,followed by domestic property.
Regardless of how secure your job is it is impossible to escape the effects of lockdowns. My job should be secure as I work as a civilian with the pollice. I hate the fact that basic things such as eating out and having friends and relatives in my house had been become illegal. I travel every year and I have missed on my holiday this year. I love travelling and I am worried I will never be able to travel abroad again if countries are on quarantine lists and if airlines go bust. I will be devastated if I can’t travel again. When I go shopping I see screens, one way systems, sanitisers etc. On several occasions people have told me not to come too close. I have not felt ill since or had any covid symptoms since lockdown but I am treated like a disease carrier. I hate having to give track and trace details when going to cafes. My family have become paranoid due to the constant fear porn pumped out by the media. I live with elderly parents and they feel simple things such as going on a bus is suicide mission. I recently had my birthday but my friends and relatives wouldn’t go to a restaurants so we had to have a takeaway. I currently can’t go to concerts or theatres. As a police worker I am disgusted by the behaviour of police in Trafalgar Square and feel the police is using selective policing according to whether the government agrees with protestors. My gym is currently being used as hospital until March next year despite being empty. There is a temporary gym without shower and changing facilities which I feel is wrong. Is it acceptable to accept people to leave gyms sweaty and in damp clothes. Is this not a health risk? I used to meet my friend after work for a coffee but this can’t happen as he is scared to travel by bus. It is depressing seeing a high street with closed businesses. I detest having to wear a mask. I have sympathy with those who lost their jobs or businesses. I see this country turning into a police state.
Good points. It’s almost like some of us have slipped through to an alternate universe. For most (the accepting), this must be their world. For us sceptics, we’re all from somewhere else. Maybe this world versions of us are now in our real world, having protests about the lack of masks and too much democracy…
When I look around me, I feel the country has become a weird cult with social distancing, hand sanitizers, one way systems, screens, unavailable seats on public transport, masks etc.
Well said. I live and work in London, its depressing to see what has happened here. Sure there are problems with it and agree that almost everything is too heavily concentrated in the capital but London pretty much carries the whole of the UK like Atlas carries the world. Once London collapses the rest of the country will follow.
If I recal correctly you and others have said shopping areas in central London were quiet. If central London is quiet is doesn’t bode for well for the rest of the country. Do you feel people working from home has taken a lot of trade from business in central London.
Perhaps that’s the plan, bringing down the 50 year old ponzi scheme that has been the UK housing market and which no government has been eager to face.
By making how big a proportion of the public homeless? But, yes, once the stamp duty scheme expires, house prices may actually fall. Who knows? I’ve been expecting them to fall for 12 years.
I’m well aware of this.The quarantine policy instituted well after it may have been any use,can only be seen as a tool to destroy mass aviation.
True and once these sectors are decimated it will take time to rebuild them. Not to mention that with commercial real estate in trouble, that can have significant effects on pension schemes and other investments.
After the war, German civil servants, teachers etc. were the poorest of all for 2 decades, incl. such retirees, as the government could only spend currently what the private sector could earn previously.
History will deservedly repeat for that lot everywhere, after the upcoming hyperinflationary currency collapses.
Undeservedly, you mean. My grandmother was a teacher in England bringing up 3 small children alone in the 1930s whose pay was cut. She was not to blame.
Unless something changes, it can only get worse from here…
I have got it from just after we flattened the curve. My fears have always been for my children’s futures.
The Press led the country into this, it looks like the Press will lead it out again.
They’ve all been heavily bought off.
Looks like they are given the number of critical articles and op ed pieces, the tide is slowly turning.
Momentum building there, methinks.
To some extent there’s international pressure to watch out for too. I don’t imagine our press would have been banging the drum for lockdown if other countries hadn’t already gone down that path. With Belgium having seen the light on PCR tests, I imagine the Netherlands and Germany won’t be far behind them and that will lead to more of a shift in the narrative.
This is true. The same pressure Sweden faces every day I suspect.
The msn news site today had a headline from THE GUARDIAN showing scepticism. Haven’t read any further.
Tide’s well turned if they’re coming on board.
Having read the above, I took a quick look at the Guardian.
One headline: “Follow Covid rules so students can go home for Christmas, says minister”
Basically the article says that everyone in the country should follow the covid rules so that students can be released from their prison for Christmas.
As a former Guardian reader and supporter, fuck them.
Furious when I typed that. To finish the thought, how dare the Guardian support the government in holding students hostage to force the rest of the country to “behave”. I’m going to sound like Biker in a second, so I’ll stop with that.
We need The Guardian to turn. I had hope that they would after the SAGE minutes came out but alas. The Guardian Aus is even worse.
It’s all very depressing. But I do think it’s swinging round now. Surely some of these people realise what will happen if this continues???
The Press did not lead the country into this, they followed a juicy story. Please do not give this shambolic government a free pass. It IS their fault.
Lapsed CofE but didn’t Jesus say something about welcoming repentant sinners?
He did and that’s what we should do with those who convert to the cause of Lockdown Scepticism
Not sure what to make of this https://articles.mercola.com/sites/articles/archive/2020/09/27/chinese-whistleblower-coronavirus.aspx?cid_source=dnl&cid_medium=email&cid_content=art1ReadMore&cid=20200927Z2&mid=DM667088&rid=973840455
Great update today Toby, thanks.
“This was our first Italian experience of the schizophrenia of Covid-Land where the rules are mere wraiths that float in the background.”
Already I know Guy de la Bédoyère’ postcard is going to be a good read.
Thank you Guy.
I remember flying AliItalia a good few years back. I was late so rushed through security and ran to the gate. The plane was due to take off in 20 minutes. When I got there the gate wasn’t open, the sort-of queue was all just standing around chatting, some to the check-in staff. Italian and English floating around.
Then suddenly the gate opens and everyone got on without trouble. The plane arrived earlt too.
And this was from Heathrow.
Ha, Alitalia. They have a bit of a negative reputation among some in the industry. I never really felt it was justified, as whenever I needed them to do something for me they always came up with the goods, albeit in their own slightly haphazard way!
Reports from Italy indicate things are closer to normal than the UK, other than the mask madness and temperature checks before you board trains.
I also know there are sceptics there just as there are here – I had some contact with one the other day, they have their own forums I believe. Presume this is replicated in most countries.
This article on Peter Hitchen’s blog is good too:
https://hitchensblog.mailonsunday.co.uk/2020/09/being-kind-to-matt-hancock-what-does-every-eight-days-mean.html
I have written to my christian friends to ask them to urge their ministers to pray for the events in Parliament on Wednesday. Where relevant, can I urge others on this list do do likewise if you have not already done so. This is the essence of my message:
You may be aware that the Brady amendment, tabled by Sir Graham Brady, aims to allow MPs to debate and vote on any new national Coronavirus measures.
I understand that, subject to the approval of the speaker, this amendment will be debated in Parliament on Wednesday. This is an important legislative move which promises to return a measure of parliamentary sovereignty.
Given the tragic failure of the Church of Jesus Christ in this country to speak prophetically into this national crisis, I believe that the least we can do is to pray that the amendment receives parliamentary approval with the hope that the terrible damage being done to the lives of the people of this country can be brought to an end.
May I urge you to lead the congregation in prayer to this end?
Really good idea.
After they have finished praying they should get the plackards out!
Not placards but ……
https://ministersletter.wordpress.com/the-letter/?fbclid=IwAR3dmUyOUWRYf8FZL0NUx9INdUhp3De2tBcRJ8qrJWiUo__OQkJXS5Iwge0
That’s a start lets hope it has some effect.
Everybody must email there Mp and ask what the end game is.
I know it’s a vaccine but the more I read the less chance there is of a effective 1 for many years,ask your Mp how long we have to live like this.
The vaccine is not the end game – its merely another stepping stone. Submitting to the vaccine may permit you to do a little more with your health passport – but you will be signing up to a never ending vaccine schedule and not a single vaccine. Your health passport will become your social credit score and health will be just one category. Every aspect of your life will be dictated and monitored. The end game is your impoverishment and total enslavement.
I was talking to an ambulance driver and paramedic yesterday, working for a private medical firm.
He told me his employers were contacted as early as March about performing mass vaccinations on the public.
He is thinking of moving away so that he does not participate in this, he felt it to be very sinister.
Good morning fellow Lockdown Sceptics. Brilliant update today Toby, thank you. Lots to be encouraged by.
Laurence Fox is a legend. One of my college tutors used to say that you should always judge a person by how good company you think they would make in the pub. Both Toby and Laurence would be up there.
Robert Kennedy Jnr has posted the following on Instagram this am. Copying here as folk have said in the past they can’t access IG.
Full post here: https://www.instagram.com/p/CFndh3anJfS/?utm_source=ig_web_copy_link
Since the government’s new mask diktat came into place my colleagues have had to abandon their face shields and be muzzled up for 7 hours.
Yesterday I witnessed it for the first time and I was the only one unmuzzled as I was exempt. However I was told to ensure that my sunflower lanyard was visible which to be honest I have been doing for awhile now (this has led to some conversations with visitors asking where and how to obtain them).
It was a rather dystopian and depressing view not to be able to see my colleagues’ and manager’s faces as well as to struggle to “read” their expressions and even understand what they’re trying to say.
I predict that over the next few weeks, there will be absences as a result of dizzy spells, chest infections, dermatitis, impetigo, etc.
German study found 80 or so virus and bacterial cultures and 4 fungi on a childs mask after it was worn for for 6-7 hours. Others may have the link to it.
A Spanish study visually showed the cultures grown on from been taken from 4 different used masks.
I sometimes mention when speaking to certain retail staff that I ought to be concerned about what is lodged in their mask as they exhale towards me. It gets a point across.
Thanks for the reminder, I was trying to remember the studies that I could bring up in a conversation.
https://swprs.org/face-masks-evidence/
Another handy reminder. Sorry I don’t hsve easy to find links to German recent Study or the Spanish video.
That site alone is good enough.
Cant beat a mank petri dish to get across the gross factor to some. We can tailor our comms – we are THAT right!
That’s excellent so thank you.
I found the original tweet of the German study and have kept it as a handy too.
Maybe its time for business to say enough is enough, what are they going to do, shut them all down, people are waking up to the con
That’s what I’ve been long saying. Its surprising how businesses and institutions have been supine and cowardly over this. They don’t seem to realise that they are aiding and abetting their own demise.
Is the problem with business a lack of imagination to think they can achieve meaningful push back against a government?
I don’t know, but the lack of opposition is a strange feature of this economic collapse like you say.
Probably because so few ordinary people have yet realised quite how bad it’s going to be…
I have no idea. Unfortunately my workplace has the disadvantage of being connected with the state sector so we have to be seen to adhering to regulations no matter how insane it is.
Private businesses have no such restraints so why they’re not fighting back is a big mystery.
Maybe the public relations people in businesses are afraid that they’ll be accused of “putting profits before lives”. Of course that’s a false dichotomy but it still seems to carry weight with a lot of people.
Especially the economically illiterate millenials.and many business particularly in fashion blatantly court them despite their lack of disposable income.
I also think businesses are scared of being shamed on social media and the press. Just look at how many of them jumped on the BLM bandwagon.
I get the feeling that now people are just waking up and seeing the big picture, whereas until now, they’ve been thinking if we follow the rules it’ll get us out of it quickly, now they realise that isint the case, Peter Hitchens described it as burning down the house to get rid of a wasps nest/ Boris, well that’s Covid gone, pity about the country
And perhaps many people are starting to question the rules as well such as social distancing and wearing masks. Especially the latter, why now?
Unions are deluded, but that business and trade body leaders are so cowed is indeed a huge disappointment.
Absolutely pathetic the way business (especially big business) fail to challenge the narrative.
Hence why I won’t shed tears for big businesses that go bust – they reap what they sow and some of them have been the worst offenders.
Simon Dolan said as much when he revealed that the vast majority of those who donated to his judicial review were SMEs.
The lower-league football club owners and chief executives are beginning to wake up. Mark Ashton of Bristol City FC has warned the government that a timetable for spectators to return “needs to happen today because there is no tomorrow”.
I think they want people to get ill. So they can feed the testing beast and also whip up more panic to turn the screws further.
There was a conspiracy theory that suggested that. Mandate muzzles which weakens their immune systems making them vulnerable even to ordinary colds and hey presto, you have your “second wave”
Yes, plus of course all the rest of the people who have struggled on for months hoping things would go away. None of us have been left without food, but we certainly can’t say that about the medical care
And if nothing else, it’s a clear sign of control.
Indeed.
Masks might very well lead to a bigger spread of the coronavirus itself. They could as such diberately be pursuing herd immunity now by mandating their use, in particular where not at risk groups like children are
impacted, but without making the Karens notice and freak out.
Agree. I will be in the second site today which is an enclosed space and not looking forward to constantly going “so sorry can’t understand you” or “you will have to speak up” and not being able to see and “read” their faces.
And of course if she’s raising her voice she’s exhaling more, so others will get more of her germs. Rather negates the point of the mask.
As you know, I used to work in a coffee shop. I hate it when people did not realise they have to speak up. Sometimes I had to ask them 3 or 4 times to repeat themselves.
AN increase in Altzheimers, brain death, soul death, social death, a total breakdown in all interpersonal communication, a complete collapse of moral, an unending sense of hopelessness and isolation, as growing sense of your vulnerability to germs, a creping fear of “getting IT”, an unnatural focus on any small extra nasal mucus, a sense of alarm at that tickling sensation in your chest.
These re my predictions for how you will all feel in a few more weeks due to constant mask wearing.
This is just evil on wheels.
What the hell is wrong with people.
A child has died in Germany recently, and there is strong speculation and indication that she died just because of wearing the mask.
There will be many more such cases and long term damages through oxygen deprivation just because of wearing a mask, as top Harley Street neurologist M.Griesz-Brisson explained in her video yesterday
(Wearing masks for longer, outdoors, at work, on planes/trains, in classrooms or even during sports will then be particularly damaging, of course.):
The body adapts to the new lower oxygen level for a while so thst you don’t notice the deprivation and its effects at all, but the brain cells will be killed regardless, and the symptom will occur later, in a bout, as unconsciousness, death or Alzheimer’s etc..
Enjoy Karens, and thanks for nothing WHO, Whitty, Vallance, Hancock, Johnson&co.
Source? Link?
Yes, children especially those that are more susceptible could suffers serious oxygen deprivation (both cells and brain).
There is also this:
https://www.snopes.com/fact-check/china-boys-dead-face-mask/
Though it is not 100% clear that wearing the masks caused death.
Snopes is not a trustworthy source for fact-checking.
I continue to be surprised by how little genuine interest there is in the virus and it’s consequences, in favour of a hysterical approach.
For example, no scientific groups seem to be curious about the effects on body, mind and immune system from the effects of lock-down, mask-wearing, isolation, general media terror campaigns FOR THOSE WITH Covid-19. I imagine that, if you’re going to get the virus, you may be less likely to make a good recovery if you’re frightened, alone, and treated like a potential murderer.
And what about long-COVID? Might it be much more likely as a consequence of loneliness and physical deconditioning?
The social/governmental responses to the virus might actually be worse for those that get it.
Could this be contributing to higher death rates too? For example say you’re an 85 y.o. man with dementia and you get Covid-19. No-one comes to visit you, you get little (albeit the most basic) care. What are the chances of recovering from a viral illness? Greatly diminished I imagine, and then your number gets added to the Covid-19 stats.
The more I think about it the more it becomes clear that those who purport to care about the virus and it’s consequences care nothing about it at all. The investment of energy is to do with hysteria, virtue signalling and sadistic control.
I couldn’t agree more Alpine. The enforced loneliness moves me to anger and sadness.
This is very interesting. It’s been clear to me that there is enormous sadism manifest in the overblown and controlling responses to the virus. I experience it personally whenever someone aggressively challenges me about not wearing a mask (sometimes they are so eager to have a shout that they don’t notice my exemption lanyard). But you are proposing that there is an alliance between people’s sadism and the virus ‘itself.’ That the obscenity here would then be not that the coronapanic has inadvertently resulted in the severe deterioration of, eg, NHS services, or social cohesion, but in some sense actually represents a desire to destroy these things.
This reminds me of an excellent article I read a few years ago in a professional psychotherapy journal: I am afraid I can’t remember the source or the author. But it focused on the crucial importance of knowing one’s own sadism. We had better know our sadism, the author wrote, or it will express itself in our kindness.
Lockdown enthusiasts believe that they are being kind; that the virus is cruel, and the lockdown sceptics are in league with its destructiveness. Your post suggests that lockdown enthusiasts are directly sadistic. The pain and sadness suffered by covid patients subject to isolation may be – unconsciously – deliberate, intentional.
It’s not that lockdown gives us an opportunity to express our sadism, but that our sadism has been taking the form of the virus. This isn’t an epidemic of hysteria, it’s an epidemic of sadism.
If this is so, it would help explain why critiques of the ‘side-effects’ of lockdown don’t seem to gain much traction. We know that people told directly about their own unconscious motivations are very likely to respond with denial.
Discussion on this site of conspiracy theory – as a style or form of thinking about contemporary politics – has been intense in recent weeks. I wonder if we might not think about conspiracy theorising as a non-psychoanalytic attempt to recognise and describe the force of unconscious motivation – in this case, unconscious sadism – in national policy making as well as in its policing by the authorities and by social media etc.
Hello Alethea. I believe all of us have a preposition to sadistic states of mind, some more than others. I agree that if you know something of your own sadism you’ve got more of a chance of modifying it’s expression. The existence of the virus may stimulate the expression of sadism at the level of the individual and group, whilst all the while keeping the sadism hidden, as it gets covered up by supposed care/concern etc.
The marker as far as I can see is to what extent you are exerting control over others. Authentic care tends to allow a robust degree of freedom in self and other. This commitment to freedom is the foundation of proper respect for one another.
If you already have an asymptomatic and non-infectious coronavirus infection, the mask will most likely turn you into a more heavily infected and infected person:
Your exhaled virus particles from the nose or throat will also be inhaled deeper and into your lungs, where they can and will do more damage.
Masks many serious side effects have indeed been completely ignored, as have lockdowns’.
But the fundamemtal error and root cause of our suicidal responses is the unquestioned acceptance of the assumption that there is indeed such a thing as herd immunity.
There exists no medical evidence for herd immunity.
It is just a computer model concept invented and peddled by epidimiologists, aka computer modelers, probably on behalf and for the vaccine industry, to provide cover for vaccinating all those people not at risk of a certain pathogen and disease too.
See Profs Gatti and Montanari and RKjrs CHD on that.
As soon as I read that Sainsbury’s was going to be a partner of the government for operation Moonshot, I thought their mask attitude might change…
https://www.bmj.com/content/370/bmj.m3558
The feeling seems to be, that it is all coming unstuck. Who would have thought you would be arrested for giving a speech like that, when they have allowed so much more. The UK has lost its way. Blair started it, and his Blairites have continued it.
Why have the Germans been way ahead of us?
The Germans have living memory of authoritarian governments.
Also they are still a serious industrial society with a rigorous education system
They can still get over a million into the streets to protest while we can only fill Trafalgar Square.The government responses are the same the world over.Its almost like they are reading from a script
agreed on both
They were definitely holding proper protests rather earlier.
Excellent news about Laurence Fox, he’s been impressive throughout this, totally understood the general mood of the majority
a political vacuum that was bound to be filled, excellent news, Loz is the man for Ethelred!
They have destroyed the mans acting career giving him no choice but to fight
The one party bairite state must end.
NSW numbers are so low now (1 positive result in 12,000 tests statewide in latest testing period) our sewage is being tested in various areas.
https://www.sbs.com.au/news/nsw-hopes-raw-sewage-testing-will-strengthen-fight-against-covid-19
Can they not give it a bloody rest for goodness sake. Today at local Westfield barely anyone masked (what a relief), but the Merrell store is now insisting you put on a pair of their stockinettes over your own socks to try on shoes. I kid you not, now your feet need a mask…… . I have emailed Merrell and told them how ridiculous it is.
If Fox is launching ‘Reclaim’, who is behind Heritage Party?
https://www.heritageparty.org/manifesto/
David Kurten
@davidkurten
Heritage Party Leader, London Assembly Member, Brexiteer
https://twitter.com/davidkurten
David Kurten has been very good at holding Khan to account in the London Assembly.
He’s had good anti-lockdown points on hs twitter feed right throughout the panicdemic.
Looks like a free-market version of the SDP. Maybe will frighten the Tories into better representing the views of their core supporters. At least, unlike Fox so far, they are clear about removing coronapanic restrictions.
I am surprised the English Democrat Party has not seen thos as an opportunity to establish themselves or rsuse their profile. They are already a registered party and in place, so could do more imho.
Remember that all publicity is good. The arrest has only drawn attention to what he has to say.
Robert Dingwall, in the linked article, writes:
“Indeed, until the early 2000s when we started to vaccinate for flu, we accepted that outbreaks would kill 20,000 to 50,000 people every winter without much comment.”
Dingwall seems not to realise what 99% of the public also does not realise – that we STILL have 20,000-50,000 deaths from flu in the UK, every few years, DESPITE a vaccine!
In the 2014-15 flu season, nearly 30,000 Brits died. In the 2017-18 flu season, over 50,100 Brits died. These deaths are DESPITE a vaccine. Almost certainly most of these deaths would have been in the over 65 age group, the majority of whom take the annual flu shot.
What does this show,? That vaccines are of very limited use against a rapidly-mutating virus. The vax used in 2017 is now considered to only have been around 7% effective. Against a Coronavirus, which mutates even faster than flu, vaccines are highly unlikely to fare any better.
The ludicrous over-hyping of the coming “miracle” vaccine – which looks to me like an injectable version of Russian roulette – shows that Big Pharma bucks (especially for Hancock, Whitty, Vallance and the crooked big business they represent) are part of the objective, while the desire to make it compulsory is truly Orwellian: we lose
our right to refuse a medical procedure, and our sovereignty over our own bodies.
A rushed experimental vaccine (for which our loving Govt has removed all manufacturers’ legal liability for any death and disability it might cause) is NOT the way forward – unless like Hancock, Whitty and Vallance you stand to make a personal fortune, or unless you are continuing to pursue an Orwellian agenda. (Agenda 2030, perhaps)
We can control this virus with common sense, sunlight, vitamin D, vitamin C, and as-needed oral drugs. The infection fatality rate is now known to be a bit worse than the common cold – but not much worse than a bad flu.
The purpose of the flu vaccine is not to stop it but try and mitigate its effects. The vaccine changes year on year depending on the predicted active strains fro WHO. Certainly a few years ago the predictions were wrong and the vaccine was ineffective. The vaccines given to the over 65 is different to that given to the under 65s due to differences in the immune system.
That is not how the authorities sell the flu vaccine. Many people that get the flu vaccine suffers the same debilitating symptoms of the flu vaccine, so in effect they then suffer from flue that was induced by the vaccine.
About three years ago my Dad had the flu vaccine, then he got a really bad does of the flu, he got over that in a few days but he went on to get an excruciating ear infection which lasted for about a month. It was really really bad.
He hasn’t had the flu jab since.
I am sure I have read that ear infections are a side effect of the flu vaccine
From memory the NZ doctor Sam Bailey noted a research paper that demonstrated the minimal efficacy of the flu virus in older people. There is also research in vaccine interference which suggest a third of people have a higher susceptibility to other respiratory viruses. – a US military research paper.
Unfortunately I cannot find the link to this paper (I believe censorship is now taking place on PubMed and other websites; certainly all the Vitamin C research by Klenner, Carthcart, Pauling et al disappeared at the start of the lockdown – there one day; gone the next), but about 3 years ago I read headline news in one of the dailies, of a just-published meta-analysis by a British team, on the benefits of flu vaccination within the UK.
The researchers’ meta-analysis concluded:
• there was no convincing evidence that flu vaccines prevent infection
• there was no convincing evidence that the vaccine prevents interpersonal spread of the infection
• there was no convincing evidence that the vaccine prevents any of the major complications of flu infection
• the only benefit was a possible shortening of the recovery period, by 24-48 hours, for those without major complications.
The then UK Chief Medical Officer was contacted by the newspaper and asked for a response. The paper was told that despite this latest report, GPs were still advised to give annual flu jabs to all and sundry.
And it was THAT comment that got me interested in all the wheeling, dealing, and pseudoscience behind vaccination. I am not a total anti-vaxxer but I believe that as in so many other areas of science, money and politics have corrupted this field.
If I can track down that original paper I will flag it up.
Dr Malcolm Kendricks blog has a number of links to Vitamin studies:
https://drmalcolmkendrick.org/2020/07/11/replies-to-the-vitamin-d-article-by-the-guest-contributor/
Since the start of the so-called pandemic the WHO instructions to social media, media and Governments were clear – anything that goes against the carefully constructed narrative is not allowed and must be censored.
By doing this, thousands of people died unnecessary, many others that have no access to healthcare (yes all this in the UK with covid only NHS services) struggle to find health information where they can help themselves to improve their health and immune systems. Even the nutritional practitioners were grouped with the hairdressing sector and were the last that was allowed to reopen during lockdown.
The highly respected Dr Andrew Saul that specialises in high dose vitamin C were instrumental in a Covid treatment protocol. http://www.doctoryourself.com
Shanghai Government Officially Recommends Vitamin C for COVID-19
http://orthomolecular.org/resources/omns/v16n16.shtml
A coronavirus pandemic can be stopped with the immediate widespread use of high doses of vitamin C. (published 26 January 2020)
So basically the same as for the Coronavirus.
As their trials are all designed to demonstrate effectiveness for the mild cases only, or the ones we don’t need a vaccine for…
https://www.nytimes.com/2020/09/22/opinion/covid-vaccine-coronavirus.html
“We found 52 clinical trials of over 80,000 adults. We were unable to determine the impact of bias on about 70% of the included studies due to insufficient reporting of details. Around 15% of the included studies were well designed and conducted. We focused on reporting of results from 25 studies that looked at inactivated vaccines. Injected influenza vaccines probably have a small protective effect against influenza and ILI (moderate-certainty evidence), as 71 people would need to be vaccinated to avoid one influenza case, and 29 would need to be vaccinated to avoid one case of ILI. Vaccination may have little or no appreciable effect on hospitalisations (low-certainty evidence) or number of working days lost.”
https://www.cochrane.org/CD001269/ARI_vaccines-prevent-influenza-healthy-adults
About Cochrane:-
“Cochrane’s members and supporters come from more than 130 countries, worldwide. Our volunteers and contributors are researchers, health professionals, patients, carers, and people passionate about improving health outcomes for everyone, everywhere. Our global independent network gathers and summarizes the best evidence from research to help you make informed choices about treatment and we have been doing this for 25 years.
We do not accept commercial or conflicted funding. This is vital for us to generate authoritative and reliable information, working freely, unconstrained by commercial and financial interests.”
Yes “The vaccines given to the over 65 is different to that given to the under 65s due to differences in the immune system.” That’s right, the one for those over 65 is an even more concentrated dose of shit than the other.
My response is always the same: “I have decided to do the extremely noble thing! I shall graciously allow my dose of the vaccine to be given to someone else, more worthy than me…” That’s if I am in a good mood. If I’m not in a good mood, I just reply “Sod off before your nose breaks.”
Great post.
The missing health message: Improve your immune system
There is some evidence that flu vaccines can increase the risk fromcoronaviruses
“he overlooks the possibility that seasonal flu shots are potential contributors to the current outbreak. (BMJ 2020;398:m810—February 28)….A randomized placebo-controlled trial in children showed that flu shots increased fivefold the risk of acute respiratory infections caused by a group of noninfluenza viruses, including coronaviruses. (Cowling et al, Clin Infect Dis 2012;54:1778)”
https://www.bmj.com/content/368/bmj.m810/rr-0
Thete is actually a lot of evidence for that, in Bergamo!
Does the Flu Shot Increase COVID-19 Risk (YES!) and Other Interesting Questions
https://doctormurray.com/does-the-flu-shot-increase-covid-19-risk/
Errr… this seems wrong.
Why does it seem to be wrong?
Because all sources I’ve read suggest coronaviruses mutate more slowly than influenza viruses.
https://www.google.com/search?safe=off&q=coronavirus+mutation+rate+flu
Logic would then suggest that it would be easier to produce an effective vaccine for the common cold (a Coronavirus) than for the flu. I assume elderly people can die of bad colds – so why is there no “common cold” vaccine for the elderly?
I put rhinoviruses and adenoviruses in the common cold category too, and there are (for example) loads of different rhinoviruses.
I agree with your sentiment generally. I guess the answer is just “the huge amount of effort just isn’t worth it for the benefit offered”. I’m pro-vax for serious afflictions, but I’m not keen on the idea of trying to manipulate our normal immune system functioning more generally with vaccines for every possible malady… seems easier and less risky to just let nature take its course generally.
Because, as someone posted a link to the other day, there are 160 rhinoviruses alone which cause colds, plus the adenoviruses, the coronaviruses etc.
You would have to create vaccines for at least half those strains to curtail what is only deadly in the very old and frail, and a mild illness for everyone else. It doesn’t make sense from an economic perspective, nor from a health one as all vaccines will have side effects.
Which kind of begs they question as to why we are bothering to put so much resource into a SARS Cov2 vaccine given It shares so many characteristics of a cold, and is unlikely to ever be as deadly again as it was in April 2020.
100%. Sunk cost fallacy if we’re generous, corruption and greed if we’re being harsher.
I’ve thought about it a lot, and the reasons vary by company as to why they are doing it, but I suspect primarily it is seen as giving them lobbying power with governments. It’s not profit on the vaccine for most of them.
This would be to push back on drug price legislation in the US or to get better patent box tax credits in the U.K. or to be able to get rid of a bunch of superfluous workers in France to get their cost base more competitive.
I’m really disappointed that Toby led this morning’s post with a subject irrelevant to lockdown scepticism. I’ve been working really hard to bring Guardian reading friends to this website, and cheerleading for this new party will only make them feel a) confused and b) considering scepticism is only a right wing issue.
That’s a good point. I might be better to remind people of the economic devastion, I assume ther Guardian is still anti poverty.
Also a lot the locked down northern cities ha large Muslim population. Sure Guardian reader don’t want to see Muslims under house arrest
The Guardian is certainly against poverty for itself, being registered for tax purposes in the Cayman Islands.
A might name! Sir Patrick Vaccine! Very good.
