The leaders of Scotland, Wales and Northern Ireland are set to gather on Monday to sign a deal aimed at kick-starting the break-up of the United Kingdom. The Telegraph has the story:
At an unprecedented summit in Cardiff, the three first ministers will put pen to paper on a joint declaration demanding the right to hold independence referendums.
The meeting comes after Andy Burnham suggested to MPs that he would authorise another Scottish referendum if there were a “clear consensus” in favour of one. …
John Swinney, the SNP leader and Scottish First Minister, claimed Mr Burnham was “facing up to the idea that he will go down in history as the final prime minister of the United Kingdom”.
Labour’s rout in Wales at May’s elections means there are now pro-independence parties in power in all three devolved nations for the first time.
Plaid Cymru surged to become the largest party in the Cardiff Senedd, with Rhun ap Iowerth, its leader, taking over as the country’s First Minister.
Meanwhile, the SNP fortified its position as the dominant power in Scotland, despite losing six Holyrood seats as Reform and the Greens made gains.
Sinn Fein won the Stormont elections in 2022, though a walkout by the DUP meant that Michelle O’Neill had to wait until 2024 to become First Minister. Sinn Fein is widely expected to hold on to power when the nation votes again next year.
The three leaders, who will be joined by Mary Lou McDonald, Sinn Fein’s President and leader of the opposition in Ireland, will gather at the five-star St David’s Hotel, overlooking Cardiff Bay, to discuss working together on a fresh independence drive. …
It is understood the three first ministers will use the summit to sign a joint declaration asserting their respective nations’ right to self-determination. …
After the talks, where they will sign a memorandum of understanding committing their parties to cooperate, the first ministers will hold a press conference.
Their agreement will cover four areas – the economy, energy, Europe and international cooperation and self-determination.
All three parties will agree that their nations should be in the EU, Scotland and Wales as new members and Northern Ireland as part of the Republic of Ireland.
It is understood that the memorandum of understanding will also commit them to strengthening relations with European “neighbours” as they prepare for independence. …
Plaid Cymru is expected to use the meeting to put pressure on Mr Burnham to hand the Welsh Government further powers over tax and spending. It is demanding revenues from the Crown Estate, including the seabed on which offshore wind farms are built, which currently go to the Treasury.
The party also wants Labour to replace the Barnett Formula with a more generous settlement and to devolve further areas such as policing and rail funding.
Worth reading in full.
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Well at least the English will have the Wesminster parliament to themselves.
Fine as long as the subsidies stop.
Anything that might introduce a breath of realism into the Whitehall warmongering madness of continually ‘poking the bear’ would be a good idea, and removing from the pool of cannon-fodder the Welsh Scots and Northern Irish would be a good start. I have great sympathy for all the ethnic Ukrainians being taken into to a hopeless war by an ethnic Jewish Russian, but it is not our war and the leaders of Ukraine had a good deal offered in 2022 that they squandered and blew the lives of the youth of the country.
Well said!
My initial reaction is to say “let them go”. I was opposed to Scottish independence at the last referendum, but that was when the UK was still recognisably itself. Since then, the UK’s economic and political power on the world stage have been so weakened by successive governments, and British culture so wounded by uncontrolled immigration and woke ideology that there’s little left to lose in the breakup of the UK.
Hurry up then!
Goodbye-ee! Goodbye-ee!
Wipe the tear, baby dear, from your eye-ee
Though it’s hard to part I know,
Don’t cry-ee, don’t sigh-ee
There’s a silver lining in the sky-ee!
Bonsoir old thing, cheerio, chin-chin
Nah-poo, toodle-oo, goodbye-ee!
Good riddance to bad rubbish. Independence for England, then we can ship all the culture enrichers, engineers, doctors, entrepreneurs, economy-builders, North and West.
Oh, come on. It’s just a load of old politics. They don’t actually mean a single word of it. But it might just get them enough votes to keep them in a job.
Having some Scottish ancestry and having lived their for a time, I’d be sad to see Scotland go. That said, it would be best if Scotland became independent. England can finally lose its pretence at being a great power (and sell the aircraft carriers). Scotland will have to fully open up its oil fields in order to pay down its share of the debt. Win win.
Wales – a bit of an odd one. Separate nation with (unlike Scotland) its own language, yet many Welsh don’t appear to be interested in independence.
As others have pointed out, the Welsh would face a dire financial situation. Courtesy of AI: Debt to GDP would immediately go to the same level as Greece. The budget deficit would go to 20% assuming public spending remains unchanged and tax remains unchanged. The budget deficit in particular is massively higher than anywhere else in Europe and huge spending cuts would be required.
Same for Scotland but not as extreme. Expanding oil would help a bit but nowhere near enough.
Northern Ireland a different kettle of fish entirely, since they’d join the Republic.
One area where I am concerned is immigration. Maybe the third worlders would simply… Read more »
Hard borders would solve that. And no, the Northern Irish will not join the people who refused to accept their democratic decision to remain part of Protestant Great Britain, and then terrorised them for decades, slaughtering thousands in the Northern Ireland War started by Catholic Terrorists supported by the Catholic South and the Vatican.
How can you be independent and in the EU?
All for England being Independent and NOT in the EU.
Wales?!!! What on earth would they feed themselves in? At the moment they are concentrated on decolonisation and never digging for coal again.
There is nothing there, trust me, I used to live there.
scotland would like independence but not if the snp are in charge. Despite the Ira being in charge there would be carnage if the north was made to join the south.
Wales exports a lot of water to England.
OK, off you pop then.
