27 March 2021  /  Updated 17 July 2021
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Unvaccinated filling up hospital beds?


sunjor
Posts: 74
Topic starter
(@sunjor)
Joined: 11 months ago

Just come across this article in The Guardian which has a doctor saying that his hospital is full of the untaxed, thought I'd been reading of late that the vaccinated were getting infected at the same rate, anyone know any more please?

 

22 Replies
ewloe
Posts: 365
(@ewloe)
Joined: 3 months ago

The vaccinated don't get sick enough to need ICU.

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FreedomFighter3
Posts: 40
(@freedomfighter3)
Joined: 11 months ago

Not actually true.

The vaccinated according to UKHSA are less likely to need hospital treatment. However they are more likely to catch Sars-COV-2 and pass it on.

And there's a bigger picture (being conveniently missed by the politicians and media - I wonder why?).

It's obvious from the world data... https://ourworldindata.org/covid-deaths

...that the vaccines are driving the disease.

The mechanism may not be fully understood yet but it's undeniable from the data. It's probably related to the forcing of variants by vaccinating during a pandemic with an experimental drug that doesn't prevent infection or spread (see Geert Vanden Bossche).

Look at the US states. There's increasing evidence that the more vaccinated are doing worse (it's not as obvious as world data because the difference is much less between states than between countries). 

Same in Ireland, the most vaxxed county, Waterford, has the most cases.
In Gibraltar with 140% vaxed, they are cancelling Christmas - are the unvaccinated to blame for that? There aren't any! 

So the unvaccinated are in hospital more, but only because people are unwittingly spreading the virus by taking up the vaccine. They are also "shedding" toxins onto the unvaccinated. Loads of otherwise healthy unvaccinated people are out of nowhere coming down with unexplained immune problems and lymph node issues.

And you also have to take into account that the vaccine itself is hospitilising loads of people.

There are some global exceptions like Australia and NZ which closed borders early etc. Everywhere else pretty much all the vaccinated countries are doing worse than the unvaxed. 

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10 Replies
ImpObs
(@impobs)
Joined: 2 weeks ago

Posts: 44

@freedomfighter3 Geerts hypothesis is looking more solid as more data comes out, Charles Rixey did a splendid analysis showing higher vaxed states had rising CFRs, the hypothesis is also confirmed by Trevor Bedfords presentation (on YT) showng the S1 domain is evolving almost 4 orders of magnitude higher than any other domain.

Dr. JJ Couey covers this a lot in his educational twitch streams for more detail (Gigaohmbiological) his updated review paper is also worth a read...

Gigaohmbiological.com/review

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ewloe
(@ewloe)
Joined: 3 months ago

Posts: 365
Posted by: @impobs

 Geerts hypothesis is

pure hogwash.

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ewloe
(@ewloe)
Joined: 3 months ago

Posts: 365
Posted by: @freedomfighter3

see Geert Vanden Bossche

Why would I consult a vet?

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ImpObs
(@impobs)
Joined: 2 weeks ago

Posts: 44

@ewloe @freeddomfighter3 So you're also disregarding Albert Bourla the chairman and chief executive officer of Pfizer?

He's also a Vet.

We have Bill Gates on TV all the time talking BS biology, he doesn't have any qualifications.

Because it's about what they say about biology, not their choice of specialization after they get a biology PhD (or not).

I have issues with what Pfizers CEO says about biology, but not because he's a vet. I have issues with what Bill gates says about biology, but not because he's totally unqualified.

If you have an issues with the hypothesis, lets hear your argument about it. I've read several 'debunks' of Geerts, and others similar hypothesis, none of which argue against known bology. 

Biology is the key, not semantics and strawmen, stick with biology and we can have an adult conversation about it, otherwise you're just wasting peoples time and energy on BS. 

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ewloe
(@ewloe)
Joined: 3 months ago

Posts: 365
Posted by: @impobs

@ewloe @freeddomfighter3 So you're also disregarding Albert Bourla the chairman and chief executive officer of Pfizer?

He's also a Vet.

We have Bill Gates on TV all the time talking BS biology, he doesn't have any qualifications.

I have no regard for any  of them. Why should I? or in Geerts, who has not published extensively. Why should you pat heed to him?  They are not relevant to the thread so why  then did you mention them, no doubt as a strawman which you then have the temerity to accuse me of .Note that variants that have emerged so far did so in the absence of vaccine pressure. 