I share to an extent your view that it’s best to focus directly on the issue at hand, though of course TY is free to do as he wishes with this site. I don’t think it is aimed at non-sceptics though – but maybe it should be, or there should be other sites for that (lockdowntruth.org possibly?). The Swiss site or CEBM may be better starting points for your friends, or UK column.
The lead is however related to freedom of speech, which I don’t think is a left-right issue. I think Fox’s new party may turn out to be a force for good, and it’s my hope it doesn’t just attract “right wingers” (understandably) fed up with “cancel culture” but attracts people from across the political spectrum who genuinely believe in freedom of speech.
What I do find disappointing is that the new party seems not to have a view on lockdown, and that we have not yet got a party focused on this. It’s stated he has raised £1m already – the power of celebrity. Shame that sums like this have not been raised for an anti-lockdown campaign. Dolan seems to be the only one publicly putting his money where his mouth is. We need more from big business to follow his lead.
I suspect that a good proportion of people who would vote for Laurence Fox are, paradoxically, pro-lockdown mask wearers. It may be very sensible of him not to play his Covid hand if he doesn’t have to.
Possibly. Disappointing if true. I would struggle to support any party that did not recognise that the coronapanic was a huge mistake, even when this is all over, because it cannot be allowed to happen again.
Its a bit like a litmus test for sanity.
Laurence Fox is such a tosser.
lol yer
I don’t think of Lawrence Fox as “right-wing”. His view on the NHS for instance, is positive. I think is arguments about “traditional values” are supported by many former Labour voters.
I think TY’s support is mainly because of the free speech issue, Fox is an important voice in that debate.
I get the point that this site is mainly about lockdown, and is strange Fox hasn’t given his views on that!
AFAIK, wanting a 1st world health care system is a cross class concern.
The producer capure that provides a smug living for some at the expense of having a 2nd world healthcare system is a predominantly comfortable middle class thing.
Its mainly the working class who need to get back to work soon who would benefit from a continental / bismarkian social insurance health model.
Maybe he will when (if) scepticism becomes more mainstream – too easy to have the ct slur thrown at you at the moment and you are immediately discounted as a quack
Fox has posted a few anti-lockdown tweets so I think that’s another reason why Toby mentioned him here. But Fox’s main issue is free speech.
What exactly is wrong with Laurence Fox? If ever a person gave off ‘peace, man’ vibes, it’s LF. He has probably never wished harm on anyone, less still caused it. Those Guardian readers who say they hate him are simply looking for their own symbolic Emmanuel Goldstein figure. Would they find much of interest here at LS? I don’t think their scepticism would run very deep.
I don’t agree. This new political party is great news and we should all know about it. Lawrence Fox has been portrayed by the media as a right wing nutter – well, we all know how the media can smear people in an effort to support their own agenda or the agenda of their paymasters.
So I suggest that in the absence of another credible party challenging both incompetent Conservative and Labour parties that people should consider this party and even see if they can get involved on a local level.
NOTES:
thought about off-guardian?
Arguably the suppression of free speech which grew out of ‘wokeness’ and political correctness is at the root of the problem we are now having in holding the government to account.
“ I’ve been working really hard to bring Guardian reading friends to this website”
They don’t have to be Guardian readers – many who once were have clocked how hopelessly biased the paper is.
But banging a niche political drum is not a good idea, and praising possible Boris appointments of the poisonous Dacre and Moore as praiseworthy (let alone selling Piers Morgan) will immediately devalue the reputation of this site.
Message from Peter Hitchens. Daily Mail
It’s time for MPs to do their jobs
ON Wednesday, Parliament must vote to renew or ditch the dictatorial Coronavirus Bill, which it enacted in a sort of mesmerised trance, without a vote, half a year ago.
It should scrap this nasty, despotic thing. And you can help. You need to email your MPs now, in large numbers. Do not try to reason with them.
Be polite, brief and acid. Say you have noticed that MPs have ceased to do the job for which they are paid more than £80,000 a year.
They are not representing you. They have let hundreds of thousands of jobs be destroyed without a squeak of protest.
And soon-to-be millions of jobs, coming to a town near you!
I ran into James Delingpole at the demo yesterday, presumably working for Breitbart as he had a photographer with him. I hope he stayed for the police attack, but I haven’t seen anything from him – yet. Word will have filtered over to this place, I’m sure.
I never noticed him. But then I tend to drift in and out of the demo. Plenty of walks in the surrounding streets to see what the Police are up to! They must see me, they must realise what I’m doing. I’m hardly inconspicuous.
Having failed to debunk the false positives, Huff Post now switched to false negatives:
https://www.huffingtonpost.co.uk/entry/truth-behind-false-negative-covid-tests_uk_5f6dbd4cc5b61af20e740e64
Bless em
Hugo Gye’s piece about lockdown scepticism contains the following:
“The period of the lockdown seems to have encouraged some conspiracy theories to thrive, such as the 5G claims and the “QAnon” movement which sees the world being under the control of a paedophile cult.”
Now, I know nothing about 5G, but I have been following the Q or QAnon movement with interest. I was originally inclined to dismiss it as a hoax or some sort of controlled opposition.
Then I read the thoughtful essays by British author, computer scientist and polymath Martin Geddes. His conclusion is that Q is indeed military intelligence at the heart of the Trump administration. His research has also uncovered – very disturbingly – that paedophilia is indeed part of the lifestyle of many multibillionaire “elites”.
We can see the tip of this iceberg with the current Epstein / Maxwell scandal. It is possible that this could lead to the exposure of crimes against children on a scale, and of a scope, that will shake the foundations of “civilised” society.
Geddes admits he could be wrong, and I remain less than fully persuaded. However, I contacted him recently and his conclusions remain unchanged. His 40-page series of essays is WELL worth reading, and a necessary antidote to the Q phenomenon being described as a “far right wing cult” by the MSM.
The essays, in PDF format, can be found here:
https://www.onq.martingeddes.com
Yes, inclined to agree re: Epstein. Trump has really taken a stand against child crime & human trafficking – ok some of these people would have been awaiting trial before he took office, but there’s been around 14,000 cases he’s taken down since he came in. inc. some who have evaded suspicions for years: former Mayors of Ohio, Seattle, a few in NY, and a prominent member of the NYC Mayor’s office.
https://www.reddit.com/r/TruthLeaks/comments/immdgs/compilation_of_human_trafficking_arrests_under/
I have always been dismayed at the lack of alarm in our country in the number of missing children. Just checked and over 112000 annually in the UK, 460,000 in the US. Considering the vile market in extreme porn, a number of children must end up in this quarter, but rarely is there any real public reaction. There is grossly more attention about protecting children from a virus that won’t harm them.
Have you seen the latest re the Clinton foundation and Haiti?
All very interesting as well. Something of a masterstroke appointing as a new Judge a woman who has adopted two children from Haiti, as it has brought all that out of the woodwork..
See here for a snapshot: https://twitter.com/cjtruth/status/1309964786843742211
Yes, indeed. It really doesn’t take much research at all, to discover that much of this is indeed true.
The Epstein private jet flight logs with named passengers is not a bad place to start!
If Q Anon start pulling the plug out of the vast swamp, then they are doing us all a service, imo.
Second one with a vested interest:
https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-8776339/Test-tsar-770-000-shares-firm-sold-13million-pointless-antibody-screening-kits.html
Are the mail plucking them off one by one in a long slow terminal killing off of these offensive bastards? Every bit of misery they get they are welcome to.
Yes, I think they are. They are also digging into Boris’s personal life and financial commitments. Ms Carrie staying at the Grand Tremezzo on Lake Como is not a good look however you try to spin it – pretty sue the ‘rank and file’ are incensed.
Boris is toast.
In case you missed this late last night
Sturgeon of Scotland
Coronavirus in Scotland: Self-catering industry faces £70m collapse
https://www.thetimes.co.uk/article/coronavirus-in-scotland-self-catering-industry-faces-70m-collapse-7rvr29qcq
Scotland’s self-catering holiday industry is expecting to lose tens of millions of pounds in bookings before the end of this year.
It has prompted concerns that many owners will go out of business as customers choose to take breaks in England where regulations are less restrictive. The Scottish government had said on Tuesday that family and friends from two households could meet in self-catering properties as long as there were not more than six adults present.
However, it reversed that decision late on Wednesday, causing widespread confusion and a serious headache for business owners and those planning an autumn break.
Then paywall
Twiiter comments about this are universal in saying how ashamed Scots are of the actions of Sturgeon and the rotten protests we have seen over the Summer. The silent majority is fizzing.
My niece,who has just returned from a 3 day break in Greece, met a Scots couple while there who were absolutely fizzing with rage at the thought of having to endure a 14 day quarantine on their return-not applicable to my niece, who lives in England-and the crushing reach of Sturgeon’s iron fist.
You’re right Basics, the silent folk are fed up, but they’re still not making a real fuss.
Hopefully the silent majority will make its views known at the ballot box in May.
Not sure there will be anything worth saving by next May.
I certainly will! Let’s hope more wake up in time.
If there’s an election next May.
Good point. And if the opposition don’t have any alternative policies, they’ll vote for her anyway
I hope so, I look on in amazement at the ridiculous restrictions in Scotland. It’s almost like Johnson and Sturgeon are trying to win a stupidity competition.
John Lee says:
And there are unknown unknowns – things that matter, and will perhaps massively affect outcomes (such as the increasingly recognised pre-existing T cell immune responses to Covid-19), but that aren’t even on the radar when an issue first arises.
What I would ask is: why the hell was this not on the radar from day one? How can there be a respected profession known as epidemiology if it doesn’t incorporate this idea into the very core of what it does?
In fact, I think John Lee is wrong there. Immunologists have known about this phenomenon all along – it’s bread and butter to them. The problems are that (a) it’s difficult to quantify, and (b) epidemiologists are lost in their own self-referencing, circular, virtual world based on a toy model that at its heart doesn’t have room for such complexity. It looks as though epidemiologists are reluctant to talk to immunologists for fear they might have to abandon the concept of ‘R0’ and their toy calculations of herd immunity threshold. And immunologists are simply uninterested in how the epidemiologists come up with their economy- & life-ruining figures, seeming ready to simply defer to them.
We are now six months into this debacle, and Neil Ferguson still hasn’t even hinted at incorporating this ‘new’ information into his calculations.
The problem is that these so-called specialists look at issues in silos and do not even consider other data and impacts.
Example ’eminent’ Cambridge virologist advising Suffolk schools on wearing masks, told them that masks will stop the spread of the virus and if he could he would make it compulsory for everyone (including children) and everywhere. What he failed to consider was the other effects of mask wearing: psychological, immunity suppression, speech development, emotional development, increasing fear, development of mask mouth, reduction of oxygen in the body and especially the brain for developing children, increase in bacterial and other pathogen infections etc.
The sad thing is that schools think they got good sound scientific advice
Perhaps ‘scientific advice’ should be regarded as an oxymoron. We might have ‘scientific information’, but ‘advice’ suggests direct input into policy. I don’t think ‘scientists’ should be in that position.
What this nonsense has revealed is that not all ‘scientists’ are equal. Some are amazingly ignorant about basic scientific method – as well as proportionality.
That’s pretty obvious to anyone who has done a science degree. I didn’t do a PhD (couldn’t stomach the washing up ….lab work is mostly tedious, and poverty) but a lot of people a lot worse at my subject than me did. I don’t think 3 years in lab suddenly made them more insightful.
Vallance has been ‘outed’ for his vaccine links a fair bit in the press – the same needs to be done with Whitty!
Because epidemiology is a cod science.
Well, since democracy has gone out of the Covid window, we might do better to be led by a triumvirate ; Lord Sumption, Dr John Lee and a choice of Simon Dolan, Lawrence Fox, Peter Hitchens, Professor Gupta, Janet Daley, Sir Graham Brady, Professor Heneghan and Toby!
Take your pick, but I’d definitely go for the first 2.
This isn’t serious but a reflection of sheer desperation on my part and many many others.
And ,for the Silly Season,which appears to have no end in 2020, Posh and Becks are holidaying in an exclusive retreat in a German forest, where they are partaking of oxygen inhalation therapy-daft, but maybe a consequence of designer mask addiction- digital detox and costly navel gazing.
Or you can have all of them and have a Decemvirate instead!
The more minds the better, the less chance that these wise people could ever fall into the kind of groupthink that has enraptured the tiny gang of ministers who are presently ruining Britain.
Good idea!
The Sanity Collective: for freedom, personal responsibility, rationality and life as it should be lived.
One huge problem I foresee is ridding the population of fear. Even if it was announced today that the dangers were completely exaggerated and that all life should go back to normal, I think a vast swathe of the population would still cower and hide and continue to wear masks. I hope I am wrong and people may say ‘oh I knew all along but was doing my bit’.
How safe does safe have to be? Just how traumatised and brainwashed are people? Will they ever behave as normal again?
Yes, some will never get over it. And some organisations will never get over it. Our govt and their advisors opened pandora’s box and I suspect they didn’t consider for a second the lasting damage they were about to do.
Which is why we need the full Royal Commission, and trials.
And that “I was only following orders” and “I didn’t know” not accepted as line of defence
Agree totally. I was discussing exactly this earlier with the OH. Those perspex screens will be a permanent feature now and I suspect many people will always wear masks when out shopping and denigrate people who don’t wear them. The split in society is bigger and more long lasting than than the Brexit conundrum.
Once you no longer have to wear them in law, there’s not a lot they can say.
Most will, some won’t. Blame those responsible for it.
There has been a bit of debate over the last few days about Anders Tegnell and whether he has been “got at” based on some of his recent statements.
There may be some cause for concern, but I hope not.
He is undoubtedly under immense pressure domestically and internationally. Any appearance of being overly blase gives his enemies a chance to attack him – we have seen this already with the leaked emails and accusations of attempting to cull the old. He has to be careful in his language.
Also it should be borne in mind that they never advocated a do-nothing approach – they were always on board with flattening the curve and controlling the spread. What they did right was to realise that measures needed to be sustainable over the long term, therefore better voluntary than compulsory, and the need to keep society going as normally as possible for the overall good of public health, that a vaccine was not a solution to be relied upon, and that zero-covid as an aim is futile and dangerous. Giesecke stated that the fatality was likely to end up similar to flu, but said a year or more was needed to judge.
They have been truly cautious, not reckless. It’s almost everyone else that has been reckless.
Kristi Noem in South Dakota got similar abuse and yet she kept that state open
Sweden is still pretty open compared to UK
And she probably has a lot more power than Tegnell
Simon Dolan reported very quickly after meeting Tegnell in Stockholm that the rumours had no basis in fact. I believe there had been a press conference just prior.
Indeed. I think he has been pretty consistent throughout
That’s why Sweden has done so well, ask the people politely to take reasonable hygiene precautions (they kind they could handle doing possibly forever) and they’ll try. Force obedience to insane rules and rewrite them 200 times, crush peoples rights, say “it’ll be over soon”, then keep extending it, that’s when people decide “f*** this”.
Yes, he met Tegnell after the press conference!
Tegnell is just being cautious. Not counting his chickens. I wonder if he’s aware of us, at LDS?
Tegnell is doing what true scientists should, not speaking with total certainty until he has the full facts. caution like this in our govrnment advisors would have spread the rest of the western world the chaos of the illegal lockdowns. Tegnell’s clearly confident that Sweden got it right, but will wait for proof (the rest of the world ruining itself and the casualties of lockdown finally becoming clear to even the zealots) before saying so. He’s not like Ferguon, who works from dodgy assumptions yet speaks as if he has a hotline to absolute truth.
Tegnell said he’d like to do more than he’d done. Not more oppression, more hygiene stuff. He might be wishing he’d done more to protect care homes, or encouraged mask wearing (though it probably doesn’t help), he wishes he’d asked for temporary voluntary closures of a few cluster producing workplaces, he’s not wishing he’d wrecked civil liberties and the economy by forcibly locking down healthy populations.
For those who may have missed it, this ramble around a shopping centre in Stockholm illustrates that Sweden is in a very different place compared to the UK :
https://youtu.be/jQat0vX-wjM
I’m in Sweden (as most of you know!). I think something that has not helped recently is that both Tegnell and Giesecke have said in press interviews that Sweden had a ‘sort of soft lockdown’. I do not know why they have started using this phrase – maybe Giesecke (who is working for the WHO) has been asked to do this, so as to keep the world off Sweden’s back (or for some other reason)?
Or maybe the men themselves believe that their approach was a kind of lockdown (even if not as other countries would understand the word)?
Everything in Sweden so far (with the exception of the 50 person limit) has been done in the form of recommendations. You might say that the elderly and vulnerable were cocooned, but they were clearly told that it would be best for them to limit their social contacts due to their risk and most chose to follow the advice. No one forced them though!
Once the various recommendations were made, companies/workplaces and so on then adapted to make it possible for people to follow those recommendations.
My personal experience was that people almost immediately minimised their use of public transport, worked from home, and initially at least, met fewer people for socialising. And used sanitiser when entering supermarkets. We were recommended not to travel between different areas of Sweden (this was particularly emphasised at Easter), so people did not. But it was up to individuals how much they wanted to isolate themselves otherwise.
Footfall in shops other than supermarkets decreased, so a lot of shops reduced their opening hours (opened an hour later and shut an hour earlier) and so things were much quieter. But by the beginning of the summer people began to relax, so now things are much more normal.
Oh, just by the way, the shopping photo Simon Dolan posted on his Twitter was from Stockholm’s equivalent of Oxford Street and also taken on the last Friday of the month, which is ‘payday’ here and when it is always more busy!
I’m interested in what you think, Carrie. I’ve heard a lot of people say that the Swedes are more conformist than the British and we could never be trusted to follow government advice like the Swedes have.
I spent all my summers (and many Christmases) in Sweden as a child, and never noticed my family there being substantially more conformist than my family here. Maybe that says more about my very middle class English background than my middle class Swedish one, but do you think our cultures are so different? They never seemed it to me
Trafalgar square yesterday. According to the media this morning, the police “cleared” the square (i.e. TSG in full riot gear making full assault) because the protesters were “not maintaining social distancing”
So, no violence, no anti-social behaviour. People were not 2 metres apart. If that is the only justification the authorities have for the police’s brutal action, then god preserve us.
Were all the BLM and XR protesters 2 metres apart?
Maybe the Police need it explained to them in England social distancing is not law, never has been, is not enforceable and was “conjured up out of nowhere” to quote Prof Robert Dingwall the “expert” and advisor” on SAGE.
Plod wasn’t social distancing from the start.
Just Plod making it up, as usual. At least they didn’t bother using horses yesterday. In case we frightened them, or something.
NHS App .
So flaws have already been found in the system,
Given that it is supposed to have cost £billions, did they not have a Business Analyst working on this?
What were the requirements?
Were the Use Cases identified?
Obviously not as this identified issue of past test recording is a specific identifiable Use Case that should have been specified.
Either these were not identified, or if they were, they were never followed through build test and implementation.
Matt says at £10bn it can’t be done and I agree with him!
It looks as though £10bn relates to the TnT systems. Which may actually be £12bn but its all from the m9ney tree so who gives a damn about a billion hither or yon.
The orginal app appears to have cost £11m and this ‘enhanced’ version and extra £35m – these figures my memory of a german article looking at the UK app Awkward Git posted a while back.
I’ll have to look for a source for the £35M figure. However, although it’s obviously more credible than £10Bn, I still find it difficult to believe that you could reasonably spend that amount on any IT project – let alone an app – in 3 months (roughly, going from when the in-house app was abandoned in favour of the Apple/Google solution). It’s probable that they’re paying a hefty whack to Apple/Google to licence their software, but that would properly be amortised over the life of the system and shouldn’t be included in the development costs (but in the running costs).
As for £10Bn on the entirety of the T&T system, it’s still, very, very hard to believe. Anything up and running that quickly would have to rely on off-the-shelf software with maybe some minor modifications/customisations. They have around 25k staff, the vast majority of whom are not on six-figure salaries. Off the shelf software does not cost a billion, even with 25k users (even with 100k users). It really doesn’t. So where has all of this money gone?
I wish Offlands had had a response to his FOI request. I’ll have to send one in myself I think.
As far as I can see, we have one of 3 things that have happened here (or a combination):
– Hancock has outright lied when asked the cost, presumably because he didn’t think the actual number sounded impressive enough
– the government procurement process has been criminally negligent and has done absolutely nothing to avoid spending huge, unjustifiable amounts of money. But in the order of at least 10 times the amount that they could possibly justify (probably more like 20x)
– there is some serious corruption at play and a lot of people have become rich beyond the dreams of avarice through this particular scheme
I know a few will likely say “yeah, so what else is new?” but I’m beginning to think that this could be hiding an absolutely earth-shaking scandal. I’m not a journalist, but any investigative journalist worth the name could potentially make their career on this and if the scandal is what it looks to me like it could be, this is the kind of thing that brings down a government and could start the whole narrative unravelling.
If the number just turns out to be flat wrong, then it will probably only mean a bit of a slap on the wrist for Hancock for being stupid (which he will claim instead of admitting to lying), so nothing to see here.
The software element simply cannot have cost billions, no matter how hard you try. Speaking as a Business Analyst employed in software development…
For those who missed it – more from Lord Gumption in the SM.
LORD SUMPTION denounces No10’s rule of muddle and authoritarianism
https://mol.im/a/8776267
What a fantastic article, pretty much sums up the whole last 6 months and backs up what most of us having been saying about the way forward.
NHS App .
Mentioned yesterday about getting an email from NHS urging me to download the App. Clearly this email is being issued to everyone whose GPs have their email .
So i have used the outlook option of reporting the email as Phishing. Theoretically Microsoft should note this and if enough people do it then the sender would be blocked.
If only!!!
I everyone marks it as junk then eventually the filters might start to automatically mark it as junk.
i think with outlook, if you mark it just as junk, then eventually if you do this a few times your own outlook junk filter will recognise it as junk and divert it to your junk folder. Using the phishing option on the junk drop down should send something back to MS to log the sender as a source of phishing emails
I was just thinking that its unlikely any manual investigation which is what I assume would be triggered in that case.
I was thinking at least when using outlook online although I realise many run the application locally – that they would use some sort of common junk filter that recognises if the vast majority mark something as junk and then assume its junk for everyone.
Thinking about it a little more the NHS is likely a customer that Microsoft is very keen to work with more and so I am sure they could get their addresses added to some sort of always accept list easily enough if such a thing does not already exist.
If the second wave is to shortly crash over our heads then why is the Nightingale hospital being decommissioned?
Security guards stopping students by force leaving their halls of residence in Manchester.
RULE BRITANNIA, LAND OF THE FREE,BRITONS NEVER, NEVER, NEVER WILL BE SLAVES?,?,?,?,?
I really struggle to understand why student would pay to be treated in this way. Why are they not already returning home and looking into legal action to get their fees returned. They are directly paying for their own oppression. At the end of the day they are technically adults and while they should never have been put in this position they are in this position. If they accept this and continue to fund their oppression its hard to have sympathy.
Burnam happy to have a ‘public health’ hostage crisis in his city is he?
Is it lawful imprisonment?
Cower Britannia, we cower from second waves, Britons surrendered all their rights as locked down slaves…
If the students stood together properly I doubt the guards would dare use force, for the guards it is just a job, they don’t want to go home injured.
The “face” of modern policing…
goons why do they all wear muzzles?
To avoid being identified on Youtube after they’ve bashed a few grannies.
Exactly why
In case they catch a cold off us disease-ridden, unwashed, stinking protestors.
It would be funny if some of them fainted while on duty as a result…
I personally think it is too late for Boris, but he does appear to be doing SOME good in the EU and tackling the BBC, Ofcom, etc spheres.
If he were looking for a way out of this very deep hole he’s dug he could do worse than hive off the whole running of the Covid fiasco the way his hero, Churchill, did in the War. He gave Lord Beaverbrook carte blanche to run war production, which arguably saved the country.
If Boris could bring himself to argue that currently what is on the No. 10 plate is just too much for one man, and a recovering Covid one at that, and hand over the entire Covid operation to ….. (insert name, but a hard bastard and a non-politician), then he might, just might, get away with it, even at this very late stage. Otherwise it’s going to be the bottle of whiskey and the service revolver solution.
it’s going to be the bottle of whiskey and the service revolver solution.
Do the services have revolvers these days? Someone could get hurt. Maybe he could borrow some of their nail varnish remover and gas himself to death with that.
Any “good” he might be doing is outweighed countless times over by the damage already done
He is done – I had a phone conversation with my MP on Friday – never spoke or met him before and even in that context he said as much. His feeling then was that Johnson would make concessions over the weekend on the Brady amendment and that would quell the rebellion for now. But would appear he isn’t backing down – this is going to be a critical week – just hope the 1922 and backbenchers have got the bottle for what’s ahead. As Hitchens says we have to bombard them now with simple unemotive e-mails – the backlash will hurt them too.
What is meant by concessions though? Verbal assurances mean nothing – he could easily backtrack once the extension to the act is voted through. Remember he has already revealed he is working for the WHO and Bill G.. so the app and so on will likely stay..
Agreed . He wasn’t explicit but the context of the discussion was specifically the need for parliament to urgently gain control and oversight over what was happening – he was very aware of the fact that there are now nearly 400 SI in place. I think for Johnson to basically tell Brady and 1922 to do one now is an very very high wire strategy. He was clearly very sceptical – we are in area that has had huge influx of tourists from all over the UK since June and still has one of the lowest levels of case prevalence.
The Webley and whiskey is the honourable way out, Johnson is not an honourable man.
“Boris … does appear to be doing SOME good”
I fell off my chair laughing at this indication of a reservoir of unfathomability gullibility.
No wonder the country is where it is!
He is NOT doing a good job with regard to the WHO and Bill G though…
If the Police broke up the London demonstration because of lack of social distancing why don’t they close down every supermarket in the country?
Fair point!
Don’t give them ideas!
Well – anyone who was watching the live feed knows its total bollocks, anyway. I wonder how many of the police actually realize that they are being made to look like saps and idiots in being asked to swallow this nonsense to do their job.
Some of those I chatted with yesterday and last week seemed very aware of this. Could almost hear them grinding their teeth as they almost, but just not quiiiiite stepped across that line into scepticism. (Probably not wanting to get too close in case they had to swing a baton at me later)
What kind of a country have we become when arrogant bullying is seen as the proper function of Ministers? Ex-Supreme Court judge LORD SUMPTION denounces No10’s rule of muddle and authoritarianismBy LORD SUMPTION FOR THE MAIL ON SUNDAY
PUBLISHED: 22:05, 26 September 2020 | UPDATED: 09:10, 27 September 2020
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We are witnessing the slow demise of one of the great conceits of the modern world: the notion that the big-hearted State can protect us against every misfortune and that human beings are mere tools of State policy to be pushed about like pawns on a chessboard according to the changing impulses of its ministers.
+9
The attempt to control the spread of Covid-19 by coercion has failed. It has failed in Britain. It has failed throughout Europe and North America.
It has failed in Israel. It has failed in Australia. The measures which these countries have taken have varied in their severity, but not in their outcome.
What is the plan, now that the risk of overwhelming the NHS has subsided? Where is the exit route? These are all important questions. But all we get for answers are sub-Churchillian blather from the Prime Minister and snarling threats from Mr Hancock
Sumption is a fantastic advocate for rationality. I particularly lighted on this :
“With a few exceptions (such as those living in multi-generational households), they can shelter themselves if they wish. Many of them will prefer to take the risk. Those who have less time remaining to them may rationally prefer quality of life to quantity.
They may prefer to hug their grandchildren than to treat them as angels of death. Why should they not be allowed to make that choice for themselves, instead of having some distant minister make it for them? “
A core principle.
https://liberty.e-activist.com/page/67412/action/1?locale=en-GB&fbclid=IwAR1XS8_5T6lYHgirh6JMc8fUoj3A8lT1MGlW3dkskq2Y3S3Au5JLn6n7-yo
Re T& T app.
At the end of the article about the flaws it states that users cannot “check-out” of a venue when leaving.
The one day I experienced this Stasi Method working in a coffeeshop I was wondering about that. We had quite a few people who bothered to check-n, but actually only stayed in the building for less than 5 minutes.
Considering the government advise is the risk is very low by spending less than 15minutes near a “contamination”, this really is futile.
Among the many things I can’t fathom is the check-in function. Why would that be necessary for the strange individuals who are using the app who will be notified if they have been near another plague-ridden human in any case?
“Strange individuals who are using the app”
I agree, but I think it’s going to get more difficult to avoid it. From a conversation with local pub manager yesterday, I gather that (amazingly) the “check in” functionality of the app works better than the commercial QR code option that they were using before and so they’re asking people to use the NHS app now. Currently, scribbling a name and number on a piece of paper is still an option, but I can easily see that being phased out.
Just received a text message from NHStracing
They use my mobile number that is on my NHS file.
Do you remember when the information you gave a doctor or medical institution was sacrosanct? Then all of a sudden the fact that Granny was vulnerable could be shared with the supermarkets.
Exactly the reason I have not permitted my GP to share my data to the NHS central spine.
Whilst appreciating what you’re saying, from my viewpoint as a practitioner in an urgent care centre, having access to your medical history would be useful as it contains information such as allergies and drug history as well as any existing conditions.
wasnt that covered by the NPfIT project the NHS ran some years ago at vast expense so any practitioner had access to your records centrally.. Or did they make a balls up of that aswell
They ballsed that up good and proper. But luckily, they did it at eye watering expense over a period of several years.
Which, if I’m conscious, I’m quite capable of giving myself. And if I’m not you probably wouldn’t know my name anyway to find my details.
Failing that I also have a spouse (who just happens to be a doctor as well).
As for existing conditions they don’t seem to be of much concern to the medical profession at present, as my necessary scans and investigations together with consultant appointments for my heart valve replacement and aortic aneurysm repair have been cancelled (?) indefinitely.
Personally, your history would be of concern to me if you presented with certain symptoms. Other than that I understand what you’re saying.
Yes – that’s the balance. As a frequent flyer, I can say that the controlled professional sharing of information has enormous benefits.
Has taking a full medical and social history fallen out of favour with our current crop of heathcare practitioners?
If you have willingly given your mobile number to your GP then they and they alone should be able to contact you – any NHS messages should be routed via the surgery because you only gave them the number.
GPs sharing numbers with supermarkets is a breach of privacy and likely GDPR..