We’re taking the cheque book though.
people deserve what they vote for. the problem is, the three quislings in charge of those countries do not represent the majority of the people who live there. i take it if they do vote to leave the u.k. they will want massive amounts of ‘ongoing’ pound notes to do so.
Exactly! And the press mostly ignored the fact that Sinn Fein IRA Terrorist’s Daughter Michelle O’Neill had NO RIGHT TO SIGN ANYTHING!
The Protestant Deputy First Minister Emma Little-Pengelly said in the Northern Ireland Assembly:
“It is therefore incredibly important that we clarify in absolute terms that it is not a meeting of the First Ministers. Michelle O’Neill is not attending as First Minister. She had and has no authority to sign anything at the summit on behalf of the people of Northern Ireland. Michelle O’Neill has not sought or obtained any agreement to attend as First Minister.
When called out on what they were attempting to spin, the parties clarified that it is indeed a meeting of the parties and not of the First Ministers. I give a commitment to the people of Northern Ireland that, in my role as deputy First Minister — a joint role, jointly leading the Executive and equal in every way in legislation and in what we do — I will never allow the role of First Minister to be used, misused or weaponised in a way that pushes for the abolition of Northern Ireland and the destruction of the United Kingdom.”
Official Reports
Michelle O’Neill’s family’s shocking IRA past | Daily Mail Online
“The beauty from a family drenched in blood: She’s just replaced Martin McGuinness and is being hailed as the soft new face of Sinn Fein. Shame about the sickening IRA history of her father and two cousins.”
I’d be sad to see them go, but, if that’s what they want…
Scotland, in particular, would rue the decision, but it’s about self-rule, so who cares that the money will dry up?
Does anyone care? Britain is broke.
I doubt that the EU would be interested in taking on yet more dependent states. The OIC on the other hand…
The latest EU rules do not allow new members to join who have a nationalised health service, as it is seen as an advantage! Not of course that the EU are consistent with their own rules!
I do not think the citizens of Scotland, Wales & N. Ireland could survive without the NHS, another detail they have not considered.
When will the English get a vote on their own independence?
“The party also wants Labour to replace the Barnett Formula with a more generous settlement and to devolve further areas such as policing and rail funding.”
Real agenda – rest is pie in the sky
OK. So you want to leave the United Kingdom. Fine.
So say goodbye to any financial help from England, and off you go. And the very best of luck – you’ll need it.
Of course they will have to take their share of the national debt with them and we may allow them to use our currency but the BofE will not be their lender of last resort. A lot of the oilfields will be ours as the border line is extended from the land border which runs from SW to NE, but then the SNP do not want the oil and gas anyway. The money we save paying out to Scotland and Wales can be used to build a secure border to stop them leaving the cesspits they will have created. It will certainly be needed should they join the EU but I think we can be pretty sure the EU will resist the temptation to give us the finger and admit when they look at the financial figures and border problems. The days of the EU chucking out money to lure in new members are gone as the remaining big funders – France and Germany – are in economic decline.
Independence referendums followed by requests to rejoin the EU. Gays for Palestine comes to mind.
“All three parties will agree that their nations should be in the EU” And what do the EU have to say about that? Non!
“[The EU] should do its best to undermine the homogeneity of its Member States… States have to become more open.” – Peter Sutherland
A highly debated comment made while discussing the economic benefits of increased diversity.
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-18519395
Displayed on Plaque in the EU Parliament.
“National sovereignty is the root cause of the most crying evils of our time and of the steady march of humanity back to tragic disaster and barbarism…The only final remedy for this supreme and catastrophic evil of our time is a federal union of the peoples.” – Philip Kerr (11th Marquess of Lothian) – 1939
“The concept of national sovereignty has been immutable, indeed a sacred principle of international relations. It is a principle which will yield only slowly and reluctantly to the new imperatives of global environmental cooperation.” – UN’s Commission on Global Governance
And while the UN/EU etc are doing their best to ‘solve’ our birthrate ‘crisis’ with mass immigration the UN also thinks this:
“A reasonable estimate for an industrialized world society at the present North American material standard of living would be 1 billion. At the more frugal European standard of living, 2 to 3 billion would be possible.” – UN Commission… Read more »
The EU will not take on two or three financial basket cases even if it would mean showing us English two fingers. They are strapped for cash as their policies ruin the economies of their big funders France and Germany.
Yes, and also because British Taxpayers were paying a whopping ONE-FIFTH OF THE ENTIRE EU BUDGET.
That’s why the EU were all so upset about Brexit. They saw their Golden Goose flying away…
If the separations were done properly, with equitable division of assets, debts, and jobs plus some border controls, it could work. It would take years to achieve and therefore ‘success’ could easily be tarnished by politicians wanting to make a name for themselves.
But wanting a revised ‘Barnett’ formula suggests to me that the new ‘nations’ don’t want separation at all.
Just more money – so obvious!
Independence must mean financial independence, but no representation in Westminster and appropriate repayment of national debt!
I’d be sorry to lose the union jack, it’s a wonderful literally iconic flag, generally for the betterment of mankind.
That said as an englishman, we can do without them if they choose to leave , no hard feelings and don’t let the door hit your arse on the way out.
I see no reason why we should not keep the Union Jack
Best-designed flag ever. It would be a shame to lose it.
Perhaps we could keep it as a post-ironic gesture?
The Republic is already shying away from Trump’s ideas for a United Ireland as they realise the costs involved.
English tax payers will happily disconnect from Scotland and Wales if they guarantee they will become Independent and not keep coming back for more handouts.
Quite right. ‘It’s yoor money now, pal’