 

This is the central weakness of Geerts arguments. More contagious variants emerged without vaccine pressure , it is a matter of faith to believe Geerts and his hogwash about 'The End is Nigh', We already know variants evolve without vaccine pressure. To reduce replication, the correct course of action is to reduce incidence of covid19 in any way we can, since replication/evolution occurs whatever we do, hence it is better to limit spread using, for example antivirals, vaccine and even masks. It is silly and childish to oppose every measure. Vaccine prevents severe disease and hospitalisation even in the new variants. The best thing to do is vaccinate as much as possible and, when applicable, develop a booster to knock out the variants later.

Note it is only ever our own immune system that stops the infection, vaccines just prime that, and all vaccine is  long gone by the time a pathogen arrives.

Look, on a realistic level, nobody is going to trust a nobody like Geerts with no track record to speak of, with his crackpot theories designed to appeal to scared people like you, who are eager to latch on to any  Plausible messiah,  Geerts makes no sense. Variants will evolve with or without vaccine, that has been shown, and more infections increase the risk, Geerts is a true crackpot, you should be ashamed of yourself. He's right that only crackpots are listening to him. There is no reason to listen to him.

 

 

 

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ImpObs
(@impobs)
Joined: 2 weeks ago

Posts: 44

@ewloe Geert has a plethora of supporting papers on his blog, he's been in the vaccine development industry 30 yrs+ and is currently working on another vaccine.

The fact you think he has no track record speaks volumes regarding your lack of research knowledge, you can find his industry record here: https://www.geertvandenbossche.org/

We were discussing his hypothesis, that's how science works, something is proposed then discussed, then as data comes out we can discuss the merits or lack thereof further. Armwaving it away only displays your limited view of biology, it produces nothing of value, the smattering of adhom you use to do this also speaks volumes regarding your defective narcissistic personality.

Leaky vaccines given during an outbreak provide a limited evolutionary bottleck driving pathogens towards higher virulence, the opposite of their normal evolutionary direction towards higher transmissability with lower virulence. This has been shown time and again with Mareks disease, as published in Andrew Reads papers. This was quoted on Joe Rogans show, which caused so much uproar Forbes interviewed Read to debunk Rogan, in which he said Rogan was wrong because the evolutionary drive only occurs when vaccines do not stop transmission, of course this was prior to the mainstream admitting the current vaccines do not stop transmission, and here we are back to the orgining Geert hypothesis for which Reads paper provides a solid confirmation, more evidence has come from Trevor Bedofrd research indicating the S1 domain is evolving almost 4 magnitudes higher than any other respiratory virus compared.

This is a live area of subject research, it's moving very fast, Bedofrd is currently proposing an alternative hypothesis since Geerts is very dangerous for the $trillion dollar mRNA industry Bedford is supporting, time will tell which hypothesis has more merrit, you can follow along although I doubt you even understand the biology sufficiently to discuss it with anything more than useless adhom.

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ewloe
(@ewloe)
Joined: 3 months ago

Posts: 365
Posted by: @impobs

@ewloe Geert has a plethora of supporting papers on his blog,

blog papers, yeah right. So what about the Geert Vanden Bossche theory and Omicron.The Omicron variant arose in Africa, where there has been nearly no vaccination, so it's not vaccine that created Omicron, it's much more likely to be lack of vaccine, by allowing virus to replicate freely.It is mass free replication that creates variants not vaccine.The Geert Vanden Bossche theory fails again.If vaccine create super variants, then omicron would have arisen in a heavily vaccinated nation.Best thing to do now , vaccinate the vulnerable like mad, develop new medicines using omicron as the target.

Here's an idea for you - vaccinate the rest of the world to cut the virus replication everywhere,

 

 

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Jane G
(@jane-g)
Joined: 1 year ago

Posts: 266

@ewloe 

Nevertheless, the first instances of Omicron  in Botswana were found in double vaccinated people. I know one swallow doesn't make a summer but it is following a pattern.

Isn't it strange that they didn't tweak the vaccines for the Delta variant, which appears to be more severe than this new one. Maybe they had too many loads of the obsolete formulation to get rid of into the trusting arms of the public and governments wanted their money's worth out of their investment. Many of us  are still scratching our heads over Javid's call for all to get their boosters in the light of this new variant that 'may evade the vaccines'. Maybe that passes for common sense in this strange new world. Mmm 

 

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ewloe
(@ewloe)
Joined: 3 months ago

Posts: 365

@jane-g did you imagine they just happened to test the right person at that time in which the  the new variant first (evolved) before anyone else, and hence detect  the first instance that existed. If so, you have another think coming.