Yes I got one too. Blocked the number.
me too
What is the number that the track and traitors ring peple from? All well and good knowing you blocked it, but so we can block it too, what is it?
Me too
I had an email today too, ditto using the email on my NHS file. Deleted it at warp speed. Don’t think my phone will support it anyway.
Same here.Never doing it
One million young people could need “urgent help” to protect their futures from the coronavirus pandemic, the Prince of Wales has warned, as he said the “enormous challenges” testing society are reminiscent of the Seventies.
If we’d treated the virus as we did those of 1957, 1969 and 2018 (and probably others) young people would not have been affected at all. Not at all.
they need urgent help to protect their futures from the prince of wales
What is that privileged f.wit on about??? Compared to the current shit-show, the 70s were a paradise. I was there.
Certainly freer. Though if you wanted a hot evening meal it did help if you had a gas oven rather than an electric one. Admittedly that was only sometimes.
They have NOT been affected by the virus!
“lockdown sceptics are rarely featured on the BBC”-if Toby means David Icke and Piers Corbyn he’s correct but Carl Heneghan and David Spiegelhalter are often on Radio 4
I think that’s been a more recent development. And there’s been little exposure for sceptic voices on BBC TV, ITV on peak time shows, where the audience is highest. But it’s improving.
However, as someone here pointed out, it is well known in propagandist circles that permitting some contrarian voices to speak in a controlled context helps to reinforces the mainstream narrative. The BBC is the master of allowing people to say a sentence or two but then immediately countering it with a ‘balancing’ viewpoint. They even sometimes invite a ‘fact checker’ to sit in on an interview!
Indeed. While this tactic may be working for them up to a point, I think on balance the case for dissent is so strong that in the main exposure for articulate sceptics who stick to the core messages works in our favour.
Email below sent to my MP spurred on by you guys and Peter Hitchens. Thank for the nudge. Even if only a small seed of doubt is sown then it will have been worth it. Please feel free to recycle.
Hang in there fellow Lockdown Sceptics. The truth will out.
—
Dear [xxxx]
This is the first time in my 50 years of life that I have written directly to my MP.
I write to urge you to seriously consider voting against the renewal of Coronavirus legislation in Parliament this coming week.
The measures taken are excessive, vastly disproportionate to the risk faced and extremely destructive in a multitude of ways (economic, health, societal0. In short, the cure is far far worse than the disease.
Please don’t just take my word for this. Instead, look at the many articles and interviews by highly respected individuals saying similar, such as:
– Professor Senetra Gupta, Professor of Theoretical Epidemiology, Oxford University
– Professor Carl Heneghan, Professor of Evidence-Based Medicine and Director, Oxford University
– Sucharit Bhakdi, Emeritus Head of the Institute for Medical Microbiology and Hygiene at the Johannes-Gutenberg-Universität in Mainz, Germany
– Professor John Lee, retired pathologist, formerly Clinical Professor of Pathology at Hull York Medical School
– Professor Karol Sikora, Founding Dean of the Medicine School, Buckingham University and former chief of the WHO Cancer Program
– Professor Michael Levitt, Stanford Prof. of Biophysics, Cambridge PhD and DSc, 2013 Chemistry Nobel Laureate (complex systems)
– Professor John P.A. Ioannidis, Professor of Medicine (Stanford Prevention Research) of Epidemiology and Population Health
– Professor Jayanta Bhattacharya, Professor of Medicine, Senior Fellow at The Stanford Institute for Economic Research Policy
– Daniel Hannan, Writer, journalist and former Conservative MEP
– Richard Drax, Conservative MP for South Dorset
The above list is not exhaustive but their views should give anyone of a rational mind pause for thought, regardless of pressure from the Conservative Whips that you will no doubt get to support the bill.
There is no need to respond, I’m sure that you have other constituents issues to deal with including economic and health hardships brought on by the governments over reactive measures.
I do urge you however to think long and hard before supporting the bill, which I truly believe will be seen by future historians and generations as the greatest mistake ever made by those in power.
Regards
Good work. Liberty have an ‘Email my GP’ tool for those not wanting to write a personal letter.
https://liberty.e-activist.com/page/67412/action/1?locale=en-GB&fbclid=IwAR1XS8_5T6lYHgirh6JMc8fUoj3A8lT1MGlW3dkskq2Y3S3Au5JLn6n7-yo
Thanks great and easy tool to use
Done it, in addition to the 3 other letters I’ve written in September.
Just sent your letter to my MP thanks.
Same, thank you.
Excellent, especially the penultimate paragraph which might cause a small light bulb to come on in the MP’s mind (if they have one of their own).
Keep this handy for posterity, it’s part of what is being wiped off the BLM websites what w believe page all over them told.
This si what they have been rumbled on and trying to hide.
Their “about-us” page is now a Not Found but it’s still very much available via archive.org — and I think the removal is almost more damning than the text itself, in terms of highlighting that they themselves are engaged in a deliberate misrepresentation of their goals. Before they removed it, you might have blamed slack or compromised journalists, with BLM itself not hiding it.
I hope the new BBC chair stops Match of the Day showing the teams kneeling on every game. We know they do it … We dont want to see it every game!!!
Also at the last protest there was a banner for a BLM UK – and lo and behold https://blacklivesmatter.uk/ show this disclaimer on their web page
Disclaimer: We are not affiliated with either Black Lives Matter USA or political arm of the Black Lives Matter Coalition UK associated and purported to be affiliated with BLM USA.
Smacks a little bit of the well known dispute between the People’s Front of Judea and the Judean People’s Front .
However you try and frame it, it is still the same divisive racist claptrap
It’ll all stop if they get the crowds back in. I can’t see the Turf Moor, Bramhall Lane, Ellend Rd crowd etc reacting well. It’s the same as the last night of the proms, all well & good signalling your virtue to an empty Albert Hall, quite another matter with 5,000 union jack clad promenaders looking at you!
“compromised” without a doubt.
https://web.archive.org/web/20200606020115/https://blacklivesmatter.com/what-we-believe/
AG: The text you quoted is here in the web archive. I used 6th June as that is the day of the mainly peaceful riot in London. Curiously, if you go to blacklivesmatter.com in the archive there is no clickable link that I could find to take you to the page I referenced above. Fortunately I had bookmarked it so was able to type in the URL.
Can anyone with deeper knowledge of the archive see what is going on here?
Their GoFundMe page is still an inspiring read for those interested with “a commitment to dismantle imperialism, capitalism, white-supremacy, patriarchy and the state structures that disproportionately harm black people in Britain and around the world”
https://www.gofundme.com/f/ukblm-fund
As an American website I read now and again said “they’ve been rumbled”.
Does anyone know the stats on the prevelance of the common cold (from one of the many cold viruses)?
I’ve developed a cold this weekend – runny nose, scratchy throat, muzzy head – as I usually do 2 or 3 times each autumn/winter. The OH also has it but much milder than me, again as per usual. He goes out and about with work so challenges his immune system daily, whereas I mostly work from home.
It’s a cold, no doubt at all, but if I was a covid paranoic I would be assuming covid and trotting off to get a test.
It got me wondering about the relative likelihood of catching a cold v covid and thought such a statistic would be a useful one to throw at the covid obsessives.
This is quite a big deal. If colds start spreading through population as much as normal then surely this completely destroys all the pro mask propaganda once and for all.
Not really, they’ll just blame people not wearing them and double down.
They would be wrong to a make that case. Even if only half the population were wearing masks when they should that ought to reduce transmission considerably- assuming masks worked.
Enough people ARE wearing face coverings for them to be an effective “circuit-breaker”, to borrow a phrase. But as you say, that’s assuming masks work.
That’s Mayo’s point. You should still see a reduction in some shape or form. And we haven’t with flu numbers
Well they aren’t stopping Flu. 110 Cv deaths last week and 1200 Flu deaths (but we’ll only ruin the economy for the first one)
But we know that they don’t work.
How many references do you need?
My very highly paid fd’s answer to that on friday was ‘It’s because people arent wearing masks – like you CGL’ – add self satisfied smirk and you get the gist. Very close to handing in notice.
When my children returned to school we all got quite a nasty cold. My three year old had shrugged it off after a day with a runny nose but the rest of us were pretty bad for the best part of a week and not 100% two weeks later.
Having had children in school for many year I know this is quite normal. From what I have heard there are many people coming down with colds at the moment.
From memory I remember reading that an adult catches a cold on average 2-3 times a year. From my experience if you have children in nursery/primary school you can expect double that.
I did wonder if my three year old might have recovered so quickly as he still drinks a bottle of formula before bed which provides 100% RDA of his Vit D amongst other things while the rest of us eat a diet that largely avoids most Vit D fortified foods. As the sun is diminishing and our normal outdoor activities have been largely shut down by the government it seems quite possible the rest of us are becoming vit D deficient so I do give the rest of the family a daily vit D supplement now.
The RDA for vitamin D is just enough to prevent rickets. Suggest you invest in a good vitamin D supplement for all of you.
Download the 14 page condensed report (will also provide youth information on the dosage)
https://www.stopcovidcold.com/covid-research.html
All the kids we know in school caught colds within a week of starting…
A change in the weather has always resulted in colds. There is nothing sinister about it but will surely result in calls for isolating us all.
As cold symptoms are caused by a multitude of viruses, I would suggest that the probability of it being a “cold” is significantly higher than it being CoViD19. Runny nose (coryza) is not a symptom of CoViD19 (at the moment).
Still, I guess a lot of people with a runny nose run to get a test done. Although it is not on the official list of symptoms.
Me too with a cold, have barely done anything this week but still caught it. I seem to remember that rhinoviruses are several times more infectious than coronavirus, and they are more prevalent at this time of year.
You would no doubt test positive for Covid. The common cold and Covid are from the same family.
https://www.marktaliano.net/an-anonymous-nurse-speaks-out-via-gareth-williams/
Some colds are caused by coronavirus but rhinovirus is also a cause.
I would not go near a test or the app with a barge poll
btw: Here’s a problem with the NHS COVID-19 app
First only the exposure notification is secret; since it uses the
google apple protocol. But once exposure notification occurs, there is nothing to stop the phone telling the track and tracers your id, you would become enmeshed in the track and trace system merely for getting notification of a possible exposure: best advice ; install on cheap phone with random credentials, i.e use a burner or turn it all off.
Another political party? Really?
No, what I would like to see is someone with the maturity and patience to talk to all the political parties, individuals, movements etc etc and get them all to join together in one new organisation. That would really make a difference.
Amazing. We are all desperate for a new political party that can challenge the government and also give an alternative to Conservative and Labour. However when one is established (reminder very tough and expensive to do), lets bash them because he is not mature or patient enough. WHAT????
I’m not talking about the three traditional parties that have led us into this disgusting situation. I am talking about the four or five existing alternatives. You want a sixth? Oh, that’ll solve everything!
You must be aware that we have a voting system where several small parties all just get wiped out.
No, let’s get the existing alternative parties, plus people like Nigel Farage, Lord Sumption, Kate Hoey, Frank Field etc into one party, or at least one union of parties.
What I want to see is one, and only one, point of opposition in each constituency so that the three traditional parties get wiped out instead.
not a chance.. remember a few years ago Anne Widdicombe tried to organise the parties into getting together to initiate a non political review of the NHS to try and reform it from the ground up.. That got nowhere .,.. which is why we still have the same mess now
So let’s give up, is that what you’re saying?
We need one point of opposition or this will continue.
The problem is we have a one party state.There is no political opposition
I saw this letter on Peter Hitchens’ Twitter account. I thought it was rather fine
Obviously the Baptist clergy are a group of uncaring, selfish, Granny killers….
Was it published in the Guardian?
Daily Telegraph, 25 Sep.
Thank you
This is in contrast to the latest notification from our priest where he urges more discipline in our attitude to the regulations. Considering there is only 20% of the congregation attending, less weekdays, not sure how further away he intends to space us in the church. Needless to say, I will be again emailing him about my concerns over his response.
Out of interest, do churches have to have QR codes?
That’s the one I mentioend earlier to the guy above who wanetd to find a more scptical church to go to.
As of this morning, 41,971 people in the UK have officially died of a positive test for SARS-COV-2.
It’s not really possible to say anything more detailed than this as there doesn’t seem to be any tracking of how people actually died.
I don’t even think that number is true. A lot weren’t tested and if they had symptoms it was put as Covid on the death certificate. All the numbers (positive tests, hospital admissions, deaths) are completely meaningless.
there was some analysis weeks ago and it came out with a figure of under 4000 as the number of people that died from covid.
As we know the 40.000+ is people who have died of anything within 28 days of a positive test. (the 28 days limit only brought in a month or so ago – previously any positive test counted) or where covid has been mentioned on the death certificate
I think that just showed people that died without any other pre existing conditions.
What I’d like to know is the symptoms or complications specific to the disease COVID19 that ultimately leads to death. These 4000 people presumably died in a similar way to each other. If so, how many of the rest died in a similar way? If there is no commonality between how people die then how is it possible to say they all died of the same thing?
It’s not good enough to say somebody died of COVID just because they tested positive or it was suspected.
Any statistical analysis would have to take into account excess deaths. There were lot of excess deaths in April/May and Covid is really the only explanation. However, one should look at excess deaths over a year to understand whether Covid is simply picking off vulnerable people a few weeks earlier than might otherwise be the case.
I think if decisions are being made that costs lives and livelihoods then they should be made using crystal clear data and not just inferences and projections. Why were autopsies banned and why is there no real detail being collected in how people actually die?
Have you read this article?
https://www.marktaliano.net/an-anonymous-nurse-speaks-out-via-gareth-williams/
Sure it was the test that killed them? Are they using arsenic or something?
<teasing>
https://twitter.com/darrengrimes_/status/1309500338572066819?s=20
Some of the comments underneath are quite amusing as always. One of the negative comments unironically uses the phrase ‘This applies to the whole country, the needs of the many outweigh the needs of the few.’ which is exactly what we have been saying on here against lockdown.
I can’t stand the sheer cruelty to our elderly folk. At their time of life every moment with their families is precious to them. It’s heartbreaking.
They are doing this to any group that is vulnerable – people in care homes, students, women in maternity wards.
At least number 6 didn’t have to wear a mask in the village
He did have to spend a little bit of time wearing a plastic/rubber “Rover” though.
“…the forced wearing of face coverings which publicly signal both surrender to the state and acceptance of the utopian, unscientific policy which guides that state.”
The mask is a Gessler’s hat.
At best.
https://www.thetimes.co.uk/article/gesslers-hat-lxwhv6gc2gj
More likely, it is also dangerous to ones own and everyone elses health:
It definetely prevents a strengthening of the immune system through limiting the usual and necessary exchange of germs, which alone will likely lead to an increase in flu cases now, it most definetely creates many various bacterial infections for the wearer, it harms many peoples psyche- and civil rights and democracies- it also probably INCREASES the coronavirus’ spread, by making people ignore SD and by making them inhale their own virus deeper again, turning a little infected non-infectious person into a more infected infectuous one, and, above all, it increases CO2 concentration and reduces the one of oxygen, with serious long term and even fatal consequences, in particular for children.
https://www.reitschuster.de/post/geruechte-ueber-zweite
n-masken-tod-eines-kindes/
https://youtu.be/R5FjKIpkvIE
It is also an illegal medical experiment as per the Nuremberg code, and mandatory mask mandates
must therefore alone immediately be abolished!
In particular in the land of a certain Josef Mengele.
https://mobile.twitter.com/northerness/status/1298247977916661760?s=20
Brilliant comment. I just wish people would realise the harm they are doing to themselves by wearing masks. I think the government wants a sicklier nation so they can enforce the vaccine on us, I can’t think why else they would do something so irresponsible.
It brightened my morning reading about Laurence Fox. The DT literally ablaze with joyous comments. Finally it looks likely I have found a new home for my vote.
http://laurencefoxparty.nationbuilder.com/
He’s named the party after himself? That can’t be right? That’s Trump-level narcissism. Tell me that’s wrong. Certainly no home for my vote, especially since I want someone who actually cares about this dystopian nightmare, rather that putting eye-candy pictures of themselves about.
I read the article in the Telegraph and that’s a temporary name until they get the actual one registered and recognised.
Loads of dissenting voices on TV today looking at the vids on Guido. Noice.
Radio
From last Monday
Starting at 25minutes in Vernon Coleman talks to Richie Allen about the Witty and Vallance show and their graph to-the-moon.
https://youtu.be/ytxEhs5BULA
Oh no!! Going into town to shop on the market was the last bastion of freedom available. Do they want to kill off our markets too?
yes
The Boris impression was excellent but wasted advertising a cookery programme.
Pity about the diversion into hobby-horse territory today. Celebrating the appointment of the essence of the combination of corrupt political patronage and corrupt crap journalism in the shape of Moore and Dacre isn’t going to do anything for any cause – and certainly will undermine the credibility of any cohesive attack on the Covid narrative.
That they will be patronised by Mr Toad is the mark of Cain, anyway.
if these appointments stop the BBC from promoting wall to wall covid scaremongering that is prolonging the lockdown then to report on it on a lockdown sceptics blog is relevant.
Of course they won’t. Both are shills for the Tory Party – not serious people. They represent precisely the problem of political influence on the BBC.
Dacre must be amongst the top ten most baleful influences on Britain in the last half-century. ‘Woke’ nonsense is way behind.
If…. they might, they might not. Still relevant to discuss on here. . And the problem is not political influence on the BBC, Right wing think they are left wing. Left wing think they are right wing.
It is a BBC state of mind that is the problem – one that is not in tune with the majority of the population.
I think thee and me are coming at this from different sides but agree that there is an issue there
Thank goodness for Carl Heneghan:
https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-8777515/Oxford-professor-urges-UK-follow-Sweden-PAY-infected-freshers-trace-contacts.html
Somebody needs to stop the imprisonment of students. By all accounts they are a very vulnerable group given their age, unfamiliarity with their new environments, and their absolute inability to challenge the diktats of the VCs and the admin blob supporting them. The Children’s Commissioner and Office of Students must intervene NOW, before there are deaths.
University Students are not children; they are adults.
Don’t agree. They may not be children but they are still very vulnerable as a cohort of young adults. They are away from the parental home for the first time and subject to financial and relationship pressures, to say nothing of the academic pressure which can be immense.
Hmm, emulate Sweden by paying them for contact tracing – I will have to look into that, because I did not know we were doing that over here.. Might be a new thing though..
Sweden pays people their wages for 2 weeks if they are off ill with CV19.
The question is, which students will be brave enough to say rather than “put mental health first, let us out”, instead “we’ve put mental health first, we’re coming out”.
The Chinese takeaway I deliver for has a number of elderly/frail and unhealthy vulnerable looking types who come to the shop to collect food – the face mask policy is putting these people in danger – and here’s why….
Other customers arriving at the shop don masks that have likely been used multiple times and are probably laden with pathogens, bacteria, fungi, etc. These are transferred to the customers fingers and then to the shop front door handle as they enter.
Along comes one of our vulnerable customers, who pay for their food and sanitise their hands before leaving the shop – using the ‘bio hazard’ door handle – hopefully masks won’t kill – but they probably do somewhere.
Front page of the Mail
“Piers Morgan… How the world went nuts” (he is promoting a new book)
I think the answer to that is “Watching Piers Morgan”
As annoying as he is, I’d love him ‘onside’. He’s become a real thorn in the government’s side.
Here we go – another David Icke moment, FFS!
How to demolish credibility in two easy moves this morning.
Leeds lockdown.
I can honestly say that I haven’t watched, listened to or read any mainstream news for the past year or more. Consequently, I haven’t subjected myself to any of the tidal waves of covid porn that has so infected those unfortunate souls who devour every item of news that can bombard their ears and devour their eyes. No wonder many of them have that lost, fearful glaze peering above their ragged and distorted face nappies.
Mrs Hopkins is the same. However, much as I try to tell her that the TV weather forecasts are no real arbiter of when she should hang out her washing (look out the window is best I say!) she insists on viewing the late night BBC offering. Sometimes she catches the remnants of the local news as she did last night which resulted in this following exchange this morning:
Mrs H: Did you know that Leeds is now in Lockdown?
Me: No,
Mrs H: How do you think that will affect us as we come under Leeds?
Me: Is there a sentry, marshal. police officer or some other useless jobsworth permanently stationed at the bottom of our drive?
Mrs H: No
Me: Is there any of the above outside any of our neighbours houses and in particular the ones who we visit?
Mrs H: No
Me: Have you ever seen a marshall, etc. etc. parading around our town or anywhere near where we live?
Mrs H: No
Me: What other aspects of the ‘lock down’ did you catch that we can ignore?
Mrs H: Don’t know!
Me: Good—Nothing changes, life goes on. Act normal, be normal, sod ’em!
Stay calm and carry on!
Anecdotally, for me the mood has changed. Got denied entry in a pub last night for the first time due to not having a mask.
Did you not say you were exempt?
Yep. He told me I needed a card and I said I didn’t have one and although I could’ve argued the case, the desire to give them my business had evaporated by that point. This is in a bar that I’ve been to quite a bit over the years, I was rather angry!
Don’t blame you—they’re the losers!
Remember that. When they need a favour in the future, because you never know, remember how they treated you.
This will be how it goes from now on.
I’m Irish so we have form (stupid or otherwise) on this.
Did you say that there is no requirement for a card but if he thinks there is, to point to what says that? But as you say don’t give them your business. I’ve given up on pubs for now -what pleasure is there to be gained by being in an establishment where people enter in muzzles, leave in muzzles and put muzzles on to go for a waz? It’s like something out of a horror film. Even before last week, many pubs were telling you where to sit.
Hehe indeed. This one was particularly bad, perspex screens hanging up all over the place, quite surreal.
I was similarly met with belligerency at a country pub yesterday. From whence comes this desire? What was acceptable last week is criminal this week. Have they no ability to think for themselves?
Why should they wish to be enforcers? This is the joke? Johnson issues these edicts but hasn’t got anywhere near enough police officers to enforce the. I’ve been back in Blighty fours weeks and I’ve yet to see either a policeman or a police car.
He’s turning England is to a version of the GDR.
It’s the fine levied in businesses for not following the rules, I’m sure of it. In reality, they are not responsible for enforcing mask wearing (beyond a requirement to put up a poster or something at the door), but they’re confused and think they are. There can’t be a hospitality business in the country that could afford a £5k fine at the moment.
Sounds like a good marriage to me!
Fifty years and counting—we were mere children when we wed
I like this Heritage Party and its new leader – great choice.
Anyone who gives Khan a good kicking is likely made of the right stuff.
think I’m muddled between reclaim and heritage parties – thought they were same thing
Laurence Fox is launching a new political party called Reclaim to take on the oppressive anti-free speech PC culture. Good! I hope it will back Lockdown Scepticism as well.
As said – riding other sectarian hobby-horses will be the same as doing a David Icke and undermine wider credibility. Just what is not needed.
Big mistake that this side-issue topped the Trafalgar Square demonstration in this edition – rather symbolic, I fear.
The “as well” part of your comment, and his political party, are what disturbs me. Lockdown scepticism is far more important and relevant to our lives.
Yes, our street market was on yesterday, and stall holders were wearing masks. There were two of the Covid marshals out and about too. There were around 30 or 40 XR protesters staging a silent walk through the shopping centre. Not many in masks in the street, thankfully.
To cheer you all up…
https://youtu.be/QzYySCB_DMc
Much respect to Laurence Fox for getting stuck in. As Niall Ferguson the historian has said – if you don’t like the institutions that you’ve got then build some new ones. Toby has already done this with great success with the Free Speech Union. Exciting times.
The Moore / Dacre thing is just noise in my humble opinion. I have no doubt that they will be popular appointees amongst some and would challenge hard but both the BBC and Ofcom are like oil tankers which won’t be turned without a massive cull in the engine rooms below deck – that will not happen. The BBC is finished not because oldies like me don’t use it anymore but because our kids don’t and won’t. Just like the problem Guinness has had for years, their typical demographic customer is dying.
Laurence Fox has a site for those that are interested https://laurencefoxparty.nationbuilder.com/
I’m afraid the mention of Moore and Dacre will poison any credibility – my point. A dangerous irrelevance when there are real battles to fight.
I think you make a good point. They are far too partisan in the other direction. An over correction / reaction is rarely a good thing. Just like lockdowns!
yip, dyed in wool MI5 lackies, they both should be hung for treason after all the poisonous lies they have printed about Covid this last six months.
Thanks I have just signed up for their newsletter.
Latest wizz from Hapless Hancock, https://twitter.com/MattHancock/status/1310156523277094912
Giving 11000 i-pads to elderly infirmed people with hearing difficulties! the old lady I (used to) visit in a care home cannot even use the phone, let alone an i-pad!
Most people in care homes are miserable and being kept in against their will. Fact.
Interesting more than half of the people on his twitter feed challenges Hancock
That’s just typical of Hancock. He believes the solution to everything is technology.
All along there has been a complete lack of humanity in the handling of this sorry episode.
I worked in IT for 30+ years and came across people like him, so completely lacking in empathy and basic social nous that you couldn’t let them near an actual living, breathing, sentient human being (as opposed to their own nerdy, spectrum-boy ilk).
Will anybody be allowed to get close enough to teach them how to use one?
GOOD POINT, wasted on the so called experts.
They make handy tea trays.
I’ve posted this before but there are 9 million people in the UK who are classed as functionally illiterate. Add to that the numbers who are literate but are elderly, infirm, Technology ignorant and/or technophobe and the numbers will be swelled to in excess of 12 million?
This is also why the drive to a cashless society will leave very many people really struggling. But do the government care? Like hell they do.
This is probably an urban legend but as a famous Hollywood film director said “Never let the truth spoil a good story”
The probable UL is that on the front of income tax returns (ask your parents or grandparents) were the instructions: “Blind people, see page 6”
That will be useful when this is the reality https://youtu.be/u5HmtEMRlpA
Dr. Fauci’s cage has been rattled by Dr. Atlas. Good!
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fqLtIY1gAHg
Decent interview with Prof Mark Woolhouse this morning on Andrew Marr show. Putting out the message that lockdowns don’t actually stop or eliminate the virus, it just defers it. Eventually even for the thickest of zealots the penny might drop….
Cheers for the heads up, link here: https://www.bbc.co.uk/programmes/p08sp9yz
Charities apparently on board. I must say, their voices are not being heard. Don’t know whether HM govt are stifling them with online algorithms or not…
https://www.independent.co.uk/news/uk/politics/coronavirus-act-liberty-human-rights-charities-b601307.html
Tony Heller on usual form
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VPnohEZqS2Y
‘Stop Press: Oliver Dowden, the Culture Secretary, has warned museums and galleries to stop removing statues and other artefacts or risk losing government subsidies, and the Department for Education has issued guidance to teachers saying they should teach children that woke “cancel culture” and “no-platforming” is an attack on free speech and has no place in British society. Is the Conservative Party finally going into battle in the culture war?’
Perhaps this is also why they’re so reluctant to bail out the theatres – long a hotbed of woke productions and anti-Brexit new plays – with Sunak going as far as to call the entire sector unviable during his not-the-Budget speech.
Agree
I dont get it, the theatres have every reason to see this government as the enemy, if they’re so happy to put on protest plays in normal times why not make the very act of a play a protest today. Open in defiance, if enough do the government can’t stop them. How can people so keen to be thorns in the tories’ side resist the desire to tell Boris where to stick his rules.
Steve Baker MP: Liberty Dies Like This
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rzNRgCd_sWk
Magnificent scenes.
https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-8777387/Police-battle-disperse-crowds-partying-street-10pm-closing-time-new-Covid-rules.html
The evidence of your own eyes (and vast amounts of alcohol) is bringing the country round.
Can’t be long now.
A development absolutely nobody could have predicted.
Yes, good to see some pushback. On the downside, this might be enough to make the PM decide just to close down licensed premises for the foreseeable. Nickla would follow suit, naturally,
I actually think that would be a good thing (in the short term). The crazier it gets, the more people will hopefully see that the emperor has no clothes on!
Wonder how many publicans would be brave enough to become speakeasies? A culture of constant disobedience, with even the cops in on it as they want drinks at the end of the shift, could develop.
Brilliant stuff. That’s cheered me up. People just want to be free to do want they want, to have a good time … who’d have thought it!
Someone needs to start a chant of “Fuck the New Normal” at one of these gatherings. Could be fertile ground…
Re that Matt Lucas sketch. A classic example of BBC brainwashing dressed up a trailer. Yes I like Matt Lucas, he is one clever funny guy, yes its funny, his impression of Boris is very good.
However what this trailer is saying is, silly old Boris, the country is totally destroyed but don’t worry The Great British Bake of is on again. Look the stars are back to normal, they aren’t dead not even Pru, what a relief!
So don’t think about all the bad stuff going on, your weekly hit of baking bollocks is coming, silly old bumbling Boris. Look the team are all happy! It’s all fine.
I wonder if the master-bakers will be wearing face-nappies?
Absolute Charlies. I hate the BBC.
er. its on channel 4 .. has been for a few years since it became too expensive for BBC
but you can still hate BBC for it
I hate channel four too, shows what I know about telly.
too right. C4 is equally bad.
someone has to pay for Paul Hollywood’s Ferraris
what i cannot forgive is the additional bake off programme featuring John Sargeant …. sorry . Jo Brand .
I rather enjoyed it. Especially the little sign behind Paul Hollywood – ‘Daily Proving’.
Interesting article by Pru Leith in yesterday’s Telegraph describing the lengths that they went to to film the program.
I’m wondering whether the university thing might be the straw that breaks the camel’s back – even my colleagues in Champaign socialist central are getting worked up about it. Certainly a way to put the back up the professional middle classes (and the mask rules in pubs/eateries and lack of theatres is starting to put the nark up many of my colleagues). One of my colleagues is particularly upset about the way his daughter is being treated up at one of the Scottish universities. Interestingly, as a historical quirk we have a ‘colony’ of co-workers who did their PhD’s at St Andrews – to a man and woman they are not impressed. I get the impression from university collaborators that many see this situation as an opportunity to poke departmental deans and VC’s in the eye and cause some trouble, rather than a genuine concern for public health.
On another note, I saw that Farrar of the Wellcome trust was mouthing off on twitter last night – I think he also has an opinion piece in the Times today. I loved the way wellcome trust Fellow Adam Kucharski immediately retweets and adds his own tuppence worth – got to keep the funders happy eh!! It’s interesting that on my campus the most ridiculous rules and policies are all pushed by managers/directors closely associated with the Wellcome trust. My particular institute doesn’t have any of these and funnily enough our policies remain pretty common sense.
If it was my kids i’d have told them to tell the Uni to go stick it up their arse, driven there and brought them home. Past ridiculous now. I can’t believe how subservient the vast majority of people are. Baaaaaaa
And also how many dictators we had in the country, crawling out of the woodwork they are, hope everyone remembers their faces.
Just like Annie, I have a list. Growing longer all the time.
Would be better to leave them there, and have them preach defiance to others on campus. Encourage them to break any silly rules imposed upon them and find some managers within the uni who you can promsie lawsuits against if they try any kind of punishment for the rule breaking.
The chattering classes have done very well out of covid. They have loved working from home, signalling their virtue on FB but finally, with the outrageous actions in the universities the disgrace of lockdown is affecting them….
Another one falls straight into the Boris trap of divisiveness and mickey-mouse generalisations.
Well done.
Rick, I think you make a fair point. I’m sorry you got downvoted by people who didn’t have the courage to reply to your comment.
I spend hours on the Daily Mail site replying to comments like Will’s, pitting “the chattering classes” against “working class people”, or white people against Muslims, or young against old, and on and on and on. Divide and conquer is effective. Even here.
Truth is, the panci closed the unis back in march, and that effected the middle classes. They just weren’t willing to see it back then. Maybe they are now.
Bit unsure why they’re getting angry at the unis nw, when they failed to get angry in March when the unis shut without good reason, cancelled everything and ruined what remained of the 2019/2020 course year. But any anti-lockdown anger is good.
Yeah my niece is in this position and my brother now seems very receptive to the info I can share with him. So I think the idea that this may open some floodgates is right.
The MPs have been disgraceful. It is literally their job to be engaged and protect people’s freedoms
Need you, friends!
Just had a ghastly experience in church. Was sitting, only one nappyless, well apart. Churchwarden tries to browbeat me into donning nappy. I refuse. Rector then urges me from the front, in full view and hearing of entire congregation, saying it’s the law. I say I am exempt. Have lanyard. He says I should have told him in advance. I say this is discrimination and against the equality act.
I told rector truthfully, after the service, that this was the only occasion on which I had been molested and harassed for not wearing a mask. He said ‘Just go.’
Note: new CV ‘cases’ in Pembrokeshire last week: 3.
Total ‘cases’: 7 per 100,000.
Deaths: 0.
Trend: down.
Alleged CV deaths in Wales last week: 3.
Have you any advice? I’m not sure that the ‘acute distress’ thing applies in Wales, but ‘trauma’ does’. (In my case it goes back to a dental gas mask forced on me by a Chinese dentist when I was 9, but it was in Singapore, so hard to get proof.)
Will go next Sunday. But dreading it.
convert…. have stroll round the other churches and see what their approach is. you might enjoy gospel!!!
That’s a nightmare. So sorry about that.
Well done. Glad you spoke up.
Yes, must be tough but go back and do the same. If anyone challenges you just speak very loudly so everyone can hear you when you state your case of discrimination.
I agree. If you can stand it, Annie, go back next week as is your right. You do not need an excuse or a lanyard and it is outrageous of them to suggest that you needed to let anyone know in advance. I love the ‘Just go’, isn’t that what Jesus said to the lepers?
Which Bible are these buggers reading? Basileus’ quote from Daniel is a good one to remember.
Anyway, I can’t talk; I haven’t been back to Chapel as it’s maskageddon, there’s no need for my organ-playing and the Minister really did have Covid19 in March so there’s no reasoning with him.
Just to cheer you up, one of AlanG’s evangelical Christian brothers gets better and more lucid by the day in his emails to us and he has no doubts about the politics behind the scamdemic. He is in constant argument with his equally evangelical but Covi-hysteric twin brother, trying to get him to see sense. It is so heartening to have family support from an unlikely source as he regards our brand of Progressive Christianity as hopeless heresy
MW
PS: AlanG says sit on the front row, maskless, and smile at him. MW
So sorry to hear this, Annie. What appalling behaviour. You don’t have to prove anything.
I have been shocked and saddened by the church’s reaction (or non reaction) in all of this. They have in general just bowed down and accepted everything as gospel (so to speak!). Yet they pontificate about how Jesus would touch lepers and forgive sinners! I would say, don’t go back, as they deserve to have reduced congregation donations just now, and write to the head office (wherever that is for your church) to point out that they are discriminating. This is from the Welsh government site about face nappies: The last paragraph refers to trauma. Stay strong.
The requirement will apply to everyone aged 11 and over – including customers and staff. However, you may have a reasonable excuse not to wear a face covering if (for example):
From experience in other countries where face coverings have been required, we know survivors of violence against women, domestic abuse and sexual violence sometimes find that wearing a mask triggers flashbacks to traumatic experiences. If that applies to you then this would also be a good reason not to wear a face covering.
What are his contact details? I can write to him and let him know what a Charlie he is if you like. No trouble at all.
Sorry to hear that.
I was surprised just now to be in a bit of a traffic jam, it was turning out time at the Evangelical Church. Loads of smiling people milling about, no Not Mingling, not a mask in sight including the Minister.
I dont think you need a reason to reject wearing a muzzle, I haven’t got one, but would never wear one, just something I feel strongly about, it should be a choice, they dont work anyway, its an outward sign of compliance for the government to see, the fools
C of E? I gave up last week when we attended a children’s service outside in the churchyard and we were still not allowed to sing. Ludicrous.
This is truly shocking. What a way for the rector and church warden to treat you. I’m afraid that I took the cowards way out at the end of July with this, after being harassed by a vocal member of the PCC about not wearing a mask and haven’t been back. I can’t concentrate on the service properly without worrying about having to end up in further arguments. I think that finding a church that is LS friendly is going to be tough – churches seem to have bought into the government’s message lock stock and barrel.
Some group of baptist church leaders wrote in the Telegraph letters some days back, said their churches would take the lead in helping the population, within and outside churches, to resist the government’s diktats. You might se if their churches are anywehere near you.
Good lord. That doesn’t sound very Christian at all. I am not sure I would be back.
Having lived in the US for a large part of my life, unfortunately, that sounds very Christian to me. But I thought British Christians were better than that. Very disappointing, especially for Annie.
Sounds like the sort of ‘Rector’ who just uses Jesus as a piggy-back ride.
You need no excuse. But it’s not easy to deal with morally fraudulent individuals such as this – by definition, since they have lost any moral compass and sense of proportion. The outburst ‘Just go’ is about as non-Christian as it gets.
But I guess you don’t want confrontation, either. Can you stand continuing to attend and just simply not wearing a mask?
Hi Annie, What an awful experience. I find the constant state of tension and preparation for a fight unpleasant and I am a lawyer by training and quite happy to argue my case. I suggest you head to the Laworfiction site and take a look at the forms they publish in relation to discrimination and harassment. Might be worth sending one as a warning shot? It could be added on to a formal notice that you will be attending next week without a mask as you are exempt. I am not religious and know nothing of the legal set-up of churches but I doubt this kind of treatment is permitted or acceptable. Sending best wishes.
I don’t know how rural you are Annie, but I would recommend another church, and perhaps have words with the deacons/rectors before you begin. Just to ensure they are happy with you exercising your rights as laid out in the (admittedly ridiculous) law.
Isaiah 41:10
PS You need no proof.
Annie you are being compelled to wear something that goes against your beliefs (and actual evidence from studies in surgeries for one). I think the rector might need to have a read of the very book he preaches from.
It is discrimination pure and simple. As for it’s the law, St Augustine would like a word.
Also, isn’t a church supposed to be a sanctuary?
Church people of all faiths are and have historically alwsys been the most zealous and intolerant enforcers of faith based rules…
When I was very young, I naively asked my grandmother why there were no black people in her church (she lived in a neighbourhood in San Francisco where there were lots of black and Hispanic people). She told me that black people (and dogs) couldn’t go to heaven. Put me off Christianity for life.
This is how Christian people should deal with governments who overstep the mark:
Daniel 3:16 Shadrach, Meshach, and Abednego answered and said to the king, “O Nebuchadnezzar, we have no need to answer you in this matter. 17 If this be so, our God whom we serve is able to deliver us from the burning fiery furnace, and he will deliver us out of your hand, O king. 18 But if not, be it known to you, O king, that we will not serve your gods or worship the golden image that you have set up.”
It seems to me that the problem with Christianity is that too many ‘Christians’ fail to practice it.
Sounds like a letter or email to the diocese is in order.
https://www.churchofengland.org/more/church-resources/welcoming-disabled-people
I’m so sorry, Annie. I would have hoped the reaction was different. I was just really pleased to see someone with a lanyard and a bare face this morning. It makes such a difference. Our church sighed authorities have produced ‘you must wear a mask’ posters, but not exemption ones, but I’ve been trying to do a bit of education locally. It may be that there has been no communication about exemptions to the folk in a local congregation. As people on the site have had success by contacting the head office of businesses, would it be worth contacting the diocese(?) to ask their policy on exemptions, especially if you can quote the regulations or direct them to a government website.
Bless you for persisting – I wish you lived nearer here!
What a shameful way to be treated Annie,I feel angry on your behalf.Sadly I am not surprised though,from what I have seen religions of all types and denominations have,for the most part,effectively gone over to the worship of the new Covid cult.
Their acquiescence to the omnipotent new religion is shocking,it is an insult to all those that have given their lives in the past in pursuit and defence of religious freedom for everyone.
Can you get someone like Francis Hoar to write a letter saying that if it happens again he will be prosecuted?
Bit drastic I know, but I am beginning to feel that the only way to stop people being hassled is to bring legal cases – because that hits them in the pocket…
Right, and that’s the answer to Stewart’s question, What else can we do?
Annie! You are the strongest of us all! You have Camus, Christianity, and a rich seam of satirical poetry! It’s awful to hear you sounding so low.
You can defy this. You ARE covered by the law: of course the childhood event you refer to counts as a traumatogenic experience.
But I think the hard thing here, really, is not so much the question of law in relation to your personal situation but the existence of the law at all: we live in a state that has lost its mind, and its respect for basic principles of bodily autonomy.
And there is the aggression directed against you: the pain of being attacked in your church, by your church. This hurts badly. I am very sorry.
Many, many thanks, all.
I think I will go back next Sunday (if Quackaduck hasn’t nailed us all to the floor), and if challenged, say calmly that I have a valid reason not to wear a mask. I shall then invite them to call the police, or other authority, to have me forcibly removed. Which will be a sight worth seeing.
After that I don’t think I shall ever go again. After the hysteria stops I shall look for a Christian church to attend.
The response of the churches to this has been pathetic.
It appears that the government is running 99.999% of the churches.
I thought God was supposed to be running them. Apparently not.
Luther would be spinning in his grave.
You could always use the Bill Hicks reply “Then forgive me”.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oyWzSDg0pc8&t=0m49s
Let me get this straight… the Vicar or Priest or whatever he was publically humilated you from the pulpit? I would suggest retaining a lawyer as he’s clearly in violation of several laws there.
So sorry to hear that. If I were local I would offer to come with you for moral support. Please let us know what happens. Is there any hope that they will apologise for their awful behaviour?
None whatsoever.
Annie, I am sorry to hear this. The priest is quite wrong to have done that. Early Quakers would stand up in church and argue with priests on various points.
Annie, that’s sounds like a nightmare. I’m sorry that anyone in your church thinks that’s an appropriate way to treat another human being.
Sorry to hear this. I would suggest a letter of complaint to the bishop or someone high up.
And looks like the rector needs to return to school – what he just did there totally contradict the central Christian message of openness and inclusivity.
An insight into the pandemic helpline
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uese-6Xln7o
Brilliant !
https://pbs.twimg.com/media/Ei3VqY0WoAovmqy?format=jpg&name=900×900
some important political correctness rules we need to adhere to…
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bXrnqcNgL00
A good turnout in Trafalgar Square yesterday. Was all going well until the Stasi turned up and ruined the party at 3pm.
For all people who want to dismiss these people as cranks I thought there was a broad mix of people there yesterday. Some full on conspiracy theorists and just regular people like me who are opposed to lockdown and all the measures that come with it. The message from the podium was certainly very inclusive and positive, stating all were welcome, regardless of how deep you may think the rabbit hole goes.
From my own point of view it’s obvious that this is the only show in town which is willing or able to get people out on the street. I visit here everyday for an update and as much as I like this site, it’s not getting us anywhere, all we do is agree with each other that it’s all a load of bollocks and that we want our lives back. It’s alright Toby and Delingpole doing podcasts but it’s too low profile and makes zero difference. If people in their positions aren’t going to start issuing rallying calls to their own spheres of influence then they may as well do nothing at all as it’s not going to make a difference.
I think the only way to grow the protest base now is for the sceptics and the conspiracy crowd to join forces in a loose protest alliance. Everyone needs to get out of their armchairs and away from their keyboards and help make up the numbers. If they don’t then it’s only going to continue to get worse by the week until eventually the entire economy and our ‘past’ way of life is toast.
Just a thought…..
I do my bit by engaging in conversation several times a day. A month ago people were willing to go along with it all to ‘be on the safe side’.
Now, as often as not, they start a conversation with a sceptical comment, this site is a invaluable source of up to date information and useful graphics as screenshots to keep the conversation going.
Excellent post.
We all agree on the anti-lockdown, which is why I attend the protests too.
Thanks, that’s actually a really helpful perspective to hear.
Here is a video from someone who was at the event.
Lee
All part of the plan. Change the language to what you want people to hear. Easier then to ridicule the non-believers.
Any update on the German doctor who was arrested? He was still in custody a few hours ago..
Not sure on what grounds he was arrested, because as I understand it, he hadn’t even had a chance to speak when they came for him..
I’ll be at a protest as soon as there’s one in my town. lets stop being so London centric, the sceptics are right across the UK and we need to show it.
Just read Peter Hitchen’s article in today’s mail on Sunday—-great stuff:
https://www.dailymail.co.uk/debate/article-8776033/PETER-HITCHENS-Boris-great-idea-Burn-house-TWICE-rid-wasps-nest.html
One short sentence does it for me:
“Johnson was never compelled to strangle the economy and turn daily life into a crime. He chose to do it.”
To which I reply: if daily life is a crime then I am an arch criminal in attempting to live it.
it likely that all lockdown zealots will download the NHS ‘T&T then fine app’ – so the number of downloads will be a good ‘opinion poll’ of how many have genuinely bought into the bollocks
How man people will download it do you think?
I haven’t done the modelling yet…
The young lad, who works in the shop at weekends, seems to know what an app is and has downloaded it ‘for a laugh’ – but he keeps the bluetooth off because it drains the battery
Me neither. I don’t have a cigarette packet available at the moment.
Fortunately, I have. The answer is 458 million.
You exaggerate, it’s really 227.86 million. Somebody called Ferguson told me.
Isn’t that just about one eight of the population of the UK? or err some percentage or other of that?
Do you have a German mistress by any chance?
Messing around with the Staats.
What ever the number is I am sure that it will double every week for the next six months.
I think there are people who won’t want to, but it will be harder and harder *not* to – Sainsburys are apparently going to make it a requirement in order to shop there..
Really? Where did you hear this?
Someone on Twitter who went shopping this morning said that Sainsburys had the QR code reader at the entrance.. And that there were posters up in the windows about its introduction. Not sure where in the country though..
what? are they going to buy me a new phone?
Maybe we’ll se al those zealor fools told to isolate by their app, then the rest of us can claim back the streets and get on with living,while they merely cower away from death.
Not necessarily, my sceptical OH had to download yesterday to attend youth football where he coaches.
Does anyone know if he’s downloaded it? Couldn’t he make a fake screenshot of it and just open that as a jpeg on his phone when the coaching venue asks him to prove he’s with their stasi?
Some of my colleagues are coming under pressure to download it by various hobbies/sports teams they are involved with. Interestingly, my workplace have said they don’t want it used on-site as the app isn’t intelligent enough to understand if you are doing a risk assessed activity with correct PPE..
Child’s hockey wants it (directive from Hockey England) but also an option to complete a form. Not everybody has a phone or a phone new enough to download the app. Challenge!. They must make another plan.
Note: many are volunteers and are just doing what they are told. Challenge!
What is happening now in universities is surely the suppression strategy coming apart at the seems?
Hope so.
The question will be whether students have the sense to realise that supression cannot work, and have the wisdom to privately embrace herd immunity. Boris Jong-Un said that under his current “suppress…”, oops,typo, “oppression” plan individual actions will dictate the nation’s fate, individual actions can be the thing that undermines his plan and forces him in to herd immunity by default. Boris’s rule by diktat is illegal and the only way to stop it is the public not collaborating, never get tested, never isolate unless symptomatic (and even then you don’thave to stay at home, just stay away from work and crowds, go out for a walk down deserted country lanes), never pay fines…
Yes, except the public IS collaborating. En masse, in fact.
If the last 7 months have demonstrated anything, it’s that the public is on the whole entirely complicit and compliant.
We need to think of something else.
We cannot do anything but to continue plugging away on the Internet sharing information.
It seems utterly logic to let the students all infect each other now. They’ll all then be covid clear by Christmas and safe to go and visit granny.
Coming apart at the seems, how?
They’ll probably live to regret it having put a lot of youngsters off going and then they’ll go bankrupt which is where a lot of them should be, vague courses, a couple of days a week, while the students hang around for the rest of the time
CHILLING ON A SUNDAY? THEN LISTEN TO THIS!
The Real Normal podcast is here to make you feel a bit more normal.
Questioning the science.
Upholding liberty
Having a beer
Having a laugh…all whilst singing songs about Bozza and Rishi.
TELL ALL YOUR FRIENDS – And have a great weekend,
I have been visiting this site now pretty much daily for several months.
In that time, the evidence demonstrating (a) the lack of virulence of the virus (b) the irrationality of government measures and (c) the economic damage has only grown.
There is also a growing number of sceptical voices in the media. And some sceptical politicians now too.
And yet, in spite of this, the government measures are becoming more draconian, the enforcement of measures (e.g. masks, tracing) stricter and the public sentiment stronger in favour of the government’s actions.
I just don’t see any hope. The power of the state is just too awesome and in March the government realised that there was no public resistance to an even greater expansion of its power.
We are entering an era of extreme government power and control, led by the psychopathic Chinese Communist Party, from whom governments around the world are taking inspiration and example since February.
Demonstrations, protests, dissent, these are all quaint, archaic ideas that are completely incapable of making even a dent in a 21st century government. The technology is in place and fully in the hands of the government to control every aspect of the lives of the population.
Anyone who laughs at the government’s mishaps over the implementation of track and trace is a fool. They will continue to throw resources into it until it works. (There are working systems in place in Asia already, so it’s not physically impossible, it’s literally just a question of time.) The government’s plans are very clear and very open.
The few of us on here had better start coming to terms with the fact that we are a minority, a pretty small one at that, who hold personal responsibility and liberty dear. We are like the native Americans who once roamed freely across the continent and slowly but relentlessly were forced to abandon their free way of life and give in to European ways of life or get squeezed into ever shrinking, hopeless little reservations. Like them we will be forced to give up our freedom or be ever more confined to a limited, suffocating existence.
That’s the future as far as I can tell.
I just don’t see any hope.
Get lost.
That’s harsh. We all have days like that, surely? I know I do.
I simply cannon fathom out how anyone looking at the same data – deaths, hospitalisation – cannot see what I see: a nasty virus that will kill some very elderly people, but generally not much worse than a bad flu bug. Nothing remarkable or special. Nothing worth changing our way of life for. I dont think I am wrong. Why are so many other people so wrong?
They’re not wrong, they’re implementing the reset agenda. The virus is just the cover story.
Hmmmm….you haven’t
felt moved to comment before now, but suddenly you post a subtly dispiriting and lengthy screed…just when the Sceptics’ case is getting traction in the media. Hmmm…
I’ve been posting on here for months actually.
I was misled by your opening para. Apologies for misinterpreting “visiting” to mean “lurking” . But I definitely don’t agree with your sentiment. This is not a time for despair,
Look, I’m just raising a point here. I’m personally a bit tired of going round in circles, questioning the models, the lockdown, the masks, the lack of rigour and evidence on the government side, seeing the same inconsistencies being pointed out. It’s just like going round in circles.
And yesterday, another protest, not a blip in the media, organisers arrested.
In the meantime, the government marches on with its suppression agenda, tracking and tracing. Now university students are being tortured, deprived from seeing each other, their families. Government measures as strict and draconian as ever are implemented on ever weaker evidence.
There is no political opposition. The Labour Party object to the fact that the measures aren’t quick or strict enough.
We are not only not making any progress but in fact going backwards. That’s just a fact.
You sound like a cancer, eating away at the very spirit of the right minded resistance, a true 5th columnist
Begone and take you foul defeatist words with you!
You know, I suspect that is more or less what the government has to say to anyone who disagrees with what it wants to hear.
Sorry if I’m spoiling your echo chamber and raising a reasonable point which is: this may not be working very well, what else can we do?
And there was me, thinking this site was for people who believed in questioning things and, you know, thinking.
What’s an echo chamber?
what’s an echo chamber ?
What’s an echo chamber ?
The media is coming round to our side now, every day the Telegraph, Mail and others post articles opposing the lockdown. The BBC hasn’t turned, nor the left-wing papers, but we’ve got mass support now. There are a fair few MPs near to turning, the current “rebellion” asking for parliamentary approval before abuses isn’t enough but it is leading the right way. Big protests are happening, though the media pretends otherwise. There’s still a struggle ahead, but less than there was in spring.
Have we really got mass support though? The majority are still very compliant.
No but we have more support than we did a month ago and that’s all that matters. We will never win by worrying about polls and trying to count our support but by believing in ourselves and planing the right way forward.Step by step we must liberate our society .
There was small blip on R2 news yesterday
“Thousands of people protesting in London against lockdown measures…”
Instead of the “hmmmmm”s – why not come out and say what you’re thinking?
Maybe you think someone feeling a bit frustrated and dispirited must be some elaborate PsyOp?
If so, all I can say is… hmmmmm.
Agenda 2030 planning has planned for this marginiliszation of dissenters to the new normal, they said some like, there will still be enclaves of self-support communities living in rural pockets in 19th century housing isolated from the new society that has developed.
We’ll be able to sell black market ciggies, beer. and bacon sarnies to citizens of the new society.
I feel the opposite, that people are waking up and seeing what is really going on.
I also think some people are. But not enough and not quickly enough.
And as far as large media goes, for every sceptic view there are multiple government narrative views.
I think they are seeing some of it for a sham, but have not yet realised that where the QR codes for shops etc will eventually lead.. Already seen a GP who requires it in order to enter the surgery..
They don’t need to recognise where it will lead, as long as they’re willing to openly defy it. Walk straight on in to anywhere that tries to stop you until you scan, if they want to avoid going bst they’ll back down. And that GP isn’t likely to try anything against people who’ve come in regardless, because I’m sure if he did he’d find himself getting sued for discrimination (discriminating against people trying to seek healthcare being something that soudns very bad in a tabloid).
What’s your point?
I agree with your sentiment. We have seen the enormous amount of great work done by committed people on here and elsewhere. The house of cards is wobbling but is still standing without any real sign that it will tumble.
Remember Hemingway (I think it was him); people go bankrupt at first slowly, then suddenly. Remember the Iron Curtain and the Berlin Wall. Booby-traps, machine-guns and anti-personnel mines. Nothing could have looked more solid, and then suddenly it was being ripped apart so fast that it was difficult to obtain pieces as souvenirs.
Our cause is just; our day will come. When it does, there will a mighty reckoning.
That’s a very good point. I was in the 6th form when the wall came down. It had been there my whole life and looked like it always would be. And then suddenly it wasn’t.
What is the tipping point?
What on earth is “impose a voluntary lockdown” supposed to mean?
Newspeak.
1984 – was a work of fiction, now a user manual.
That is so true!
Staying apart keeps us together.
Orwell would be proud and horrified in equal measure
Just caught the news on LBC, the wording of the report that uni students can go home for Christmas, “if we all pull together” sounded almost as if University students are being hostage.
That is nothing but a disgrace.
Saw on Twitter a quote from the coronavirus act and one of the recent SIs which apparently is the legal basis on which students can be ‘locked down’ and kept from their families..one part comes into force today..
If they are widely enough defied then whether they have legal force doesn’t matter (not that any laws have been legitimate sicne March). Thousands of students all acros the country deciding to do things regardless are more than cops can handle, remember that they are sometiems supposed to dedicate time to enforcing real laws. And their universities won’t be able to threaten them either, none would survive the collapse of reputation and income they’d get if they tried expelling a large proportion of their population.
Some universities have hired private security firms to prevent quarantined students leaving their accomodation. Probably pretty intimidating for most – police not needed.
Just had an email from this lot
https://appgcoronavirus.marchforchange.uk/
“Since July, I’ve been working with March for Change and a cross-party group of MPs to conduct a rapid inquiry into the Government’s handling of the coronavirus crisis. On Wednesday, the group heard from international experts about how poorly the UK now compares to other European nations at controlling a second wave.
Our next evidence session will take place on October 6th and will look at the ‘test and trace’ system. Our researchers are busy putting together a panel of experts but we also want to hear about the everyday experience of getting tested.”
So they are doing a survey on experiences of testing.
Two issues.
Number one – i aint going anywhere near a test .
Number two – Email is from Caroline Lucas. As Groucho Marx would have said, i wont participate in anything that has her as a member
Same here. I tried to add a rational comment to the APPG submussion back when it opened, now I get whinging zealot lockdown spam from them. And if you make an insulting reply to the spam telling them what you really thin, it never gets read, the email is an unmonitored do-not-reply one. they don’t provide a “contact us here” email in the spam either. But they think we’ll be happy to make donations so they can conclude, in defiance of all evidence, that we should have had our liberties stolen even earlier.
A number of readers seem to be suggesting that the common cold is widespread at the moment.
If this is the case, I wonder if it might explain the huge surge in covid-19 ‘cases’ in the Covid symptom study. These are increasing at a much faster rate than the government case numbers or the ONS estimates.
You’re back on shift then?
well I had a couple of days of sneezing last week with slight head aches. But I don’t think I had a temp (no thermometer) and I didn’t have a constant cough, more sporadic.
And I returned from Thailand via Guangzhou in a plane full of Chinese early December – I immediately nipped over to Spain to see friends and they said they were all ill after I left and I got the blame. Also one of the takeaway owners returned from Wuhan area in early February, so If I hadn’t had it I probably got it then – symptoms in early march were stomach IBS type pains, headaches, chills, loss of smell, rash on wrists and the shits for no good reason – on and off for a couple of weeks – so I’m pretty sure I’ve got the T-shirt.
The problem is simply the one that has existed from the start of the shit-show – that there is no reliable information about real Covid infection. It’s largely guesstimation, and infinitely manipulable, given the large range of error sources in the PCR testing.
We have no idea whether – or how much of – the rise in hospitalisations etc. (normal at this time of year) are actually from Covid, or simply a co-presence of an RNA strand in some patients.
… and society is being wilfully wrecked on this basis?
Apart from the fact that the symptoms of CONVID 1984 are similar to other respiratory illnesses?
Yes. About 9 in 10 colds were not Covid but other viruses already in the summer. Need to wait for the next detailed ONS report to see what that is now. If you had a cold in late Feb or early March it probably was Covid. If you have one now probably something else.
Symptoms plus positive PCR is about 95% likely to be Covid. But I wouldn’t bother to get tested. But do try and find a doctor if it gets bad (and she can test you then).
I wonder how many viruses we would test positive for if we were tested for a range of them with the same zeal as we are for this particular coronavirus.
It would also be interesting to isolate and sequence a few more. There surely must be more HCoVs than the handful we know about, not to mention all the other kinds of virus. From a purely academic point of view.
“If you had a cold in late Feb or early March it probably was Covid.”
If you had a runny nose, it was a cold….
The Iceland study found runny nose in 55%.
https://doi.org/10.1101/2020.08.09.20171249
This is the largest study that was done on the spectrum of symptoms of people with fairly mild illness. Iceland was one of the places that did the most testing during the actual epidemic.
It’s indistinguishable from a cold apart from if you are in the small fraction who get severe symptoms where some of them possibly become quite characteristic. But then only because it’s new. In 3 years’ time I think it will be very hard to tell it apart from any other flu or coronavirus without PCR testing.
I forgot to mention in my earlier post Some of the comments today and Toby’s main article have got me thinking – locally, the hospitality sector seems to have been leant on quite heavily, presumably by the local council and the police, and even the ‘ethnic’ places which have resisted silly rules (and been a bastion of normality) have suddenly got a cob on about masks, sizes of parties and so on.
That’ll be the Hitlers from council Environmental Health Departments threatening fines and closure.
That was always going to happen when they gave local authorities responsibility for Public Health some few years ago.
They presented it as pre-natal scans and smoking cessation.
Yet here we are.
They have been intimidating shops in my area and handing out signs that state simply “No Mask No Entry” for them to display. After I pointed out the the law to the owner of my nearest convenience store (who is a nice chap, not wedded to masks but doesn’t want to be fined) he took his down.
Similar report in The Sun online. Hopefully the message will start filtering through.
https://www.dailymail.co.uk/debate/article-8776423/Coronavirus-UK-learn-live-covid-says-ROBERT-DINGWALL.html
The main problem for politicians and the public has now IMHO become this stupid nationalistic statistical competition.
And as Gupta has said from the start: we have omly had to pay a mild toll to the flus over the last century, because we (had to) let the Spanish flu rip through.
Avoiding SARS-Cov2 at all cost will thetefore likely only lead to us/our children and grand children pay a heavier toll to its succesors later, with or without a vaccine.
Do any of you have children at university? Share this fact with them then ask them why they’re putting up with this?
It’s the NHS England’s latest data on deaths from Covid dated 24th Sept.
Since the first Covid death the total deaths of people aged 0-39 without an underlying health condition is 39!!!!!!!!!
(An underlying health condition is something that’s serious enough to get mentioned on the death certificate, so this isn’t asthma, or obesity, it’s a serious condition that’s contributory to death.)