 

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ImpObs
(@impobs)
Joined: 2 weeks ago

Posts: 44

@ewloe either you're not capable of reading, or not capable of clicking links, only trying to bloster your narcissistic supply, or just here to waste peoples time.

https://www.geertvandenbossche.org/supportive-references-from-literatu

https://www.geertvandenbossche.org/supportive-references

 

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Fingal
Posts: 134
(@fingal)
Joined: 11 months ago
Posted by: @freedomfighter3

There are some global exceptions like Australia and NZ which closed borders early etc.

So you're saying lockdowns work! That's new for this website.

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9 Replies
ewloe
(@ewloe)
Joined: 3 months ago

Posts: 365
Posted by: @fingal
Posted by: @freedomfighter3

There are some global exceptions like Australia and NZ which closed borders early etc.

So you're saying lockdowns work! That's new for this website.

The virus can only spread when people mingle. That should not be news to you.

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ImpObs
(@impobs)
Joined: 2 weeks ago

Posts: 44

@ewloe

The virus can only spread when people mingle. That should not be news to you.

Nonsense, the virus is endemic, airborne aerosol, proved by experiment, with added confimation by the fact they've found it in 40% of white tail deer that are known to be very shy of humans, and never "mingle" with people. 

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ewloe
(@ewloe)
Joined: 3 months ago

Posts: 365
Posted by: @impobs

@ewloe

The virus can only spread when people mingle. That should not be news to you.

Nonsense, the virus is endemic, airborne aerosol, proved by experiment, with added confimation by the fact they've found it in 40% of white tail deer

right, so you are recommending physical distancing then, esp. not mingling with  white tail deer!!

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burke19
(@burke19)
Joined: 12 months ago

Posts: 83

@ewloe 

"right, so you are recommending physical distancing then, esp. not mingling with  white tail deer!!"

Very nice analogy, I can really picture it. Also a text book example of cognitive dissonance. Keep up the good work!

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ImpObs
(@impobs)
Joined: 2 weeks ago

Posts: 44

@ewloe I said no such thing, try not to be such an idiot.

There is no escape from it, if deer caught it, physical distancing doesn't work, obviously.

The whole basis of lockdown was to 'flatten the curve', because they recognise everyones going to be exposed to it eventually anyway, they tried the ridiculous lockdown everyone idea to reduce the height of the first wave, to "protect the NHS" ignoring decades of well known disease epidemiology. 

Best course of action is what we've done for every other pandemic in history, isolate and treat the symptomatic, protect the vunerable, but everyone else goes about their normal business, which would soon build herd immunity. ~80% of people have cross immunity from the other 6 endemic corona virus we've known about for decades, these are the huge numbers of "asymptomatics".

But then, as should be obvious by now, this was never about health.

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95% protected
(@95-protected)
Joined: 11 months ago

Posts: 899
Posted by: @impobs

@ewloe I said no such thing, try not to be such an idiot.

There is no escape from it, if deer caught it, physical distancing doesn't work, obviously.

 

Whet you consider to be proof just isn't.

If a number of deer have caught it, then there must have been deer-patient-zero, where it crossed species. Once in the herd deer can infect each other, unless they have been encouraged to social distance from each other.

Some of those deer may be influenced by this website and go out of their way to maximise infection, by refusing all safety measures. They will say to themselves.....

"to hell with everyone else, I won't do as suggested. I don't care what damage I casue. I saw a mad person on the internet, I will believe that sort of person and spread their word"

 

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ewloe
(@ewloe)
Joined: 3 months ago

Posts: 365
Posted by: @impobs

@ewloe

But then, as should be obvious by now, this was never about health.

no, it was about white tailed deer!

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ImpObs
(@impobs)
Joined: 2 weeks ago

Posts: 44

@ewloe no, deer don't run the global financial system

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95% protected
(@95-protected)
Joined: 11 months ago

Posts: 899
Posted by: @impobs

@ewloe

The virus can only spread when people mingle. That should not be news to you.

Nonsense, the virus is endemic, airborne aerosol, proved by experiment, with added confimation by the fact they've found it in 40% of white tail deer that are known to be very shy of humans, and never "mingle" with people. 

Actually, you will find that nothing can ever be proved. Only disproved.

 

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