So, during this entire pandemic 1 person per single age cohort on average has died of Covid. If we think about university students that’s an average of 3 to 4 years, so, we can reckon that 3 or 4 people of university age have died of Covid during the whole charade across the whole of England. Have there been any in Scotland? Probably none in Wales or NI.
Storm the bloody barricades!
“Share this fact with them then ask them why they’re putting up with this?”
Much like the rest of us : there is b all that we can do about it.
My sentiment. Pointing out how a measure is daft, draconian, inconsistent, pointless, illogical just doesn’t seem to be cutting it.
Raab was on the radio showing he had no idea of the facts.
Hancock was on the radio showing he didn’t understand what false positives were.
Not a blip. Nothing. The oppression machine marches on.
Student interviewed on Radio 2 News this morning saying how scared she is to be
“in locked down hall of residence, there’s no internal security everybody just going mad like it’s a never ending party !”
Good for them, get themselves infected, get over it and immune without really noticing so it’s safe for nan to come over at Xmas.
You young lady, by trying to hide from the inevitable, will probably cop it in the third week of December, just in time to go home and kill your granny.
That’s hilarious. Needed a good laugh. Cheers!
Drat, I tried to edit it to
‘Trying to hide from the inevitable in your lonely bedroom…”
Your kind comment thwarted me.
Trust me, the punch line landed just right.
Young? Away from home? Catch covid now and granny won’t.
I suppose I should have added that as fewer than 50% of kids go to university & they’re probably a disproportionately healthy lot even though on average it might be estimated that 1.5 to 2 university students may have died without underlying health issues the chances are it’s 0.
Can any of the Jocks who read this find the data for Scotland. Given that Scotland is about 10% the population of England the odds are about 1 in 10 that a single University age Scottish student has ever died of this, 1 in 18 for a Welsh Student and 1 in 30 off for someone from NI.
Luckily this data is available. In Scotland for those aged under 25 there has been zero deaths, that is not just those with comorbidities that is everyone. No man under 45 has died since June 3rd, there have been 11 in total. The last woman, under 45, died on May 2nd, there have been 6 in total.
One of the, supposed, benefits of university is to learn how to think critically. The evidence of most graduates behaviour is that isn’t the case.
https://public.tableau.com/profile/phs.covid.19#!/vizhome/COVID-19DailyDashboard_15960160643010/Overview
I am just amazed!!! & I thought I knew this data pretty well!
This may already have been posted, from yesterday’s demo, but good to see rational, heart felt comments. Has buoyed my spirits.
https://youtu.be/gcrL1F2ug9Q
An excellent supplement to the live feed.
LBC seems to have become second only to The BBC a cv19 positive broadcaster of the year, before anyone comments, I know early on one of the news people was ill with cv19. I am not saying cv19 does not exist, I am not saying some people become ill with it.
Currently people calling in about their experiences, fears, positive thoughts about the NHS T&T app.
The presenter is simply knocking those who are negative towards the app, one person said about when you swipe into a bar, restaurant, cafe etc, how does the app know you have left the venue?
Presenter said it does not matter blah, blah, blah then a caller phones in and say that somewhere within the app she has read you are automatically classes as have left a venue at midnight on the day of your visit!
So if you pop into a cafe at midday for a coffee, leave 35 minutes later, but the app still has you at that location until midnight, so if someone who later tests positive for cv19 goes into the same venue hours after you leave, you will be told to isolate as you have been contact.
I doubt this will be an issue to many on here, as our mobile phones do not work with such apps, but the way the app works is potentially designed to up the number of people who have to isolate.
Seems like Joe Public have educated themselves about the app already, just needs a few phones to self-destruct and it’s all over.
surely the app ‘leave time’ should be 10pm curfew tiime!?? I work in software and can see soooo many loopholes and usability issues with this app. Will be interesting the reaction when jo public are told to self isolate based on very scant information and risk of 10k fine for breaching this. I wouldn’t be surprised if tracking was put in place in if the phone moved from home location…
BUT… I fear that this is just version 1 and will be the basis for further enhancements and morph into the ‘digital id’ without which life will be nigh impossible – all in the name of civil duty of course! It’ll start with the covid related info, then include other ‘health’ related info/tracking, then morph into tracking and limiting your carbon footprint (air/car travel), in time link to your financial records/payments which will be mainly cards and could restrict purchase of certain items maybe … who knows what else over the years. This is all aided by technology – Big data, AI, 5G technology etc.
In the meantime there will be continual health scares to ramp up the rhetoric and fear – regular tests and vaccines will be mandated (paid for by us) and results to enter into your ‘digital id’ to function in society. All benefiting the pharma industry and other nefarious companies and individuals.
The Government is stuck in the domain of wishful thinking. It cannot accept that the
virus is a force of nature which can only be made worse by naive interventions. Nature always outplays them with the law of unintended consequences. They must realise that the refined structure of laws, management and regulation that we we built up in the pre-virus days over many decades is far more durable and tested than the jury rigged “structures they try to create with off-the-cuff lockdowns or other naive/ quick-fix measures; in this respect ministers reassemble children with buckets and spades trying to stop the tide. The are pulling down the our pre-existing laws to fix something they only imagine can be easily fixed. You end up without the system you had before, as well as all the problems of covid19. They need to cherish and support what we have already not throw everything away on covid19, we have seen that costs many more lives than it saves, i.e 75,000 in 6 months of lockdown and such-like measures. wrt: Trafalgar square protest: In recent months, protests by BLM and Extinction Rebellion have attempted to bring the nation to its knees. And these protests have not been interfered with by police. Now the government itself has already brought the country to its knees with lockdowns, yet a peaceful protest by lockdown sceptics, intended to put the county back on its feet, was met with fierce police interference. Our government treats peaceful constructive protests more harshly than violent destructive ones.
The dark truth is that violence works.
The BLM agenda has made progress because they act violently and in sufficient numbers.
If violence doesn’t accomplish anything, as governments like to postulate, then why is it so keen to maintain its monopoly of violence? And why does it unleash violence on the population when it isn’t getting its way?
Peaceful protesting in Trafalgar Square is going to get the sceptic movement absolutely nowhere.
And much as I love TY for all the work he is doing, cutting commentary about the government’s incompetence and mendacity isn’t going to get us very much farther either.
Forget BLM in this context. It’s a side-issue – an irritation rather than a threat.
True but I agree with the point about peaceful protest;over 1 million people marched against the Iraq war and it achieved nothing.
The government only react to violence
Ok ok ok, it’s a joke. I’m sure you’re all adult enough to know that!
I absolutely give up. I have just nipped round to a friends house – Tories, ardent Brexiteers, he’s ex army, she’s a parish councillor, only ever averagely bedwetting so far – and they have track and trace QR codes on their gate. They actually expect visitors to inform big brother of their arrival. If people like this are still buying into this whole ridiculous charade we are doomed.
Ex army = told what to do for their whole life!
fair point. Loving your work btw. I listed to the first 8 pod casts back to back last week and have you 5 stars on iTunes. Keep it up!
Thanks mate! Means loads to have made a few more people feel a little more sane!
Ex army or now 77th brigade?
No he’s ex army. Was an army lorry driver and now a builder.
“and they have track and trace QR codes on their gate”
Sounds like grounds for unfriended.
Sounds like grounds for tearing the QR codes down and putting some lockdown sceptic posters in their place.
I keep my horse on their land and in fairness they are lovely people. I’m not prepared to burn every bridge I have over it and neither are they. I am afraid us sceptics need to recognise that the vast majority are not independently minded, they are not interested in reading the evidence but prefer to have it filtered through the government and MSM and they will do anything for a quiet life. When you get abused in the supermarket and even in church (as Annie was today) it’s easy to see the appeal of the “go along to get along mind set”. This is a war of attrition against us as much as “the virus”. We have to hold our ground because it is clear we are no difference from the Germans in the 30s, the chinese or the North Koreans. The majority of humans are decent but they are herd animals and will do what they are told if they think it will buy them a quiet life. Let’s be honest, the holocaust wouldn’t have happened on the scale it did if so many had refused to wear the star, refused to report to the train station with their one small suitcase!
absolutely correct – ‘anything for a quiet life’! I suspect it’s more prevalent in the home counties and countryside where may not feel the impacts so much being surrounded by fields etc and likely to be affluent.
We are in Derbyshire.
So am I!
Fair enough
How did they get the QR codes? Can people buy them? (Sorry, I’m not very technical!)
There’s link on government website somewhere for generating a QR code for your premises.
Anyone can use it.
It needs an eMail address and property address. If you can use that creatively there might be interesting ways to subvert the system.
I was thinking along the same lines.
HMtheQueen@gmail.com
Buckingham Palace
SW1A 1AA
All the Uyghurs in Xingjiang also have QR codes attached to their doors.
“Tories, ardent Brexiteers, he’s ex army, she’s a parish councillor,”
This cuts across all categories.
3rd email to school:
“During lunch today xxx was going through her day tomorrow with us. She said that she has to sit in the common room for 3 hours after tutor time and that she has to wear a mask for all of that time.
So, the school is forcing her to come in at 8:50am, and then forcing her to have to sit masked for 3 hours. How can you not see that this is not right? Or even moral?
A German lab tested a childs mask after 7 hours of wearing to find 82 bacterial cultures and 4 fungal blooms. Does that sound healthy to you?
On the days that xxx has a first lesson that is later in the day, I will bring her in in time for that lesson. I do not give the school permission to run (or ruin) our lives for us any longer. “
Forcing children to wear masks is nothing short of child abuse.
As far as I’m concerned every parent has a moral responsibility to resist a mask being put on their child.
Others can correct me but isn’t it the case in medical settings where masks are worn there is a 40 minute limit on wearing a mask before it is replaced?
Presumably someone with immunity (from previous exposure to c19 or some other immunity from our amazing immune system) does not have a forcefield outside their body, so…
If exposed to c19 again then the immune system will deal with the virus once it is internal. Is it possible that, although not infectious due to the low viral load 1st, 2nd, 3rd… time exposed, they may still have a positive PCR test if it is over sensitive?
How come? Masks are not compulsory outdoors are they? Is this the next move i the process, to be followed by shoppers at markets also having to be masked?
I was at the protest In London yesterday and was pleased with the turnout as it seemed a larger crowd than the 29th August. To my mind the crowd, was well behaved , peaceful and good natured. The police that were initially in the crowd before 3pm mirrored this behaviour and were in a lot of cases engaging in discussions with the protesters.
But I was appalled by the behaviour of the police that arrived at around 3pm. I was on the top balcony area below the National Gallery and to the side of the speakers area. The police arrived, very suddenly and quickly in large numbers and stood together in lines, effectively pinning us in from all sides. These police were not overtly threatening, but they were intimidating, purely because of their numbers and the fact that we were pretty much hemmed in, with nowhere to escape to. These police were still polite, although they were very firm in not allowing people to get passed them and out of the area.
The next lot of police that arrived with their batons and helmets had a different intent altogether, they were not there to keep the peace or to get us to disperse peacefully, but to intimidate, threaten, provoke and retaliate. They were not peace keepers – but thugs looking for a fight.
After going backwards and forwards within the contained area, I was able to eventually find a way out, when their attention was momentarily diverted by something. As someone attending the second protest of my life, I must admit to being frightened by the threatening behaviour of the police towards a peaceful crowd.
I did continue with everyone else to Hyde Park and it was heartening to see the sheer numbers of protesters marching in Regent and Oxford Street.
Although this is my first post, I have been lurking here for months and would like to thank Toby and everyone that contributes to this site for providing a bit of sanity in an otherwise insane world. Thank You All
Thank you for the report and also for going yesterday.
Seconded. It was pretty clear from the live feed that a very peaceful crowd was disrupted by needless police aggression.
thanks Verity for supporting the cause – i imagine it was quite frightening the aggressive police tactics, and not being able to easily get out of the area. It’s also disgraceful that the police force is acting in this way against fellow citizens protesting peacefully – they should be ashamed of themselves. Something just isn’t right about all this heavy handedness!
Thanks Sue. Agreed, something just isn’t right about so much in the world at the moment!
What I find interesting about SAGE and using academics is that very often they are separated from the real world, and hence the actual common sense simple but effective ways of thinking.
But I don’t think it’s because they don’t have the opportunity to hear it or be taught it.
When I started my Phd (Physics) we had a week-long training course on working in a lab and setting up test equipment. We had to pass a test too.
The guy who taught us wasn’t a lecturer or post-grad. He was the technician who used to frown on us when we were undergraduates in the lab!
But it turned out he gave one of the best bits of advice I ever received.
We were discussing what happens when you are running an experiment, you’ve been slaving away getting it to work and suddenly you get a blip on the screen that could signify that you have something?
What do you do? he asked.
Do you run down to your supervisor and tell them the news? Do you run to the Dean? Do you shout our Eureka and dance around the room???
No, he said, “You check if it’s plugged in”
When getting data, the first thing you ask is: how was this measured? Because very often you get values (like the 0.9% IFR) which are so wildly outside normal experience that you need to ask “Was it plugged in?”
When you can’t answer that you turn to practicalities, which is something I learned in the space industry. In this industry you can lose your satellite and possibly people too but you still have to balance spending years and years of money trying to meet requirements, when you should have launched it anyway.
The risk of getting to orbit and early operations is the same.
We didn’t see any expert talk this way. We saw them again and again bleat on about the data and the models without considering that most of time you don’t actually make decisions based on models. You make them based on real data and experience and you build contingency around that.
Because all it takes is the simple question: Was it plugged in?
“ “You check if it’s plugged in”
Love it. Such a brilliant meme for those who don’t do the basics.
It’s really hard to understate it Rick, because the bloke was the old guard technician. He wasn’t a lecturer or professor. It was a little stab at people too, which I learned later.
I’ve sent it to my son (Fellow/Senior Lecturer – Physics). I think he’ll appreciate it
I f.ing hope so – or my child-rearing’s buggered!
This is a very good post. It’s comparable to the ‘so what’ test in business. Me and Mr TT are both natural scientists, with PhDs in areas of social science. Because our undergraduate degree was a 4 year course, we had to spend six months in our final year in a lab doing original research. I was in an MRC-funded lab and despite my total lack of interest in the subject by then, I was a diligent, albeit not especially gifted student. However, seems I did discover something novel. It was written up in a prestigious journal by my supervisor. Our paths crossed some years later, and he was gracious enough to say in a public forum, that my work had changed the course of a particular line of research, and he had dined out on that ever since! Most of the protagonists in this current fiasco are neither scientists – by which I mean conducted original research in a lab – or medics. Those that are have allowed themselves to be captured by financial interests. It is time for a root and branch clear out of the scientific base that advises government, at the same time that the Cabinet is removed from office for maladministration.
“ scientists – by which I mean conducted original research in a lab”
Just a minor disagreement. I don’t think that is the most basic definition of a ‘scientist’.
In fact – the problem with a lot of the Covid apologists is that they have only worked in the narrow confines of a lab.
… but real science is about scientific method and the analysis of data within a rigorous framework of hypothesis testing.
Doing research, my ‘lab’ was the outside world, and, above all, before anything else, LOOKING to check the data to see ‘if it was plugged in’.
I agree that there is a lack of hypothesis testing, and an inability to interrogate the data. That is a common criticism of social science, in particular, where researchers usually set off with a ‘hypothesis’ that they then seek to confirm, as opposed to seeking to reject the null. However, it would be wrong to assume many of the protagonists in this case have only worked in a lab – when do you think any of the following ever spent any time in a lab, if ever – Devi Sridhar, Neil Ferguson, Susan Michie? Of course, none of them have ever worked in the real world, but that is a different matter.
There is a difference between “doing science” and giving scientifically informed advice. The difference can be seen quite clearly by the following thought experiment. You are seated at the table at SAGE 11. Your copy of the dossier containing what little is known about the virus is in front of you. The meeting opened with the chair telling you that the PM needs the committee’s advice that afternoon. The chair turns to you and says “Suppose we just did nothing and let people get on with it. We need to know what would happen. Could the NHS cope?” How would you answer that question? I don’t mean, by the way, what answer would you give, interesting though that might be. I mean, what processes would you go through to get from what you have — the data in front of you, the resources available to you on the day, and your accumulated knowledge and experience — to answering the PM’s question the same day?
This appears to be a scientific question, about what happens in the real world, so you could consider a process that would answer it by the “Scientific Method” which people in the columns seem to set so much store by. You might formulate a testable hypothesis, such as “The NHS can cope with mitigation and suppression but not with do-nothing” You. might then propose to perform some sort of randomised control experiment, where you divide the country, and London, into three tightly demarcated zones, in each of which you try the three main policies: laissez-faire (a la Brazil), social measures (a la Sweden), and draconian lockdown (a la Scotland). For optimal results people should be assigned randomly to the three parts. At the end of six months you count up the number of dead bodies, count the number of days the NHS was in effective operation and assess whether or not your hypothesis was confirmed or falsified by the experiment. There you are, an answer completely in accordance with the scientific method.
Except that you don’t, because it’s grossly unethical, it’s practically, legally and politically impossible, and it’s not even close to answering the question as asked. It is in fact completely useless.
So let me ask again. What do you do? What analytical or practical processes do you carry out to get you from the question to the answer sought on the day?
But then it was never about the science, was it?
Thanks for picking up the challenge. The question on the table is, you will recall, “Suppose we just did nothing and let people get on with it. We need to know what would happen. Could the NHS cope?”
Your point 1 does not tell me how you would turn noticing something into an answer to the question. Points 2,3 and 4 are how you would treat someone else’s answer. The question is how you would go about answering. Do your points 2,3,4 taken together mean that you would accept the output of a model that you felt commanded peer approval? Point 5 is anachronistic and, as it happens, wrong. Deaths had hardly started to rise by that point, let along fall again — and Levitt was wrong to model the rising data using a Gompertz curve (indeed falling data is doubtful). Points 6,7,8,9 are nothing to do with an answer to the question “Suppose we did nothing”, since they are recommendations for doing something, not estimates for what would happen if we did nothing.
So I think the only viable answer I can see to the challenge in your response is along the lines of “Use a model that’s better than the one that was used at the time”. Is that a fair summary?
Interesting thread which I’m scanning very quickly, as it’s yesterday’s comments now, and probably no one is going to read this now anyway.
I’d add one thing here: had I been there, at those early meetings, I’d have asked what had been the experience with previous new viruses and bad flus. What had been the predictions, and what had been the actuality? And what, as far as we could tell, had already happened in China?
The answers to those questions would have cast serious doubt on the Imperial modelling, and might have shed some useful light on the current predicament.
Lots of interesting discussion about the scientific method. What SAGE and the responsible ministers were being asked to undertake was more to do with rational and balanced analysis than actual science.
https://twitter.com/Covid19Crusher/status/1310170249464078336/photo/1
When is the pandemic ending? Some would say that when the excess mortality has gone. This has just happened in Brazil which still will have several thousands of deaths in line the next months for the last descending part of the pandemic. But like many countries the lower excess mortality will perhaps absorb that number. In flu pandemics the pandemic was over when excess mortality was gone although cases would occur at lower level. But all restrictions(if any were instituted)were lifted. Everybody would just expect the next influenza wave and respond when the parameters showed an increase that incl. increase in excess mortality.
“when the excess mortality has gone.”
Don’t play the game. ‘Excess mortality’ is a movable fiction. Just consider historical proportionality.
I can’t see much difference between excess mortality and historical proportionality. Earlier, included in the definition of pandemic flu, excess mortality was one of the criteria for pandemic. That is not against historical proportionality which is a reasonable comparison. The Asiatic flu 1957 in the US had clearly an excess mortality. But going back for seasonal influenza during World War 2 and even some years after the war, the circulating seasonal flu some years could even have higher excess mortality than the pandemic year. In Sweden the total excess mortality first 9 months this year is higher than previous years but the same in 2015 when we only had seasonal flu. That is historic proportionality. But even more interesting is going into excess mortality in age group. In Sweden there has been practically no excess mortality in age below 65 but all excess mortality in over 65. This defines C-19 as a geriatric pandemic.
It’s irrelevant when the pandemic ends.
The plandemic will only end when the major currencies have collapsed and the sheep are thereby finally woken up.
Right,
lets have 5 or even ten FACTS that will help change a brainwashed zombie’s mind about the dangers of covid. They have to be clear simple to understand and hard hitting. I am going to make an A5 leaflet I can give to people.
Number of people under the age of 60 without pre-existing medical conditions who have died in the UK. Answer – 300.
Estimated equivalent number of jobs lost worldwide. Answer = 500 million.
good stuff, well it isn’t but you know what I mean
I’ll re-iterate mine :
(a) Since 1993, there have been 7 out of 27 seasons with higher mortality (i.e c. 25%). None of them needed the shut-down of society.
In three-quarters of a century (my lifetime) that indicates about two dozen similar or worse events.
(b) Taken with 2018/20 (a weak ‘flu season), the mortality over two years was precisely average.
Therefore : What’s to panic about?
Good stuff keep em coming with sources if possible. I am will copy them.
I have a mask zelot coming round tomorrow, a young student chappy, by the sound of it, very brainwashed indeed. I asked him not to wear a face nappy when he comes round with his laptop, again I can’t believe I am asking customers not to wear one. Just insane.
(a) Since 1993, there have been 7 out of 27 seasons with higher mortality (i.e c. 25%). None of them needed the shut-down of society.
This is good indeed but hard to understand, takes too much thinking and is in the past…
(b) Taken with 2018/20 (a weak ‘flu season), the mortality over two years was precisely average.
This is a good one
I’m happy for someone to rephrase it – but the point is to get over that this is nothing exceptional.
Spot on, Rick, but it’s an uphill struggle.
99.999% of healthy people recover from c19, most don’t even know they had it
at least 75,000 will die from non-covid19 illnesses because of lockdown
75% of covid19 deaths were in nursing homes and hospitals, where they were infected
99.999% of healthy people recover from c19, most don’t even know they had it
That’s the best one.
at least 75,000 will die from non-covid19 illnesses because of lockdown
this one is good but hard to prove and a bit arbitrary
75% of covid19 deaths were in nursing homes and hospitals, where they were infected
This one boosts the covid is dangerous narrative, not a good stat
I think the 75,000 is a sage forecast, not sure, fair enough re the bottom one
It is, the report was linked in yesterday’s LS update.
None of these figures will convince them, these are the sheeple and they only believe what the Gov or MSM tell them. They cannot comprehend that they would lie to them, so no matter what you tell them they have no desire to believe it.
I think your probably right but perhaps times they are a-changing. I think people are a lot more receptive to a counter narrative.
“You cannot reason people out of positions they didn’t reason themselves into”
Jonathan Swift
That’s a very good approach indeed.It will quickly expose their level of understanding and fears and what factors they see to be most important
Avearge mortality age covid19 = 82yrs
Average mortality age worldwide =72yrs
very good
people under 39 who have died 39 that’s a good one. How about the 390 odd who have died of it that were under 65 what’s the exact number? That statt Rabb didn’t know in that interview.
sources would be good
I think 307, although how many were
A)false positive?
B)assumed Covid during peak?
C)had hidden underlying conditions?
I think that figure was taken from the 3700 figure after PHE rounded down their numbers to show those who had IT but didnt have any underlying conditions who died. Of those 307 were under 65
Give them this link (2020 ranks only 8th in last 30 years. for excess mortality in UK):
https://hectordrummond.com/2020/07/17/another-jaw-dropping-graph/
Or just tell them to Google “jaw-dropping graph”.
Or this link (expands on the above, also covering other countries such as Sweden, and the current “casedemic”):
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8UvFhIFzaac
Or these Mike Yeadon Twitter threads (former head of respiratory research at Pfizer, and former colleague of Patrick Vallance, strongly disputing current government claims about “second wave”):
https://www.twitter.com/MichaelYeadon3/status/1308164416207233024
https://www.twitter.com/MichaelYeadon3/status/1309793649069260806
all very good stuff but it’s too graphy and read-y, these facts are for a leaflet. perhaps there is room for ONE graph..
Just give what I wrote as the facts, but include the links on the leaflet (or include Google search terms such as “jaw-dropping graph”).
I didn’t write any facts for the second link, but it could be “Sweden, which didn’t lock down, and is now back to normal, also did not see unusual excess mortality”.
thats a good one but easily countered by Sweden did lock down and also the “the well they had lots in deaths in their care homes didn’t they.” thing.
I think it’s well-known that Sweden didn’t have a lockdown (offices, pubs, restaurants, public transport all remained open, nobody had to stay in their houses, etc.). They also haven’t been wearing masks. And the care homes deaths doesn’t change the fact that they did not have greater overall mortality than some recent flu seasons. I think these are exactly the type of facts that the majority are unaware of and might shock them. But it’s your leaflet, well done for making the effort and good luck with it!
mention how many people die each day in the uk from other diseases and what proportion of these were covid. There was a good pie chart somewhere, maybe this site, which showed very clearly this and the covid slice could hardly be seen on the chart – i thought it illustrated it well and proportionally.
Also where covid rates in death rate amongst all diseases – can’t remember but was something like 16th or maybe lower
good job two-six – i might print some off and stick under car windscreens!!
yes that pie chart. very good. that might be the one graph, however its a bit not to do with just covid,
Stats about job losses and business closures suicides and increased admissions to hospitals for children…might be a good thing
the covid deaths in the pie chart are so small you can’t see it either lol
this thing about protecting others and asymptomatic transmission is a big pillar to bring down.
protecting granny
What about this one :
https://pbs.twimg.com/media/Ei3mMv8XYAUqT5p?format=jpg&name=small
good one
Covid currently accounts for just one in a hundred of all deaths in England and Wales. I left out that nasty percent word.
(ONS figures).
more people die in accidents at home than from covid now. Should we shut down B&Q???
In August 2020 in England, covid was the 24th commonest cause of death.
(ONS)
Flu deaths v Covid deaths in the last two weeks. That’s a killer. People are just stunned.
Similar comparison with weekly deaths from heart disease and cancer.
On schools. In Sweden, 1.8m schoolchilden from kindergarten to age 16 continued to attend school as normal throughout the crisis with no use of masks. Not a single child death.
Scottish Nightingale being dismantled (at great cost) after never treating a single Covid patient, while healthy students in Scotland are confined under what amounts to house arrest.Would this be done if a real second wave was expected?
Lies about exponential growth of ‘cases’. Lies about doubling rates of infections.
Govt. estimate that lockdown has caused 75,000 deaths. Nearly twice Covid deaths.
Great news, please upload it here when you do!
Normal death rates, not flu, but everyday deaths of all ages as I don’t think people realise that 1600 die daily which makes it around 45,000 a month. Puts the single digit scare stories now in context. The CDC figures or equivalent which show if we treated the risks of everyday life with the chance of dying from this, we would not be able to do anything in life, slipping in the bath or falling downstairs has a higher probability of death yet alone driving or riding a horse.
This may not be simple enough for an A5 leaflet but I wanted to share it anyway as it’s had some measure of success when I’ve used it. It’s difficult for people to visualise large numbers so I’ve used the analogy of a standard sized book (novel)
An average sized book = 500,000 text characters (90,000 words – 70 characters per line (approx.)
Anyway, here it is: The number of people who have died in the UK of the virus equates to the last 4 1/2 lines on the very last page of an average sized book **
** UK population: 66,000,000 = 132 books
UK deaths: 42,000 / 132 = 318
Also, the other tactic I use is to say that 10 in every 15,000 have died rather than 1 in every 1,500. It seems to have more impact.
Anyway, good luck with your leaflet!
good one!
I’ve just been catching up on the recent Anna Brees footage from Trafalgar Square yesterday.
The interviews underline the folly of this site letting minor political side-issues intrude on the consensus around Covid. The people interviewed were very varied. Start riding sectarian hobby-horses, and you kill that breadth of opinion.
Anyone have guidance on to what to do if the police ask for your name? I’m trying to become informed on laws and legislations so I can preempt what might happen if I’m maskless in a shop and the police talk to me. I’ve got the guidelines and legislation for mask exemptions to hand, but I’m wondering if I have to give them my name and address if asked. Thanks.
From what I understand there are only certain times you MUST give your name etc an these have to do with confirming you have the correct licence or entitlements for things like driving, selling alcohol, owning a firearm/shotgun, right to be in the country, right to work, prove you are old enough to buy an age restricted product – things like that.
Anything else such as a stop in the street you are not obliged to give any information.
An information site for foreign students/tourists:
https://www.studyinternational.com/news/know-your-rights-what-to-do-if-youre-stopped-by-uk-police/
They can always be arseholes and make up a charge and arrest you, search you and see if you have driving licence, credit card etc on you to confirm your ID that way but do NOT say anything except “I want the duty solicitor” and to put in an official complaint about their behaviour.
Correct. I watched a lot of Crimebodge videos. You Have to give them your name if you’re stopped driving, but not otherwise unless arrested. Or one of the other scenarios AK gives.
Lots of police don’t seem to know/care though. Always film your interactions with them.
A good protest yesterday. Held up a “Stuff the Stupid Rules” / “End the Crazy Rules” sign.
Well done all you who attended.
I was trying to insert a picture of a sign in a local arts crafts shop, I already mentioned it yesterday, and that I spoke to the person behind the till how offensive it is to people with exemptions. Not very good with computers.
So here it is recreated.
F A C E C O V E R I N G S
M U S T B E W O R N
at all times while in this shop.
You will NOT be admitted if you are not
complying with the current legislation.
are they guilty of Discrimination under Equality Act?
Most likely yes they are.
Best just tel them you will take your business elsewhere
Yes – if you can substitute ‘Blacks, Irish, or Dogs admitted ….’ then it’s illegal.
Tell them complying with the current legislation means they have to accept that there are exemptions.
No ifs, no buts.
Do they have a “NO MOLOTOV COCKTAILS” sign?
what they fail to understand is that you are exempt that you ‘are complying with the current legislation’
A similar local shop sign was quickly changed after a post on their Facebook page explaining the guidelines and suggesting their sign should be changed
Mail on line: “Third wave can’t be ruled out ”
SHOOT ME NOW!!!
Neither can aliens landing in Croydon next Wednesday.
I thought it was Thursday.
Nor can Elvis coming back with Lord Lucan in tow.
Riding Shergar?
That’s the Daily Express headline for tomorrow
In other news “we predict the tide will come in tomorrow” and “there will be a winter next year”.
Yes but like Canute,Boris thinks he can order the tide to go out.
unlike Cnut . .He ordered the tide back knowing nothing would happen to show his advisors he was not infallible.
BloJob however thinks he is infallible
TRUE.
But then Canute was intelligent.
Next thing to sell out?—–surf boards!
They really do love the Spanish Flu template don’t they?
No shoot them!
I a very small town in rural north germany, which has a very, very low occurrence of +PCR tests, a group of mainly Rumanian descent have suddenly tested +. The authorities are baffled where they picked it up, as there have been no +PCR in the wider area for weeks.
Just show how ludicrous this testing is. No mention of how they found the first one, but then of course tested everyone they could get their hands on.
For some reason a lot of +pcr tests are of mainly Balkan originated people working in German factories or agriculture.
Do you think it’s because they had higher susceptibility? Or because they’re the only ones being tested?
I guess it might be a mixture of both. A lot work in food production, which after the first outbreak at the meat processor Toennies was under the radar by authorities, but then you also had Goettingen, where blocks of flats where they house asylum seekers had an “outbreak”.
That was like China, huge fence around the building, security, minimal warning and chance for people to stock up on food, and once you tested negative you were allowed out, although names were not checked properly and it was quite a farce.
It probably due to the test kits unable to differentiate between live and dead Covid cells. Bear in mind the common cold and Covid belong to the same family.
Excellent piece by Dr John Lee in the ”round up” section today, sums the shit storm up perfectly.
Right on the money, ”…..academics often have extremely complicated and impressively detailed ways of getting things completely wrong…”
also his taking apart of the naïve ‘precautionary principle’
“‘There was no science’ behind COVID lockdowns,” Sky News Australia interview with American lawyer Michael Senger: https://www.skynews.com.au/details/_6192742875001
Highly recommended.
Listen to Dr Bodo Schiffmann talking in English about the arrest of Dr Heiko Schöning.
Dr Schöning has not been able to talk to his wife and the German lawyers are having difficulties. Dr Schiffmann calls for help from the British people. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SHjYqp0F-nU
Powerful video
I visited North Korea a few years ago. As regards Covid 19 restrictions there, I’ve checked, and although the are restrictions on the number of people who may meet in public, there are NO restrictions regarding how many people may be present in one’s own home. So, my wife, daughter, in-laws and grandchildren are off to Pyongyang for Christmas!
It comes to something when a country vilified as THE most dictatorial country on the planet has a more liberal approach to family get-togethers than “the home of democracy”-The United Kingdom!
Yep!
“But North Korean culture is different, they behave themselves”
You are allowed to change your name at any time provided it is not for the purpose of fraud.
Me, I’m Neil Ferguson.
And I’m Spartacus………………..
No, I’m Spartacus!!
no – you can be Brian
Let’s all be Bruce so’s to avoid confusion.
you can look after logical positivism.. Ill be in charge of the sheep dip
Best laugh all day mjr. Thankyou so much.
Bwrian, Bwrian?
Welease Bwrian!!
Fraud personified!
And his beautiful girlfriend Matti FistPennis
From this point forwards, my name is Matt Wanksock.
When I am at the pub, anyway,
Bit academic as they’ll all be bankrupt and closed by Christmas. Serves them right.
In the meantime I won’t go in order to hasten their end
I sent this video to my MP Caroline Lucas. I am very concerned that Dr Schiffman has been arrested.
I have written to Ms Lucas several times on the pandemic. She seems to believe it. In fact I met her on the bus, and spoke to her yesterday (which she did not like).
She was completely masked up, do not want to discuss this with me, apart from saying that all the govt advisers said how dangerous the virus is!
i got a letter from her to say she would vote against the extension of the coronavirus act, but she is a real trimmer.
I would not trust her, how can she be Green and have no f…ng clue!.
Dr Heiko Schöning was arrested
Sorry limited edit facility on this site. I meant Schoning, but cannot edit now.
Search this page (control F) for Lucas.. You will see a post from me re her involvement in an APPG . She doesnt have a clue about wide range of topics
She is unpopular in Brighton. She is arrogant and looks down on her constituents. I have heard she will not stand for parliament next time. Perhaps there will be no next time though…..
And mine. Our local paper printed a readers letter where her assistant was instructed to reply; I am far too busy to deal with constituents.
Hello Kate,
Coincidently I was sent a marchforchange email today, so I did the same. ..Ms Lucas’s questionnaire was about testing frequency, location red herrings. SIGH
I e-mailed her a couple of days ago enclosing Dr Yeadons allegations – saying that the government was misleading the public on this “pandemic” and calling on Whitty and Vallence to resign..
That afternoon I saw her get on my bus, so after some thought I went upstairs to speak to her.
She had a natty black mask on and was totally on board with all the pandemic misinformation. She did not want to listen to me and rushed off the bus as fast as she could to get away.
I have emailed her several times since, as I am truly concerned by the impending police state, but expect nothing from her.
How can she be so stupid?
“how can she be Green and have no f…ng clue!.”
isn’t it a pre-requisite?
Jenny Jones is brilliant. Caroline Lucas… isn’t.
She also owns a multi-million pound property empire, and toots backwards and forwards across the Atlantic to visit her son who is at an (expensive) American university. That, and the fact that she idolises a teenager with no formal schooling who can ‘see’ carbon dioxide tells you all you need to know!
https://twitter.com/Covid19Crusher/status/1309946709561217025
Some interesting data from Brazil.In this table one can see effect of treatment. Cannot find out when persons were treated but seeing the high deathrate you would assume a selected patient group but all details etc in Portuguese so this is my guess. I assume these are hospital treated patients or a select proportion of them, most likely all hospitalizations (567000). Brazil obviously had Tamiflu in stock after the flu pandemic planning and massive treatment with this drug single seemed useless. However, if combined with CQ, although very small numbers, better outcome. But single drugs no effect at all in this crude observational study. In Pakistan they have also seen a good outcome with the combination HCQ-Tamiflu.
https://twitter.com/Covid19Crusher/status/1309946702405799936
The other data massive from Brazil is syndrome/pre-existing disease presentation and outcome. As noted previously, diarrhoea seemed to be protective and also pure cough but not dyspnoea. The other interesting is that asthma seems to be protective for bad outcome.
It seems most likely that the reason asthma is protective is not the asthma itself but the inhaled corticosteroids.
It’s not obvious as the steroids might make things worse (because they’re immunosuppressants) but it may be that the inflammation is more the problem than the viral clearance. So they would work for similar reasons dexamethasone does.
It would be worth doing a trial on that if there’s enough Covid still around to do one. If you could just give people inhalers it would be a nice easy treatment.
When I was ill in 2009 with a horrible chest bug my Ventolin really worked well to help me breath.
They are already using it. Ventolin & steroid sales rocketed earlier this year.
Not so much now, as guess what? Nobody is sick
Feck I just got this in my email, must have used my details from my surgery.
Got a reply saying Unfortunately the replies aren’t monitored, I bet they are.
Bastards
i had the email yesterday. marked it up on outlook as a phishing email (in the drop down for junk). Yes – from details held by your GP
Others have commented they have had texts
My surgery has a Confidentiality Statement :-
I am contemplating asking how giving away my eMail address is, somehow, not a breach of this statement. I don’t consider that I am at grave risk of serious harm.
very interesting … i think a call to my surgery tomorrow about this…. I have not given any consent for my details to be used
Well, I think “Other health professionals on a need to know basis” as per the first bullet point will be what you are told. Just about covers giving your info and treatment details to any old tom, dick or harry working for the nhs or any of its overpaid consultants/contractors.
Only ever let them have your address and landline. That way, at least they’ll have to do some work to try and contact you.
I’ve gotten letters and a text from Ipsos Mori about a “free test”. The only place they could have got my personal details from is my GP surgery. I wish I could “deregister” myself.
yes i got one also – replied with “foxtrot oscar” – it’s a no-reply email but i wonder if they do view these … ohh hang on there’s a knock on the door!!
that’s exactly what I replied with
These buggers are never going to give up!
From the Telegraph lived feed:
Third wave of coronavirus entirely possible, admits professor
A third wave of coronavirus is “entirely possible” and another lockdown would only serve to “defer” further outbreaks, Professor Mark Woolhouse has warned.
Professor Woolhouse, an infectious disease epidemiologist at the University of Edinburgh, said that while strict measures stop the immediate crisis and quickly reduce transmission, they do not make the virus go away.
Speaking on BBC One’s The Andrew Marr Show on Sunday he said that modelling had previously shown it was “entirely possible” that another lockdown would be needed in September.
When asked if there could be a third wave of coronavirus he said: “That’s entirely possible.
“The scenario I mentioned earlier does actually include this possibility and this is just another demonstration of what I was saying earlier that lockdown doesn’t solve the problem, it defers it.
“That’s why we need some kind of cavalry on the horizon or alternatively, if you think that vaccine is not going to be available in six months or 12 months or two years or whenever, it means that we do need alternatives.
“The alternatives that have been mentioned so far are things like the Moonshot programme of mass testing.”
one sensible comment there
“and this is just another demonstration of what I was saying earlier that lockdown doesn’t solve the problem, it defers it.”
So the answer was not to lockdown.
Can the Professor distinguish between “possible” and “probable”?
What a dick. So that is basically saying that once the “second wave” (no such thing, as we know) is over, there is going to be a third one?
Wait until the dictator sturgeon sees this…
Have a look at the actual interview, its on the BBC site now I think, I watched it earlier this morning and took a little more positives out of it, especially as he rubbished lockdowns.
Thanks. I’ll watch it. However, from the limited piece in The Telegraph he seems to be pushing vaccine, and that Moonshot rubbish.
My reading of what Woolhouse has been saying in the last few days is that lockdowns are pointless. Once you do it once, you have to keep doing it if your strategy is zero covid (as per his erstwhile colleague in Edinburgh, Devi Sridhar). He is essentially saying there needs to be a new strategy, because if a vaccine doesn’t arrive – and I think he is sceptical – we will be discussing lockdowns 3, 4, 5. It’s a bit like post-Financial Crisis, when instead of biting the bullet after QE1 (which, arguably was useful in buying time when central banks were unsure what would happen in the months after Lehman), they kept going with QE infinity and beyond, yet the problems still remain.
Yes, would agree. It’s not a second or third wave, it’s just the spread of the virus that whatever lockdown you did managed to defer the first time. It’s evil genius – you lock down, knowing that you are probably going to stop the spread a bit, then you open up and increase testing and hey presto the “second wave” you predicted – manufactured
Perhaps the tune of the day ought to be something from the Beach Boys – with so many waves it must be good surfin’.
The alternative is to ditch masks, stop focussing on the elusive and likely ineffective and dangerous vaccine, bring in HCQ as an early treatment and open up the effing country completely- ASAP!
Cupid self-advertising Stunt.
Now – how about getting things right again?
And implies that supermarkets etc are not included despite suggestions from Sainsburys. Slightly confusing on churches in that it is optional for church worship but mandatory for community groups meeting in the same building – and seems to imply you have to display the QR thing. Comments later about GDPR and ICO implies we may have to pay…
https://twitter.com/JohnDStats/status/1310211726424580096
From Euro Data
“It’s not just the UK. There is a peak in non-Covid deaths coinciding with the Covid peak, which also happens to coincide with peak lockdown stringency”
Many would say the non -C-19 deaths were undiagnosed C-19. But below from Oxford during two months of lockdown only 2/67 autopsies showed undiagnosed C-19.Below a sobering account of excess deaths due to lockdown,
“Of the 67 autopsies done at our hospital during the first 2 months of lockdown, only two autopsies identified COVID-19 that was undiagnosed before death. More frequently, reduced access to health-care systems associated with lockdown was identified as a probable contributory factor (six cases) or possible contributory factor (eight cases) to death. These causes included potentially preventable out-of-hospital deaths such as acute myocardial infarction and diabetic ketoacidosis, in which patients contacted the health services by telephone and were advised to self-isolate at home rather than attending hospital. Direct reference to financial or work pressures caused by COVID-19 was identified in three of ten cases of suicide.”
https://www.thelancet.com/journals/lanpub/article/PIIS2468-2667(20)30180-8/fulltext
shocking! hope all those who were clapping the NHS see the damage they have caused to the people suffering with other conditions, but probably not as too busy clapping!
Anyone know what Costa are doing? Mrs and Miss Tenchy went in one yesterday. Miss Tenchy faked scanning the QR code, but they weren’t sure whether use of this code was mandatory, or if you can still give them your (false) details manually.
In our local Costa nobody bothers you whatsoever, if you ignore the QR code, nobody asks you to do it manually; no problem.
“suppress the virus” translates into English as “suppress the people”
Said it yesterday…. these protests need to start getting unashamedly populist. No, I don’t live in London – wish I did. However it need to start there. Piers et al need to suck it up and blast out Rule Britannia. A complimentary hand gesture – peace, fist etc should do it. There is no room for personal feelings, it is purely pragmatic.
Also, whatever you think about David Icke and his ideas, I don’t think it helps to have him give speeches.
I feel the same about Piers personally.
Give one yourself then!
Until then don’t criticise. These people are brave for doing what they do.
Do you believe references to 5G help further our cause?
If you’re offering me a talking slot I’ll happily take it
Yes, Icke is brave, but he’s got such a hell of a bad reputation when it comes to ideas. It’s so easy for the MSM to label the entire cause as a conspiracy when people like Icke speak in support. As far giving one myself – sorry, but I live 300 miles away.
Yes but the MSM has already labeled you (and us) anti lockdown nutter and there is nothing we can do about it. Yes, life is not fair.
I was there yesterday and on 29 August, a round trip of 500 miles each time. The atmosphere on both occasions was completely peaceful and it was reassuring and uplifting to be in such a large crowd who have ‘done the math’ and worked out that lockdown is a politically inspired policy which blatantly ignores the science and is astronomically (more) costly in terms of damage done. I feel, however, that the agenda and speakers should focus more on the scientific evidence and less on what can too easily be dismissed as conspiracy theory – albeit a term which is now as often misapplied as ‘racist’ and ‘climate denier’. I do not dispute that various actors are indeed conspiring to promote certain outcomes, but we need to confine ourselves to arguments that are centred on the current coronavirus crisis and can be demonstrated with mathematical clarity. Other, possibly more nebulous, arguments should not be conflated because they only serve to weaken the credibility of what is scientifically and statistically obvious when presented on its own. Btw, the behaviour of the Metropolitan Police Territorial Support Group yesterday was an outrage and an utter disgrace. The 100% peaceful protest was terminated with disproportional and unnecessary aggression; I personally witnessed people being arrested for assaulting the police who had absolutely and to my certain and empirical knowledge done no such thing. Shame on them!
Apologies if posted already but great article on the SDP website RE: universities: https://sdp.org.uk/sdptalk/lets-keep-our-universities-open/
After watching the Tour de France and seeing thousands of french people stood half way up a mountain wearing masks, it was good to see the World Championship time trial today with thousands of Italians stood by the road side not wearing masks and not really distancing. Anarchic bunch, them Italians
Nice to hear. They have gone mask mad generally, though Vittorio Sgarbi, who made that classic ranting speech to the Italian parliament, has banned them when not needed in the town of which he is Mayor (Sutri).
Just been there and can confirm the common sense attitude of IMO more than half the people.
It’s also why the have it under control currently.
Like Sweden, German speaking Switzerland and Ticino: no masks, or wearing them haphazardly and in a sloppy way only.
If you want to have rising coronavirus case numbers instead, mandate masks to be worn, especially outside, at work, on public transport and planes and in schools for hours.
Found an old e-mail from 2010 from the Nightjack website on what to do if arrested, still valid today:
“In these days of us increasingly having to deal with law abiding folk who have fallen foul of the “entitled poor” and those who have learned how to use us to score points and exact revenge, I thought it would be a good idea to give out a bit of general guidance for those law abiding types who find themselves under suspicion or under arrest. It works for the bad guys so make it work for you.
Complain First
Always get your complaint in first, even if it is you who started it and you who were in the wrong. If things have gone awry and you suspect the cops are going to be called, get your retaliation in first. Ring the cops right away and allege for all you are worth. If you can work a racist or homophobic slant into it so much the better.
Make a counter allegation
Regardless of the facts, never let the other side be blameless. If they beat you to the phone, ring anyway and make a counter allegation against them. Again racism or homophobia are your friends. If you are not from a visible minority ethnic culture, may I suggest that that the phrase “You gay bastard” or similar is always useful. In extremis allege sexual assault. It gives us something to bargain with when getting the other person to drop their complaint on a quid-pro-quo basis. This is particularly good where there are no independent witnesses. When it boils down to one word against another and nobody is ‘fessing up, CPS run a mile and you, my friend, are definitely on a walk out
Never explain to the Police
If the Police arrive to lock you up, say nothing. You are a decent person and you may think that reasoning with the Police will help. “If I can only explain, they will realise it is all a horrible mistake and go away”. Wrong. We do want to talk to you on tape in an interview room but that comes later. All you are doing by trying to explain is digging yourself further in. We call that stuff a significant statement and we love it. Decent folk can’t help themselves, they think that they can talk their way out. Wrong.
Admit Nothing
To do anything more than lock you up for a few hours we need to prove a case. The easiest route to that is your admission. Without it, our case may be a lot weaker, maybe not enough to charge you with. In any case, it is always worth finding out exactly how damning the evidence is before you fall on your sword. So don’t do the decent and honourable thing and admit what you have done. Don’t even deny it or try to give your side of the story. Just say nothing. No confession and CPS are on the back foot already. They forsee a trial. They fear a trial. They are looking for any excuse to send you home free.
Keep your mouth shut
Say as little as possible to us. At the custody office desk a Sergeant will ask you some questions. It is safe to answer these. For the rest of the time, say nothing.
Claim Suicidal Thoughts
A debatable one this. Claiming to be thinking about topping yourself has several benefits. If you can keep it up, it might just bump up any compensation payable later. On the other hand you may find yourself in a paper suit with someone watching your every move.
Always always always have a solicitor
Duh. No brainer this one. Unless you know 100% for sure that your mate the solicitor does criminal law and is good at it, ask for the Duty Solicitor. They certainly do criminal law and they are good at it. Then listen to what the solicitor says and do it. Their job is to get you off without the Cops or CPS laying a glove on you if at all possible. It is what they get paid for. They are free to you. There is no down side. Now decent folks think it makes them look like they have something to hide if they ask for a solicitor. Irrelevant. Going into an interview without a solicitor is like taking a walk in Tottenham with a big gold Rolex. Bad things are very likely to happen to you. I wouldn’t do it and I interview people for a living.
Part 2, the rest:
“Actively complain about every officer and everything they do
Did they cuff you when they brought you in? Were they rude to you? Did they racially or homophobically abuse you? Didn’t get fed? Cell too cold? You are decent folk who don’t want to make a fuss but trust me, it pays to whinge and no matter how trivial and / or poorly founded your complaint there are people who will uncritically listen to you and try and prove the complaint on your behalf. Some of them are even police officers. Nothing like a complaint to muddy the waters and suggest that you are only in court because the vindictive Cops have a grudge against you. Far fetched? Wait until your solicitor spins it in court and you come over as Ghandi.
Show no respect to the legal system or anybody working in it
You think that if you are a difficult, unpleasant, sneering, unco-operative and rude things will go badly for you and you will be in more trouble. No sirree Bob. It seems that in fact the worse you are, the easier things will go for you if, horror of horrors, you do end up convicted. Remember to fake a drink problem if you haven’t developed one as a result of dealing with us already. Magistrates and Judges do seem to like the idea that you are basically good but the naughty alcohol made you do it. They treat you better. Crazy I know but true.
So there you go, basically anything you try and do because you are decent and staightforward hurts you badly. Act like an habitual, professional, lifestyle criminal and chances are you will walk away relatively unscathed. Copy the bad guys, its what they do for a living.”
The Whitty/Vallance graph brought to mind an old riddle from schooldays. Here’s the 2020 Covid version:
Take the number of cases;
Double it;
Add 10;
Double it again;
Subtract 20;
Divide by 4;
Subtract the number of cases;
Apply the iron laws of geometric progression and multiply by the R-number raised to the power of the number of days between now and 15th October.
Zero cases – problem solved!
I should stress that this is not a prediction, just a way of thinking.
And they still got it wrong:
https://twitter.com/LeahButlerSmith/status/1309426011063422976
Relevance to the main issue the country is facing? I couldn’t see any, so unless I missed something, no relevance to the destruction of the country as a whole.
I agree.
Dr Heiko Schöning released
https://twitter.com/BreesAnna/status/1310229128612806656
Glad he is out.
This just strengthens resolve.
I don’t know why students are putting up with the situation they are facing, it would not have happened in my day without a hell of a fight. I would be preparing my protest banner as we speak and it might look something like the attached image (if it is visible when I press the post button that is)
It’s the snowflake generation, they have had things to easy so do not know how to protest or demo like we did in the old days.
Actually I have met some young people of about 19 yrs. They are pretty tough.
I think the govt. is mistaken in pushing them
They do not understand yet what is being done to them but once they do these young people will be implacable.
Lets hope the young will be on the right side.
I hope you are right.
I have some 19yr old female students living next door to me and frankly I am scared of them!
It is an astrological thing, that generation all have a saturn pluto opposition which is pretty lethal. In a way I am glad they have it because they will need to face some hard times and will need to be hard themselves. But they will be a force, and not like the students who came before them (with the exception of us sixties lot, who were revolutionaries)
As an astrologer myself, I always thought this generation was going to be our Big White Hope because they were born with Neptune in Aquarius. Air sign generations usually bring about radical new ideas, to wit the Neptune in Libra lot in the 60s. Thanks for mentioning that Saturn-Pluto opposition which really does indicate the shape of things to come for them. Maybe the terrible restrictions from authoritarian powers students are having to now face will be the trigger…
I think so, this is formative for them.
I suspect their experiences will count for more than their star charts.
Saturn pluto relates to coercion and power struggles, both as outer experience and as internal qualities It is not nice at all.
I think it will be like the crushing of the students on Westminster Bridge in 2011. Neither group of young people will forget, and nor should they.
What?
Don’t indulge in lazy generalisations. They don’t help, win nobody over, and just label you as a sour old fart.
I wouldn’t swap the comparative ease that my generation had for what this generation have.
For the life of me I can’t understand why they just don’t say NO.
I mean you might get nicked.
Big fecking deal.
Anybody with any wit about them would be able to walk out these places if they really wanted to.
From what i’ve read itjust sounds like a big party.
I’m actually thinking of breaking in.
I know of some of the wardens at Edinburgh, who are postgraduate students, complaining that it is ‘really hard’ because ‘no-one is social distancing’ in the halls. Just jobsworths enacting policies created by bullies backed by the biggest bully of them all, Wee Jimmy Krankie.
If you want to see true horror of the dystopia we are in, Roland Garros Tennis now live on ITV4. It is horrific.
I know, having really missed Wimbledon this year (The only spectator sport I like) I tried to watch the Tennis…ye gods no thanks.
Dystopian madness. It’s outside, so WTF is everyone wearing masks AND sitting way apart from everyone else? Even with antisocial distancing they could have got loads more spectators in. The buffoons who come up with these rules want a tennis racket shoving up their arses – wide end first.
I just had a look and you’re right about the numbers – looks like spectators have to sit with a seat in between. I wonder if they just didn’t get the ticket sales as there are whole sections empty. Also it’s Murray vs Wawrinka so maybe not appealing to the french!
Don’t you realise that everyone has to wear masks everywhere all the time in Paris inside and out?
and at their desks in the office – absolute nightmare!
There was one lady wearing it down under nose who was frequently in shot when players serving. Can’t have that, gentle word and she is now wearing ‘correctly’. All of them touching them every few seconds though.
Playing summer sports in autumn/winter weather is always gonna be interesting. I would’ve like to have seen them playing Wimbledon now, plenty of bust ligaments and twisted ankles.
I can’t wait to see the F1 GP in October at the Nurburgring with six inches of snow on the track!
Why was Dr Schöning arrested and none of the other speakers? Why him?
I have my own ideas .. nothing whatsoever to do with nationality. I myself have duel citizenship.
Listen carefully to his interview with Anna Brees and take particular notice of what he has to say about the underlying cause of the ‘crisis’ and also notice his demeanour, delivery and appearance. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lRJt4Cw4lC8&t=778s
‘They’ must have been terrified to let this particular doctor, the driving force behind the German resistance movement, be seen and heard by the demonstrators.
Masks, lockdown, distancing, cases, testing … all red herrings!
I hope he sues the Met big time.
From the timing of the Police intervention it’s as clear as the nose on your face that he was not going to be allowed to speak.
The intervention was to silence him – simple as.
Would be good if he could make a video of what he was planning to say.
I think he did speak in Trafalgar Square, he was picked up later when the demonstrators moved to Hyde Park.
The police made a mistake in blocking the demo in Trafalgar square at 3pm, it just forced people onto the street and later into Hyde Park.
The police could not stop them, there were not enough police to control five or six thousand people,…(so I hear)
He certainly started – but then it was starting to going Pete Tong as there was clearly action going on around the speakers stage and was never heard by the majority of the crowd for the few minutes he was speaking as far as I remember it – certainly from where I was standing that was the impression.
Subsequent to the Trafalgar Square demo there were marches of several thousand people forced out of the square down Oxford Street to Hyde Park calling out “take off your mask” to shoppers as they went.
So the police action was counter-productive.
Yeah – was great being in a crowd again and chanting.
Just like walking through Glasgow central station just off the Hampden train after Celtic have won the cup
Does anyone know of any interviews Dr Schoning has given, obviously excluding the one above.
I have been posting here about the underlying economic reason for this reset for some time.
The financial system collapsed last year, was pumped up temporarily by the fed, but now the banks are recapitalising themselves on real assets – all the businesses the “coronavirus” will force into bankruptcy.
It is a criminal conspiracy.
Few are seeing that the western financial system has been collapsed.
Yes, Kate you are right.
Please don’t stop posting.
It is a worldwide criminal conspiracy and the German Ausschuss aims to take a legal route to expose the conspiracy. They are setting up a class action legal case against, in the first instance, Christian Drosten (German Gov. scientific advisor) who developed the first so called Covid PCR test and the head of Robert Koch Institute and head of WHO ( I think).
They are also investigating government liability from damages they may face due to their policies and legal mechanisms. Heres a vid to explain in English..I also posted this earlier today
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=x_sTEem7LG4
Kate, do you have any written explanation of this collapse?
Hi jb
https://www.cadtm.org/Another-look-at-the-Federal-Reserve-s-panic-in-September-2019-and-solutions-to
https://newleftreview.org/issues/II123/articles/robert-brenner-escalating-plunder.pdf
Thanks. I can read much faster than it would take me to watch a video, and I couldn’t find anything after an internet search.
I know what you mean about videos – I always run them at 1.75 speed.
The CADTM site has some good analysis.
UK “cases” two days ago 6873, yesterday 6041, today 5693 (source https://www.worldometers.info/coronavirus/?utm_campaign=homeAdUOA?Si#countries
The 22.00 closing must be working.-or is it the muzzles?
unfortunately that didnt start till Thuersday evening and the incubaton period is at least 7 days ie 3 days, as previously it is declining before the effect from the actions takes place. Guess what it will be claimed as a victory by Pinky and Perky though.
Hospital admissions are also down.
My view: meaningless without proportion data i.e. “of X people tested Y showed positive”. And we know that we get statistical quirks at weekends. So I can’t read anything useful into it.
I emailed them yesterday to ask why they don’t correlate “tests done” against “tests positive” but I’m not expecting to get a response.
Yes, it’s pretty meaningless, but the government uses this data to keep assaulting us with new restrictions. Accordingly, any reduction is good.
DM spin https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-8778015/More-60-Wales-population-lockdown-tomorrow.html
“UK records another 17 Covid deaths in 24 hours and 5,693 new cases – 46% higher than last Sunday” Could have been “18% fall in two days”.
distraction
Just mooching the internet as getting a bit chilly to sit in the garden.
Found lots of strange and interesting stuff but found this updated a few days ago:
https://www.cdc.gov/coronavirus/2019-ncov/prevent-getting-sick/how-covid-spreads.html
Now contains at the top of the page:
“A draft version of proposed changes to these recommendations was posted in error to the agency’s official website. CDC is currently updating its recommendations regarding airborne transmission of SARS-CoV-2 (the virus that causes COVID-19). Once this process has been completed, the update language will be posted.”
https://bluntforcetruth.com/news/cdc-admits-there-is-no-proof-covid-19-is-airborne-virus-and-they-have-been-misleading-the-public-all-along/
Said to have been posted before the usual/correct vetting procedure has taken place.
https://www.mscbs.gob.es/profesionales/saludPublica/ccayes/alertasActual/nCov/documentos/COVID19_Estrategia_vigilancia_y_control_e_indicadores.pdf
Have just seen this update from Spain dated 25th September. It looks like they are tightening up on their definition of a “case” using x-rays and symptoms rather than just a positive test result. There is a footnote at the bottom of page 11 which suggests that PCR positive tests requiring more than 30-35 cycles are likely to be non infectious.
My Spanish is a bit rusty these days but hopefully this looks like a step in the right direction. Any Spanish speakers on here?
Great information thanks. Definitely needed as PCR on its own is useless
Something similar is being done in Belgium, I think
I agree. The PCR has been written into guidance around the world to trump all clinical symptons. Good to see a sensible approach being taken here.
Yes found same information here
https://twitter.com/andrewbostom/status/1310179396049870849/photo/1
Interesting development in Spain, strengthening the active case definition
Active: Symptoms AND positive test(ie for rtPCR at Ct<30-35 that is focusing on transmissibility, ELIMINATING “high Ct (>30-35) rtPCR+”, asymptomatic (non-)“cases”
Carl Heneghan has today on his twitter interesting information on C-19 in Spain recent data
https://twitter.com/CorrNotCausa/status/1310279654734024704
Clarification now.The Spanish document is extremely complex.They have not as above included Ct 30-35 in the case definition but rather bizarrely using this only if health care workes can be at home or not.So as I understand now, case definition requires symptoms but not as above does it include anything about Ct values.
I shall book my flights in anticipation of some more sensible case numbers now
This the best update about Spain until 25 Sept
https://www.dropbox.com/s/6mk4465ewjcb6ln/SPAIN%20-%20Second%20Wave%20Monitoring-25Sept2020.pdf?dl=0
Bottas wins in Russia – I tested negative but just in case!
I don’t watch motorsport anymore, the black masks everywhere so menacing. Even interviewers in the open air with masks, many hear what they mumble.
MotoGP are handling this so much better than F1. Interviews with riders and podiums are maskless. I can’t watch any interview with anybody with a mask on.
I don’t watch any sport any more – refuse to pretend it is normal. Prefer to watch a couple of people at my tennis club going at it – that’s real.
I stopped to watch a game of cricket a few weeks ago – a few spectators dotted around the ground – all looked normal from a distance!
and afterwards do you watch them play tennis?
Valuable advertising space being wasted on that mask.
You might be head hunted!
what would be your slogan on the mask?
I cannot say here, not in polite company.
how does he slurp the campagne with the nappy on his face???
Bit of a waste I’d say…
I suppose you wait for the filtered champagne to start dripping through the mask?
Sounds lovely.
I think you wait until people stop taking photos.
You know the game inside out!
That isn’t champagne in his right hand it’s the vaccine!
Please can this be highlighted on tomorrow’s Lockdown Sceptics.
“There is no law that masks must be worn when walking to a table and can be removed when sat down, even though this will no doubt be the practice as followed in some other European countries. The simple blanket rule is that masks are to be worn. It must be, therefore, that just as the government can pretend PCR testing is effective, it can pretend that if we are sat at a table, whether for 4 minutes or 4 hours, then we are eating and drinking throughout, even when we’re mostly just having a chat. If the clipboard carriers don’t also pretend, then the bars may get a bit livelier than expected”
https://laworfiction.com/2020/09/face-covering-some-pretend-law/
What this means is the masks must be worn at the table, when eating, drinking etc. The law makes no mention they can be removed when inside the premises.
How does this work?
Any ideas anyone as all I can think of is everything to be liquidised and sucked through a straw passed around the afce covering.
It is simply an oddity of the law that you are simply exercising the “reasonable excuse” that it is necessary for you to remove the mask to eat or drink. However, if you were to finish your meal and were not ordering anymore, technically you have no reasonable excuse to not be wearing a mask, and the law says you must then put one on.
Glad someone has an explanation because as it stands the way the law is written it’s farcical.
Any law regarding CV-19 is *£$%&*”& farcical.
LoF is saying that there is nothing in the law that says masks can be removed. So clearly the rule is being ignored by staff when customers eat and drink. But if the law is the law then they cannot remove masks to eat or drink and will have to absorb the food through osmosis or sucking as per Awkward Git.
And if you openly disregard this law then why have masks at all.
The makes provision, graciously, thus:
Yes it does indeed. The SI covers for the purposes of eating or drinking. But is talking to your friends over a meal the same thing? You would have to do a niqab-pulley thing. The one you see with some Muslim women who have a little lever to lift their face covering out so they can get the food in their mouth!
You won’t see this on BBC today.
https://m.facebook.com/sargonofakkad100/videos/335518764329241/?refsrc=https%3A%2F%2Fm.facebook.com%2Fstory.php&refid=52&_rdr
A mostly enjoyable day spoiled only by being on the receiving end of some indirect pepper spray at Hyde park corner. I had a lot of constructive conversations with the police on the day, including the chief inspector (wearing a yellow cap) on the ground – who seemed to have lost control of the situation. To be fair, don’t think the guy punching that old lady in the video is typical of met police. He should be identified and face some sanction for that behaviour though. Shame on him.
shocking.
Some good sound reporting from Anna Brees at the London protest.
https://youtu.be/gcrL1F2ug9Q
I dont use FB. Is there any other link of this that doesnt require logging in?
Most I spoke to yesterday and last week were fine. Didn’t speak to the CI, though I did see him.
Lawrence Fox on Twitter https://twitter.com/LozzaFox
Toby Young on Twitter https://twitter.com/toadmeister
I would be more enthusiastic if the first aim of the party was to end lockdown. As it stands, I feel the timing is wrong.
I agree. The ‘virus’ and the destruction of life as we know it, is the biggest single problem affecting all of us. Lawrence Fox may well have some good ideas but can it be a touch of ‘fiddling while Rome burns’?
‘Destruction of life as we know it’ due to the government by the way and not due to the’virus’
Guessed you meant that.
Just another divide and conquer thing, this time not as a deliberate strategy perhaps, but that will be the end result.
Is the intention to be a one issue party? Think what happened to UKIP once the referendum happened, it had nowhere to go and self imploded.
Yes – I rather felt that something like this was set to happen after that Question Time. Washed-up actor looking for alternative employment!
It reminds me of Killjoy-Silk and his “Veritas” party. Although I’m told Fox was quite good in Poirot.
The Heritage Party ticks the anti-lockdown box plus all the others (for me) and also already has a leader on the London Assembly.
Can this also be highlighted in tomorrow’s edition.
It’s an outrage almost beyond all others in this current Hysteria. It’s despicable behaviour on the part of the government and the universities.
Lockdownsceptics@gmail.com so it does not get missed
It is unbelievable that lawyers are simply sitting back and allowing this and all the other covid laws and rules to go unchallenged. Selfishness at its peak.
They are playing the long game and thinking of the civil actions in the years to come.
Simon Dolan is doing something, with the help of his lawyers. If he wins – a big if – the government should fall – or would if we lived in normal times.
Otherwise lawyers can only proceed if a client instructs them to bring a case, which is not easy given the cost of litigation and the rule that the loser usually pays, which can be ruinous.
As for the lawyers in parliament that is a different issue. They should have been shouting from the roof tops about the lack of legitimacy of covid restrictions. I am reminded of something John Gierach said, that even the best of them fall out of love with democracy once they are elected.
May work in our favour – overreach. Rules starting to look more and more arbitrary.
Yesterday posted a graph of UK New Covid cases per 1000 tested which did not show a recent exponential rise or much rise at all. This graph is in the below article
Prof Fenton “The impact of false positives in Covid testing”
https://probabilityandlaw.blogspot.com/2020/09/the-impact-of-covid-false-positives.html
I found it quite puzzling why t&t does not apply to premises feeding the homeless.
Aah, they cannot “isolate at home”
Course not and despite throwing money at everything else at the moment why are homeless not being given a roof over their heads and a safe bed to sleep in?
priority is being given to those arriving on dinghies on the south coast, in 4 star hotels across the country.
77 spotters may find misinfirmation interest in a recent Tobias Elwood twit post. Visit the link for an Elwood tweet which includes a pie chart with obvious spelling error.
https://twitter.com/_InThisTogether/status/1310211773602111488?s=20
In this together tweets:
The art of disinformation from a 77th Brigade officer. Government “data,” especially Pillar 2, is abject bilge. It records totally unreliable test results, not “outbreaks.” (why 2 R’s?) By seeming to challenge policy, TE is reinforcing baseless propaganda. Don’t fall for it.
Quote Tweet
Tobias Ellwood MP
@Tobias_Ellwood
· 5h
HOW TO TACKLE COVID – NOT WITH 10pm CURFEWS
Government’s data shows where our strategy should now focus. So hitting HOSPITALITY with 10pm closing makes no sense (& was not advised by SAGE).
Let’s not place unnecessary rules on VIABLE businesses and turn them into UNVIABLE ones.
I would argue that using the terms Viable against unviable is a method for drifting in acceptance of a government cull of business they don’t want to exist. This is a clensing of businesses by an undemocratic decree.
He’s my MP but made a tit of himself over the Bournemouth beach issue. There are a lot of independent shops in the various Bournes of Bournemouth and I expect he’s getting an earful by now.
DM headline
Shocking moment middle-aged woman is slammed to the ground by police during clash with anti-lockdown demonstrators in Trafalgar Square – as Sadiq Khan is branded a hypocrite for calling the gathering ‘unacceptable’ after he backed the BLM protests.
See video footage. She was standing on a portable with one officer pulling the chair from under her feet and she fell to the ground. Shocking!!
Sounds like a sympathetic headline too – encouraging
And they’ve let me post sceptical comments as well for the first time in about 10 days.
Comment section is full of abuse, basically saying that “she deserved it” and that even worse things should be done to her and everyone else at the demo.
The other articles I looked at are full of very sceptical – basically government can get stuffed.
The trolls, bots and 77th cannot control every article I guess.
My comments on 2 of them were 28/0 thumbs up and 17/3 thumbs up after 2 minutes.
Given up with it for today, bored now.
I’m sure you’re right. You win some, you lose some. I’ll go back to it tomorrow and add more comments of my own.
Can’t read the comments. Too upsetting that our fellows believe that assault by the police is legitimate.
The police state depends on fellow travellers anf Stasi-type informers. Without them, it is dead.
Always remember: “The actual cause of death may not be COVID-19 in all cases.” (My bold)
https://coronavirus.data.gov.uk/deaths
Translation: the actual cause of death will not be COVID in most cases.
Another excellent link from Swedenborg, below, for which many thanks.
It makes depressing reading:
‘….contrary to the Government claims made this week, there is no real real evidence of exponential growth in the virus.’ (Taken from the government’s own figures)
‘….discussion of a single FP or FN rate completely misses the fact that there are multiple tests from different vendors being used at the moment. The NHS alone are using at least five different primary rt-PCR tests. Each has a different manufacturer or seeks a different RNA target and therefore has a different sensitivity and specificity profile. What we do not have as yet is independent laboratory verification of the manufacturer’s claimed sensitivity and specificity.’
‘As best as we have been able to identify from the literature collected that has assessed the rt-PCR and lab-based antibody tests:
https://probabilityandlaw.blogspot.com/2020/09/the-impact-of-covid-false-positives.html
Words fail……
Here are someone else’s
‘There must be some kind of way outta here
Said the joker to the thief
There’s too much confusion
I can’t get no relief….’
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qmGFFJtkDXA
Tim, the lack of any sort of standardisation and procedures just show what an amateur cowboy show this is.
And yet this cowboy is currently riding a bucking bull through our economy and our lives.
Been thinking about the situation and trying to imagine what the next steps are likely to look like. There is no doubt that they (Govt) are trying to plot a way out that allows them some credit and enables them to lay the blame at someone else’s door as far as possible. I think there was a lot of hope about the Oxford vaccine, and the reflected glory of the UK being the first to develop it. Now that has been dashed, you can see how quickly the narrative switched. Now it is all about ‘six months’ and ‘getting through the ‘winter’. They have upped the fear and the restrictions without doing anything substantial. They are buying time. My hunch is that their new escape strategy involves making Whitty and Vallance, and by extension, all of Sage, the fall guys. They sent them out with their laughable graph and made them try and defend it. Not even Hancock was anywhere to be seen. No questions allowed. We then hear that Boris has been consulting Tegnell, as well as Gupta and Heneghan. Then Tegnell starts saying some slightly odd things defending lockdowns. Could it be that, knowing we are headed very quickly towards the inevitable disaster, they know a change of course is not only desirable, but essential. Dominic Cummings is a very very smart operator and he will know Boris and his Government will not survive the coming crisis if things remain as they are, the backbench rebellion is growing, sceptical voices are gaining traction and when unemployment hits, more and more people will start to question the narrative. Therefore the way out is to either force Whitty or Vallance (preferably both) to resign, or if necessary, sack them for presenting ‘misleading information’ . Then hire new ‘advisers’. If they can headhunt Tegnell it would be seen as a master stroke! If not, they could get Heneghan and Gupta. They could then ditch most of the rubbish, steer a path through and still claim to be ‘following the science’ and blame the ‘wrong advice’ for all of the disastrous consequences of their own decisions. They are not stupid. They know there is a great stinking pile of manure that will be dumped on their heads quite soon. Now the vaccine is no longer the Great White Hope, this seems as feasible a ‘solution’ as any other. Thoughts?
Something seems to be on the wind, I’d go with dropping tweedledumb and tweedledumber in the shit when come mid-octeber their graph is obviously total bollocks.
Then say “the big boys made us do it, wasn’t our fault”.
Then we string them all up.
No no, brick wall, AK-47. I’ve even got it on order…
I’m pushing for a trial for treason and crimes against humanity, guilty verdict then hung drawn and quartered like in the old days.
Agreed.
AK-47 too fast, I think a rifle with a bolt so these traitors get the full pain, bullet going into the chamber. See which one wets them self first.
Remember the executioner has to clean up afterwards. Fast is good with me.
don’t waste a good bullet … do it the old fashioned way of hung, drawn and then slaughered!!
Or maybe like the “experts” of olden times who put women in water to see if a witch or not … put them in the Thames with a millstone to see if guilty or not!!!
But unfortunately we now have financial crisis like non which has gone before, we need to join together under one currency… one world, etc. etc.
Yep we are heading for a financial collapse – next month I think.
This is probably why Boris looks so sick, he knows what lies ahead and he has to take the rap for the bosses.
A Nuremberg trial in The Hague should be on the cards, for all involved world leaders and their corrupted un-scientific advisers.
I think it will happen
It isn’t only our poison gang, remember.This is international crime on a colossal scale.
The members of the Behavioural Oversights Team and the 77th (SS) Brigade should be dealt with too.
Yip.
It’s known as, ‘a big boy did it and ran away’
One of my favourite novels.
“Dominic Cummings [thinks he] is a very very smart operator”
There: fixed!
“They [think they] are not stupid”,
There, fixed that as well!
DavidX
“Thoughts?”
Paragraphs.
Yes, sorry. It’s a bit difficult writing on a phone. That’s my excuse anyway!
I think they’re waiting for public opinion to turn decisively. I think it’s coming.
It’s coming. Promise.
Whilst of course I would welcome this, I’m slightly uncomfortable with policy in general being made in line with public opinion and nothing else. That’s what got us into lockdown in the first place.
You have a political mind, Sir. I can see that the government has been looking for an escape for a while now and suspect they were hoping to claim victory about now. If you haven’t hit the nail squarely on the head, then I do not think you are too far away. Whitty looked pretty ill last week, so I guess he knows he’s staring into the abyss. His memoirs may well prove interesting.
The thought that they are trying to get away with it is like a fishbone in the throat, even though that’s politics.
I still feel Boris will be gone soon.
They need to get a change before the start of October because that’s the 4 week typical notice period. Many people this week are going to be told they are out, after spending a few months speculating as internal changes were made and updated in their companies.
Edit: I suspect the numbers will be an additional half a million
They can blame me as the sole person responsible and sole biggest superspreader, as long as they finally change course and end this manslaughter.
Modern day Britons by now genetically embedded problem: always focussing on avoiding blame instead of on taking responsibility.
Or, we get to mid-October and the figures are way below the Whitty/Vallance non-prediction. They say: “See, the measures are working. Live with this until mid-November and we’ll be able to release you all for Christmas!”
Cue mass adulation from MSM.
Saw Gupta on the box earlier. She wasn’t good.
Reallly? That’s a shame. What was she saying? Are they all being compromised as part of the deal to ‘bring them in’?
I think she’s often too intelligent and nuanced to really get the mass appeal going. She’s probably deflated, I can hardly blame her… but certainly a bit of fire would help sometimes.
There will be no vaccine , iv always known it , I think in 7 months time things will be very different and I’m sure we will be back to.normsl the government knows we cant carry on like this the end game is approaching
I’m sure there will be. Not sure what it will contain.
Plotting their way out? Love to see the evidence for this because I can’t. Testing, testing, testing to push the numbers up. If they were plotting their way out they’d stop that bollocks for starters
I admire your optimism, but I’m afraid I don’t share it.
A friend of mine came out with that daft expression, but if it saves one life, so I told her that 80,000 sadly died last year of diabetes, no more said. Since this all started it gets you checking figures about the 600,000 approx that die every year and the hysteria about covid
We can spend a trillion gazillion pounds, cause the early demise of 10’000’s of cancer patients, and cripple the future of all our children – but if it saves just one life its worth it. This has to be one of the most stupid expressions that have come out of this experience – along with “unprecedented times” , “i protect you, you protect me”, “following the science”, and “we’re all in this together” ….. but top prize goes to Chairman Dan with “staying apart keeps us together” …….I do not know why people can’t see through this nonsense…..
Every Covid dead cost us £250 million sofar, every possibly prevented, rather ‘delayed by at most a few years’ one still £50-100 million if we are generous and use Ferguson’s numbers.
£500k would have been justified at most.
Now think what could have been done otherwise just medically with this money.
And that ignores the medical collateral damage, like those 34.000 expected excess cancer
deaths and the permanent economic damage, which will ensure that we will never be able to provide pre-Corona level medical care for decades.
And as for dealing with Covid 20, 21, 22ff- we have no clue, no visble strategy and no more dough for that.
Effing madness.
And “people before profit”.
It’s not saving one life, but it’s destroying plenty.
Just point her to yesterday’s Lockdown sceptics where the government’s own figures show more will die from Lockdown than from the virus and ask her ‘how does that work then’?’
If it saves one life I’m okay with those that die, dying alone and scared.
If it saves only one life then it’s completely pointless considering around 1600 people die every day in this country, even if the hypothetical life had been saved.
Dr Heiko Schöning speaks on his release from Wandsworth Police Station, 27 Sept 2020
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=T1d-hogsKwE
Love the name! – will have a listen now.
Shameful especially when you think back to who Blair allowed to preach on the streets
Already removed from YouTube.
YouTube are the lowest form of pond life.
Anyone download it?
Its still on Anna Brees’s facebook
https://www.facebook.com/Breesmedia/
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=T1d-hogsKwE
Me
But they must be scared pond life
!
He invites everyone to Berlin 10th October! They took a book, his phone and laptop! Wow I was quicker than the YouTube censors!
Thanks!
!
MADNESS! We’ve Lost Our Minds! Birmingham – they are posting testing kits through you letterbox
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-1r6j8Hl0hs
*********************************************
Dr Heiko Schöning speaks on his release from Wandsworth Police Station, 27 Sept 2020
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=T1d-hogsKw
Love the handle Dr Patrick Vaccine!
If I get one it will immediately be filed under bin!
The Dr Heiko Schöning release has already been taken down…
Video unavailable – already!
So with this app out and nutters getting QR codes made up for their houses, what’s to stop a malicious person checking in at someone’s house prior to getting a COVID test? The 21st century knock down ginger?
also people sending messages to people they have a grudge against saying they’ve been in vicinity of cv person and need to self-isolate … ooooh there’s an idea!
Or just copying a QR code and sticking it somewhere else. Like a hospital
Good point. Even simpler and more effective for someone looking to cause problems.
wow thats a good idea replacing all those QR codes with another QR code, a forged poster that looks like the real one but with a link to anti covid fact…hummm
A sticker would suffice, hard to notice too, imagine the mayhem
Genius!
Love this idea!!
From an Information Security point of view there is a massive security risk with all these QR codes being on public display and being scanned. It would be easy to replace the QR codes on poster with another that would download a malicious app, allow someone to take control of the device, or something that could potentially steal personal data (although the NHS app most likely does this).
Yes, there are so many potential flaws in addition to the major problem of the government requiring you to ‘check in’ with them everywhere you go. I’m surprised there isn’t more vocal opposition to this. But then again, as we know, covid > all else.
I only wish I had the talent to do that! Might as well make a few quid off the sheeple!
I’m hoping for a massive data breach. We need the public to completely lose confidence in the app and the process.
me too, come on you hackers, hack this pile of shit!
There’s no data to breach. That’s the point of the Apple/Google API.
My hairdresser has just lost a customer, noticed this morning that he now has a QR code in his shop window.
Boris has obviously had a breakdown, hes not thinking straight , the rest of the government -hancock know we cant carry on like this , I expect a big u turn by november and boris resigning due to I’ll health.
Boris arrested
I think dePiffle is just suffering from allergies – to work.
Clearly, being king of the world isn’t much fun right now. I suspect his recent “tiredness” is more likely to be chronic hangover.
His demeanour during his speech at the UN suggested he was on artificial stimulants.
He increasingly talks gibberish – even by his previous standards. This, plus his strange gait, are symptomatic of a neurological condition. The knives have been out for a couple of weeks, and it has gone public with The Mail publishing various hit stories, including reference to his finances and Ms Carrie’s photos from Lake Como. The backbenchers have finally woken up to what is going on, and hopefully will seize control over the next couple of weeks. He has to go, taking with him most, if not all of the Cabinet of also-ran, useless shills. There needs to be a root and branch cull of the scientific advisers, with a completely new strategy in place well before Christmas. I wonder whether students being locked up in halls of residence will be the final straw? If not, by the end of next month there will be more evidence of a catastrophic economy to shake up the political class.
A great scenario, sooner it’s acted out the better.
Great summary I really hope hes gone soon.
Well – I doubt that there’s many here will beg him to stay.
But then what? Apparently Mr/Mrs Normal then just throttles back a bit to calm the masses – but the essential insults to society stay in place?
It’s one of the oldest con strategies in the political playbook.
https://docs.google.com/document/d/1fGTaVA32MSSLX5uqzbdcTg-mmDgKw2hGd3BUg6IDWfY/edit
This is China’s strict definition of C-19 case. Requires symptoms and PCR below 35Ct.Remarkable that symptoms not required in definition of case in CDC,ECDE and WHO guidelines.In the above document you can read. Quote
“It is also rather odd that both CDC and WHO had guidelines in place to minimise over counting of cases for previous viral outbreaks including SARS, MERS, Ebola and Zika, yet these safeguards have been removed in respect of SARS-CoV2”
This is huge. So obvious that this crisis is being manufactured with maximum effect in mind.
This is potentially huge. Great info. Where is it from?
Case definition is found here
https://www.thelancet.com/journals/lanpub/article/PIIS2468-2667(20)30089-X/fulltext
But PCR below Ct35 was in a twitter where I had the first link but can’t find that information just now
Is this similar to the change in reporting cases in Spain, must have symptoms AND PCR below Ct30
2/2
Wow. Huge. That’s a big win. Carl Henegen stand up.
The bedwetters will lose their minds. Government cover up they’ll cry
Yes, he needs to push for that revision here.
I found out later that this was not correct copy an earlier reply
https://twitter.com/CorrNotCausa/status/1310279654734024704
Clarification now.The Spanish document is extremely complex.They have not as above included Ct 30-35 in the case definition but rather bizarrely using this only if health care workes can be at home or not.So as I understand now, case definition requires symptoms but not as above does it include anything about Ct values.
Its no doubt more complicated than we understand it to be. However, the open ended advice recently issued by the UK government was just a fudge.
Needs to be addressed
https://www.frontiersin.org/articles/10.3389/fcimb.2020.00317/full
There is sound theoretical scientific reason to believe hydroxychloroquine (or chloroquine) may work, as noted in this article which discusses the effect of covid-19 on ACE2 receptors.
To paraphrase one paragraph: “Generally fusion of SARS-CoV-2 with the host plasma membrane occurs within acidified endosomes that requires cleavage at S2′ exposing a fusion peptide that inserts into the membrane. There is a potential beneficial effect of chloroquine due to its effect on the endosomal uptake and acidification”.
Used a lot in france iv Been told and despite many new infections deaths are very low
Lots of info here
https://americasfrontlinedoctorsummit.com/
A good experience in gwlag Wales! I was dreading going to shop for the first time in my local town since the muzzle edict, and clasped my little ebay exemption badge with clammy hands. First stop at the health food shop and both the owner and assistant sported exemption lanyards (wink wink) and I thanked them effusively for creating a mask-free zone.
Then the chemist’s for a prescription: place was like Fort Knox with barricades and sad muzzled employees but no-one bothered to question my nappy-free visage and no glares from customers either…
Then the clothing shop for a browse. Was about to hold up badge but owner said airily with a smile. “Oh we don’t bother with masks here!”
So grateful it wasn’t the traumatic experience I’d feared, so wanted to share my pathetic gratitude that at least one place still does the Real Normal!
Any houses for sale?
Quite a few – weather was pretty bad this summer!
I’m booking my flight over right now!
Good to hear.
Everyone in my part of Wales has been charming about my exemption, with the sole exception of my most Christian church.
I left the Christian church decades ago because I found most small-minded judgemental people seem to congregate there.
There are exceptions of course and I’m happy to meet those in a social setting.
For the first couple of weeks, the person who gives me a lift to church insisted I wear a scarf( It is the thinnest silk imaginable) but at church they are fine with me and another exempt lady.
Could your shop-keepers please run some training for the ones up here in the Caledonian gulag? It would be much appreciated.
A lot of the shopkeepers (at least those who are left in what was once a flourishing little high street, but now sporting quite a few empty shops that have gone bust) are alternative types…and the rest are peaceable soft-spoken West Walians who aren’t as belligerent as some of the shockers I’ve read about here. Some also seem quite startled at my exemption badge, having apparently never seen one before, and don’t know what to say…so not sure training possible!
How encouraging to know that sensible people exist in some areas of the country. I don’t think there are any in my area…. I have been going maskless since they were made mandatory and have only had two or three polite enquiries as to whether or not I’ve got a mask, and then a polite acceptance of me saying “I’m exempt”. However, I had my first unpleasant encounter last week when my favourite charity shop re-opened. Here’s the email I sent the next day – I am still awaiting a reply though suspect that I’m not going to get one –
The stupid thing is that this marvellous shop is really just a great big shed full of wonderful secondhand junk, no doubt covered in germs at the best of times, and yet they were insisting I use hand sanitizer…..
Even before this madness I found quite a few of the staff in charity shops to be very rude,officious and unhelpful,I bet they are just loving all this covid lunacy.
Name em and shame em, I might go there. I could do with a browse round a charity shop, i could also put them straight on a few things.
That’s great to hear.
Today, my step-daughter wanted to pop into the Spar in a village near Wrexham for an ice lolly. She didn’t want to wear a mask as she’d just had lip fillers done and her mouth was sore.
Although I’ve persuaded her brother and mother to take an exemption card (for their asthma), she has so far refused. “I’d rather wear a mask – it’s too much hassle.”
She stepped tentatively into the shop. Then briskly walked back to the car. Too frightened! I told her to be brave – then we noticed an elderly gentleman emerging without a mask. This emboldened her, and in she went.
After her, a late middle-aged lady followed – maskless. My step-daughter later told me that, upon entry, this woman had apologised loudly to the shop assistant – “Sorry I’ve forgotten my mask – will this do instead?” At the till, she covered her mouth with the pizza she was buying…
We live in Derbyshire, in a village. Today, I saw a young woman (she looked to be in her mid-20s) walk past our house, on open land in the sunshine, wearing a face-nappy. Mentally ill? Virtue signalling? The funny bit was that there were a few dog-walkers around, all 70s or 80s, all bare-faced. Maybe the daft bint thinks she’s protecting them from all that evil, all-pervasive airborne virus. It is very unusual to see masks outside round here so I hope it was a one-off.
Meanwhile, our dippy neighbour is finally getting it. She is much more robust than she was and was telling us some good stuff: an elderly GP has apparently come out of retirement to work at a local surgery and she thinks we should all go back to normal – now.
Our neighbour’s 8-year-old daughter has had her PE lessons cut from 2 hours to 20 minutes per week. Her 5-year-old son still gets 2 PE lessons but if it rains it is cancelled (we’re talking the High Peak here, so you can imagine how many lessons there are likely to be.) They have to wear their kit all day on PE days as they are not allowed to take in anything from home. She is making them walk to school at least twice a week instead of scooting (it’s about 15 minutes walk.)
She is really pissed off and told us that more people have died from the lockdown than from Covid and she doesn’t believe the crap at all. She is not going near the T&T shite and her M&D (our age) are also ignoring the invite we all got from the GP to have a flu jab, as are we. Apart from the silly young woman, above, I gather there is some local resistance to the new mask crap as well. MW
Great to read another one of your reports MW. I believe some of the young folks think the mask is now a hip fashion item to be worn at all times.
Yes I’ve thought that all along. And young children no doubt whine for their parents to let them wear one too, and parents give in.
Wasn’t that the idea when they started pushing mask-wearing, i.e. a “cultural change”?
Good to hear!
Saw a masked couple out in open countryside in a brisk wind today. Madness.
Were they wearing them for warmth??
Had to pass a car that had stopped just in the road, occupied by one solitary 70+ old geezer wearing a mask and gripping the steering wheel with two hands enclosed in blue surgical gloves.
personally I thought if the virus struck him and he shuffled off this mortal coil, the world would be one less twat!
Am I a bad person for thinking this?
Not bad but judgemental and lacking compassion.
The poor old geezer might have been “shielded” for the last few months and might only just be venturing out. If he only gets his info from the BBC, you can’t blame him for being terrified.
Thanks. Guess I am a nasty person. I’ll blame it on the BBC…
It can have that effect!
Charity Shop Sale
All items £1
You could buy them but not take back for a refund!
I suppose if the item did not fit you could take back as a donation?
PS Fitted my wife perfectly!
Seen at a local golf club. Is this legal?
“to comply with government restrictions, members are advised that, the following requirements are placed on them whilst using the clubhouse and bar”
“Any person with a medical exemption from wearing a face mask must advise the secretariat in advance (proof of exemption required)”
Well it’s incorrect. This is explicitly not required to comply with government restrictions.
Stupid, petty rules? At a golf-club?
Whatever next?
Golf clubs have always been bastions of petty rules.
Whoosh.
Nope probably an offence under the Equalities Act 2010
Toolkit for dealing with this here
https://www.laworfiction.com/wp-content/uploads/2020/07/Face-Covering-Exemption-Notice-with-Law-Explained-24-July-2020.pdf
It was illegal – unless the law’s sneakily been changed.
A) HMG told docs not to issue exemption letters
B) It’s a criminal offence to require confidential info about your medical condition (Equalities Act 2010)
and they might be interested to know it incurs huge fines.
Thanks
I’m due to visit this club tomorrow and I was hoping to get a bacon bun before playing a round (without muzzle of course!)
No it’s not legal
Their understanding of the rules is below par!
No, they are wrong. Think I got this on here originally –
https://laworfiction.com/wp-content/uploads/2020/07/Face-Covering-Exemption-Notice-with-Law-Explained-24-July-2020.pdf
I’m sure they’ll be happy when folk don’t renew membership as most golf clubs are on their knees dying because they can’t get enough members these days.
Do you think people leave their masks on outside to prevent touching them?
It’s the only sensible explanation – not that I’m holding much hope.
I guess this must be it. It’s a shame though as it could make things worse.
https://papers.ssrn.com/sol3/papers.cfm?abstract_id=3676570
You tube seems to have withdrawn the video of the German doctor speaking when he left Wandsworth police station. Anywhere else where you can access it?
Anna Brees FB
Thanks!
Thanks I was looking for it.
Here it is:
https://www.facebook.com/watch/?ref=search&v=346447653143621&external_log_id=2f166633-26f0-4f27-9442-fdf312f7ab29&q=anna%20brees%20media
Today’s theme tune – ideally to be sung in the background by yesterday’s Trafalgar Square demonstrators at about 3 pm
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YhwU3btJVmk
Anna Brees media I believe
Oops attached to the wrong post I think. Apologies
I’m not into organised religion but this is a great essay https://mchurley.com/an-enemy-hath-done-this/
I read it. It is very much worth reading. I found it so direct and relevant I printed it and sent it to my “ religious“ friends.
I think we should all gather and sing ‘Always look on the bright side of life’ from Lifecof Brian. This whole absurd circus needs some pythonesque mockery to break the spell.
PROTEST
Next Saturday, October 3rd
12 noon. Hyde Park.
Is this singing the bright side of life followed by the conga?
Could be. Why not go and start the conga?
https://threader.app/thread/1309471981792886784
If you haven’t time to see the 2h video with Kulldorf, Bhattacharya, Levitt discussing the C-19 response in the Florida video heres is a twitter thread summarising the video below.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?time_continue=6833&v=6P3SkTBfGzU&feature=emb_logo&ab_channel=GovernorRonDeSantis
Depressing update from the East Mids.
Our daughter works in a posh-ish pub in a nearby village.
The pub is part of a small chain. All the other pubs in the chain have had visits from the police since Thursday. The pub our daughter works in haven’t seen the police yet but have had THREE visits from council officials SINCE THURSDAY.
Who are the council officials?
Wow. Talk about reign of terror!
I’ve just watched a video of a young woman in Surrey who completely lost it when challenged about the one-way system in her co-op. She went on quite a rampage and swept loads of bottles of wine off the shelves.
People have already had enough and the petty local tyranny hasn’t got going yet!
What a pathetic use of taxpayers’ money
Here in Lincolnshire my local council has no interest in anything but covid,if you ring them about anything they would usually deal with they don’t want to know.
As for the Police,don’t get me started !.
Sounds like the Stasi are out in force, with nothing else to do.
They’re really enjoyed their new powers to boss people around.
Get the message out.
https://youtu.be/fEe8uRlUPIc
Suggest sending it to all your contacts.
(They may be like some of mine after all this time, they might not open it)
Good points!
Has anyone else seen the new Morrisons advert on TV? I’ve had to stop watching The Chase repeats on Challenge because it’s on every break
Refuse to watch the ads – it’s the only way.
So far I’ve missed it.
Is it bad??
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5psHVbAUasc here it is for your viewing ‘pleasure’.
Been watching a bit of Phantom of the Opera this evening… my, how times have changed!
I swear everytime it comes on !
I live in Northern Ireland and apparently there was an anti lockdown rally in Belfast I knew nothing about. Could anyone from here who knows of upcoming events mention it here as I don’t do local news. Many thanks
Delores Cahill made an appearance
I have been having an ongoing text debate about this whole thing with a so called “friend”, and I thought I was winning them over to the sceptical side, but now all of a sudden, I’m struggling for a short succinct reply! Can my good friends here help with a cutting reply?!!
So essentially, the last response I got was “the virus doesn’t move, people move it, we stop moving, the virus stops moving, the virus dies, it’s that simple……and then two picture messages, one being the logic of being pee’d on so you are protecting others (if you know the viral picture I mean), the other being a Petri dish showing the difference of someone coughing on it with and without a face mask on. I think we need to help each other in replying to these morons! What would you say to this?!!! I want to win this argument, but I want to do it intelligently without resulting to aggressive language!!!
Only 1 in 100 deaths in the UK are of people ‘with’ the virus. The other 99 are something else…
That would be 10%. I don’t think it’s anywhere near as high.
Wouldn’t 1 out of 100 be 1%?
Blush! Sorry.
TIme for a glass of vino I think.
you sure you’ve not already had too much??.
No, definitely still sober.
OOOPS!!!
In fairness to you, the last number I saw suggested 9% of those dying from respiratory illness have covid. The remainder from flu or pneumonia. Then there are the cancers, coronary disease and so on.
Very kind of you, thanks, but it was a simple arithmetical error on my part.
That trope’s being doing the rounds since April. The response is simple: if humans stop moving they die.
Ask them to think it through, if everyone stayed still what would that do to the economy, to society. How would the sick get cared for, who would operate the power stations, how would food get delivered?, etc etc etc
Bacteria grow on petri dishes, not viruses. So that’s not proof of anything.
Yes if every single human being on the planet locked themselves indoors for 2 weeks or a month I guess the virus would die out. But that can’t happen because hospitals need to stay open, supply chains for food, medicines etc need to keep running, who generates your electricity and gas and cleans up the water that comes out of your tap? Are the police and army on every street enforcing it?
Short of welding every single person on earth into some sort of home or detention centre and every single public service shutting down worldwide (no ambulances etc), which would obviously cause millions of deaths, then the virus will remain at low levels and will bounce back the minute any survivors of such a shutdown are released.
Viruses are not ‘alive’. They are active or inactive. Unlike bacteria. Which is why in most cases hand sanitiser is an insanity because it’s not anti viral
Perhaps send your masked avenger this video.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sRFtVsL9dzE
The peeing image is a great example of Not Thinking It Through. Apart from the idiotic premise, peeing in your trousers would end up causing you infection as well as burning the skin. Any participants would soon learn to not piss themselves, or control their pissing.
Using that system is saying infect yourself to save others.
Also, do you breathe out streams of piss? No you do not. Gases are not liquids.
How much confidence does your friend have that they can get everyone in the world to stop moving for ~21 days?
Does your friend believe that we are the only animals that can transmit viruses? Can we convince all other animals to temporarily suspend movement too?
Should we be doing the same for other viruses… why stop at this specific coronavirus?
How come we don’t do this for flu? Why didn’t we start wearing masks in March or April when we had a thousand deaths a day?
The best responses to both of these were very similar.
Firstly the pee’ing one. If you continue the analogy after pee’ing into your trousers you walk around with them on and once you get home you put them away in a drawer and wear them again the next day (as most people probably do with a mask).
The Petri dish one is very similar. What’s on the petri dish is in the mask that people wear, walk around with and put back into their pockets before putting them back on again similar to the above.
You can’t win the argument because your friend isn’t going to be won round. No matter what killer fact or witty remark you demolish him with, he will still believe he is right and you are wrong. Don’t waste your time on it.
Coronial autopsies identify the indirect effects of COVID-19
“Indirect increases in morbidity and mortality resulting from movement restrictions imposed during the COVID-19 pandemic have been identified as a public health concern.1 Deaths registered in England and Wales exceeded the 5-year average by almost 50 000 during the first 2 months of lockdown, which started on March 23, 2020.2 Confirmed COVID-19 accounted for the majority of deaths; the remaining excess deaths (>12 000) could reflect undiagnosed COVID-19 or alternatively, deaths from unrelated conditions. Similarly, in the USA, only 65% of excess deaths during March and April, 2020, were attributed to COVID-19.3”
https://www.thelancet.com/journals/lanpub/article/PIIS2468-2667(20)30180-8/fulltext
Perhaps already posted.
Some twitter coments by way of pointing people to read the report.
“You’ll have heard the BS from the authorities that all the excess deaths in spring were due to Covid19. Oh no, they weren’t.
This excellent piece by the Coroner, working quietly in the background, blows that excuse out of the water. Lockdown killed tens of thousands of people.”
“2 out of 67”
“More frequently, reduced access to health-care systems associated with lockdown was identified as a probable contributory factor (six cases) or possible contributory factor (eight cases) to death”
Any person that wilfully gives any false information concerning any birth or death or the cause of any death they have committed an offence against S4 Perjury Act.
S7 of the Act deals with aiders and abettors etc.
https://legislation.gov.uk/ukpga/Geo5/1-2/6/section/4
The exact passages of legislation appear here:
https://twitter.com/TonyGreyMan/status/1310219914305830914?s=20
Wow!
IIRC The requirement for mandatory autopsy and inquest for notifiable disease related deaths was removed for CoViD19 by the Coronavirus legislation.
I see some optimistic remarks centred around the idea that Mr Toad might soon be gone/removed.
I think it is wise to be very wary. Good magicians depend on distraction and sleight of hand … and Johnson is the prop, not the performer.
Here’s some good news!
My son’s in-laws have been vehemently shielding for the last six months. FiL has COPD and had a stroke last year, so he is in the vulnerable category.
They took it all so seriously that even MiL’s 89 year-old mother was left to her own devices. (To be fair she’s actually pretty fit and as tough as old boots, living on a diet that seems to consist mostly of gin, ginger biscuits and lemon cheese.)
Last weekend, they ventured out for the first time, to drive and stay with my son and DiL. Major expedition under the circumstances. They intended to stay exclusively at my son’s but eventually ventured out shopping, to purchase the pram for the impending baby.
They’ve now gone on to visit their other daughter and SiL.
Major breakthrough!
Good for them. The months of anxiety they have had. Getting mobile again – great.
I like the sound of your MiL! Gin, ginger biscuits and what’s lemon cheese? Excellent.
She’s my son’s Nana-in Law! She’s as sharp as a tack and as devious as they come.
You might call it lemon curd?
It’s a rather delicious buttery lemon spread.
App Hancock twitter.
https://twitter.com/MattHancock/status/1310221986275225603?s=20
A threadful of criticism directly at Hancock. More for the 77 spotters, click on accounts of messages that seem extremely strange praising the politician personally. Click a few and you soo get a hang of the bot accounts.
There’s no way of knowing but I propose there is something fishy about this message it fits a pattern:
5h
Replying to
@MattHancock and @NHSCOVID19app
I have already downloaded it thank you so much Matt
https://twitter.com/Macey6Macey/status/1310222240680685568?s=20
Good work.
if you look at Nicola Macey’s thread she only ever replies to Hancock tweets – including one reply to a Hancock tweet that included an interview video that says “I like your hair cut Matt Hancock you look so nice” .
I cant tell if this is spoof account , or 77, or whether Nicola is real and has learning difficulties
The usual hallmark of 77s/bots is the single recurring theme.
Or a stalker.
Also joined May 2020.
One tweet to Hancock reads something like “just wanted to let you know I’m staying safe and social distancing”
Absolutely a bot
Rather strange things in Spain,see quote below.Can explain why many patients admitted but also many discharged quickly in their daily statistics. Also post the best update of the situation in Spain, which seems to have peaked and coming down.
“In case this article is of interest… Average age has dropped to 38, people are on average not as sick and – interestingly – are going to hospital quicker. It’s not clear if this is due to the system being less saturated or the earlier, older demographic being more ‘obedient”
https://twitter.com/longcovidspain/status/1310155121708408832/photo/1
https://www.dropbox.com/s/6mk4465ewjcb6ln/SPAIN%20-%20Second%20Wave%20Monitoring-25Sept2020.pdf?dl=0
This is good. Really interesting analysis of modelling Sweden vs UK. Not new news for us but well presented.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Bpu87AHIILA
It will come.
Andto be hated by Grauniad zombies is a guarantee of being human.
A lady has reported on twitter that a pub asked her to complete a form stating why she is exempt from wearing a face mask;
https://twitter.com/northerness/status/1310191395941031936
A year ago this would have seemed outrageous but these days it seems that such actions are just a part of living in the ‘Covid world’. All our rights and protections seem to have flown out of the window, life is now a bit like living in East Germany in the 1950s.
East Germans could go and have a drink in peace without being asked for their papers before they entered a bar.
It’s illegal to ask for patient data. The pub has no means of storing that data. The pub has no place to feed that data into. Tgere is a defect with the landlord’s thinking, if true.
Dat be illegal
That’s illegal, that sort of information is confidential as it will contain data that can identify the person and medical details. That breaks data protection, GDPR and medical records legislation.
It may well be illegal but i am not sure that counts for much in covid world? Much of our rights and legal protections have been swept away in the interest of beating the virus.
They haven’t, but most people don’t know the law and the people who do know aren’t doing anything about it.
It’s all too rushed there’s no training for managers and staff to explain the law and what you can and can’t do. I had to tell explain quite a bit of this stuff to members of staff at our store.
Forgive me taking up space with what we all know, but how much ‘staff training’ is needed to understand this?
Those who have an age, health or disability reason for not wearing a face covering should not be routinely asked to give any written evidence of this, this includes exemption cards. No person needs to seek advice or request a letter from a medical professional about their reason for not wearing a face covering.
Some people may feel more comfortable showing something that says they do not have to wear a face covering. This could be in the form of an exemption card, badge or even a home-made sign.
This is a personal choice and is not necessary in law.
A couple of paras of plain English. Here is a sample script for a ‘training session’:
“Don’t challenge people who are exempt. They do not need a badge or anything. That’s it”.
So many ‘officials’ have not seen the official guidance *at all*.
Exactly. It seems that most of the staff (including supervisors) haven’t read any of the guidance, I don’t think they’ve even read the email the company sent out (or if they did it went in one ear and out the other). I hate those online training modules, but they do make you read everything and understand it.
Public Health Scotland have produced figures the local rag claims show nearly half of current ‘infections*’ are among teenagers.
Where do teenagers hang out? That’s right they are press ganged for nearly all of their teenage life into education settings – where ‘buubles’ and ‘masks’ and ‘hand stripper’ and teachers behind perspex is off the charts insane.
Aside from the incovenient truth that teenagers do not die from covid these figures show clearly the junk science and witch craft measures are useless. Before every LS and their skeptical dog says PCR tests are junk anyway, I know, but these cattle, sorry teenage people, must have a symptom to be put forward for the old meangingless false positive in the first place.
*’infections’, picking up a slight trend to use ‘infections’ now rather than ‘cases’. Neither are accurate but tge switch may be a deliberate muddying of the waters to yet futher confuse the public. What they in fact mean is the person likely returned a false positive PCR test, nothing more.
Raised temperature? Cough? Individually these symptoms have a low specificity for CoViD19, even together their specificity is not much higher.
I seem to recall that years ago, come September/October all the children went back to school and got colds and chicken pox and students went back to college and got glandular fever and nobody bothered much about it.
Covid 19 seems to cause fewer problems than chicken pox or glandular fever, what is all the fuss about?
Bear in mind glandular fever has symptoms similar to CoViD19 as mentioned in the flu like illnesses from the other day on here.
It’s a lot more serious for young people mind. One guy I knew was pretty much out for a year with it.
I’ve known people take a year to recover from glandular fever.
Glandular fever can drag on for quite some time, much like long Covid
This is great news. As we all knew it would (and despite the silly measures), immunity is building in this population, helping build a protective shield for the old/vulnerable.
Personally one of my concerns is that because masks are so symbolic and contentious, people end up focusing on this. Meanwhile, they’re printing money like there’s no tomorrow, introducing laws by diktat without parliamentary scrutiny, proposing negative interest rates etc. etc.
The focus on masks could end up taking focus away from these other important issues, which ultimately lets them get away with it.
I’m fully guilty of getting sucked in to the masks thing though, so I don’t have an easy solution in mind!
Masks are a diversion. Which is why they were mandated when they were mandated, rather than in March or April. Most who wear them do so under duress, whatever we think of them.
Live in Ten minutes, (21:30GMT) Mark Windows, Windows on the World
https://windowsontheworld.net/live-shows/
With live chat
Carl Vernon on being “selfish”:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KK8oiHrVTCk
Seems that huge sums of money have been scammed from the Covid business loans as well. Seems that the government is terminally incompetent
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-54187581
Not as much though as our corrupt regime has pocketed. Ten billion for track and trace?
https://www.bmj.com/content/370/bmj.m3037
Pressure building:
https://www.telegraph.co.uk/politics/2020/09/27/defy-tory-lockdown-rebels-expect-certain-defeat-boris-johnson/
‘David Davis: ‘Any Tory Govt that ignores an amendment tabled by the chairman of the 1922 Committee is off its rocker’
It will be an interesting week. I think there will be resignations this week – possibly even from Cabinet.
Lets hope so!
Spot the catch:
Sir Graham’s amendment to the Act proposes that future restrictions proposed under the Act should be debated and voted on by Parliament if they affect the whole of England or the whole of the UK, rather than ministers being able to bypass the Commons as is currently the case.
Given that they are currently locking down the nation a bit at a time, could this still mean government by diktat?
I can’t speak to the situation in the UK, but what’s happened here has been quite insidious. For example, the Ontario premier opted not to invoke a provincial mask mandate and left it up to each city/region — and they fell like dominoes. So to legally challenge mask mandates instead of just suing the provincial government, you must take action against each municipality. So as long as they all work in lockstep they get the same result — draconian measures introduced a bit at a time, not at the same time, and with slight variations. And our premier’s extension of his emergency powers, while “debated” sort of, was a done deal with a majority government. Only one MP voted against the extension and is no longer a party member as a result. The provinces really have carte blanche do do whatever they like, whereas our federal government is a minority government but is not likely to be challenged by the other parties for the same reason Labour hasn’t challenged in the UK — they are all for the mandates and often argue they haven’t gone far enough. Your situation sounds slightly more promising than ours.
Reminiscent of 1930’s Germany. Who says we never learn from history.
We’re not federal – yet.
There are plans to decentralise, but not in a good way.
I hope so!
I want to believe it will succeed but after months of the dictatorial regime it almost feels too good to be true.
In the spirit of pressure building Patrick 21st Century Wire Henningsen gave this appraisal earlier, he is a good analyst on UK Column also:
1h
A deluge is coming.
If #CoronaVirus Act is not renewed, then public backlash vs #BorisJohnson & #MattHancock will be immense, they wont survive past Xmas. They, along w/their #COVID ‘crisis’ will go down in history as biggest fraud ever perpetrated in name of “health & safety”
https://twitter.com/21WIRE/status/1310318557398532099?s=20
Makes me feel concerned to be ready for the extension to happen. It’s a good prinicple to hope for the best and plan for the worst.
Great reply: “The 2nd wave will be a popular tsunami wiping them [Piffle, Handycock and Sunak] off the political map forever.” I admire the spirit.
Dr Vernon Coleman on form
https://brandnewtube.com/watch/revealed-how-the-bbc-is-deliberately-suppressing-the-truth_SD2GfN7EMIjUkSD.html
Not sure of the viewing figures of the BBC now, but the young dont watch it, probably why most are not scared witless and still going out to pubs etc. Boris has the right idea about the replacement for the top job
I tend to disagree on that.
Changing the man at the top is laudable, but will make no difference.
The first thing to do is to decriminalise non payment of the license fee, then move to a subscription model.
The BBC will not change its spots, although Mr Moore could help most by not opposing decriminalisation, then encouraging a subscription service.
Well hopefully that’s the way it’ll go, no place for state funded tv now.
I heard that the BBC was heavily protected by police yesterday when the Trafalgar Square demo was on.
Which tells you a lot about how the BBC perceives its role. .
Remember that the Groan comments are shaped to fit the overall editorial agenda. They exclude comments that go against it – same old ‘community standards’ shite.
Hi mate, first-time poster, long-time lurker! (old fashioned leftie, remainer & green voter – so I know all about the Guardian and it’s despicable turn since the angle grinder episode). The thing with the shortage of PPE argument, is that it makes no sense when one considers the Government and local authorities were advising you could simply cut up an old T-shirt to make one. Unless there was a mass shortage of cotton in the spring. Cheers
Really annoying that Sainsbury’s is now pandering to the masked lot, instead of giving people the choice without making it a bad experience for those who cant be muzzled another shopper lost. The fuss over trolley cleaning, hand sanitiser’s is a joke when you think how so many in the world have to live, and idiots here complain because their trolley hasnt been cleaned. Pathetic
Bizarre ,,, Garden Centre today we had to queue , some random youth then proceeded to pre-scan all the items in our trolleys …presumably touching everything in our trolley with same manky gloves he did everyone else’s with as he didnt change them.
I merrily stood mask free in a sea of zombies
also the cleaning of tables and chairs with the same cloth and slap dash attitude, not that I blame them, they must know its all a farce and going along with it, it really is a pathetic OTT business to keep up the scare mongering, wonder if they are sanitising everywhere in the shanty towns of the world etc. LOL
Clarification of a Covid patient from Senior Analytical lead NHS
” This would include any patient with a positive test in the last 14 days no matter what they were admitted for ”
So even Hospital admissions are being manipulated
It’s a load of b*llocks isn’t it?
Thanks for finding this out. I thought they were being creative with the statistics.
Many nursing home residents are now tested weekly…..though in theory they will not be a ‘new case’ in the care home if they tested positive two weeks ago and then again today, as double counting of cases is not allowed I hope….but does anyone please know….will they count as a Covid Patient in a hospital if they are admitted today please?
Yes they would, probably also re tested I would guess
Liam Gallagher
@liamgallagher
Over 45s now gotta stay in fuck rite off I’m of out with my mask on what you gonna do bout mother fucker LG x
Think he means without his mask on. Liam’s part of the turned tide.
Or does it mean that he’s over 45 and will not stay in? But is going out with a mask on?
I typed all that without saying fuck.
I think he means fuck em. Masks and over 45 bullshit. Hes off out not giving a fuck. I supposed choon in to the next tweets, i can’t see Liam being into masks, but i am no expert. The attitude of fuck em tells me he made an error in rant. Fuck em describes have nothing at all to do with their bs, not a half way ferret around the edges.
I think Liam was pro mask and his brother Noel is the one who won’t wear one. Maybe they have opposing viewpoints just to spite each other.
Wow, i am surprise if that is the case, I just set down my naive take on it under bluemoons. World is crazier that I thought if fuck em means I’m off out in my mask!
Here we go:
https://www.radiox.co.uk/artists/liam-gallagher/gives-stance-wearing-face-masks-gotta-be-done/
Liam Gallagher
@liamgallagher
Don’t like but it’s gotta be done think it’s a crime to hide this face
Thanks, I am really surprised as weasely use of fuck em, I understand nothing of popular culture! I see the announcement is July so has pop moved on since then?
Knowing them that probably is the case
I was wrong. It is the case. I even looked at LG twitter, not easy! Sceptical views, yet he is wearing a mask.
I wonder if known faces may appreciate the opportunity to hide?
Amazing
Not so fast! It might not be, there appears some doubt in my assumption liam has balls! He may in fact be a ninny.
D’oh I can’t read – I thought he said ‘without my mask’
It caught me out too, I presumed a typo. But it was my error to assume.
Comments about Korean paper below
“It can´t be track & trace that has ended the epidemic in South Korea, they missed >90% of the infections.”
https://twitter.com/FrankfurtZack/status/1310289124327403520
but also
“The sample is too small to take any conclusion out of it. But we don’t need to find South Korea to fail at it to know that TETRIS does not work. Straight from our unpublished manuscript:” (worth reading abstract from that manuscript in the twitter
https://twitter.com/federicolois/status/1310296289494663172
In conclusion Test and Trace can not work after the first few hundered infections and is impossible to use in a disease with so vague symptoms often and not deadly symptoms like EBOLA.Hunt,Hague and Blair mad scheme with mass testing will never work.
https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC7384903/
“The estimated seroprevalence was 7.6% (95% confidence interval, 4.3%–12.2%) with 15 positive cases. Among them, only one had a polymerase chain reaction (PCR)-confirmed case among their close contacts and 13 did not experience COVID-19-related symptoms.”
“Our study suggested that the number of undiagnosed missing cases was substantial even with the stringent strategy adopted in Korea, similar to that of other countries”
Does the idea that we can trace a virus that is quite infectious but in many cases benign strike anyone else as incredibly arrogant? I’ve never understood it.
Yep, I can’t see how test and trace can work in a country of 70 million, with many different migrant cultures and language groups, maybe a million illegal migrants, and, as you say, so many asymptomatic cases. Maybe somewhere like Singapore it can work. The best you could achieve with T n T in the UK is a slowing down of spread – totally pointless now, just prolonging the agony.
Any data yet on what proportion of the population has download the track and trace app?
Hancock twitter said 10 million so far. But no evidence cited.
AHH but is that gross or net ? Close relative and partner came for tea, proudly showed off app on phone. Told them that that was quick way to get told to isolate for 14 days. Stunned silence, then one after another ‘ oh shit, going to delete it right now’.
Having nearly vomited at the advert on BBC I’m proud to say I will never ever under any circumstances download that. And I suspect my family / friends and loved ones will be just fine. Fuck you very much.
If we have a problem in the UK with false pos, the situation in the US could be worse. This is farcial and just illustrates the multiple different testing kits around are dangerous and not up to standard
“This is my favorite US example of false (+). “The NFL had 77 ‘positive’ COVID-19 tests from 11 teams re-examined by a New Jersey lab after false positives, and ALL those tests came back NEGATIVE.”
https://apnews.com/article/5d15429433051c78f2ca42fc08fbf835
Same thing happened with 2 Scottish football teams. Players and staff tested positive (I believe at a private clinic) and subsequently all tested negative via an NHS test.
I’m sure there have been numerous other incidences of individuals in sports that are hard to keep a track of.
I’ve had the email asking me to download the app. I replied thus:
“I’d rather catch coronavirus while giving Matt Hancock a blow job than download your poxy App. But nevertheless, thanks for asking.”
I just deleted it. I don’t want that kind of shit on my phone. Or the app.
Could we replace Hancock with sticking your head in the jaws of a rather large alligator, the former is just too grotesque.
Here is a little story, I went down the canal for a cycle today, down to a little bridge over the canal way out of town with a foot path running over it. All very nice, I supped some ale and watched the world go by, I met a guy who I am sure was a hobbit with a Scottish accent we had a little chat. A cheery coupl on bikes went past the guy saw my ale and said “That looks like a good idea mate !” as they whizzed past under the bridge.
A few more walkers go past, then this guys wanders up. The bridge is off the tow path and leads to nowhere but he climbed up and was standing there looking around, it’s an interesting feature and is inviting to climb up. He was a bit lost looking. We got talking.
I noticed immediately this guy had a enormous cranium, he was like a Meekon. Almost alien like. A proper boffin I thought. Turns out he was at Southampton University doing data science working with airlines to make their things more efficient using errr efficient data processes, or something. Fascinating.
Then I said,” well I bet what you do is all about zero carbon and sustainability now isn’t it?” He said yes and that the airlines are desperate to show efficiency in everything they do now and since covid he has been really busy.
Humm I thought, time to talk covids!
So I said what do you think of the covid thing? He said, he thought it was quite good, commuting to work was horrible and he really liked working from home I said “so do you think aviation will recover as its almost destroyed now?”. He said yes it would, I asked him when he thinks it will get back to normal, he said when there is a vaccine.
I said I dont think there will be a vaccine, there never has been one before for a corona virus,so why now? He looks a little upset, then I asked him what proportion of the uk has died from “covid”, he really didn’t want to say.
I had to really poke him to give me a figure, he was almost right, ok, “so how many people have died of it that were under the age of 35 with it, again he really didn’t want to give me a figure and was getting uncomfortable, I had to give him the answer. How many under 65? again he didnt want to say, I gave him the answer.
He started telling me about how his young son was vulnerable with asthma and how they have been wary with him and chest related things, so I asked him how children have died of it, desperate to chang the subject he asked me what I did for living, in a very panicky way but I said one sec, how many children have died of it? He said “I can see where this is going” and then he started to walk off.
I was de-platformed!
I was reasonably upset at this point, I was having a nice chat with him, I said sorry and please come back and lets talk some more but he ignored me and walked off.
As he went away down the canal, The IPA got the better of me and I shouted after him:
“The problem is, its all bollocks! It’s the new normal innit? AND it’s fucked! and so are all the people who believe it!”
Errrp, yep I should stayed in really.
It was a very strange encounter, this guy just didn’t want to go anywhere near the outside of his covid belief bubble. Very disappointing.
I often wondered how very intelligent people can be so.. stupid. There’s a good explanation on the Corona Circus website:
if he believes air travel is ever going to be the again, he need a wake up call.
I hope the IPA was good
Good night, friends all, God bless, I don’t know what I’d do without you.
Every new day, whatever its trials, brings us one day nearer to the Liberation.
Magna est veritas et praevalebit.
Great us Truth, and it will prevail.
night hope tomorrow goes better for you.
Speaking with my sister in law paramedic.
She revealed new advice from her superiors by email. Outside of their work they are told not to attend weddings, family events or any event where social distancing is difficult. Basically, work, go home, cover yourself in sanitiser, have sex with your mask on if you have to, then back to work. Nothing else.
This was after 4 colleagues from another ward tests positive following a golf event. No guidance broken, it happens.
It’s the new thing: people are being ‘encouraged’ to sign new employment contracts, agreeing not to go anywhere you can’t socially distance, nor travel to anywhere not on the official travel corridor. If you want to keep your job, you sign.
I’m amazed at the police resources available to deal with lockdown protests compared with what is normally available to deal with petty crime or anti social behaviour!
What do they do with the TSG when there are no peaceful demonstrations to attack? They must keep them somewhere secure, surely? A prison, or somewhere?
“Top scientists” advising crazed Nazi Government to lockdown all over 45s (in addition to all students, almost the entire Midlands, North East) and advising people to work from home wherever possible. That should prevent needing to have a full lockdown. Wankers.
They have absolutely lost the plot.
Here’s a link:
https://www.thesun.co.uk/news/12774862/scientists-over-45-shield/
Wankers indeed – of the most extreme variety. One has to question the sanity of anyone suggesting such a catastrophic idea.
Killer question in the ‘realnormalpodcast’
“”Herd immunity is only 8% in the U.K.? Bollox. How does he think the virus killed so few in SE Asia if T-cell immunity from SARS and previous Corona viruses didn’t provide protection?”
Worth a listen:
https://www.buzzsprout.com/1268768
Need a bit of help here.
My wife is exempt from wearing a face covering, but is often harassed by the security staff at Heathrow airport. They are always demanding ‘proof’, until a phone call to their manager makes them quietly back down.
What is the relevant legislation preventing them from asking her for ‘proof’ of her condition?
The best thing for the country and everyone living in it is:-
1. Stop testing
2. End all coronavirus restrictions
3. Stop all mask propaganda
4. Provide free counselling for people who are afraid of Covid19
We will then get back to normal.
Why is it that whenever we see anyone being interviewed on bbc about the impact of local Covid restrictions on them personally, they always seem to be smiling or even laughing?
If only students (and their parents) realised how much power they potentially hold.